Making learning to read 'worth it'

[Arch]

Talking to my sister last night, she mentioned that nephew Oli (4 and a half) is apparently not interested in learning reading. Apparently, he reckons he doesn't need to, because he knows everything (with dinosaurs being his major subject). Doesn't want to be bothered with his school reading books at home.

Now, of course, he's less than 5 years old, so he's got bags of time - I know that in some countries they don't even start teaching school stuff until later.  And we know that over encouragement and forcing the issue will simply be counterproductive.

But, any ideas about making it worthwhile and interesting for him? He's an absolute hoover for Facts, especially about dinosaurs. From what she said, I think he can recognise lots of dinosaur names fine. I wondered if the phonics they learn could be applied to more exciting words than cat and dog. I guess also, building reading into everyday life, making it useful, might be more interesting than reading 'baby' stories (he reckons being read stories at school is baby stuff).

My only concern is that I had a dear friend who remembered going to school in the expectation that he'd be taught interesting stuff like how external valve gear on a Gresley locomotive worked, but when he found out it was all dull stuff about cats and mats, it started a rather on-off school career...

[mrcharly-YHT]

Far too young to even worry about it.

Let kids mature and start learning at their own time and appropriate age. 

"In some countries"?  Steiner schools don't start on reading until age 7. Certainly doesn't seem to affect results.

The way to get kids reading is to find really good books, read them to the kids for a set amount of time. When the kid is desperate to find out what happens next, but you've finished reading, hand them the book for them to read themselves.  'Little Wolf's Big Book of Badness' is a brilliant book for this; good story (so not boring for adult to read out loud), well laid out with good typesetting (so easy for kids to read) and appropriate vocabulary.

you are right about the second concern. Don't over-egg school being 'about learning'. For bright kids, they have to find their own interest at school.

[Julian]

Does he see grown-ups (particularly boy grown-ups) reading at home?  Do they read to him?  And does he have a natural healthy sense of competition?  If so, I wouldn't worry.  Either he will aspire to read his own books since it's something adults do, or he won't want to be left behind by his peers.

[alexb]

Both my kids picked up reading on their own. We read to them every day and every night. But we didn't go through this whole business of showing them what every word meant or how to say it. They just suddenly srtarted reading to themselves. When they were small they would read aloud if you asked them to, but didn't understand why you would want to do that.
We went through periods when they came in and asked what words meant, but never "what does that word say".

Reading in school is a very artificial environment, all reading for set amounts of time for example, or all reading from the same small group of books.

My advice is to hit you local library (if it's any good) and hit the children's reference section and get some Dorling Kindersley books on dinosaurs or something similar and then a lot of picture heavy story books.

My eldest read loads of Asterix books when she was young, the youngest shows no interest at all in them, but both are avid Manga and comic book readers.

Don't sweat it, 5 is very young. Lots of home ed kids don't really start to read until they are 7 or 8.

[hellymedic]

He's a hoover for facts.
Leave lots of illustrated books with many facts lying around.
Do not push.
Do not push.
Do not push.

Read informative plaques on visits to zoos and museums to him word by word.
Ask which posters he likes in the street.

See if the shelf labels and food package labels mean anything to him next year on a trip to a supermarket.

Literacy is not all about books and classrooms.

[Si_Co]

Miss S had no interest in learning to read, and for a number of years saw it as something school made her do, she did not discover the joy of the written word till secondary school, now she's at library everyday

[hellymedic]

Not for now, but you can tell Oli the story of my friend and the supermarket 'value' tins in my cupboard.
Friend wanted rice pudding.
Friend got baked beans.

ALWAYS READ THE LABEL!

but don't push reading till he's good and ready.

[Arch]

Not for now, but you can tell Oli the story of my friend and the supermarket 'value' tins in my cupboard.
Friend wanted rice pudding.
Friend got baked beans.

ALWAYS READ THE LABEL!

but don't push reading till he's good and ready.

Actually, that was an idea I thought of - getting him to tell a tin of value Baked Beans from Tinned Tomatoes, and so on.

I'm sure he'll take to it eventually. He and his brother have had books, and been read to from as soon as they could focus. He knew from an early age that books contained facts, and when he started school he informed his Mum that from now on he wouldn't have story books from the library, only 'information books'. When I found a tractor fanciers magazine in the recycling and sent it to him, aged about 2 and a half, my sister said "thanks, but I've had to spend hours reading the captions under the photos to him, on his demand of "read it, mummy, read it!""  Her interest in hydrostatic implement systems waned a little...

 Maybe, like AlexB's kids, he's reading what he wants to, but just can't see the point of 'performing' to order.

Apparently, when I started school, at the end of the first term Mum and Dad went in to check on my progress and were told I was a reluctant reader, which surprised them, since I loved books at home. "Yes," said the teacher, "and we have an incentive, where when a child reaches a target (reading a page or something), they get a jelly baby".

"Ah," said Mum.  "She doesn't like jelly babies.  Try chocolate buttons."

Now try and stop me reading...

I'm not worried really I think, I just want him to find learning fun.

[Kim]

"Ah," said Mum.  "She doesn't like jelly babies.  Try chocolate buttons."

*Recalls the parable of barakta and the bible verses*

[Arch]

oh, do tell!

[L CC]

Apparently I didn't learn to read (refused to) until I went to school. As that was what you went to school for. And then didn't get the 'sweeties for finishing a book' after the first couple of weeks because I was finishing the books too quickly and getting too many sweets.

My 3 eldest didn't appear to learn to read, there was very little transition between reading nothing and reading everything.
I wouldn't worry. He's got a lifetime to find out. I bet he can read the difference between velociraptor and tyrannosaurus better than you think.

[Arch]

I wouldn't worry. He's got a lifetime to find out. I bet he can read the difference between velociraptor and tyrannosaurus better than you think.

Oh, I have no worries about that! He really is an expert in that field, knows lots of names of dinosaurs, not just the 'common' ones, and knew before he was four that Dimetridon isn't strictly a dinosaur.

Apparently he and his dad visited the natural history museum in Oxford the other day, and Oli pointed to a sign and said it was identifying the Pachycephalosaurus...

I can see how cats and mats might seem a little dull when you're more interested in words like that.... On the other hand, knowing your beans from your rice pudding is possibly a more useful life skill!

I'm going down to visit at the end of May, not seen them all since Christmas, so I'm quite excited!

[Cudzoziemiec]

I can see how cats and mats might seem a little dull when you're more interested in worlds like that.... On the other hand, knowing your beans from your rice pudding is possibly a more useful life skill!

FTFY!

[Biggsy]

There's no need to worry as there's more incentive for kids to learn to read now than ever before - thanks to computers and mobile phones.  It won't be more than a year or two before little Oli will want to read so he can join in with what his friends are doing.  They'll be complaints about "text speak" - but it's still language: perhaps the main language of the future!

[Kim]

The other thing which hasn't been mentioned yet, but was I suspect influential in the refinement of my own reading skills, is that you need a relatively high level of literacy to be able to do anything useful with a computer.

Obviously this is less of a factor than it was in the 80s, when computers were both inherently interesting and primarily text-oriented.  These days it's entirely possible for toddlers with no reading skills whatsoever to shoulder-surf their parent's iPad password and find and launch their game of choice, but I'm sure there are plenty of computer-based incentives to read for slightly older kids.  Bear in mind that research shows that the txt spk beloved of the whippersnappers actually requires a higher level of literacy skills to use effectively than plain English.


As for the parable of barakta and the bible verses, I'll let her tell it.  It's funnier that way...


ETA: x-post with Biggsy.

[barakta]

Is the bible stories funny?   If you insist, I beg to differ on "funny".  Boring more like.

When I was about 5 my parents took over running the Sunday School from the previous people.  They did various children's activities with biblical themes so colouring in bible stories and so on.  One of the "activities" was giving us a bible verse to learn for the following week.  The idea being those who remembered their bible verse got a sweet the following week.

The sweets they had were these disgusting purple things with purple sugary icky goo inside them which I didn't like.  I didn't see the point of learning boring bible verses, I didn't like the sweets and anyway my parents bless them aren't the most organised people in the world so if I'd wanted sweets I could have just gone and nabbed one when they weren't looking at home or in Sunday school.

Yes I was a 5 year old atheist as I remember asking my parents questions about "God" which they couldn't answer to my satisfaction. so it was very much a thing my parents made us do.  My favourite memory from that era of church was taking tea to old ladies and chatting to them after the service cos my parents would hang around for HOURS every week and the other children including the vicars daughter were horrid brats.

[Biggsy]

The greatest stories ever are in the Bible, and versions in modern plain English are available now.  (Not that I'm happy with children having religion put to them).

[Cudzoziemiec]

Then you might enjoy this, Biggsy.

http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/965733.The_Book_of_God

[Biggsy]

I'm too lazy these days to read fiction.   The stories make good films though.

[hellymedic]

I would be very surprised if Oli does not learn to read 'by osmosis' before he is 7.
It will happen.