Vista C vs HCx

[drossall]

Compared to a C, I know that an HCx has a more sensitive receiver that will lock on to satellites more quickly at start-up, and probably be more accurate.

I believe that the HCx handles more waypoints per route.

What else, though? Is the mapping better? Any major advantages? Many here seem to swear by the HCx.

[Wowbagger]

I like my HCx although I've no experience of any other gps to allow me to compare it to anything.

I think the worst things about it are the physical design. The handlebar mounts are total crap and the gooey sealant whcih is spposed to hold the rubber casing on has all disappeared on mine. But as an auxiliary device to a set of maps it's really good.

[Chris S]

I'm prepared to be corrected, but it's my understanding that the battery life is better on the Cx.

[simonp]

If it has an x in the name the memory is expandable - so more maps loaded at a time.  In fact with the card in mine I get the whole of the UK on at once.

[andygates]

Yup, the Vista C is Colour.

The Cx is Colour and eXpandable - takes micro SD cards up to 2Gb.

The HCx is Colour, eXpandable and High-sensitivity - takes cards, will flash to bigger cards, and has a more sensitive antenna.  Downside: costs more, slightly shorter battery life.

I wouldn't bother with the non-expandable one.

[Wowbagger]

I think the batteries last ages anyway. A decent set of rechargeables, 2 Ah or better, will give upwards of 10 hours of use.

[simonp]

I think the batteries last ages anyway. A decent set of rechargeables, 2 Ah or better, will give upwards of 10 hours of use.

I get far more than that with my Vista HCx - almost enough for a 400km Audax.

[frankly frankie]

I have a Legend C, Cx and HCx, all in regular use.  The old C is noticeably lighter weight than the other two, also slightly dimmer screen.

Compared to a C, I know that an HCx has a more sensitive receiver that will lock on to satellites more quickly at start-up, and probably be more accurate.
I believe that the HCx handles more waypoints per route.
What else, though? Is the mapping better? Any major advantages? Many here seem to swear by the HCx.

HCx stores more User Waypoints overall, but the waypoints per route limit is the same on all 3 units.

HCx lacks the Alarm clock feature of the C and Cx - quite a useful feature for me, but maybe other people won't be bothered.

HCx has the ability to colour Routes - not stuck with the default magenta colour.

[edit] HCx has a faster processor - makes screen scrolling smoother and allows you to opt for more map detail.

I would be inclined to argue with the supposition that 'more sensitive' equates to 'more accurate'.  
In terms of startup time, the difference between HCx and Cx can be counted, in seconds, on the fingers of one hand.  Performance under tree cover on a bike* - no noticeable difference.  Urban canyons - I don't have enough experience but I expect the HCx would be the best here.

* its a lot to do with the speed of travel - at walking speeds tree cover is a real problem for the C and Cx, but at cycling speeds all 3 are equally unfazed.

Overall, the differences between them are not much greater than the differences introduced by a software upgrade, on any given GPS.

[andrew_s]

C vs HCx

H  = more sensitive
Mostly to do with not losing a signal in cases where the C would, rather than improved accuracy or time to lock. Wherever you are struggling to get a good signal from 4-5 satellites - under wet trees, urban (or real) canyons etc, or even just very thick and wet cloud.

x = expandable memory - ie. micro SD cards
2GB card (£5) = space for maps for whole of Europe (or whole UK with Topo detailed contours), plus storage for a month or two detailed track logs, plus storage for whatever points of interest you can find on the web (Archies 20,000 campsites, Camra GBG etc).
No x = trying to get the lot into 64MB or so of on-board memory. 1 track log before you have to simplify it and lose timestamps etc. Maps for (eg) London, Kent & Sussex, discard and reload from PC/DVD if you want to go anywhere else. POIs fighting for space with the maps.

Plus Frankie's differences (though coloured routes could just be the versions of firmware he has loaded on the two units).

[drossall]

Thanks, these are really good comments. Should perhaps have made clearer that I already have a C (not a Cx), so the issue is the benefits of an upgrade.

Interested that others have problems with the handlebar mount and seals. That's not my experience on a Summit (not a Summit C!) or a Vista C. The only problem I have had is the Summit occasionally switching off - the battery contact problem - and oddly that seems better with rechargeables, almost as though they are marginally larger and therefore a more snug fit.

I must get about 20 hours life, after useful advice about choice of chargers from another denizen of these parts.

So far, the case for an HCx is not looking convincing, except for long-distance touring.

In many ways I still think the Summit is good, mind you. A big black arrow that just keeps pointing where you need to go can be a lot simpler than worrying about a map. That said, I did use the Vista C mapping on a recent ride when I had a problem with my preplanned route.

Nobody has said anything to suggest that the mapping works any differently or in more detail on an HCx compared to a C?

[frankly frankie]

The 'x' - the card slot - is well worth having -
* the ability to load a big map and then not have to faff with it before each project.
* the ability to auto-record daily timestamped tracklogs.
NB you can't load a map into memory without a card.

The map display is no different - except the screen is very slightly brighter/more contrasty (with no backlight), and scrolling is a bit smoother on maps where there's a lot of detail showing.
There's no more detail to be had, except infsofar as, with the faster processor, its practical to opt for a higher map detail level in the map setup, if you want.  That just tweaks the zoom level at which more detail kicks in.

The 'H' - high sensitivity - is IMO only noticeable under test conditions, makes no real difference in everyday cycling use.

[andygates]

Does the 'H' unit go mental sometimes too, then?

[frankly frankie]

They all seem remarkably reliable and accurate, to me, when used on the bike.

Its a different story when walking - these devices definitely like to be kept moving.
And viewing the recorded tracks later shows up some wavering and wandering that really isn't apparent when the GPS is being used to follow a route or track on the bike.

To me, they all comfortably exceed any expectations that I might get from the published specs.  The 'Estimate of Accuracy' - indicated by a circle superimposed on the map - is ridiculously pessimistic, by a factor of 10, I'd say.

[simonp]

The 'H' - high sensitivity - is IMO only noticeable under test conditions, makes no real difference in everyday cycling use.

I went from an Etrex Vista to an Etrex Vista HCx.  The difference is huge.  The old Vista was virtually useless for navigating in central London.  Might as well have carried a brick.  The HCx works flawlessly under those conditions.

High sensitivity means that when you are in a canyon you can pick up satellites which are near the horizon which the low sensitivity receiver would not pick up; it means you can get a signal in my study which would never have happened with my old device; it means more accuracy in challenging conditions because where one receiver manages to get 3 sats the higher sensitivity one found 5 - not just the ones that are conveniently overhead.

I used to regularly lose signal in forests with the old model.  Yet to see it happen with the new one.

[De Sisti]

I have an Etrex Vista CX and have NEVER had a problem with the handlebar mount. The rubber casing surrounding my older CX became loose and Garmin exchanged it for a newer CX model.

[Wombat]

They all seem remarkably reliable and accurate, to me, when used on the bike.

Its a different story when walking - these devices definitely like to be kept moving.
And viewing the recorded tracks later shows up some wavering and wandering that really isn't apparent when the GPS is being used to follow a route or track on the bike.

Yes, I noticed that at the weekend.  We were rehearsing a route, in the car, for following by numpties later on.  I just left the Etrex legend (plain old monochrome one) in the car glovebox switched on, while we investigated each location, and the track on Memory maps when I got back home did some serious wandering whilst we were in the pub!   I was surprised it even got a signal there...  however, all the moving tracks were pretty damn accurate, as they havwe been whilst cycling in our rural and suburban area.  I've has no problems with the handlebar bracket on poor quality road cycling (both the roads and my cycling are of poor quality...)

[andrew_s]

back on the original topic, older model Etrexes don't do a USB interface, which is a pain in this day and age. Check before buying.
You can get a serial to usb adapter cable, but that's extra cost.

[Charlotte]

Don't worry about the handlebar mount.  I've got mine on one of the standard Garmin mounts (of which I have several, across a number of bikes) and it's been fine.  As standard, there's a lot of play, which at worst can result in shaking the unit so hard that it turns itself off.  There's also the chance of vibrating out the screw that holds the mounting clip onto the back of the unit.

My answer has been to do three simple things.  A drop of threadlock on the screw and a lanyard round the bars as a belt & braces backup will stop you loosing your GPS.  To stop the vibration, I just use an elasticated toweling wristband, as modelled by tenis players, etc. round the mount.  It holds it all together and stops any vibration. 

I've yet to have a problem with it mounted like this 

[Andrew Br]

Face-palm moment 

I've just read Charlotte's reply (the bit about the threadlock) and thought "If I did that, I wouldn't be able to get the battery case off because the adaptor for the bar-mount covers the latch".

It seems though, if I turn the mount around on the handle-bars and then fit the adaptor the other way, it all works..........

I sometimes wonder how I manage to dress in the mornings.

 

[Charlotte]

Welcome to the YACF school for the gifted 

[Andrew Br]

Welcome to the YACF school for the gifted 

Can I be head-boy ?

[Chris S]

Welcome to the YACF school for the gifted 

Can I be head-boy ?

Who will be your fag?

[Kim]

To stop the vibration, I just use an elasticated toweling wristband, as modelled by tenis players, etc. round the mount.  It holds it all together and stops any vibration. 

I found that the Vista HCx's clip was a fair bit looser in the handlebar bracket than the one for my old yellow eTrex (the non-waterproof replacement battery cover).  Tactical application of a layer of gaffer tape to the bracket sorted the vibration issue nicely.  Not sure how much I trust the screw into the Vista's battery cover, but so far no complaints.

[Panoramix]

Welcome to the YACF school for the gifted 

Can I be head-boy ?

Who will be your fag?

[Chris S]

Welcome to the YACF school for the gifted 

Can I be head-boy ?

Who will be your fag?

Ah - sorry. Public school humour.  .