Author Topic: Grammar that makes you cringe  (Read 835054 times)

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #800 on: 01 May, 2010, 10:28:25 pm »
I believe that's the antipodean soap opera effect?

clarion

  • Tyke
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #801 on: 01 May, 2010, 10:30:03 pm »
I think it is?
Getting there...

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #802 on: 01 May, 2010, 10:34:43 pm »
Is it.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #803 on: 02 May, 2010, 02:25:30 am »
I think it is?  (But we do try to beat it out of our young - in a non-physical violence way of course)
@SandyV1 on Twitter http://twitter.com/#!/SandyV1

mattc

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Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #804 on: 04 May, 2010, 09:43:01 am »
I think it is?  (But we do try to beat it out of our young - in a non-physical violence way of course)

Glad to hear it Sandy! :thumbsup:

Of course, _writing_ a question mark after a statement is different - it's probably not 'correct', but in an informal context it can make your intention clear.

And rising intonation is fine if you WANT to make your statement a question,
"It is?" being a perfect example.

The problem is a rising intonation on EVERY SENTENCE; I guess people start to do this as a way of keeping the listener interested, but the effect is to make the speaker sound utterly uncertain about everything! (as well as needing more effort to listen to them)

I once attended a technical presentation (from a Brit) done entirely in this style. Almost incomprehensible.
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Mr Larrington

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Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #805 on: 14 May, 2010, 03:26:08 pm »
"With his arrest and subsequent imprisonment for thirty-nine charges of smuggling alligators into Shoreditch Public Baths, and two counts of smiling at vicars in second-class railway compartments, Frobisher had finally received his just deserts."

Which deserts?  The Gobi?  The Kalahari?  The Atacama?  That little one in Spain where they filmed the Spaghetti Westerns?

Or did you actually mean "just desserts"?

Cretin.
External Transparent Wall Inspection Operative & Mayor of Mortagne-au-Perche
Satisfying the Bloodlust of the Masses in Peacetime

HTFB

  • The Monkey and the Plywood Violin
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #806 on: 14 May, 2010, 03:39:38 pm »
It may help to note that your desert is what you de-serve (that is, what you are thoroughly well served with), whereas your dessert is what you are dis-served with (that is, what you eat as dinner is unserved and the table is unlaid). 

Not especially helpful or mature

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #807 on: 21 May, 2010, 01:04:36 pm »
Don't know if this has already been posted, but won't harm to repeat:

Dear America

JJ

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #808 on: 21 May, 2010, 02:54:25 pm »
This isn't strictly grammer, but it does make me cringe.  I wouldn't mind it from an individual in say, a forum post, but it's on about a hundred gazillion notices printed at the behest of HMG.

"It is against the law to smoke in these premises."

You can't be IN premises.  You can be on them, or off them, but not IN them.  You can even base your argument on a premise, but you CAN'T be IN one.

HMG employ lots of well-educated people to write things and proof read them and check ad re-check them and sign them off.  How can they not get this right?

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #809 on: 21 May, 2010, 03:05:04 pm »
This isn't strictly grammer

...or spelling, apparently. ;)

d.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #810 on: 21 May, 2010, 09:35:17 pm »
I have spent time recently educating a soon to be graduate that the singular form of premises is premises not premise when talking about property.
@SandyV1 on Twitter http://twitter.com/#!/SandyV1

JJ

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #811 on: 21 May, 2010, 11:26:35 pm »

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #812 on: 23 May, 2010, 05:15:27 pm »
I have spent time recently educating a soon to be graduate that the singular form of premises is premises not premise when talking about property.
??? It's usual to talk of "these premises", not "this premises". Is there a singular?

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #813 on: 23 May, 2010, 05:19:34 pm »
I have spent time recently educating a soon to be graduate that the singular form of premises is premises not premise when talking about property.

On what premise do you base that?
It is simpler than it looks.

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #814 on: 23 May, 2010, 06:52:32 pm »
On a government "Didn't we do well?" advert on a bus:-

500 less crimes in....
Quote from: Kim
Paging Diver300.  Diver300 to the GSM Trimphone, please...

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #815 on: 23 May, 2010, 07:44:17 pm »
My guess is that 'less' will soon mean 'fewer' as well as 'less'. I wouldn't be surprised if fifty years down the road 'fewer' will just be a word you use when you want to sound quaint and twentieth-centruryish.

HTFB

  • The Monkey and the Plywood Violin
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #816 on: 24 May, 2010, 07:44:54 am »
In Shakespeare's time there was a distinction between mo and more, mirroring that between less and fewer. The language is poorer for losing it, alas.

The last ten years or so have lost the distinction between "may" and "might". I've almost certainly grumbled about this before. If I had had my way, things may have been very different...
Not especially helpful or mature

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #817 on: 24 May, 2010, 07:56:02 am »
I've read that languages continually get simpler. Presumably we'll end up with one word meaning everything...

What I haven't figured out is where the complex languages come from if the above is true. Do they appear suddenly from a dictionary?

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #818 on: 24 May, 2010, 07:57:04 am »
I have spent time recently educating a soon to be graduate that the singular form of premises is premises not premise when talking about property.
??? It's usual to talk of "these premises", not "this premises". Is there a singular?

It's in relation to the use of the term in town planning reports eg. the proposal is to erect premises for use as three "food premises" (defined term).  When talking about one of them it does not become a "premise" but remains premises.

As an aside, we used to use the term "curtilage" very often but in the drive for "plain English" it is being lost - pity.
@SandyV1 on Twitter http://twitter.com/#!/SandyV1

Cudzoziemiec

  • Ride adventurously and stop for a brew.
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #819 on: 24 May, 2010, 03:41:12 pm »
This thread has complained about quite a lot of verbs derived from nouns where there already exists a verb with the same meaning. "Leverage" and "burglarize" are two examples that spring instantly to mind. My addition to this category is "to acquisition".
Quote
I took out of my inside tunic pocket a small pad and a pencil stub that I'd recently acquisitioned from a desk drawer of my company Orderly Room at Fort Benning.
In think this verb is a good invention. Although it's meaning may be the same as "acquired" the ending lends a shade of "recquisitioned", particularly given the military context.
In any case, I'm not going to argue with J.D. Salinger.
Riding a concrete path through the nebulous and chaotic future.

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #820 on: 24 May, 2010, 05:39:05 pm »
I've read that languages continually get simpler. Presumably we'll end up with one word meaning everything...

"It's a beautiful thing, the destruction of words. You wouldn't have seen the Dictionary 10th edition, would you, Smith? It's that thick. [illustrates thickness with fingers] The 11th Edition will be that thick. [narrows fingers]"

d.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #821 on: 24 May, 2010, 10:02:33 pm »
This thread has complained about quite a lot of verbs derived from nouns where there already exists a verb with the same meaning. "Leverage" and "burglarize" are two examples that spring instantly to mind.

I looked into the whole 'burglarize thing'. As it turns out up until around 1850 there is no written record of either 'burgle' or 'burglarize' - there was the word 'burglar' but that was it. Then within a year of each other, the word 'burgle' turned up in texts over here and the word 'burglarize' turned up in texts in the USA. I'd always assumed that 'burlgar' was derived from 'burgle', but apparently it's the other way around and both 'burgle' and 'burglarize' were created independently.

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #822 on: 24 May, 2010, 10:28:27 pm »
It's in relation to the use of the term in town planning reports eg. the proposal is to erect premises for use as three "food premises" (defined term).  When talking about one of them it does not become a "premise" but remains premises.
Is that legitimate? I think I'd want to talk about three sets of premises. It's not "a premises" when you have one.

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #823 on: 25 May, 2010, 12:28:24 am »
Definition of premises (1): land, and all the built structures on it, especially when considered as a single place; (plural only; not used in singular form) The subject of a conveyance or deed

Definition of premises (2): premises n. 1) in real estate, land and the improvements on it, a building, store, shop, apartment, or other designated structure. The exact premises may be important in determining if an outbuilding (shed, cabana, detached garage) is insured or whether a person accused of burglary has actually entered a structure.

The term premises (as used in Australia anyway)  relates to the use of the land and building/s.  It's premises if it is within one building. If it is one use within three buildings, it's still premises!
@SandyV1 on Twitter http://twitter.com/#!/SandyV1

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #824 on: 25 May, 2010, 01:41:11 am »
There appears to have been burglarization of meaning here.
It is simpler than it looks.