Sustrans

[Canardly]

Having a really active local sustrans group, quite sad to read comments here really. Our local sustrans group leader organises lots of local cycle runs for local families and kids and also encouraging people to get on a bike again. This group was also pretty proactive in attracting £3.5m of investment in a new pedestrian/cycling river bridge, work on which has just started and which will connect two previously separate communities and provide local kids with safe off road cycling routes to local schools.

As to negotiating right of way and rules with local farmers, installing and erecting signage, reporting overgrown trees, hedging, brambles,  etc they contribute a lot I think.

As to cash, funding and grants, hold on to your hats people its going to get rough and take note of the advertising blitz taking place atm for major charities.

[red marley]

The road junction outside our house was selected as one of the Sustrans DIY streets pilot projects. The idea was for Sustrans to help local communities redesign street space to be more people-friendly (largely by encouraging pedestrians and cyclists to reclaim space previously thought to be the preserve of motorised vehicles). I agree entirely with the aims of the initiative so as a local resident became involved in the project.

The project involved about two years of effort by the local community including regular meetings, community consultation events, commissioning artworks, advice on tree planting etc. The end result was absolutely nothing was ever implemented. This appears to be largely due to appalling management by Sustrans of the project with dire communication, poor management of expectations, divisive community involvement and Sustrans ultimately walking away from the project when it came to applying for funding to get the work actually carried out (this didn't stop them spending £50k on the various consultations, employment of the Sustrans staff on the project etc.)

So in this case at least, Sustrans set back the cause of street and cycle friendly redesign several steps. We now have a community of people who feel their effort has been wasted and who will now feel more cynical about future initiatives. And a road junction that remains exactly as it was before the project.

It has not left me with a positive view on the value of Sustrans, nor their ability to use donated money wisely.

[Jaded]

My legs after using my section of the NCN last Tuesday.

Very much a Fire and Forget project, as far as I am concerned, definitely useless for commuting in weather, and certainly only likely to get people out cycling on it in the summer when there aren't too many dog-walkers pooing on it.

[YahudaMoon]

Well said peoples.

I posted this in the wrong thread again ain't I ! On The Road ?

[Canardly]

My legs after using my section of the NCN last Tuesday.

Very much a Fire and Forget project, as far as I am concerned, definitely useless for commuting in weather, and certainly only likely to get people out cycling on it in the summer when there aren't too many dog-walkers pooing on it.

Looks like a slack chain to me

[YahudaMoon]

looks like one of them volunteers to me ha!

[rogerzilla]

My experience is similar.  NCN 45 from Cricklade to...well, about a mile down the road actually, which makes you wonder why you bothered, is impassable at any time except after two dry weeks in the height of summer.  It uses an unmade farm track, and the soil is clay.  I suppose you could ride out from Cricklade, negotiate the three or four sets of gates and then ride back again for a short, safe pootle.

NCN south of Swindon, in stark contrast, has a 1 in 6 boulder field just before Chiseldon.  I am proud that I once negotiated it on a Thorn Nomad.

[corshamjim]

Yep, I'm sure we can all point to awful stretches.  My prime example is NCN403 South of Chippenham.  Thankfully it's now closed and re-routed on quiet roads instead.

While it was open, it had lots of gates which were a right pita to negotiate, thick gravel which was horrible to ride on and a particular short steep bit with a 90-degree bend at the top which needed some skill to negotiate.  My wife Claire who was just getting back to cycling at the time managed to pedal to the top then toppled off at the 90-degree turn on to a pile of stinging nettles.  Unsurprisingly, Claire hasn't bothered to go cycling again since.

[nuttycyclist]

There a great way for familys to cycle with there children knowing there safe from the cars n traffic. Only today I had my children with the bikes on the pavement, age 6 n 9 BTW, and my heart is in my mouth worried all the time cos I'm thinking some crazed driver of a car is gonna vear off the road or my little girl will fall of her bike of the pavement and into the road.

This is the sustrans NCN in Southend.  It's described as traffic free, but there is nothing to stop vehicles entering the path.

    YouTube
        - Kanal von sqrooloose
 
My heart was in my mouth @ 00:12 and 00:39

I would NEVER take my niece and nephew along there, it's not only dangerous it is much much worse than it used to be (when I would have taken them for a ride along the seafront).

You say you had your heart in your mouth fearing a vehicle would mount the pavement, but at least the pavement has a kerb separating it from the oncoming traffic!!!!

I think there Email would have been more productive if they sent Emails out asking for volunteers and not £20, though no one wants that nowadays do they ! Its just money money money.

Agreed.   The success of some routes is down to the volunteers who do do a great job; not the sustrans group behind them.

[Regulator]

My legs after using my section of the NCN last Tuesday.

Very much a Fire and Forget project, as far as I am concerned, definitely useless for commuting in weather, and certainly only likely to get people out cycling on it in the summer when there aren't too many dog-walkers pooing on it.

Looks like a slack chain to me

More like a slack sphincter...

[Jaded]

That's why I'd never ride behind you Reg! 

[Nightfly]

The road junction outside our house was selected as one of the Sustrans DIY streets pilot projects. The idea was for Sustrans to help local communities redesign street space to be more people-friendly (largely by encouraging pedestrians and cyclists to reclaim space previously thought to be the preserve of motorised vehicles). I agree entirely with the aims of the initiative so as a local resident became involved in the project.

The project involved about two years of effort by the local community including regular meetings, community consultation events, commissioning artworks, advice on tree planting etc. The end result was absolutely nothing was ever implemented. This appears to be largely due to appalling management by Sustrans of the project with dire communication, poor management of expectations, divisive community involvement and Sustrans ultimately walking away from the project when it came to applying for funding to get the work actually carried out (this didn't stop them spending £50k on the various consultations, employment of the Sustrans staff on the project etc.)

So in this case at least, Sustrans set back the cause of street and cycle friendly redesign several steps. We now have a community of people who feel their effort has been wasted and who will now feel more cynical about future initiatives. And a road junction that remains exactly as it was before the project.

It has not left me with a positive view on the value of Sustrans, nor their ability to use donated money wisely.

As I suspected  .

[MartinGT]

@Nutty

On that video, there is nothing on that new cycleway to suggest to the public that its for cyclists really so no wonder they are walking over it etc.  Surley every couple of hundered metres a big cycle painted on the path would help?

[her_welshness]

The road junction outside our house was selected as one of the Sustrans DIY streets pilot projects. The idea was for Sustrans to help local communities redesign street space to be more people-friendly (largely by encouraging pedestrians and cyclists to reclaim space previously thought to be the preserve of motorised vehicles). I agree entirely with the aims of the initiative so as a local resident became involved in the project.

The project involved about two years of effort by the local community including regular meetings, community consultation events, commissioning artworks, advice on tree planting etc. The end result was absolutely nothing was ever implemented. This appears to be largely due to appalling management by Sustrans of the project with dire communication, poor management of expectations, divisive community involvement and Sustrans ultimately walking away from the project when it came to applying for funding to get the work actually carried out (this didn't stop them spending £50k on the various consultations, employment of the Sustrans staff on the project etc.)

So in this case at least, Sustrans set back the cause of street and cycle friendly redesign several steps. We now have a community of people who feel their effort has been wasted and who will now feel more cynical about future initiatives. And a road junction that remains exactly as it was before the project.

It has not left me with a positive view on the value of Sustrans, nor their ability to use donated money wisely.

As I suspected  .

I wonder how many times this has happened? 

[nuttycyclist]

@Nutty

On that video, there is nothing on that new cycleway to suggest to the public that its for cyclists really so no wonder they are walking over it etc.  Surley every couple of hundered metres a big cycle painted on the path would help?

When that was filmed it was just before the paint went down.

There is now a white line next to the road (narrowing the cycle path even more) and cycle logos all along it.


Behaviour has not changed.

Here's another clip showing the markings.   Enjoy

    YouTube
        - Kanal von sqrooloose
 


(more comment in the Southend Cycle Town part 2 thread.)

[SiD]

It's been a case of "Build it… and they will not come".

In theory it was a great idea but on the ground is a wholly different story.
I live on one Sustrans route and work beside another.
The only cyclist using the routes is me coming to and going to work.

It's all very well sticking up signs a printing maps but that seems to be where it stops.
Not a very "joined up" organisation. I've always found them a wee bit disconnected.

[Hot Flatus]

I view them in exactly the same way as I view the CTC.

Totally irrelevant to me. Maybe they are of benefit to some people, I don't know.

[Honest John]

I 'm suprised at the amount of negativivity

Put it this way; if I want to find a roundabout and uncycleable route from A to B, bridleways are clearly marked on OS maps.

For Sustrans routes to be of any use, they have to be direct, complete and properly surfaced.

[mattc]

There are two sections I use near me, maybe 2/3 a mile each. I think they were both footpaths with ridable surfaces before, but the ex-railway one got a new (rather marvellous!) surface.

So perhaps I should be grateful to Sustrans ... however, the one I use the most is effectively a bypass for a nearby high-speed B-road. I suspect that if we persuaded all the walkers and cyclists off the footpath/Sustrans-route onto the B-road, drivers would very quickly become a lot more courteous (only costing them 5-20seconds even in rush hour).

There is a 3rd route in the area, but ever since I moved here the surface has degraded year-on-year, and I'd far rather use the road now, even in rush-hour.

[cycleman]

sections along the a 308 at staines and near thorpe park are covered in road debris and never has been sweep in all the years i have had the misfortune  to use this route. i have often had punctures on this section as a result 

[rogerzilla]

Sustrans say that the reason they can't have everything surfaced in smooth tarmac is usually because the landowner won't permit it.  Unfortunately this consigns most of the purpose-built parts of the NCN to leisure MTB riding.

[iakobski]

sections along the a 308 at staines and near thorpe park are covered in road debris and never has been sweep in all the years i have had the misfortune  to use this route. i have often had punctures on this section as a result 

So get in touch with the local volunteer ranger who can deal with it. An email via the website will get to the right person fairly quickly.

[RichForrest]

sections along the a 308 at staines and near thorpe park are covered in road debris and never has been sweep in all the years i have had the misfortune  to use this route. i have often had punctures on this section as a result 

So get in touch with the local volunteer ranger who can deal with it. An email via the website will get to the right person fairly quickly.

Also get in touch with the council, they have to maintain it also.
Around here the paths are either under council or Parks trust land and while riding around I will often see problems that a quick email will sort out.

Make a point if it could cause an accident and it will be done very quickly. I reported a removable bollard missing leaving a 2" collar sticking up. It was replaced the day after.

[Feline]

I have mixed feeling about the Sustrans issue.
On the one hand, I do make good use of the NCN routes near me. I commute 21 miles to Bristol mostly using NCN 3. Whenever I get the train I use the Strawberry Line to Yatton station. I ride with Bristol CTC a lot and we often encorporate long stretches of NCN 10 and NCN 26 into our rides. The Bristol-Bath railway path is a nice flat way to return from a hilly ride out in the Bath direction.
My parents did a very swlo LEJoG a few years ago using the Sustrans maps and leaflets as inspiration. They had a great time, and maybe wouldn't have done this ride without the info they had back then from Sustrans and trails like the Camelford one in Cornwall.
I also have a good friend who works for Sustrans in Bristol.

So basically, I am a Sustrans beneficiary.

The negatives though are that from what I gather much of the work that has been done around Bristol in the few years was actually funded by the huge cycling city grant, and almost all the maintenance of the existing routes is done by volunteers. Apparently this year Sustrans decided to make their staff canteen vegetarian only, which did not please the hungry carnivorous cyclists among them. What on earth has sustainable transport got to do with people's ethical dietary choices or preference

I am currently sitting on the fence. It's a bit spiky up here. Since I don't have a limitless quantity of £20's then I expect there are other causes more deserving of my donation this year.

[David Martin]

Sustrans have been a great poster child for the NCN - they have spawned a concept.

However the amount that they themselves have implemented is >.< that much. The rest is funded and implemented by third parties such as councils, often beaten down by landowners, budgets and lack of vision.

The Sustrans guidelines are quite good and they have done good promotional work for, eg, safe routes to schools, but they have never had the benefits of being a big heavyweight.

I found the most useful weapon in my armory was the new Scottish Cycling By Design which is excellent, is a UK compendium of good practice, and should be used to beat up councils to justify why they deviate from it.

Not sure about Sustrans as an organisation - so many of the Connect2 projects are falling over as people realise that most of them are vapourware in Sustrans mind, requiring serious financial commitment by local councils.

..d