Author Topic: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset  (Read 3798 times)

Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« on: 25 November, 2015, 12:57:34 pm »
This was originally given a 'working title' of 'Little Lane Improvement Project' but, thanks to one of the group is now likely to become known as 'Mud Sweat and Volunteers'

The project is to reinstate a track from close to the centre of the village to the A357 (about 1 mile) where it's a short distance to a newly built car park and the North Dorset Trailway. From there it's a short ride to Sturminster Newton, a longer ride to Blandford Forum, access to Child Okeford is improved. Shillingstone Station (a historic restoration of a disused railway station with a cafe) is very close to where Little Lane will emerge.

This is what we presented during a Neighbour Plan public presentation: Link to big pdf. The second round of questionnaires is now being analysed and appear to be showing that most of the parish is in favour.

Some preliminary work (mainly keeping landowners informed and sorting some of the drainage problems out) has already started.
We have two ears and one mouth for a reason. We should do twice as much listening as talking.

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #1 on: 27 November, 2015, 02:24:04 pm »
We had a meeting with one of the land agents today.

We now know all of the land owners/tenants/agents on either side of the lane and have, pretty much, a decent level of support and willingness to cooperate. From some, even, willingness to offer support.

The agent we spoke to also gave advice on dealing with the council (specifically getting receipts for any scalpings delivered to us as 'recycled material' and not 'waste').

We also got a hint (from another landowner) that the feature we call 'The Lake' may once have been kept clear by a culvert under the lane. We'll need to do a bit more investigation (digging) to see if we can find at least one end of that. Access to the field on the upstream side is awkward but we'll find it on the downstream side if it does exist.

In February The Lake (water) was deeper than my wellies are tall:



We've now got rid of much of the water. The mud, though, is deeper than my wellies are tall:



Somewhere under here we think there may be a culvert.


We have two ears and one mouth for a reason. We should do twice as much listening as talking.

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #2 on: 29 November, 2015, 04:15:11 pm »
Looks like a brilliant project. Hope you get the support you need and win through with a decent surface for all users.

Mike

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #3 on: 29 November, 2015, 04:26:36 pm »
The culvert (if it exists) may well be easier to find in the field. What sort of age and where would the water run from/to?
 
We have a few hundred meters of this to deal with but no culvert.
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #4 on: 29 November, 2015, 05:34:27 pm »
A lady I talked to, yesterday, told me she used to help keep the culverts and ditches clear a long time ago. She doesn't remember a culvert  under the road at 'The Lake'. Unfortunately. It's 'always' been subject to flooding there.

On the west side around that part of the lane is a field that has already been planted (not sure what with) but digging in there wouldn't go down too well. A cross section across the lane from west to east would be:

1) Planted field
2) Field margin about 1 to 2m wide - possibly a conservation strip we would not want to disturb
3) Barbed wire fence
4) Hedge
5) A drop of about 1m to the road surface
6) Road surface
7) A short rise of (less than 1m) which, years ago, had drainage grips which drained into
8) A ditch parallel to the road and currently full of years of brambles, hedge trimmings and silt
9) Another hedge
10) More fields (currently grassed with no livestock but may contain a dairy herd next year)

Another ditch (full of brambles, detritus and silt) and roughly perpendicular to the lane, runs down to a brook.

Water/drainage flow is west to east.

IMO the ditch parallel to the lane is, really, on the wrong side. It should be on the west side. I don't see us being able to change that. A qualified drainage specialist might have a better chance of convincing the 'committee' but we don't have one of those yet.

My plan would be to continue improving the ditches on the east side where, if there is a culvert under the lane, we should find the outlet. If we find an outlet that would give us more evidence to support a search for its inlet on the west side and significantly narrow down the search. A very large oak tree  on the west side has (likely) destroyed the culvert if there ever was one there.

If we decide to move the ditch to the west side (and the lane to the east) we would need to put at least one culvert underneath the lane to give water in the new (west) ditch somewhere to go.

It would be nice to sort out the drainage at this particular point for, at least, the next 20 years.

We have two ears and one mouth for a reason. We should do twice as much listening as talking.

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #5 on: 29 November, 2015, 05:40:21 pm »
An excellent scheme - good luck!

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #6 on: 29 November, 2015, 06:42:00 pm »
Probably drained with the ditches then? IIRC they need to be at least 18" below the road surface to work properly. A friend with a digger may be some help here. That would at least start the resolution of the issue.
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #7 on: 29 November, 2015, 07:18:51 pm »
Unfortunately no-one with easy access to machinery has come forward yet. The project is still gaining momentum.

We have a couple of events planned to see if we can press-gang a few more people. ;D
We have two ears and one mouth for a reason. We should do twice as much listening as talking.

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #8 on: 05 December, 2015, 12:45:14 pm »
Rumours are starting to appear about potential sources of machinery (and drivers). All to be verified before being written into the plan. Nevertheless a step in a good direction.

There is also talk of a gas pipe that crosses the lane somewhere along its length. We've seen no evidence of that on the ground but it does seem very likely. We'll do a more intensive search. Chances are it will be far too deep to be a problem to us, but I'd prefer to know where it is (if it exists).

On another issue - we might be setting up a little production line to make a steady supply of kissing gates.
We have two ears and one mouth for a reason. We should do twice as much listening as talking.

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #9 on: 10 December, 2015, 09:30:11 am »
Meeting with a friendly highway engineer this morning. A qualified opinion is always useful and might even be essential if we ever want to apply for grants or loans.

It'll be interesting to have a dig, in a few places to find out if the rumours of a tarmac surface under all the mud are true. If there is it'll be very broken up but it'll give us something to work to.
We have two ears and one mouth for a reason. We should do twice as much listening as talking.

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #10 on: 10 December, 2015, 03:50:19 pm »
Another culvert found. Something very wrong with this one so lots of clearing to do until we find out more about it. A few more ditches identified, some parallel with the lane, some perpendicular to it.

Highway engineer confirmed my plan - plug away at the ditches and drainage, get it reasonably dry, then improve it.
We have two ears and one mouth for a reason. We should do twice as much listening as talking.

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #11 on: 04 January, 2016, 04:14:33 pm »
Just had a look along the lane. The objective was to find out how it was coping with the last few days of fairly persistent p(*£ing down. It's done remarkably well so we're now thinking of getting a chain-gang together to start removing some of the mud.

Found evidence of some more old ditches that'll have to be cleared - and a couple of culverts.
We have two ears and one mouth for a reason. We should do twice as much listening as talking.

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #12 on: 08 January, 2016, 02:17:08 pm »
Sounding good! We are awaiting the decision of the new land owner before we can progress. I think he is rather swamped with other issues at the moment..

(I'll get my coat)

..d
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #13 on: 09 January, 2016, 05:44:48 pm »
I am now the proud owner of a standard Number 2 shovel.

Clearing of mud starts on Wednesday (weather permitting).
We have two ears and one mouth for a reason. We should do twice as much listening as talking.

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #14 on: 10 January, 2016, 09:12:12 pm »
Good stuff
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #15 on: 11 January, 2016, 08:22:23 am »
On Saturday we had a public exhibition of the progress on our parish neighbourhood plan - and signed up a few more volunteers to help with Little Lane. :)

Reinstating Little Lane was at the back of a few peoples' minds before research started for the neighbourhood plan. We've consistently tried to promote the idea at almost every opportunity. I've been surprised how much support it has received at the 'do you think it would be a good idea' level. The neighbourhood plan isn't finalised, yet, but it looks as though Little Lane improvement will form part of the plan and might even receive a share of the Section 106 money from the new housing that's being proposed. One of the developers has shown willingness to include easier access for Little Lane users in his proposed development.

Everyone who has shown an interest has been contacted about the mud-slinging on Wednesday. It will be interesting to see if we have gone from "I think it's a good idea" to "I'm getting involved. Here I am, and here's my shovel."

It'll be nice if it's not just the same bunch of between 4 and 6 people. The more volunteers we get, the more we can create a feeling of ownership and make sure future maintenance doesn't become a millstone around just a few (aging) necks.

We've also found evidence (hearsay at the moment) that the council erected barriers to prevent motor vehicle access. It may have been incorrectly classified as a highway. It'll be excellent if we can have it downgraded to bridleway (with access for agricultural vehicles) without too much legal hassle and expense.
We have two ears and one mouth for a reason. We should do twice as much listening as talking.

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #16 on: 11 June, 2016, 01:14:10 pm »
Great to hear of the progress on your path. The inclement weather and some land ownership issues have led to some setbacks for my project.

The land containing the trackbed was split and sold off as part of larger parcels of land. One of the new landowners is not interested in engaging with us, making any progress difficult. We had to stop the work we were doing and hand back some of the grant money as we were unable to spend it. However we do now have a full engineering assessment of how the path was when we stopped work.

Note the careful use of words. With the heavy rains over the winter we had several trees come down and a major slip in the cutting wall. This has led to a damming of the watercourse, infil of the drainage ditch and the ponding of the track.
DSC_4746 by David Martin, on Flickr hard to see but that is a substantial slip, taking out part of the field the other side of the fence above. About 70 tons of material has moved.
DSC_4713 by David Martin, on Flickr
Ponding of the track - I haven't checked the depth.

The current plan is, landowner permission dependent, to excavate the drainage ditch and place a polypipe drain, leaving the infil from the slump. That should remove the ponding.

But for now we wait.
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #17 on: 11 June, 2016, 05:56:13 pm »
Sounds like you've got more bureaucratic problems on your hands than us. The whole length of Little Lane belongs to the Council who have given us permission to just get on with it. They've even promised materials (but nothing has been forthcoming yet).

We're getting cooperation from neighbouring landowners - one, especially, has done quite a bit of work clearing drainage ditches. Another has used a JCB to strip off a lot of the mud and get it down to the base layer. Much of it has been patched, over the years, with builders rubble - most of it in chunks far too big to be any real use (agricultural bodge job). Once the base layer is fully exposed we will really see what we need to do and be able to get a budget properly worked out.

So, the next steps are to finish stripping as much mud as possible and we have to prepare a cost/benefit analysis soon for an application for a Section 106 grant - available as a result of recent building work in the parish. It's a somewhat competitive process as we're up against some other projects to which some or all of the grant money might be allocated.

The good news is that it is walkable - but only in boots. It still fails my 'walk test'. If I walk to a bus stop at the end of the lane could I go into the office without too much mud on my shoes? The answer, at the moment, has to be no. Also, some mountain bikers have reported using it - but I wouldn't recommend it for children or anyone with a child seat, trailer or trail-gator.
We have two ears and one mouth for a reason. We should do twice as much listening as talking.

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #18 on: 11 June, 2016, 10:52:19 pm »
You are way ahead of me. I need a landowner to comply, some drains, about 200 tons of infill to get a walkable base and a few tens of kilopounds to make it happen.
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #19 on: 01 November, 2017, 10:02:37 pm »
Resurrecting this thread with an update:

We got funding from 'Leader' (some French(?) acronym) which seems to be known as 'Local Action Groups' in the UK. It was topped up by a guarantee by the Parish Council for some extra work - the County Council's highways department might cover this anyway. The fundraising for the project also won an award from Cycling UK.

The 'extra work' is a problem at the north end of the Lane, where users must cross an 'A' road to get to the next sustainable part of their journey. Dorset County Council have promised to make a safe crossing.

Work has already started, and progress is such that it is now possible to walk the Lane in boots rather than wellies.

By mid-November we expect the resurfacing to be complete, and in early December there will be an opening ceremony/event.

We anticipate we'll be playing Whack-A-Mole as the new asset settles in, but - hopefully - all the work will have been worthwhile and cyclists/walkers coming to or leaving our village will be much safer.

The press release can be read here: http://www.fippennynews.co.uk/little-lane-work-starts 
We have two ears and one mouth for a reason. We should do twice as much listening as talking.

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #20 on: 14 January, 2018, 09:14:20 pm »
Thread resurrection as this link popped up on my twitter feed.
https://www.cyclinguk.org/news/new-safe-link-walkers-and-cyclists-opens-north-dorset

Well done all!

My pet project is currently awaiting a landowner deciding that we can continue with the project. We may be forced to revert to Scottish Community buy out legislation to put a marker down on the land.
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #21 on: 15 January, 2018, 09:52:23 am »
Thanks. We've still got a fair bit of snagging to do - mainly restoring the sides of the lane and getting rid of bramble roots before they sprout. At the north end (the furthest point from the village) it is necessary to cross a main road with bad sight lines in all directions of crossing and sight. As  condition of the Leader funding we had to have an acceptable plan to solve that problem. 'Highways' have a plan which is high on their priority list for early 2018.

The time between the initial idea, and the receipt of funding was put to use in 'discovering' as many problems as we could - mainly finding features (such as ditches) which had disappeared under a couple of decades of neglect. Sadly, we couldn't reinstate all the ditches. 

As a condition of the Leader funding we have to maintain the lane for at least five years - hopefully during that time we'll turn it into a much-loved, well-used asset which will not be allowed to fall into disrepair again.

We have two ears and one mouth for a reason. We should do twice as much listening as talking.

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: Mud, Sweat and Volunteers in North Dorset
« Reply #22 on: 07 April, 2018, 03:44:38 pm »
I had a very productive meeting today. The section of most problem (ie the one where the cutting sides have slumped and blocked the drainage) has been sold off along with the neighbouring farm house. Normally the prospect of dealing with another landowner would be daunting but this couple are lovely, very keen on the path and the restoration work and have the time and equipment to do a load of the work in that section too. So within a few months the drainage should be sorted. We were able to give them almost all the info we have, including tree surveys (they wondered why some of the trees had tags on) and a detailed description of what they can no longer see.

Add to that the Estate have sought planning permission for 3 new houses on the site of the old farmyard. This requires demolishing the old farm buildings. The rubble can be reprocessed straight into the cutting to make up for the robbed out track bed. And we already have SEPA guidance on this so that is a win-win.
Very enthusiastic now. Hopefully this will spur the more recalcitrant landowner on the south section to cooperate.

..d
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes