Author Topic: Non-car lane  (Read 3813 times)

Cudzoziemiec

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Non-car lane
« on: 25 November, 2018, 08:55:33 pm »

I noticed this sign on the Bristol ring road. There's a special lane which is only for use by buses, HGVs, taxis, motorbikes, cars carrying at least two people and "authorised vehicles". So in effect it's a lane for every vehicle except cars without any passengers...
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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #1 on: 25 November, 2018, 09:29:27 pm »
One type of vehicle missing from that sign... are they banned?

IanN

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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #2 on: 25 November, 2018, 09:55:48 pm »
One type of vehicle missing from that sign... are they banned?
No, but I wouldn't.
There is (unusually) a decent cycle path round most of the  'ring road' (the NE Bristol bit where I think this is)

Cudzoziemiec

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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #3 on: 25 November, 2018, 10:04:07 pm »
What's more remarkable, there's a decent cycle path on both sides of the road. I was on the NE (outer) side of the NE part of the ring road (which isn't actually a ring, more like a quadrant) when I took the photo.
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ian

Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #4 on: 26 November, 2018, 10:17:36 am »

I noticed this sign on the Bristol ring road. There's a special lane which is only for use by buses, HGVs, taxis, motorbikes, cars carrying at least two people and "authorised vehicles". So in effect it's a lane for every vehicle except cars without any passengers...

These are common in the US, most urban freeways have restricted 'diamond' lanes.

Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #5 on: 26 November, 2018, 11:58:36 am »
[ So in effect it's a lane for every vehicle except cars without any passengers...
Yes, but don't underestimate just how many vehicles are in that one class, it's about 60% of car journeys that are single occupant I think.

Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #6 on: 27 November, 2018, 12:01:00 pm »
Nice idea, but how is this enforced?

I recall an episode of Curb Your Enthusiasm where Larry acquires a prostitute to occupy his passenger seat for the sole purpose of using the Car Pool Lane to get to his destination on time. 

Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #7 on: 27 November, 2018, 12:20:33 pm »
[ So in effect it's a lane for every vehicle except cars without any passengers...
Yes, but don't underestimate just how many vehicles are in that one class, it's about 60% of car journeys that are single occupant I think.

Consistently

Nice idea, but how is this enforced?

I recall an episode of Curb Your Enthusiasm where Larry acquires a prostitute to occupy his passenger seat for the sole purpose of using the Car Pool Lane to get to his destination on time. 

Is that Leisure Suit Larry in the Land of the Lounge Lizards? sounds inspired by.

I think it is (or, can be) enforced by camera

ian

Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #8 on: 27 November, 2018, 12:36:25 pm »
In most US states (I've been in) it's enforceable by camera and mostly seems adhered to. The NJ turnpike had/has one (at peak times in certain areas). I used to pick up a homeless person in the Bronx and then kick them out in Piscataway (or wherever they sobered enough to realise they'd been kidnapped).

Needs must. Plus you'd get a bonus from NYC for reducing their homeless population.

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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #9 on: 27 November, 2018, 12:43:50 pm »
I nearly got sideswiped utterly to DETH by some clown on I-5 near Seattle, so anxious was he to cross four normal lanes to reach the HOV one.
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Cudzoziemiec

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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #10 on: 27 November, 2018, 01:01:50 pm »
[ So in effect it's a lane for every vehicle except cars without any passengers...
Yes, but don't underestimate just how many vehicles are in that one class, it's about 60% of car journeys that are single occupant I think.
I would actually have guessed somewhat higher than that. It just struck me that decades ago bus lanes were introduced, and various other vehicle types lobbied to be included, some successfully: cycles, motorcycles, taxis – some unsuccessfully: lorries, for some reason often coaches and IIRC in London it is or was the case that minicabs are not allowed in bus lanes? Now we have "Bus Lane Plus Plus"!
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Kim

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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #11 on: 27 November, 2018, 01:20:55 pm »
Have pedal cycles ever not been allowed in bus lanes[1]?  My understanding was they had right of way on the public highway, and it was legally difficult to ban them compared to motor vehicles.


[1] Not counting dedicated roads that are the bus equivalent of motorways: Access roads to bus stations and the like.

Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #12 on: 27 November, 2018, 01:27:12 pm »
Have pedal cycles ever not been allowed in bus lanes[1]?  My understanding was they had right of way on the public highway, and it was legally difficult to ban them compared to motor vehicles.

[1] Not counting dedicated roads that are the bus equivalent of motorways: Access roads to bus stations and the like.

There's a bus-only lane near me: https://goo.gl/maps/KE8NCuctyBs

No one's ever stopped me cycling in it (it's marginally quicker than the road alternative as there are fewer sets of traffic lights, and generally quicker than the Sustrans obstacle course of a cycle path).

Kim

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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #13 on: 27 November, 2018, 01:37:01 pm »
Yeah, I must confess to regularly accessing Euston station via the bus-only road.  Much better than pushing a bike through the crowd of pedestrians.

Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #14 on: 27 November, 2018, 03:24:07 pm »
Have pedal cycles ever not been allowed in bus lanes[1]?  My understanding was they had right of way on the public highway, and it was legally difficult to ban them compared to motor vehicles.


[1] Not counting dedicated roads that are the bus equivalent of motorways: Access roads to bus stations and the like.

Bikes are not allowed in bus lanes in Chester

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.1679198,-2.9017715,3a,15y,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s1a1EpTJAl3tjPTXduTpXrQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Compliance is enforced by punishment passes from bus drivers. The cycleway referred to in the sign is a metre wide shared bit of the pavement which is supposed to be 2 way. Oh it's outside a school as well (The local minor public school so none of the little dears actually walk or cycle there but still not best practice)
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Kim

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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #15 on: 27 November, 2018, 03:26:13 pm »
I wonder what the legal status of that sign is.  I wouldn't be surprised if it's the equivalent of "Cyclists dismount".

Not that it matters if you're being harassed by bus drivers....

rogerzilla

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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #16 on: 27 November, 2018, 03:32:29 pm »
In most US states (I've been in) it's enforceable by camera and mostly seems adhered to. The NJ turnpike had/has one (at peak times in certain areas). I used to pick up a homeless person in the Bronx and then kick them out in Piscataway (or wherever they sobered enough to realise they'd been kidnapped).

Needs must. Plus you'd get a bonus from NYC for reducing their homeless population.
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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #17 on: 27 November, 2018, 03:36:04 pm »
It's only legal with an associated TRO. Unfortunately Chester doesn't have an online list of TROs and I lost the will to live (and moved to a different site) before I could be bothered to go down the FOE route. There are only 6 scheduled buses an hour on that route so you wonder why the council bothered. Chester was also a 'cycling demonstration town' for a while but the only result was a study paper that the council ignored.
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Cudzoziemiec

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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #18 on: 27 November, 2018, 08:54:44 pm »
It's not actually a No Cycling white disc with a red edge sign, so almost certainly only advisory. And all the crapper for that.
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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #19 on: 29 November, 2018, 12:24:23 pm »
There was a similar experiment on a motorway near Montreal some 20 years ago. It worked fine, until some drivers with no passengers had the idea of sitting an inflatable doll on the passenger seat. Retailers of said dolls probably made quick fortunes, until the government passed a law stating that it is illegal to drive with a doll on the passenger seat  ::-)

Kim

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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #20 on: 29 November, 2018, 12:34:04 pm »
I wonder if that applies to skellingtons?

I once had the pleasure of witnessing somebody driving out of an access road by Brizzle University's Biology building with skellingtons in all the passenger seats.  Made my morning.

Cudzoziemiec

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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #21 on: 29 November, 2018, 01:59:38 pm »
I hope they were wearing their seat belts!  :D
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Kim

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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #22 on: 29 November, 2018, 04:48:07 pm »
I hope they were wearing their seat belts!  :D

They were!

simonp

Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #23 on: 29 November, 2018, 04:52:35 pm »
Nice idea, but how is this enforced?

Judging by the amount of abuse I see of this lane by single-occupancy cars, I would say it's not enforced at all.

Adam

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Re: Non-car lane
« Reply #24 on: 01 December, 2018, 04:41:55 pm »
Have pedal cycles ever not been allowed in bus lanes[1]?  My understanding was they had right of way on the public highway, and it was legally difficult to ban them compared to motor vehicles.


[1] Not counting dedicated roads that are the bus equivalent of motorways: Access roads to bus stations and the like.

Crawley has some, strictly for buses only.  They're described as guided bus lanes, but not like the Cambridge or Luton busways.
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