Yet Another Cycling Forum
General Category => Freewheeling => Topic started by: zigzag on 01 February, 2017, 05:11:25 pm
-
i'd like some low profile mudguard reflectors, mainly as they look neater and snag less while still being effective at reflecting light. any idea where i could get ones (like the sks ones in the picture) without buying the whole set of 'guards?
(http://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/fuAAAOSw241Yhisu/s-l1600.jpg)
-
Reflective tape is lighter
-
Googling "cycle mudguard reflector" brought up useful stuff, including...
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VINTAGE-BICYCLE-REAR-MUDGUARD-ROUND-REFLECTOR-/221307986206
-
Reflective tape is lighter
and potentially reflects more light in total - although mudguards aren't quite flat enough for the most brilliant tape, unfortunatenly, like 3M Diamond Grade that's rather stiff.
-
Stiff reflective tape works very nicely on mudflaps.
-
Reflective tape is lighter
My thoughts exactly. Though it isn't a legal substitute for the BS marked reflector, if you care about such things.
-
How many folks here use BS-marked front and rear lights?
-
Probably just the Brompton owners. Though I've definitely got a couple of BS reflectors on the fleet (courtesy of SKS).
K-marks, of course, are a little more prolific.
Personally, while being compliant does no harm, I reckon the spirit is more important than the letter of the law, and a nice strip of red Scotchlite would be simple and robust.
-
I even made mudflaps entirely out of stiff reflective tape - not one of my most durable creations! Of course sticking the tape on sexisting flaps is the way to do it.
-
reflective tape works well on flat surfaces, but mudguards are curved in both directions, so unless the tape is stretchy it wouldn't stick neatly. proper reflectors are more visible and durable too. another brand that makes low profile reflectors is vavert, again, not sold separately
(http://www.laxzo.com/ekmps/shops/jsphshi/images/vavert-35mm-fixed-mudguard-rear-reflector-road-racing-bike-cycle-bicycle-14352-p.jpg)
-
I have red reflective self adhesive vinyl, if you'd like some.
It is vehicle wrap, so stretches in each direction.
There was some on the end of the mdgrd on my Pompino - until that snapped off >:(
-
I don't even have a reflector on the Surly, just a strip of reflective-fluorescent tape that's part of the Carradice. But I have thought about attaching a reflector on to the mudguards. Just haven't got around to doing it yet...
I even made mudflaps entirely out of stiff reflective tape - not one of my most durable creations! Of course sticking the tape on sexisting flaps is the way to do it.
Is this some kind of kinky bondage you're into? :D
-
You could fit an old (cheap/free) lightweight filament dynamo combined mudguard lamp for its approved reflector:
which even if (unused) lamp part is not legal as your SOLE* UK rear lamp, according to Chris Juden, reflectors are more standardised so it will probably have BS6102/2 (/3 is for lamps) or an EI or EIA mark or a or a K mark( note there are separate K numbers for reflector and lamp so a combined unit should have 2 K numbers) .
https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?t=81117&start=135#p742896 (https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?t=81117&start=135#p742896)
The trouble with saying only the spirit of the law matters is when a negligent driver hits you, and their insurance company is pleased because they can then accuse you of contributary negligence due to the lack of following the letter of the law and can reduce/avoid payout .... Have heard of this with a rear lamp..
-
I think it's quite easy to find BS-marked reflectors. Much easier than lights (and arguably more useful, in that the reflectors work identically to those without BS markings whereas BS marked lights tend to be not so good, and in that most bikes come with the reflectors fitted when new).
I wonder how cyclists manage to be legally compliant in countries lower down the cycling marketing rankings than UK.
-
The trouble with saying only the spirit of the law matters is when a negligent driver hits you, and their insurance company is pleased because they can then accuse you of contributary negligence due to the lack of following the letter of the law and can reduce/avoid payout .... Have heard of this with a rear lamp..
Well yes, but you're already stuffed by the pedal reflector rule if you use most clipless pedals, recumbent cycles, panniers, etc.
-
reflective tape works well on flat surfaces, but mudguards are curved in both directions, so unless the tape is stretchy it wouldn't stick neatly.
Thin tape/sheet is often just about stretchy enough to make it work, albeit with the odd small crease at the edges in some cases. Mine doesn't look 100% neat close up, but stays stuck down perfectly well. It helps not to cover the whole width.
As for being visible, reflective tape can be *more* visible than a "proper" reflector even when it's less reflective per square inch, simply by covering a many more square inches. The effectiveness of commonly available products, IMO, ranges from adequate to amazing.
I even made mudflaps entirely out of stiff reflective tape - not one of my most durable creations! Of course sticking the tape on sexisting flaps is the way to do it.
Is this some kind of kinky bondage you're into? :D
Sorry*. Of course I would never mean to recommend sexting one's flaps.
* Not really. I noticed the typo before posting but posted anyway. :demon:
-
As for being visible, reflective tape can be *more* visible than a "proper" reflector even when it's less reflective per square inch, simply by covering a many more square inches. The effectiveness of commonly available products, IMO, ranges from adequate to amazing.
IME Scotchlite reflects better than the corner cube plastic reflectors in pretty much all real-world circumstances, as it's much less fussy about angles.
-
I was surprised to discover empirically (late night campsite loo wanderings with head torch) that the red reflector built into a B&M rear light reflects brighter than the white stuff printed onto Carradice panniers. I'm not sure where Carradice get their reflectives from, but they do look printed on. The stitched on tape they use on the Super C saddlebag looks significantly brighter than what they use on panniers and other saddlebags.
-
...Well yes, but you're already stuffed by the pedal reflector rule if you use most clipless pedals, recumbent cycles, panniers, etc.
In a Cycle(CTC era) Q&A page Chris Juden's opinion was as long as your pedal reflectors were visible at some point in their arc(eg briefly visible below panniers) you should be OK cos the amber flashing would be visible:
but recumbent-ists will just have to wait for the law to be updated...(perhaps due to the red tape challenge:)
(ie hope for option D of TRL report PPR711)
some (usually shimano) clipless pedals can take pedal reflectors (covered on CTC/C-UK forum).
https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=92645&start=510#p907291 (https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=92645&start=510#p907291)
-
The red reflective tape challenge? :D
-
thank you for the suggestions; unless it is done professionally reflective tape looks like a bodge. e.g. a few neatly cut and applied chevrons would look alright imo, while a piece of tape with creases not so much. as said in my original post i'd like a reflector, that is flush with the mudguard and follows it's shape.
-
Reflective tape is lighter
and potentially reflects more light in total - although mudguards aren't quite flat enough for the most brilliant tape, unfortunatenly, like 3M Diamond Grade that's rather stiff.
You may find that heating it up with a hair dryer will make it flexible enough to stick onto a compound curve.
-
Reflective tape is lighter
and potentially reflects more light in total - although mudguards aren't quite flat enough for the most brilliant tape, unfortunatenly, like 3M Diamond Grade that's rather stiff.
You may find that heating it up with a hair dryer will make it flexible enough to stick onto a compound curve.
Also, putting a *little* bit of stretch in it, as you would with electrical tape, and starting in the centre and working outwards.
-
The heat tip is good for adhesive tape/sheet in general, but Diamond Grade is still too stiff for mudguards, IME, especially when it cools back down. I don't think it stretches at all.
-
What about the stuff made for lorries? Sticks on curtain siders so must have a bit of flex in it.
-
What about the stuff made for lorries? Sticks on curtain siders so must have a bit of flex in it.
The non-diamond-grade stuff is fine. I have it on all sorts of curved surfaces on my bikes (eg. cranks).
-
Although it seems that diamond grade often is what's used for ECE104.
http://www.vikingtapes.co.uk/c-451-reflective-tape.aspx#.WJN9p44jHIU
Of course lots of lorries have flat, rigid sides.
-
Proper approved reflectors aren't exactly heavy: why take the risk of legal problems? You can fit both red tape and an approved reflector.....
-
Proper approved reflectors aren't exactly heavy: why take the risk of legal problems? You can fit both red tape and an approved reflector.....
Indeed, that's what I have on my commuting bike. Approved reflectors, BS (or EU equivalent) lights (backed up by others that aren't an official standard), and other reflectives.
(Yes, even pedal reflectors - Shimano PD-T400 Click'r pedals - double sided SPD and built in reflectors, not easily snappable click in ones which make the pedals single sided.)
-
Proper approved reflectors aren't exactly heavy: why take the risk of legal problems?
Proper reflectors for clipless pedals can spoil the experience or limit choice, as can approved lights, and when I'm already illegal because of those things then I perceive any additional risk from lack of an approved rear reflector to be almost zero, so I don't bother to find and fit a suitable one.
Just answering the question, not encouraging anyone else to go without proper reflectors.
-
Is there a forum-recommended supplier of small quantities of reflective tape, or is it (as ever) just a question of picking from ebay?
-
Edited to add; below is in reply to zigzag, not jsabine's question
Do the reflectors work if rotated 90 degrees?
If so something like this?
https://www.rydestore.com/ryde-eclipse-oblong-motorcycle-safety-reflectors-red.html?gclid=CJnJuMajg9ICFWa77QodZ7sEFA (https://www.rydestore.com/ryde-eclipse-oblong-motorcycle-safety-reflectors-red.html?gclid=CJnJuMajg9ICFWa77QodZ7sEFA)
-
Is there a forum-recommended supplier of small quantities of reflective tape, or is it (as ever) just a question of picking from ebay?
eBay was cheapest for cycle-related quantities last time I looked (accounting for postage as well). Hopefully those who have bought recently will recommend particular items and sellers. Quality (reflectivity) of unbranded products is very variable but can be what you want for thin and flexible stuff. Stick to 3M Diamond Grade for applications where it can be stiff.
-
Velo Orange:
https://www.veloduo.co.uk/products/velo-orange-grand-cru-polished-alloy-mudguard-reflector (https://www.veloduo.co.uk/products/velo-orange-grand-cru-polished-alloy-mudguard-reflector)
(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0744/6897/products/1_1e45cfc6-d0fd-4100-acca-ab7e1a2be7c7_medium.jpeg?v=1421136755)
-
Edited to add; below is in reply to zigzag, not jsabine's question
Do the reflectors work if rotated 90 degrees?
If so something like this?
https://www.rydestore.com/ryde-eclipse-oblong-motorcycle-safety-reflectors-red.html?gclid=CJnJuMajg9ICFWa77QodZ7sEFA (https://www.rydestore.com/ryde-eclipse-oblong-motorcycle-safety-reflectors-red.html?gclid=CJnJuMajg9ICFWa77QodZ7sEFA)
thank you, but it would still sit away from the mudguard, as the mudguard is curved and the reflector is flat.
the ideal reflector would be of a similar shape, only curved to match mudguard's shape, with the optics inside oriented horizontally back, when the reflector is attached between 10 and 11 o'clock, if that makes sense.
Velo Orange:
https://www.veloduo.co.uk/products/velo-orange-grand-cru-polished-alloy-mudguard-reflector (https://www.veloduo.co.uk/products/velo-orange-grand-cru-polished-alloy-mudguard-reflector)
(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0744/6897/products/1_1e45cfc6-d0fd-4100-acca-ab7e1a2be7c7_medium.jpeg?v=1421136755)
thank you, i've already got similar ones, and it's not what i'm after
-
SJS have these
https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/lighting/jos-mudguard-fitting-rear-light-reflector/
Any nearer what you are looking for ?
-
SJS have these
https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/lighting/jos-mudguard-fitting-rear-light-reflector/
Any nearer what you are looking for ?
nope, nowhere near :)
-
We have applied some of the red reflective stuff that somebody here on the forum was selling a while back. Bumper if I recall correctly?
Well, it is not very effective imo, certainly far less reflective at the patches on Ortlieb panniers, nor as good as the B&M reflectors built into their lights, nor as good as the reflectors built into Philips rear lights.
Every little helps but sometimes something just doesn't quite cut it.
-
Edited to add; below is in reply to zigzag, not jsabine's question
Do the reflectors work if rotated 90 degrees?
If so something like this?
https://www.rydestore.com/ryde-eclipse-oblong-motorcycle-safety-reflectors-red.html?gclid=CJnJuMajg9ICFWa77QodZ7sEFA (https://www.rydestore.com/ryde-eclipse-oblong-motorcycle-safety-reflectors-red.html?gclid=CJnJuMajg9ICFWa77QodZ7sEFA)
Probably not so well. They're usually tilted slightly to left and right, so if you rotate them 90 degrees they would no longer be vertical.
-
Is there a forum-recommended supplier of small quantities of reflective tape, or is it (as ever) just a question of picking from ebay?
eBay was cheapest for cycle-related quantities last time I looked (accounting for postage as well). Hopefully those who have bought recently will recommend particular items and sellers. Quality (reflectivity) of unbranded products is very variable but can be what you want for thin and flexible stuff. Stick to 3M Diamond Grade for applications where it can be stiff.
How stiff is Diamond Grade? Comparable to cereal box, removals box, stiff plastic? I get the impression from other posts it would be good to stiffen up otherwise flexy mudflap material - is that right?
-
*has a feel of some DG*
Oh, it's more flexible than I was remembering - cereal-packet-like - but still it would add a little stiffness to a mudflap. It may help to use 55mm rather than strips of 25mm.
-
I discovered yesterday that you can get retroreflective paints, made using microscopic glass beads, eg: http://www.glowtec.co.uk/reflective-paint-info.htm. I think that's the same principle as Scotchlight. What's more, it seems you can even get powder coating. So if you want, you can have your whole frame reflective, for a price. That would certainly give you night time visibility, though of course it wouldn't satisfy any regulations (at least not in the UK).
-
*has a feel of some DG*
Oh, it's more flexible than I was remembering - cereal-packet-like - but still it would add a little stiffness to a mudflap. It may help to use 55mm rather than strips of 25mm.
That sounds about right for what I want - thanks.
Having got some of Jurek's thin'n'flexy stuff this morning (thanks, Jurek!), I shall have a gander on ebay.
-
in the end i bought a set of mudguards (which i don't need) for a reflector. if anyone sees cateye rr-c1 sold individually, let me know as i need few more.
(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170306/68e046254c36a29ccf60c1edf7280938.jpg)
-
Rigid plastic reflectors like that need to be fitted facing straight back - i.e. the face close to vertical.
The retro reflection falls off quite quickly once the angle between the light and the face gets further than about 15 degrees from square on. That's why there are 3 faces; to cover a wider horizontal angle.
-
the trick with this particular model is that it's designed to be mounted at 10 o'clock position while reflecting horizontally back - which is what i was after. the only way i would improve it (to suit my needs) is to make it narrower, i.e. get rid of the sides, and increase/extend the central part to about 2x12cm, so that it covers 10->11 o'clock section. the optics should obviously be oriented backwards along the whole curve. the above/below is the best i could find on the market so far..
(http://202.215.251.86/images/product/any/rr_c1_zu.jpg)