How much do people dislike Info controls ?

[wilkyboy]

Perhaps the question would be better phrased as: how many controls are acceptable on an event; given that infos are often interspersed between reasonably spaced 'proper' controls. 

For me, one info after (say) 10k is okay; a number of them suggests the organiser should perhaps go back to the drawing-board.

100km and shorter BP routes can be difficult to do any other way if you're going to stay away from towns, or the start is nowhere near any towns, especially if it's a clover-leaf route with 50 + 100km options (one leaf or two). 

Mandatory routes would sort this, but you'd need a bank of people with laptops to check GPX files, or else you'd need to run secret controls — at which point you may as well run checkpoints, but it still needs teams of volunteers and additional RA.

I have just one info on each of my 100s, but it's as much "for the fun of it" as removing them would mean the routes would be only 1km or so under-distance (by shortest route) on one of them, or would otherwise allow riders to return via a busy road on the other.  I see 100s as a step-up to longer distances, and so I see more first-timers at that distance, so I like to introduce them to some of the finer points of audax while they're still fresh

[Greenbank]

A mildly controversial info control today - "name the species of bird" on a sign but not everyone knew it! I played it safe via a quick sketch of the sign in the relevant box.

It was quite obvious though. What "colours is the bird on the sign?" whould have beed a fairer question.

Colour based questions have been discussed already - they're not good for the colour-blind riders.

Brazier's Run?

3 swords/scimitars on the crest on the bridge?

What was the question about the post office/shop in High Easter this year?

[Doo]

Wow, seems folk don't mind info controls. I use them as snack stops...

[Whitedown Man]

A rare non-working Saturday this weekend so eagerly looked at the website for local Cals. Found one - result! But then noticed just how many infos there are. I know the only person missing out is me, but having to stop every 20k with 2/3 of those stops being infos just isn’t for me. Roll on AUK entering the 21st century and introducing validation by GPS.

[Ian H]

A rare non-working Saturday this weekend so eagerly looked at the website for local Cals. Found one - result! But then noticed just how many infos there are. I know the only person missing out is me, but having to stop every 20k with 2/3 of those stops being infos just isn’t for me. Roll on AUK entering the 21st century and introducing validation by GPS.

Yes but, it's not just the infos, it's the overly intricate route that they portend.

[andyoxon]

Arguably mandatory route rides refresh the parts of audaxing,  that googlemaps walking-mode minimum distance and reasonable numbers of infos cannot...   

I don't particularly mind greater than average info numbers.  OOI I did try and replicate one on my mandatory route DIY 200kms, using gmaps walking mode.  I added three intermediate controls, reached 10 'infos' but was still 20km under distance.*

* Which may reflect my preference to opt for the minor roads, and such devices as the Fyfield A420 'portal'...

[quixoticgeek]

The 200k I did at the weekend had an info control, the first I've had in my limited Audaxing experience. The question was of course in Dutch, which I am not very good at. I checked with Ivo (OTP) to make sure I knew the question. In English it was:

"What is the name of the house at 28 station road?"

And the Brevett card had a nice space to write it in:

"The L_______"

147km into the ride we get to Station road, and look at the houses. Number 28 has a name along the lines of "The Forge", but 3 doors down at Number 24, is a house called "The Laurels". I'm a bit confused, it's my first info, it's late, I'm not sure about the language. I take photos of both buildings on my phone and on my camera.

Fast forward to when I hobble into the finish control, I collapse in a seat, hand over my Brevett card, take my phone out to show the photo and say to the organisor "So, number 24 or 28?"

The organisors response was "Well that's proof enough that you were there!"

Cheered me up no end.

J

PS (Numbers and answers changed in case the organisor wants to use the question again, as well as translating it into something that makes sense in English)

[Bianchi Boy]

Make all route 10% over distance. That way if you cheat you will still have ridden the required distance.

 

BB

[rdtrdt]

I'm only do occasional audaxes. I'm not really an audaxer as such,  so it doesn't really matter what I think, but for what it's worth...

I don't particularly care about validation and I only jump through the validation hoops because it's the "done thing" and to be polite to the organiser.

I'm similarly only an occasional audaxer and have never bothered with any controls at all, ever, so am always down as a DNF.

Since I'm not trying to qualify for anything, and ride audaxes merely for fun/training, the controls and validation process serves no purpose for me. I've actually been surprised not to find anyone else ever taking the same approach, but each to their own.

I see from other posts that me ignoring controls and thus apparently DNFing lowers the organisers costs. Maybe I should negotiate an entry fee discount? 

As mentioned above, I assume one day GPS validation will eventually be introduced and I'll cease being a ne'er do well...

[Cudzoziemiec]

...

The organisors response was "Well that's proof enough that you were there!"

Cheered me up no end.

J

PS (Numbers and answers changed in case the organisor wants to use the question again, as well as translating it into something that makes sense in English)

I think that's the general idea of infos.

Probably.

[citoyen]

I see from other posts that me ignoring controls and thus apparently DNFing lowers the organisers costs. Maybe I should negotiate an entry fee discount? 

Or maybe you should be charged extra for wasting the time of controllers who have to sit around waiting for you when you're the last name on the start list who hasn't checked in.

[rdtrdt]

I see from other posts that me ignoring controls and thus apparently DNFing lowers the organisers costs. Maybe I should negotiate an entry fee discount? 

Or maybe you should be charged extra for wasting the time of controllers who have to sit around waiting for you when you're the last name on the start list who hasn't checked in.

Not applicable - I always inform the organisers that I'll not be bothering with controls so they don't send out a search party looking for me.

[citoyen]

Not applicable - I always inform the organisers that I'll not be bothering with controls so they don't send out a search party looking for me.

Fair enough. I wish certain others I could name were as conscientious.

[rdtrdt]

Not applicable - I always inform the organisers that I'll not be bothering with controls so they don't send out a search party looking for me.

Fair enough. I wish certain others I could name were as conscientious.

Seems a reasonable request.

Some of the audaxes I ride end near-ish to where I live, in which case I'll detour home rather than completing the official route. I always inform the organiser when I'm going to do this because even though I'm not completing controls they'll still recognise my face (or rather my absence if I don't arrive back at the finish HQ...), so again I don't want them thinking I'm missing in action.

Although ICBA with controls I'm not trying cause the organiser any grief...

[LiamFitz]

Not applicable - I always inform the organisers that I'll not be bothering with controls so they don't send out a search party looking for me.

Fair enough. I wish certain others I could name were as conscientious.

+1

Separately I had the experience for the first time ever on the KVR this weekend when, arriving at a road junction where there was an info I asked a chap who was there already and writing info into his card what the info was. I had my gloves on and my card stashed away in a back pocket but was told firmly to look it up for myself as he rode off. I can only assume my cheery manner got on his pip and I guess he was well within his rights to say no but it did rather take me by surprise!

[bludger]

In my last ride an info control clue was 'height limit on car park on corner.'

I asked the organiser if he'd like imperial or metric. He responded simply 'it's 2.3' (metres).

I don't mind info controls but think it's nice if organisers look the other way if a mistake's been made.

[ElyDave]

Similarly, I missed a distance sign in one town.  I could give other numbers to different towns from there, but not the one required.

One controller had a swig of beer while I wrote the number of fingers held up by the other.

[Greenbank]

There's plenty of looking the other way in some corners of Audax. For BP rides the rules aren't that strictly enforced at all (out of time riders, missing info answers, even Brevets validated despite failing to ride the entire route). It gets a lot more strict (but not completely) for BR and more so for BRM.

It's only the odd person and never really affects anything at the competitive end of this type of non-competitive cycling.

[Ian H]

It's possibly best not to publicise these misdemeanours too widely. 

[Greenbank]

True.

The rules required to guarantee no possibility of cheating would either be completely unworkable or utterly stifling. I'm happy with the level at which the current rules are pitched.

[Phil W]

Not applicable - I always inform the organisers that I'll not be bothering with controls so they don't send out a search party looking for me.

Fair enough. I wish certain others I could name were as conscientious.

+1

Separately I had the experience for the first time ever on the KVR this weekend when, arriving at a road junction where there was an info I asked a chap who was there already and writing info into his card what the info was. I had my gloves on and my card stashed away in a back pocket but was told firmly to look it up for myself as he rode off. I can only assume my cheery manner got on his pip and I guess he was well within his rights to say no but it did rather take me by surprise!

How odd. On Windsor Chester Windsor in 2015 there was an info on a sign post. Since the Spring route check the bush had sprouted somewhat and obscured the sign. After climbing into the bush with a head torch (it was by now nigh time) I emerged with the answer. Just then another three riders turned up. I did not tell them to dive into the bush themselves.

[Von Broad]

Separately I had the experience for the first time ever on the KVR this weekend when, arriving at a road junction where there was an info I asked a chap who was there already and writing info into his card what the info was. I had my gloves on and my card stashed away in a back pocket but was told firmly to look it up for myself as he rode off. I can only assume my cheery manner got on his pip and I guess he was well within his rights to say no but it did rather take me by surprise!

Some people do audax to get away from their problems, other people just bring all their baggage with them [personally I do both!]
People like those you encountered on Saturday.......quite honestly....sounds like 'bankers'.

As a fully paid up member of the full value rider brigade and a rider who is very bad at info controls [as in sometimes I am lazy and really can't be arsed....yes, I know, this is a very bad attitude], I always get the feeling that, getting back to arrivee all extremely disheveled and worn out, that an absence of info control information on my brevet card, is met by the controller with astute empathy and a tacit understanding that "well, [looks up at clock, and rolls eyes] ......if it's taken him this long to get round then there's probably a very good chances he actually done the route as prescribed, so I might as well just go ahead and fill in the relevant information myself, and be done with it"

[Philip Whiteman]

I am not bothered whether my riders complete info control answers or not.  All I want is my participants to have a great day out.

[frankly frankie]

It's possibly best not to publicise these misdemeanours too widely. 

They aren't just publicised here - they are celebrated

[LiamFitz]

The weird thing is that on many sportives where many riders are in it for a time , there is very little by way of checking apart from a timer mat about half way around. I did one ride which went up loads of big lumps in the Chilterns and realised that a cheeky main road bash would have got be a Gold standard time to go along with my extravagant goodie bag of gels and fliers for other rides. By contrast, we do have a mechanism for checking, no glory for getting back quickly, and rejoice in it's subversion!