eBikes - easier, OR faster?

[quixoticgeek]

There is another use for e-bikes, and it's one that doesn't involve ownership. Freeloading.

There's a lot of e-bikes round these parts, you can often here them coming up behind you as a slightly higher pitched whine, with an absence of squeaks and rattles. Wait for it to approach, and as it goes past, jump on the rear wheel. You now have someone to draft until they decide to go somewhere you're not going, which allows you to make significant progress through the inevitable Omni directional headwind.

I used to find e-bikes a right sod on the fietspad, until I realised just how useful they can be if you time it right.

J

[PeteB99]

If you want a Chinese made Ebike you might want to put your order in soon.

http://www.bike-eu.com/laws-regulations/nieuws/2017/12/eu-adopts-new-anti-dumping-rules-implications-for-e-bike-case-10132222

[Kim]

There is another use for e-bikes, and it's one that doesn't involve ownership. Freeloading.

There's a lot of e-bikes round these parts, you can often here them coming up behind you as a slightly higher pitched whine, with an absence of squeaks and rattles. Wait for it to approach, and as it goes past, jump on the rear wheel. You now have someone to draft until they decide to go somewhere you're not going, which allows you to make significant progress through the inevitable Omni directional headwind.

I've never had much luck with drafting barakta's electric-assist ICE trike, because the only machine I've got that's low enough to really benefit is the Red Baron, and that's sufficiently aerodynamic that at 25kph you needn't bother.

However, last weekend I found myself rushing for a train down Nottingham's Deliveroo Expressway^[1], on my Brompton, accompanied by my friend on a sit-up-and-beg German ebike.  I took the forward position out of habit, but soon realised that was the stupid way round.  We changed positions, and with some gratuitous wheelsucking I was soon blatting along with a fraction of the effort that I'd normally need on a proper bike, let alone the Brommie.

So yeah, ebikes - especially those set up to make a nice big hole in the air - are indeed excellent for drafting, and should be encouraged.   


_{[1] As the new cycle superhighway along Castle Boulevard is colloquially known, for obvious reasons.}

[quixoticgeek]

I've never had much luck with drafting barakta's electric-assist ICE trike, because the only machine I've got that's low enough to really benefit is the Red Baron, and that's sufficiently aerodynamic that at 25kph you needn't bother.

However, last weekend I found myself rushing for a train down Nottingham's Deliveroo Expressway^[1], on my Brompton, accompanied by my friend on a sit-up-and-beg German ebike.  I took the forward position out of habit, but soon realised that was the stupid way round.  We changed positions, and with some gratuitous wheelsucking I was soon blatting along with a fraction of the effort that I'd normally need on a proper bike, let alone the Brommie.

So yeah, ebikes - especially those set up to make a nice big hole in the air - are indeed excellent for drafting, and should be encouraged.   

Having foolishly signed up for a Big Race™ this week, I've started doing longer and faster training rides. Normally the colleagues I commute with grab onto me and I pull them along as my bike is faster than their omafiets, but today I rode part way home with a different colleague, he has a German made pedal assist ebike with all the aero dynamics of a brick. He also has a 20km commute. I rode with him for 15km before turning round to do another 20km into the wind home. Him having the ebike meant I could do the pace that was comfortable for me, without having to worry about those I'm with keeping up or hanging off my backpack. It's most refreshing.

Shame I've yet to find justification for myself owning an e-bike, I'm wondering what other uses I can put others e-bikes to beyond company and wind shields...

J

[Cudzoziemiec]

I'm sure a friend with an ebike would be a useful friend to know in the event of hauling (small items of) furniture, for instance.

[Kim]

I'm sure a friend with an ebike would be a useful friend to know in the event of hauling (small items of) furniture, for instance.

I've certainly made use of the trike for hauling heavy stuff in the trailer.  Partially because of the low-speed stability and less squirrely braking, but the extra oomph from the motor is lovely in traffic.

[giropaul]

I didn’t think that cycling offences affect your car driving licence in the UK (although they do here in Germany)

But - it wouldn’t be a cycling offence. An e-bike “ over speed/ power legally becomes a motorbike. A chap around here has a lawn mower sort of motor strapped to a bike - he needs an MoT, licence, insurance and helmet, as well as number plates.

[Kim]

I didn’t think that cycling offences affect your car driving licence in the UK (although they do here in Germany)

But - it wouldn’t be a cycling offence. An e-bike “ over speed/ power legally becomes a motorbike. A chap around here has a lawn mower sort of motor strapped to a bike - he needs an MoT, licence, insurance and helmet, as well as number plates.

Indeed.

I believe that you can get a driving ban for going equipped for car theft, which could conceivably be done on a pedal cycle, but that's about all.

[Cudzoziemiec]

You can get a driving ban in the UK for any offence whatsoever. I learnt this when it was mentioned in these very pages by the Learned Julian.

[mattc]

I didn’t think that cycling offences affect your car driving licence in the UK (although they do here in Germany)

But - it wouldn’t be a cycling offence. An e-bike “ over speed/ power legally becomes a motorbike. A chap around here has a lawn mower sort of motor strapped to a bike - he needs an MoT, licence, insurance and helmet, as well as number plates.

Also I'm pretty sure that UK judges *do* have the power to endorse your car licence for other "related" offences. I've read one-or-two anecdotes of it actually happening - it's incredibly rare. IIRC drunk cycling has come up?

[quixoticgeek]

Slogging into a headwind on the way to work, I look up to see opa breezing past me barely pedalling. I'm about to swear loudly when I spot the battery on the rear rack. Bingo. I jump on his rear wheel and for the next 2km do a steady 24.5kph. Made the headwind completely go away. Was great. Annoyingly, still didn't break my Pr for that leg on strava...

Today I was in Maastricht for an Audax tomorrow, so thought I'd entertain myself with some hills. I'm grinding my way up the Cauberg in bottom gear when oma and opa both over take me. I'm about to swear really loudly at my own ineptitude when the road tilts up, thenen I spot the batteries on the rear racks. I just got owned on the Cauberg by oma and opa on e bikes.

What ever you say about their merits in sport cycling, for every day transport for 8-80 accessibility, you really can't beat them. Especially if there are any hills in the area. Makes me wonder if rather than giving over 65's a bus pass, what if we gave them a pedal assist E-bike instead?

J

[Auntie Helen]

Spooky, we arrived in Maastricht yesterday for a tour (no audaxing for us!)

The problem with e-bikes for the elderly is that they are heavy and we have seen several cases where people have fallen off when they have stopped simply because of the weight. But apart from that I think they are great.

[mzjo]

I didn’t think that cycling offences affect your car driving licence in the UK (although they do here in Germany)

But - it wouldn’t be a cycling offence. An e-bike “ over speed/ power legally becomes a motorbike. A chap around here has a lawn mower sort of motor strapped to a bike - he needs an MoT, licence, insurance and helmet, as well as number plates.

Also I'm pretty sure that UK judges *do* have the power to endorse your car licence for other "related" offences. I've read one-or-two anecdotes of it actually happening - it's incredibly rare. IIRC drunk cycling has come up?

It is also the case in France. (I am told that you can be booked and points lost on your car licence for speeding on a bicycle even though the bike doesn't need a speedo). It is most certainly not a safe way of getting home after drinking too much - people can be and have been banned from driving for a non-car related offence.

[Cudzoziemiec]

What ever you say about their merits in sport cycling, for every day transport for 8-80 accessibility, you really can't beat them. Especially if there are any hills in the area. Makes me wonder if rather than giving over 65's a bus pass, what if we gave them a pedal assist E-bike instead?

J

Not going to happen in UK obviously (until I'm King of the World) but maybe it could work in NL where oldsters might well have been cycling all their lives. As a bonus, in the UK it would result in better bus services too! (Bus cos don't get refunded for the passes, so run fewer services instead to reduce loss.)

[Kim]

The problem with e-bikes for the elderly is that they are heavy and we have seen several cases where people have fallen off when they have stopped simply because of the weight. But apart from that I think they are great.

I saw a paper on that...  *googles* https://researchmgt.monash.edu/ws/portalfiles/portal/33966117

In summary, things that cause safety issues for e-bike riders are mostly the same things that cause safety issues for un-assisted cyclists.  (ie. negligent motorists, quality of infrastructure, losing control of the bike at low speed)

There's some suggestion that throttle-only operation creates a hazard, which makes intuitive sense (I was on a ride a while ago where someone explained the risk of leaning a bike with a full-length twist grip throttle against a wall while it's switched on in a DAHIKT style).  The extra weight can be a problem for some riders, as can mechanical failure due to self-assembly.  Speed in itself only seems to become an issue when combined with poor infrastructure.

But the elephant in the room seems to be that many e-cyclists are older people who haven't previously cycled as adults, so lack basic bike skills.  That's good news in that electric assist cycles are giving new people independent mobility, but bad in that they're a demographic that's at higher risk of injury.  On the gripping hand, the occasional fall as you start/stop you e-bike may be a much healthier^[1] alternative to a sedentary lack of independence.


_{[1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27299435}

[teethgrinder]

I'd use an ebike for an easier, rather than faster ride. My opinion might change if I tried riding one 

Trek Bike Store in Milton Keynes are promoting ebikes over the Easter holiday (but not Sunday when they are closed) and you can try them out.

I'm riding the Double Dutch Audax on the Saturday but if anyone fancies coming up to Milton Keynes to have a look and maybe go for a cafe ride then I'd be up for that.