Author Topic: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?  (Read 35604 times)

Mrs Pingu

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Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #25 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:00:20 pm »
I wear hi vis, but only when I'm commuting in winter. This is not because I think it's any more likely that motons who are fiddling with their ipod/mentally preparing a shopping list/arguing with their spouse are going to see me, but so that if they do run into me they are slightly more likely to get twatted with a big stick when they get to court. (Lives in hope anyway).
Do not clench. It only makes it worse.

gonzo

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #26 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:01:44 pm »
BTW. I find that dressing like a zebra is a good way to get noticed!

Jacomus

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Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #27 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:02:14 pm »
I may be missing something but haven't we all agreed that stealth cyclists are not good? What makes this any different?

Visible or not - If someone becomes visible as they come in contact with your bonnet, that's not much help.

JrC - Presumably they can something, it's more a case of reduced visibility.

A Stealth Cyclist is NOT defined by their clothing.

One can be a Stealth Cyclist dressed entirely head to toe in HiVi, simply by riding without lights.

A light, even a cheapo LED will provide more than adequate visibility for a cyclist.


Cyclists tend to be most worried about vehicles approaching from behind, not seeing them, and smashing them to a pulp. In reality, a cyclists is least likely to be hit from behind. The most common motorvehicle-cyclist collion is at junctions, where it is proven that Motion Induced Blindness completely erases a cyclist or even motorcyclists from a car drivers interpreted vision - negating any conspicuity aids in common useage

Visibility is an issue that is FAR more complex than colour.
"The most difficult thing is the decision to act, the rest is merely tenacity." Amelia Earhart

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #28 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:05:28 pm »
All cyclists should be required by law to dress like this:
Caption It #120

Wowbagger

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Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #29 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:05:47 pm »
I'm always amazed how many cyclists (using the word in its broadest sense) ride around after dark in dark clothing and no lights and still get noticed by motorists.

I remain to be convinced that hi-viz makes a great deal of difference. You can be decorated like a Christmas tree and still some plonker, tuning the radio at the wrong moment, will SMIDSY you.
Quote from: Dez
It doesn’t matter where you start. Just start.

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #30 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:05:47 pm »
BTW. I find that dressing like a zebra is a good way to get noticed!

Um...zebras dress that way for camouflage.

annie

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #31 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:06:32 pm »
I guess that cycling naked might get you noticed.  Ho hum. 8)

Wowbagger

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Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #32 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:07:20 pm »
I've yet to see a T-boner at the WNBR.
Quote from: Dez
It doesn’t matter where you start. Just start.

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #33 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:09:32 pm »
Most of my riding is on small country lanes, so I wear stuff that I as a driver notice from furthest away.  

So this time of year in daylight it's either hi viz or blocks of non-black colour, at night it's reflectives and I use lights whenever it's gloomy or foggy or when the sun is really low.  I wear black at night, but it's got reflective bits. In the summer I dont think it matters so much because the contrasts are higher anyway.





gordon taylor

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #34 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:09:46 pm »
I wear hi vis, but only when I'm commuting in winter. This is not because I think it's any more likely that motons who are fiddling with their ipod/mentally preparing a shopping list/arguing with their spouse are going to see me, but so that if they do run into me they are slightly more likely to get twatted with a big stick when they get to court. (Lives in hope anyway).


I've recently gone from black to hi-viz (+ helmet) for the same reason. I am absolutely convinced that I'm going to be hit by a vehicle on my commute and I don't want ANY pathetic excuses to come between the jerk and the big stick.

I hate the whole idea of ME having to compensate for the dangers caused by drivers, but I've given up preaching - I just zip up and relax.

gonzo

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #35 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:09:50 pm »
A Stealth Cyclist is NOT defined by their clothing.

It's very hard to disagree with you about the meaning of a made up phrase!

Do we agree that camouflage on a bike is a bad idea?

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #36 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:10:02 pm »
 When I am in the car I am grateful for anything that helps me drive safely, and that includes efforts by other road users to be seen.

Would that be because you do not need to pay as much attention to what you are doing?

Peering intently through my windscreen doesn't seem to make the invisible visible

David Martin

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Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #37 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:13:33 pm »
 When I am in the car I am grateful for anything that helps me drive safely, and that includes efforts by other road users to be seen.

Would that be because you do not need to pay as much attention to what you are doing?

Peering intently through my windscreen doesn't seem to make the invisible visible

They are visible. If they weren't you could see the road through them.
You do not have a right to expect everyone else to make themselves visible beyond what is required by law. You do have a duty to conduct yourself such that you do not pose a danger to others, seen or unseen.

If you can't see the cyclists then you are travelling too fast or not paying enough attention, or both.

..d
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

FyPuNK

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #38 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:14:27 pm »
In summer it bucketed down with rain on my commute back home, my summer shower jacket is black, on that 7 mile journey as was nearly wiped out three times as cars came so close to me, it was daylight but I had my rear LED on due to the rain, this prompted me to buy a hi vis for winter. I now find I get a little more respect but in-keeping with certain research on the whole cars are closer to me than before, I read an article by I think Dr Ian Walker and something that came out was the more proficient you look on the bike the less room a driver will give.

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #39 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:15:58 pm »
I often wear just black, but on my Mum's request, have started to wear brighter colours. Bright blue, for example. And I have good lights. I won't go as far as fluo, however.

Good road positioning is definitely the best visibility aid, in my experience.

Chris S

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #40 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:17:28 pm »
Hi Vis works better if it's got a blue panel on the back with Police in big friendly letters.

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #41 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:17:38 pm »
 When I am in the car I am grateful for anything that helps me drive safely, and that includes efforts by other road users to be seen.

Would that be because you do not need to pay as much attention to what you are doing?

Peering intently through my windscreen doesn't seem to make the invisible visible

I have yet to see an invisible cyclist or, for that matter, anything at the roadside which is invisible.

Wowbagger

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Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #42 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:19:26 pm »
I've noticed since having the Hope Vision that more cars seem to be giving way to me. I think they see a bright light and don't know what I am, so assume something big. I tend to wear hi-vis after dark, but I wonder whether the beneficial effect of the very bright lights might be lost if the subset of motorists who can't stand cyclists can see exactly what they are too soon.
Quote from: Dez
It doesn’t matter where you start. Just start.

alan

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #43 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:20:18 pm »
I suspect that the colour of your clothing is not critical.
A driver sees you or he doesn't.
Your safety is reliant on his powers of observation.
You have no control,& very little influence, over his driving skills.

I sometimes wear hi-viz or flouro clothes primarily for the "comfort" of knowing that I can do no more for my own well being.

Jacomus

  • My favourite gender neutral pronoun is comrade
Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #44 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:20:48 pm »
A Stealth Cyclist is NOT defined by their clothing.

It's very hard to disagree with you about the meaning of a made up phrase!

Do we agree that camouflage on a bike is a bad idea?

 ;D

Depends what you mean by cammo...

Head to toe in 95 Pattern will be perfectly visible in a city, more so than Urban Cammo - i.e. HiVi

Out on a cuontry road, bright sunlight, light coloured vegetation HiVi is out. 95 Pat is more visible, black is even more visible.

Heavy shade - the yellow of HiVi doesn't work, and drivers won't be using their headlights, so HiVi is crap, 95Pat would be really bad and black would be relatively bad. A white or light blue top would be the best.

It all changes on the situation. But one thing remains a constant - a light is the best visibility aid going when the light fails. 
"The most difficult thing is the decision to act, the rest is merely tenacity." Amelia Earhart

inc

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #45 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:21:22 pm »
I cannot believe intelligent people think riding in black in the winter gloom is fine, maybe you all live in central London but out in the sticks you just blend into the hedgerow on a dull day. You don't need Hi-vis just a brighter colour. Motorist around here are great normally giving you a wide birth but I don't want to be involved in a genuine " I am sorry I didn't see you" incident. Why take the risk.

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #46 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:22:11 pm »
Driving and cycling I have met pedestrians in the road and, no matter what clothing they were wearing, I've always seen them. Even lightless cyclists are visible enough for me to have time to think what to shout at them.

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #47 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:22:27 pm »
 When I am in the car I am grateful for anything that helps me drive safely, and that includes efforts by other road users to be seen.

Would that be because you do not need to pay as much attention to what you are doing?

Peering intently through my windscreen doesn't seem to make the invisible visible

I have yet to see an invisible cyclist or, for that matter, anything at the roadside which is invisible.


I have seen some idiots in dark clothes on moonless rainy nights with no lights that do a fair impression of being invisible.
 
I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that.

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #48 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:23:02 pm »
...Both Nutty and I often write about our findings regarding space and SMIDSYs when we stopped wearing HiVi.
...

I must get a photo of how I was garbed on one SMIDY. -> Hi-Viz orange long sleeved top with reflective stripes round arms and body.  Sitting on a daffodil yellow motorbike with the lights on.  ::-)




I've found over the years that adding hi-viz and/or helmet when cycling doesn't add much at all in the way of safety.  If anything it decreased my safety as drivers cut me closer and pulled in earlier after overtaking.


I've posted before my fear re a cyclist on the A303 at night wearing black, but having followed him on my bike (with an accidental hi-viz moment as the most comfortable rain jacket happened to be yellow) I can vouch for the fact that he was just as visible as the rider next to him who was in hi-viz overload.


I now make a point of buying clothes for comfort, not colour.  As I said above the rain jacket is hi-viz, but it was a close run thing between that and the black one.   I will rarely wear a road worker's hi-viz vest over my clothing now as it's just too uncomfy and annoys me as it blows around in the wind.




And as I said to a person the other day who moaned that "cyclists" didn't wear hi-viz, "whose responsibility is it to go to each fallen tree on a road and put a hi-viz jacket on it so that drivers can see it instead of driving into it".

Re: Wearing black cycling gear in winter - plain daft or what ?
« Reply #49 on: 04 January, 2009, 08:25:11 pm »
 When I am in the car I am grateful for anything that helps me drive safely, and that includes efforts by other road users to be seen.

Would that be because you do not need to pay as much attention to what you are doing?

Peering intently through my windscreen doesn't seem to make the invisible visible

I have yet to see an invisible cyclist or, for that matter, anything at the roadside which is invisible.


I have seen some idiots in dark clothes on moonless rainy nights with no lights that do a fair impression of being invisible.
 


On which basis I assume you could clearly see what was beyond them, through them.  ::-)

EDIT: I have no issue with making oneself seen in poor visibility conditions. When these arise, I put on the lights.
Oddly enough, the same as a lot of other road users do - along with streetlights which switch on when light levels are poor.  :)
I do not consider such conditions to be an opportunity to dress myself in the manner of a bowl of citrus fruit.