TdF 2011 general discussion thread - likely to contain spoilers

[Sergeant Pluck]

I'm astonished that Vino wasn't brought up out of the trees on a back board.

Likewise, crazy really. That, leaving decisions as to whether they are well enough to ride to injured riders, and two crashes caused by Tour personnel - all a bit shambolic.

[arvid]

Why arnt they talking about prosecuting the driver ,never mind sending him home??

The Vacansoleil team director is considering this. They will investigate their options tomorrow.

[Hot Flatus]

There are always interactions between Tour vehicles and riders, usually not on camera though. It is, sadly, a fairly usual happening for a spectator to get injured or killed as well.

More serious crashes than usual, though, but then the Giro was similar.

[Sergeant Pluck]

David Millar's interview was interesting - he was saying that, in effect, "better equipment" and a more uniform fitness level was making the Tour faster; this and the higher stakes was making racing riskier.

How much faster are they going, compared to say 30 years ago?

[border-rider]

They seem to be piling along pretty minor roads at times too.  I know that's often so in the mountains, but the early stages - I thought - the roads usually are a bit more open

[Hot Flatus]

How much faster are they going, compared to say 30 years ago?

About 3-6k faster overall average

[Rhys W]

Why arnt they talking about prosecuting the driver ,never mind sending him home??

The Vacansoleil team director is considering this. They will investigate their options tomorrow.

Dave Brailsford seemed to hint that this was being considered as well.

[arvid]

The Dutch commenters are blaming the material, although they are unclear about the reason why. I think it has more to do with the stakes tbh.
They might have a point though. I know from motorbikes that good old steel frames give way earlier feedback than more modern stiff racing frames. I reckon the same will apply to bicycle frames. Maybe the carbon frames don't give any feedback until they're actually losing the bike already? I wonder if titanium bikes would fix this.

[Hot Flatus]

Feedback is irrelevant when you are either hit by a car, or overbook a bend and go off the edge

[andygates]

As Millar said of his first crash of the day (!), there was no time to do anything, bam, he was down; and Brad said of his crash, people went down ahead and it was a tight bit of road and bam, they were all down.

The riders crashing is one thing.  The riders being taken out by doltish driving is a whole other.  Media cars need to keep their damn distance while the roads are narrow.  If they carry on like this, the riders will have a bolshy strike stage -- they've protested over less before.

[David Martin]

I don't see why media cars are in the race convoy next to the riders at all. Cameramen/photographers on motorbikes, yes, but media?

Maybe they will insist that all drivers are qualified race officials, irrespective of whom they are driving for.

There is a difference between riders in the convoy off the back of the bunch being hit/colliding with cars and having some numpty enter the sterile zone and knock off the riders through stupid driving.

..d

[CyclistsAnonymous]

I've only just seen the clips on Sky News this morning. Looks like a very dangerous situation. Great clip to promote safe driving when near cyclists though

[TheLurker]

To lighten the mood a little...

It would seem that Sergei the Meerkat is a member of the Lampre Tifosi.  If you can bear to watch the advert look at his tie...

[David Martin]

To lighten the mood a little...

It would seem that Sergei the Meerkat is a member of the Lampre Tifosi.  If you can bear to watch the advert look at his tie...

Really? I had him down as a Katusha man meerkat

[Nuncio]

Anyone else notice the near thing in the final couple of kms, with a spectator hanging over the boards, camera to eye, almost taking out an HTC (I think) rider.  There was contact and the rider made a quick adjustment in towards the pack, but without coming off or taking anyone else out.  The spectater was spun round backwards away from the hoarding.  I hope his camera was broken.

[matthew]

When overtaking a cyclist goes wrong, choosing between the tree and the cyclists, should be a no brainer for the driver, tree every time. Particularly when filming a cycle race. However it never seems to happen that way.

[LEE]

When overtaking a cyclist goes wrong, choosing between the tree and the cyclists, should be a no brainer for the driver, tree every time. Particularly when filming a cycle race. However it never seems to happen that way.

It was incompetent driving but, if he'd chosen the tree, I would have expected more injuries as the car spun into the road causing everyone behind to choose quickly between stationary car, trees & cyclists.

Just numpty driving, looking sideways at cyclists rather than ahead I bet.

The riders got lucky and the driver got lucky this time, it could have been a lot more serious.

More idiots are yet to come.  Those wankers, supposedly cycling fans, running alongside the top climbers on the big climbs, waving flags in their faces and bouncing off other specators as they run, barely missing the cyclists as they do so.

I'm amazed at how many "cycling fans" show almost no consideration for the pros.

[border-rider]

It was incompetent driving but, if he'd chosen the tree, I would have expected more injuries as the car spun into the road causing everyone behind to choose quickly between stationary car, trees & cyclists.

I think he'd have had a couple of motorbikes and some cyclists pile into the back of the car if he'd either hit the tree or braked hard also.

The riders got lucky and the driver got lucky this time, it could have been a lot more serious.

+1

Very balanced reactions from the riders involved I thought. Shocked but happy still to be alive and accepting that it wasn't deliberate.

I did wonder what that car was doing, though. Why did it need even to be mixed up in the riders ?

[pcolbeck]

Isn't a media car the TdFs equivalent of a box at Man United. You can put your friends / business clients in it as a treat.

[David Martin]

I did wonder what that car was doing, though. Why did it need even to be mixed up in the riders ?

Non-team cars had been told to move to the side and let the Europcar team car through to Voeckler. They were told to not attempt to pass the riders. Instead of obeying race radio the driver deliberately tried to pass the riders on a narrow road. (Having driven comissaires before I can attest to how difficult this is on a wide road let alone a narrow one.)

Quite rightly thrown off the tour. Driver and vehicle. I can easily see drivers in future needing some proper accreditation and proof of race convoy experience before being allowed to drive in the convoy.

..d

[David Martin]

Isn't a media care the TdFs equivalent of a box at Man United. You can put your friends / business clients in it as a treat.

Yes, to a great extent. It shouldn't have been anywhere near the riders.

[andygates]

Any word on how vino is doing?

[perpetual dan]

Apparently surgery on "head of the right femoral" went well. Astana's home page has him giving a thumbs up.

I really wish I hadn't clicked on accident pictures during lunch. From the youtube the car doesn't look to be in danger of even clipping a wing mirror on the tree and misses the bank quite easily.

[jogler]

From the youtube the car doesn't look to be in danger of even clipping a wing mirror on the tree and misses the bank quite easily.

I too had the same opinion

[Nuncio]

From Van Den Broeck To Stay In Intensive Care, Vino Operated On Overnight  | Cyclingnews.com

Jurgen Van Den Broeck will stay in intensive care for two or three days as he recovers from his injuries after crashing out on a descent during Sunday’s ninth stage to Saint Flour.

The Omega Pharma-Lotto team leader fractured three ribs, his shoulder blade and also suffered from a collapsed lung. He initially tried to continue in the race...

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