Going to Japan

[Jakob]

Some interesting stuff, thanks all.

DO NOT underestimate the language barrier. Not only do very few people speak English but in my experience people seemed too embarrassed to engage in pantomime. And I could not make myself understood at all with my poor Japanese.

How poor is your Japanese? I have no illusions about what I will achieve in the 5 months I've got, but I expect to get a modicum of familiarity with reading and speaking. It looks substantially easier than Mandarin, I was able to learn enough of that to be able to read, write and speak to manage 3 independent weeks in China. Effective communication in spoken Mandarin was  the hardest, because of the tonality, I suspect that reading may be harder in Japanese, I dunno.

We're  looking at three weeks, flying business class Air China will help acclimitisation at less than the cost of Premium Economy BA etc, no kids

<starts looking for slip-on shoes>

If you can read Chinese characters, you can often guess the meaning, as long as you know the context. Other than that, I doubt you'll learn anything real useful in 5 months, without putting some real work into it. (private tutoring, etc).

[Ham]

Shit. The babel fish has been baked. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WeByuOD8k1c

[Tom B]

I was able to learn enough of that to be able to read, write and speak to manage 3 independent weeks in China. Effective communication in spoken Mandarin was  the hardest, because of the tonality

This recalls a syndicated agony column from years ago: 'Anyone who can eat around a worm and carry on a conversation with the hostess at the same time doesn't need advice from Ann Landers.'

Anyway, you'll find any Chinese characters you can recall to be highly beneficial. Ok, some have slightly different forms or usages in Japan, but there is a high degree of similarity.

There is lot of good advice above but here are a few pointers that come to mind from a Chinese-and-Japanese speaker:

*   Mandarin is hard at the beginning because of tones and unfamiliar sounds. After you have got thru that bit, it is more straightforward. Putting words together into sentences is simpler than European languages but because of the lack of grammatical endings. Conjugate the verb 'to have' in Chinese: '有 / yǒu'. Job's a good'un.

*   Japanese pronunciation and word stress are not hard. It must have one of the simplest sound systems of any major language. Learn the five vowel sounds and how to make the 'o' and 'u' long when necessary (and it is a looong sound). Keep the stress patterns even and keep practising the polysyllabic words. There's a bit more to it than that, but not much.

*   Japanese has a number of conventional polite expressions that get used a lot - and I mean a lot.  When you're in Japan, you'll hear them all the time and so can work out when to use them. 'Sumimasen' is a good all-purpose polite expression. It can mean 'excuse me (can you tell me where the station is)', as well as 'I'm sorry, a mild 'thank you', and a mild 'see you' ('arigatoo' and 'sayonara' carry more meaning and so are not always the most fitting)

*  Japanese has lots and lots of words from other languages. Those from outside the Sinosphere  are written in the katakana script. Japanese will expect you to understand 'katakana words' aka Gairaigo, even those that are meaningless to English-speakers. The good news is that most are not meaningless: for every 'pasu-kon' (personal computer) there are ten or a dozen on the lines of 'miruku', 'rajio', 'pen', 'doa', 'aisu kurīmu' etc. Learning these is a good language-hack for Japanese.

I could go on with more if you like, or PM me if you have specific questions. In case you're wondering, I studied Chinese at Uni (Leeds and Beijing) and lived in Japan in the 1980s.

[LEE]

The last time I was in Japan we encountered a mass dog wedding (dogs marrying other dogs, anything else would be wrong)

Interesting that you think Dogs marrying Dogs is OK and that their owners haven't got too much time on their hands.

[Cudzoziemiec]

*  Japanese has lots and lots of words from other languages. Those from outside the Sinosphere  are written in the katakana script. Japanese will expect you to understand 'katakana words' aka Gairaigo, even those that are meaningless to English-speakers. The good news is that most are not meaningless: for every 'pasu-kon' (personal computer) there are ten or a dozen on the lines of 'miruku', 'rajio', 'pen', 'doa', 'aisu kurīmu' etc. Learning these is a good language-hack for Japanese.

Interesting that the example given in the introduction to the Wikipedia page, 'level up' meaning 'rise a level', is now used with that meaning in certain contexts in English. Whether this is absorption from Japanese or not, I don't know. Sorry, this doesn't help you going to Japan, I just find the whole process of loan words and their alteration fascinating.

[Ham]

..... I just find the whole process of loan words and their alteration fascinating.

So do I, cross fertilisation is fantastic. There are actually quite a few from Chinese into english, like the expression "having a look-see" is reputedly from the Chinese (who have a habit of repeating words for emphasis or familiarity) Kan-kan. Chin-chin and chop chop are clearly closer. Ketchup, char, amongst others.

Tom, thanks for that, I'm pleased that I appear to have realistic expectations (maybe). And yes, I've already realised that I shouldn't have any problem identifying men's and women's facilities

[Randy_Butternubs]

Some interesting stuff, thanks all.

DO NOT underestimate the language barrier. Not only do very few people speak English but in my experience people seemed too embarrassed to engage in pantomime. And I could not make myself understood at all with my poor Japanese.

How poor is your Japanese? I have no illusions about what I will achieve in the 5 months I've got, but I expect to get a modicum of familiarity with reading and speaking. It looks substantially easier than Mandarin, I was able to learn enough of that to be able to read, write and speak to manage 3 independent weeks in China. Effective communication in spoken Mandarin was  the hardest, because of the tonality, I suspect that reading may be harder in Japanese, I dunno.

We're  looking at three weeks, flying business class Air China will help acclimitisation at less than the cost of Premium Economy BA etc, no kids

<starts looking for slip-on shoes>

Very poor. I had learned some but it was a long while ago. I knew a few phrases and thought with a phrase-book I'd be able to get by but due to lack of practice was frustratingly unable to make the sounds correctly.

With some Chinese and 5 months you should be fine.

[ian]

The last time I was in Japan we encountered a mass dog wedding (dogs marrying other dogs, anything else would be wrong)

Interesting that you think Dogs marrying Dogs is OK and that their owners haven't got too much time on their hands.

Well, I was thinking about dogs marrying people. Which after the hentai girls would possibly have passed for normal. It was a very peculiar day even by Japanese standards. I like Japan. I'm not going to attempt understanding the place, it would just spoil it. My wife is over there. There's a cup noodle museum across the road from her hotel. I can't believe she's still not been in.

[rogerzilla]

Is there anywhere you can pay to crash through one of those paper walls, like in every Bond film set in Japan?

[nikki]

There's a cup noodle museum across the road from her hotel. I can't believe she's still not been in.

I went to the one in Yokohama 3 weeks ago.




I'm still shaking.







Custom Cup Noodle thobut.

[ian]

That's the one. Though I like to imagine they're a standard feature of Japanese cities.

Most Japanese I know refuse to believe the amount of potato salad we ate the last time we were there. It's true though, we had potato salad everywhere. I think we somehow slipped into a secret potato salad subculture. They have a special sign and everything. And a mime. My potato salad mime is fantastic.

Though possibly it wasn't potato salad and my starchy tuber mimicry isn't nearly as good as I claim.