Russian participation in sport

[De Sisti]

Here's an interesting article about a (Swiss-registered) Russian-Sponsored UCI team. If there is
any consistency in sport, then the Gazprom name would be removed from the jersey of the team.

https://www.cyclingweekly.com/racing/who-are-the-gazprom-rusvelo-cycling-team-and-how-are-they-linked-to-the-russian-government

[Mr Larrington]

The Haas F1 team's major sponsor is an potash fertiliser manufacturing outfit called Uralkali and the son of a major shareholder just happens to be one of their drivers.  They appeared without any logos on the car for the final day of testing in Barcelona last week, though Nikita Mazepin was still driving the thing.  It remains to be seen how this will pan out – will Mazepin keep his drive and will Mazepin Senior be able to keep sending the cheques being just two of the questions.  The plug has been pulled on this September's Russian Grand Prix, at least for now.

[De Sisti]

Here's an update to my earlier post. The Gazprom-RusVelo team has been sanctioned by the UCI.

https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/uci-bans-russian-and-belarusian-teams-from-competition-until-further-notice/

[spesh]

The Haas F1 team's major sponsor is an potash fertiliser manufacturing outfit called Uralkali and the son of a major shareholder just happens to be one of their drivers.  They appeared without any logos on the car for the final day of testing in Barcelona last week, though Nikita Mazepin was still driving the thing.  It remains to be seen how this will pan out – will Mazepin keep his drive and will Mazepin Senior be able to keep sending the cheques being just two of the questions.  The plug has been pulled on this September's Russian Grand Prix, at least for now.

Assuming Haas keep him, the plug's just been pulled on Mazepin being able to drive at the Silverstone GP

Just one day after the FIA stopped short of following a recommendation from the International Olympic Committee to prevent Russia athletes from taking part in international events, Britain’s Motorsport UK has announced more draconian measures.

In a statement it announced that no Russian- or Belarusian-licensed teams, competitors or officials will be allowed to enter or participate in sanctioned events in the UK.
...

The only way such drivers could continue would be to race under a different nationality’s licence, as the Motorsport UK decision is based on its refusal to recognise licences issued by the Russian Automobile Federation (RAF) and the Belarus Automobile Federation (BAF).

https://www.autosport.com/national/news/russian-drivers-banned-from-british-motorsport-by-motorsport-uk/8632589/

[Kim]

Winter Paralympics 2022: Russia and Belarus athletes classed as neutral after Ukraine invasion

Sounds like a reasonable approach to me, but what do I know?

[Mr Larrington]

BBC has just reported that Roman Abramovich has put Chelski up for sale

[Beardy]

BBC has just reported that Roman Abramovich has put Chelski up for sale

The reports I’ve seen say that he’s also written off their debt and that he’ll don’t the proceeds of the sale to a charity supporting Ukrain soldiers.

[spesh]

Russians getting hoofed from virtual football as well.

Games publisher Electronic Arts will remove the Russian national team and all other Russian teams from Fifa 22 and associated games, it has announced.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-60592658

[Peter]

How do you define a Russian oligarch?  How do you buy something from a Russian oligarch without contributing to a Russian oligarch's stash?

[Wowbagger]

Why are obscenely rich Russian people "oligarchs" and other obscenely rich people "billionaires"?

[De Sisti]

Why are obscenely rich Russian people "oligarchs" and other obscenely rich people "billionaires"?

Here is an explanation that may help you.
https://www.thestreet.com/markets/emerging-markets/what-exactly-is-a-russian-oligarch

[Beardy]

Just as I’m reading this thread a pop up informs me that the Russian (and Belorussian) Paralympic athletes have been banned from competing. I feel sorry for the individuals concerned because they’ve worked hard get where they are and there’s likely little or no evidence that they support Putin.

[spesh]

Just as I’m reading this thread a pop up informs me that the Russian (and Belorussian) Paralympic athletes have been banned from competing. I feel sorry for the individuals concerned because they’ve worked hard get where they are and there’s likely little or no evidence that they support Putin.

The report I saw earlier on the BBC text news said something about the situation in the atheletes' village becoming "untenable". It didn't go into why that was, but to me - and it's confirmed by the news article online - that very much read like assorted countries were telling the IPC that they would pull out if the Russians and Belarusians were allowed to compete.

Athletes from Russia and Belarus will not be allowed to compete at the 2022 Winter Paralympics in Beijing after the International Paralympic Committee reversed its original decision.

The IPC was heavily criticised when, following Russia's invasion of Ukraine, it initially said it would allow the athletes to compete as neutrals.

A statement said the "situation in the athlete villages" was "untenable".

The Games' opening ceremony takes place on Friday.

IPC president Andrew Parsons said an "overwhelming number of members" had spoken to the IPC and said they would not compete in the Winter Paralympics should athletes from Russia and Belarus be allowed to take part.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/disability-sport/60599739

[Peter]

Why are obscenely rich Russian people "oligarchs" and other obscenely rich people "billionaires"?

Here is an explanation that may help you.
https://www.thestreet.com/markets/emerging-markets/what-exactly-is-a-russian-oligarch

I loved the placing of the ad.  "4 ways to retire comfortably on £500,000"!

[Cudzoziemiec]

Why are obscenely rich Russian people "oligarchs" and other obscenely rich people "billionaires"?

Because oligarchy is a feature of current Russian society. It's not a uniquely Russian feature nor a modern one, of course; I recently came across a reference to oligarchs in the context of 17th and 18th century minor German states (in a book written in 2013). Some of the patrons of Bach and Handel were probably oligarchs!

[Wowbagger]

Why are obscenely rich Russian people "oligarchs" and other obscenely rich people "billionaires"?

Here is an explanation that may help you.
https://www.thestreet.com/markets/emerging-markets/what-exactly-is-a-russian-oligarch

Reading that, I can't see a massive difference. Corrupt people becoming fabulously wealthy through siphoning public money into private hands. Is Abramovich more corrupt than the Glazers? I don't recall the precise details, but when they "bought" Manchester United they somehow succeeded in transferring the debt they incurred in the deal onto the club itself, which, as I understood it at the time, meant that they had a free football club and quite a lot of millions in their bank account, and, in the event of the football club going under (that didnt seem likely since it was Manchester United) they Glazers personally wouldn't have been liable for the debt. (I'm happy to be corrected on these points. I haven't bothered to go back and check, but that is what I remember from however long ago it was). And of course, we have seen the financial probity demonstrated by the Tory party in this country, firstly in being prepared to take huge sums of laundered money from rich Russians (you don't have to be Russian to apply...) and secondly how they handed out covid-related contracts to their mates in unlawful ways.

Why are obscenely rich Russian people "oligarchs" and other obscenely rich people "billionaires"?

Because oligarchy is a feature of current Russian society. It's not a uniquely Russian feature nor a modern one, of course; I recently came across a reference to oligarchs in the context of 17th and 18th century minor German states (in a book written in 2013). Some of the patrons of Bach and Handel were probably oligarchs!

I take the point re vocabulary, but I still don't see much difference.

I doubt that Bach received a lot of cash from oligarchs because he really only had the one employer - Thomaskirche in Leipzig. I don't think he was ever especially wealthy. Handel, on the other hand, was well in with English royalty and was very rich indeed.

Mods: feel free to move bits to POBI, but you know the old saying "You can't keep politics out of sport..."

[rafletcher]

The report I saw earlier on the BBC text news said something about the situation in the atheletes' village becoming "untenable". It didn't go into why that was, but to me - and it's confirmed by the news article online - that very much read like assorted countries were telling the IPC that they would pull out if the Russians and Belarusians were allowed to compete.

And the cynic in me thinks there's an element of "That'll improve our medal chances" to those protests.

[mrcharly-YHT]

I think that the key difference between oligarch and other billionaires is the relationship between governmental power and the individuals.

Bezos did not become a billionaire because of his political connections and influence on policies in a country. Ditto Gates. or the Bosch family in Germany.

[Cudzoziemiec]

Why are obscenely rich Russian people "oligarchs" and other obscenely rich people "billionaires"?

Here is an explanation that may help you.
https://www.thestreet.com/markets/emerging-markets/what-exactly-is-a-russian-oligarch

Reading that, I can't see a massive difference. Corrupt people becoming fabulously wealthy through siphoning public money into private hands. Is Abramovich more corrupt than the Glazers? I don't recall the precise details, but when they "bought" Manchester United they somehow succeeded in transferring the debt they incurred in the deal onto the club itself, which, as I understood it at the time, meant that they had a free football club and quite a lot of millions in their bank account, and, in the event of the football club going under (that didnt seem likely since it was Manchester United) they Glazers personally wouldn't have been liable for the debt. (I'm happy to be corrected on these points. I haven't bothered to go back and check, but that is what I remember from however long ago it was). And of course, we have seen the financial probity demonstrated by the Tory party in this country, firstly in being prepared to take huge sums of laundered money from rich Russians (you don't have to be Russian to apply...) and secondly how they handed out covid-related contracts to their mates in unlawful ways.

Why are obscenely rich Russian people "oligarchs" and other obscenely rich people "billionaires"?

Because oligarchy is a feature of current Russian society. It's not a uniquely Russian feature nor a modern one, of course; I recently came across a reference to oligarchs in the context of 17th and 18th century minor German states (in a book written in 2013). Some of the patrons of Bach and Handel were probably oligarchs!

I take the point re vocabulary, but I still don't see much difference.

I doubt that Bach received a lot of cash from oligarchs because he really only had the one employer - Thomaskirche in Leipzig. I don't think he was ever especially wealthy. Handel, on the other hand, was well in with English royalty and was very rich indeed.

Mods: feel free to move bits to POBI, but you know the old saying "You can't keep politics out of sport..."

See Mr Charly's answer above. It's not about wealth but about how you got it and what you then do with it.

[Mr Larrington]

No difference at all, according to a Kremlin apparatchik in 2018:

"The phrase 'Russian oligarchs' is considered inappropriate. […] The time when there were oligarchs in Russia passed long ago, there are no oligarchs in Russia."

YouGov concurs on the grounds that Boris Yeltsin invited these characters to acquire near-bankrupt Soviet industrial wossnames at knockdown prices.  But then any other stance from YouGov would be a tad hypocritical.

[De Sisti]

I think that the key difference between oligarch and other billionaires is the relationship between governmental power and the individuals.

Bezos did not become a billionaire because of his political connections and influence on policies in a country. Ditto Gates. or the Bosch family in Germany.

The quote in bold is something alluded to in an item I listened to on Radio4 yesterday*.


*Can't remember what the programme was (and not going into BBC Sounds to find it), but I understood the point they made.

[Wowbagger]

As I said, by no means all, but a fair few Western rich bastards have indeed made their cash through corrupt government practices. It’s what privatisation  was all about.

I was quite interested that Leonid Blavatnik was not on the list of 35 Putin cronies read out in parliament by Layla Moran last week. He, (in)famously, gave Oxford Uni £75m to set up their school of government and there were quite a few dyed-in-the-wool Oxford types who were appalled that OU should receive such largesse from a Mate of Putin, because they were indubitably ill-gotten gains. But they seem to have forgotten about Rhodes.

Edit: when my daughter did a masters at the Blavatnik school some years ago, quite a few of the visiting lecturers were household names from political circles. Douglas Alexander is one who immediately springs to mind. Jonathan Powell too, iirc. I don’t suppose their strong Westminster connections could have kept Blavatnik’s name off the list, could it?


I have made the mistake of not checking but will leave the above in place as a sobering reminder. I am as sure as I can be that my daughter told me LB made his money through aluminium, under Putin’s approval, but Wikipedia says he and his family emigrated from Odessa in 1978, when he was 21. I’m not quite sure what the fuss was about when he donated the money.

Edit: but it seems that there may well be some link between Blavatnik’s wealth and Putin. This lot seem to think so: https://www.spisok-putina.org/en/personas/blavatnik-2/

[Mr Larrington]

They haven’t quite forgotten about Cecil Rhodes.  I mean, less than a year ago Oriel decided not to take down his statue because it would be difficult.  And expensive.  But they did add a plaque explaining that Rhodes was, in fact, a bit of a bastard.  So that’s all right then.

[Wowbagger]

Regarding my post immediately above Mr. L's, it has crossed my mind since I posted it that Leonid Blavatnik would have a strong vested interest in hiding from public view any links he may have with Putin and the current Russian régime. I shall ask younger daughter and son what their take is, but I'm sure I didn't make any of that stuff up and said offsprings' degrees and professional credentials means that they are highly likely to Know What They Are Talking About.

Edit: https://nypost.com/2022/02/27/heres-where-russian-oligarchs-and-their-families-own-property-in-nyc/

I feel pretty well vindicated by that piece, but Wikipedia doesn't mention the aluminium link.

[Wowbagger]

https://newrepublic.com/article/165546/len-blavatnik-campaign-donations-democrats-russia-ukraine

A current piece about Blavatnik. That claims that his team insist on him not being referred to as an "oligarch" before he grants interviews.