Yet Another Cycling Forum
General Category => On The Road => Topic started by: quixoticgeek on 17 January, 2019, 10:06:31 pm
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So Who's fitting studded tyres this evening ready for the impending cold snap?
Had lots of hail and some snow here this evening. Forecast is now for 4 cold, but clear days. I've got the spare wheels with the studs ready. Haven't fitted them yet, as I'm not sure if I will be venturing out on the ice just yet.
Anyone else?
J
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Mine have been fitted to the pub bike for a few weeks*, and were actually used today for a slightly icy commute :)
*The luxury of having a spare bike
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Mine have been fitted to the pub bike for a few weeks*, and were actually used today for a slightly icy commute :)
*The luxury of having a spare bike
In theory I could fit the studs to the Brompton, as the 'spare' bike, but it's such a faff with the rear hub. I'm pondering for next winter building up a real simple single speed hack bike as a winter commuter, fit the studs to it from about early December until March.
J
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What do you do about the studs scoring the frame when a Brompton is folded?
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What do you do about the studs scoring the frame when a Brompton is folded?
Leather padding.
http://b.42q.eu/2016/12/07/a-bromptons-winter-boots/
J
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My MTB has been standing by for stud duty since December. I should have used it this afternoon, or at least used the road rather than the shared-use bollocks.
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On the trike today - one day late
(https://media.giphy.com/media/R8bcfuGTZONyw/giphy.gif)
(https://media.giphy.com/media/Tb2i75AlI926I/giphy.gif)
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Going back to the original question, I've ordered studded tyres for my Brompton on the basis of the discussion above, and I already have them for the fixed that I often ride for Audaxes etc. in winter. However, it seems a bit mild, here in the balmy south east, for studs yet, so my order was more on a Be Prepared basis.
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Nope.
If it's icy or snowy, no cycling for me. Can't risk knackering the knee up again which had surgery a few years back.
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When I was living just outside Luton, on my commuter bike I'd simply switch the wheels, as I had a spare set all ready with the Marathon Winter Plus tyres on.
Now I've moved to the south coast, it doesn't seem to get anything like as cold so haven't had to worry about any ice on the roads.
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Really wish I had the bike with the studded tyres.
Loads of sodding ice on the fen roads.
I doubt I could fit marathon winters on the CDF. It is shod with 37mm hypers atm and those only just fit under the mudguards. MWs are 35mm but I seem to recall that they measure tall.
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I doubt I could fit marathon winters on the CDF. It is shod with 37mm hypers atm and those only just fit under the mudguards. MWs are 35mm but I seem to recall that they measure tall.
Schwalbe Marathon Winter come in 30mm too:-
https://www.rosebikes.co.uk/schwalbe-winter-active-spike-tyre-709890?product_shape=black&article_size=700x30C
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I doubt I could fit marathon winters on the CDF. It is shod with 37mm hypers atm and those only just fit under the mudguards. MWs are 35mm but I seem to recall that they measure tall.
Schwalbe Marathon Winter come in 30mm too:-
https://www.rosebikes.co.uk/schwalbe-winter-active-spike-tyre-709890?product_shape=black&article_size=700x30C
Ther'es the cheap Winter and the more expensive Marathon Winter
https://www.rosebikes.co.uk/schwalbe-marathon-winter-plus-performance-line-spike-tyre-2671420
I noticed that SPA Cycles have deals on studded tyres just now.
Though if I order now, I'll probably get them after the ice has gone...
That said, the alternative might be riding 200s on a 29er MTB with 2.25" Ice Spiker Pros; great on ice, reasonably good on snow, passable on tar, terrible on tram lines...
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Ah, yes, not a Marathon (have edited my post) but still good enough if the other option is nothing.
I'll look to get a pair of them at some point (under £20 a tyre is nice but £8.99 P&P from Rose isn't so much). Can't find them anywhere in the UK that sells them with only 10 minutes of googling. Anyone? (Note that I specifically mean the 30mm Schwalbe Winter tyres.)
[EDIT] Bike-Discount have them: https://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/schwalbe-winter-118-spikes-28x1.20-wire-631607?currency=3&delivery_country=190 and £5.35 P&P
I've got my old 35mm Marathon Winters to get rid off as they won't fit on the new commuting/hack bike. Hopefully I can use the same wheels (if I give the rear a new cassette).
[EDIT] Actually, just checked and new bike can take tyres to 40mm so I may be able to keep my existing 35mm Marathon Winters, so no urgency in ordering the 30mm Winters. I'll wait for better deals in the next year and also create an adapter so I can switch the front dynohub wheels easily (current one is a SON, old wheel has a Shimano dynohub).
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Any idea what the difference is between the Schalbe Winter and the Marathon winter?
The pic of those in the rose advert look identical to the marathons but with some studs missing. I have a packet of studs.
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The lack of 'Marathon' in the name probably means it hasn't got the extra 'SmartGuard' puncture protection layer (not surprising that has to go to get the tyre down to under 35mm).
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AIUI the Marathon Winter has twice as many studs. The Winter probably rolls somewhat better on tarmac as a result, and would seem like a good choice for falling-off-your-bike-on-black-ice prevention rather than deliberately riding in serious ice and snow.
Schwalbe appear to have further complicated matters by launching a Marathon Winter Plus. This appears to have the full Marathon Plus level of puncture protection. I expect it's second only to Ice Spikers as Good Training™.
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what are the best conditions for studs? is it fresh powder and or ice that is crushed down? i'm guessing that for sheet ice ie water that has frozen clear they don't work, or am i wrong? m I right the studs need 'bedding-in' with some km?
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what are the best conditions for studs? is it fresh powder and or ice that is crushed down? i'm guessing that for sheet ice ie water that has frozen clear they don't work, or am i wrong?
Other way round IME, I find that Marathon Winters work well on solid ice, patches of black ice, frozen rutted compacted snow/ice, fresh snow up to a few cm.
What they don't really work well on is snow that's more than an inch deep. For that standard MTB knobblies are best.
I had no problem doing 25kph+ along here: http://www.greenbank.org/misc/IMG_9500.JPG (http://www.greenbank.org/misc/IMG_9500.JPG)
m I right the studs need 'bedding-in' with some km?
I never bothered and mine have survived 200km+ of riding without losing a single stud. Sometimes I only need the studs for the first 1km of my commute until I hit more popular roads that have been gritted and cleared by the traffic and that remaining 10km could have been done on normal tyres.
Sometimes I'll need them for 10km+ of riding as nothing has been out to clear the roads, or I've purposely picked a route like that (i.e. Richmond Park when they close it to cars as the hills get too slippery for most cars).
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what are the best conditions for studs? is it fresh powder and or ice that is crushed down? i'm guessing that for sheet ice ie water that has frozen clear they don't work, or am i wrong? m I right the studs need 'bedding-in' with some km?
They work spectacularly well on sheet ice. You can ride (carefully, no hard braking or cornering) almost as if it isn't there (and then put a foot down and fall on your arse because your shoes have no grip).
The studs themselves do little on virgin snow - ideally you need a big low-pressure knobbly tyre (think fatbike) for that. And of course you still want the studs for any ice that's underneath the virgin snow. The Ice Spiker is a normal MTB-size compromise that mostly works on any kind of white stuff, but its rolling resistance is incredibly high and it feels pretty vague on clear tarmac compared to the Marathon Winter (and if you're going off-road, its grip on dry rock is disappointing).
Compacted snow is mostly ridable on any studded tyre, but if it's relatively fresh you can get to the point where the tyre grips well enough, but the layers of snow shear and take your wheel with it. This is more like sliding on mud than on sheet ice, so if you're used to off-road riding you're relatively unlikely to end up on your arse.
The BRITISH speciality of slush that's been rutted by motor vehicle tyres and then re-frozen solid overnight is the nasty one: The studs will grip well enough on the ice, and if it's only a little bit frozen you can generally plough through the ruts. But if it's really solid it comes down to wheel diameter vs depth of rut, and you can tramline on deeper ruts just as well as you would on a rutted muddy track that's dried solid. Some educated guesswork required not to embarass yourself.
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I put Nokian Hakkapeliittas (106 studs) on yesterday. I will need them tonight.
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Really wish I had the bike with the studded tyres.
Loads of sodding ice on the fen roads.
I doubt I could fit marathon winters on the CDF. It is shod with 37mm hypers atm and those only just fit under the mudguards. MWs are 35mm but I seem to recall that they measure tall.
I've got 35mm Marathon winters on my CDF. It's fitted with Flinger Deluxe Mudguards from Spa Cycles and there's plenty of room
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what are the best conditions for studs? is it fresh powder and or ice that is crushed down? i'm guessing that for sheet ice ie water that has frozen clear they don't work, or am i wrong? m I right the studs need 'bedding-in' with some km?
They work spectacularly well on sheet ice. You can ride (carefully, no hard braking or cornering) almost as if it isn't there (and then put a foot down and fall on your arse because your shoes have no grip).
Agreed. I have some Kahtoona nano spikes, which I wear when cycling with spiked tyres, means you can put your foot down on the sheet ice without falling over... Learnt that the hardway...
Comedy off roading in the woods in the dark on a studded brompton, I accidentally ended up cycling onto a small lake, I got about 2m, and then turned round and got off it Damn Quick™.
I bed my spikes in, largely as I tend to put them on at the first frost forecast, and keep them on all winter. This winter I haven't, as I have a spare set of wheels with them ready. I lost 3 studs in about 1000km last winter.
The studs themselves do little on virgin snow - ideally you need a big low-pressure knobbly tyre (think fatbike) for that. And of course you still want the studs for any ice that's underneath the virgin snow. The Ice Spiker is a normal MTB-size compromise that mostly works on any kind of white stuff, but its rolling resistance is incredibly high and it feels pretty vague on clear tarmac compared to the Marathon Winter (and if you're going off-road, its grip on dry rock is disappointing).
For this sort of area (UK/NL), the actual issue is that when you have about 30mm of snow, what is underneath is a sheet of ice, if you are riding anything but a fat bike, you are going to go straight through the snow to the ice below, then fall over. This is where spikes are great.
Compacted snow is mostly ridable on any studded tyre, but if it's relatively fresh you can get to the point where the tyre grips well enough, but the layers of snow shear and take your wheel with it. This is more like sliding on mud than on sheet ice, so if you're used to off-road riding you're relatively unlikely to end up on your arse.
Not had that as an issue yet. How deep does the snow need to be for this to happen?
The BRITISH speciality of slush that's been rutted by motor vehicle tyres and then re-frozen solid overnight is the nasty one: The studs will grip well enough on the ice, and if it's only a little bit frozen you can generally plough through the ruts. But if it's really solid it comes down to wheel diameter vs depth of rut, and you can tramline on deeper ruts just as well as you would on a rutted muddy track that's dried solid. Some educated guesswork required not to embarass yourself.
Ah, sastrugi. It's what makes cycling on ice with studded tyres *REALLY* interesting. Carry spare underwear...
There is something great about being able to cycle into work on the day when half the office has called in as working from home, and the rest have taken public transport...
J
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Ah, yes, not a Marathon (have edited my post) but still good enough if the other option is nothing.
I'll look to get a pair of them at some point (under £20 a tyre is nice but £8.99 P&P from Rose isn't so much). Can't find them anywhere in the UK that sells them with only 10 minutes of googling. Anyone? (Note that I specifically mean the 30mm Schwalbe Winter tyres.)
I gave a hint in my reply, here's the link for 700x30c
https://spacycles.co.uk/m2b0s142p3917/SCHWALBE-Winter
Spa also have the Snow Stud in 700x38
and the Marathon Winters are 700x35
I could probably do with seeing if the 26" Spiker Pro's I have hanging up somewhere would fit my 26" tourer, but it'll be a guards off job... Although given the amount of snow they pick up judging by the suspension bridge on my MTBs after a snow ride mudguards are probably a liability in the snow anyway.
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I could probably do with seeing if the 26" Spiker Pro's I have hanging up somewhere would fit my 26" tourer, but it'll be a guards off job... Although given the amount of snow they pick up judging by the suspension bridge on my MTBs after a snow ride mudguards are probably a liability in the snow anyway.
Depends on the snow. Not all snow is created equally. Some snow will clump up together, and will clog up on your mudguards. Other times when it's slushy, with gritted roads, riding without the mudguards, or at least an arse saver, you will end up with your back covered in crap.
We joke about native arctic peoples having 50 words for snow, there's a reason for that![1]
J
[1]The English language has lots of words for rain...
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Compacted snow is mostly ridable on any studded tyre, but if it's relatively fresh you can get to the point where the tyre grips well enough, but the layers of snow shear and take your wheel with it. This is more like sliding on mud than on sheet ice, so if you're used to off-road riding you're relatively unlikely to end up on your arse.
Not had that as an issue yet. How deep does the snow need to be for this to happen?
I found it was a problem last December when I went out to play (with the Ice Spikers that had been gathering dust for a year and a half since I bought them) in the ~100mm of snow that came down overnight. I'd dropped the pressure right down to the sweet spot (maybe 12-15PSI) for the virgin snow in the nearby park, and when returning home by road discovered that riding *in* the freshly-formed vehicle ruts was a bit exciting for this reason. I suspect that higher tyre pressure would have solved the problem - which I didn't experience on the way out - but I wasn't going to muck about inflating tyres when all of 1.5km from home.
I've experienced something similar with a Marathon Winter on the rear wheel of the trike on partially re-frozen foot-trodden snow, but it's just a momentary traction issue when you have an extra wheel.
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I've ridden a few miles on Marathon Winters and don't believe that they have the Marathon anti-puncture layer. I believe that the 'winter' tyres are built on the marathon XR tyres. They actually puncture quite easily, in my experience.
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I've ridden a few miles on Marathon Winters and don't believe that they have the Marathon anti-puncture layer. I believe that the 'winter' tyres are built on the marathon XR tyres. They actually puncture quite easily, in my experience.
I don't think I've actually had a visitation on one, but they're certainly not up to the levels of puncture protection that you ideally want if your fingers are going to freeze in the time it takes to change a tyre. Hence the new Marathon Winter Plus model, presumably.
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Winters arrived. They work perfectly. Ice has vanished, even before they were fitted on the bike.
Actually, I lie. There is still black ice in the mornings on the fen roads. I'm still going to use the studded tyres for a while, simply because I can't afford another knock on my noggin. Can use the short route to work (bike to local station, 2.5miles) for a while, then I'll try the riverside cyclepath. That wasn't great on previous tyres, they weren't so good on grip, but the winters are a bit more suitable.
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I think it is definitely stud time.
Feeling motivated to fit the studded tyres so I can ride.
Not felt motivated to ride for ages, but the idea of crunchy roads and white fields is quite beguiling.
anyone else have the studs on?
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I fitted clicky winter tyres to not one but two of my bicycles yesterday. This ought to ensure a mild winter, but the weather gods obviously aren't paying sufficient attention.
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My studded tyres in the shed are comfortably over 10 years old. The studs might be ok, but I’m slightly worried about the rubber.
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With the forecast for 15° next week, you'll need to be quick.
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I think it is definitely stud time.
Don't they make a mess of the rollers?
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Popped out for a brief ride at lunchtime. Great difficulty standing - we have almost no snow, but everywhere is sheeted with ice.
Nice slow (very unfit) ride up onto the hills, then a bit of comedy off-roading. fun until I started sliding downhill on rock-hard wet ice. Well, that was kind of fun too (getting going again back uphill was difficult!)
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I was having a very successful mixed mode bumble around in the sno with studded tyres flat pedals and walking boots for when the hills got a bit steep for me. Came to a bridge and forgetting that I was not clipped in decided to bunny hop the expansion joint. Cue flailing feet and now have a very sad looking boot as the front tyre ground large chunks of leather away...
I did though stay upright!
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We've had a mostly dry week with temps down to -5°.
This evening it's rained. The pavements are basically a sheet of ice. Even train platforms are iced over. With announcements to be careful getting off the train due to the ice.
I have been *very* glad that I had my Kahtoola Nanospikes with me. Walked straight across the ice with no issues.
Fantastic.
Have yet to find the courage to do battle with the marathon winters in the Brompton tho.
J