Cycling in the olympic VIP lanes

[Cudzoziemiec]

I thought the police handed out PCNs all the time, eg to motorists caught speeding.

[mattc]

FPNs

[Cudzoziemiec]

Yes. Not the same thing then? Evidently not, but why not?

[Julian]

An FPN (Fixed Penalty Notice) allows the police to dispose of a criminal matter without the bother of cautions, charges, all that guff.  You get your penalty notice, pay it, and you should hear no more - meaning you don't get a criminal record.  You have the right to have your case heard at the Magistrates Court if you really want and the Magna Carter Nutters^TM generally do.

A PCN (Penalty Charge Notice) allows the local authority to dispose of a civil matter in a similar manner. 

If you are being given an FPN by the police, failure to pay it will see you hauled up in front of the magistrates court, fined, and landed with a disclosable criminal record.  Failure to give correct details may be a separate offence.  They may ask for your details if they suspect a crime has been committed.  Declaring yourself to be Mickey Mouse resident at Buckingham Palace is not likely to end well.  Be co-operative and pay up.

If you are being given a PCN by a random civil officer, failure to pay it will see you going through a torturously long procedure involving appeals to an Independent* Adjudicator, who will usually uphold the penalty, and after that you can be taken to the County Court where eventually you may face a CCJ, which will affect your credit rating.  However, random civil officers have no power to detain and no power to demand to see ID.  Riding away from them is an appropriate course of action although it will piss them off enormously.  If they try to detain you physically you can sue them.  But it's easier to ride away if you can.


*ish

[Pickled Onion]

Thanks Julian that's really useful information.

Just to be 100% clear: using the lanes as someone not in the "Olympic Family" is a civil offence and one won't be chased down by a copper on a Smith & Wesson because they wouldn't GAF? What about disobeying one of the temporary no turn/no striaght on signs? Are they real moving traffic offences or just plastic ones? If by some unfortunate chance, a Civil Enforcer were to grab me or my bike and not let go, what would I be threatening to sue him for? If there were a handy plod nearby, would he be able to get the plod to find out who I am?

The reason for asking is my route to work, which is normally chokka when 2 lanes are in use, will be down to a single lane barely a gnat's crotchet wider than the tipper lorries which will be nose to tail along the length. So do I take my chances in the gutter, or in primary hoping the tipper drivers actually look down and don't just run over the top of me, or in the Zil lane with the 60mph BMWs? Then the street where I work has a no right turn. I can't go the alternative route, because there's also a no straight on, nor can I pass and double back because there's no U turns either.

[Cudzoziemiec]

Thanks, Julian - nicely explained as always! I'm familiar with the idea of FPNs and had initially thought PCN was the same thing. It must be something that was invented while I was abroad and obviously I'm far too law-abiding to have encountered it. Probably.

P.S. Volgas were more attractive than Zils.


Zil


Volga. Had many a fun taxi ride in them. 

[Julian]

Thanks Julian that's really useful information.

Just to be 100% clear: using the lanes as someone not in the "Olympic Family" is a civil offence and one won't be chased down by a copper on a Smith & Wesson because they wouldn't GAF?

So I assume, because the media is reporting that it will attract a PCN not an FPN.  I haven't checked that this is accurate for myself, but if the media have got it right then so have I.

What about disobeying one of the temporary no turn/no striaght on signs? Are they real moving traffic offences or just plastic ones?

Those are temporary traffic signals and disobeying them is a criminal offence for which you could get an FPN and / or a mags court appearance.

If by some unfortunate chance, a Civil Enforcer were to grab me or my bike and not let go, what would I be threatening to sue him for?

False imprisonment and / or unlawful detention

If there were a handy plod nearby, would he be able to get the plod to find out who I am?

Probably.  I would expect it to go along the lines of "this man is causing a public disturbance, please arrest him for a public order offence."  However, if your powers of bluff are up to it (and your office don't mind you being 8 hours late from time to time) then you would probably not be charged.

The reason for asking is my route to work, which is normally chokka when 2 lanes are in use, will be down to a single lane barely a gnat's crotchet wider than the tipper lorries which will be nose to tail along the length. So do I take my chances in the gutter, or in primary hoping the tipper drivers actually look down and don't just run over the top of me, or in the Zil lane with the 60mph BMWs? Then the street where I work has a no right turn. I can't go the alternative route, because there's also a no straight on, nor can I pass and double back because there's no U turns either.

I think you'll have to resort to some walking action in order to get round the temporary traffic signals.  No chance of working from home for the duration?

[Charlotte]

So I assume, because the media is reporting that it will attract a PCN not an FPN.  I haven't checked that this is accurate for myself, but if the media have got it right then so have I.

From TFL:

Penalty Charge Notices will be issued for vehicles that contravene traffic regulations on the ORN.

From getaheadofthegames.com:

Failure to do so will result in a Penalty Charge Notice and could mean your vehicle being removed.

Sounds to me like you can ride your bike in LOCOG's Zil lanes with utter impunity 

[Julian]

Well, it's not utter impunity, because of the potential for HASSLE.  I'd rather avoid confrontations with civil enforcement officers who wish they were police officers.  And of course you have further potential for extreme bullying from the Zils who have been assured that there won't be any pesky cyclists on their red carpets.  So I'll be avoiding them.

But legally speaking as long as you don't end up giving them your details I don't see how they could have you.

[Pickled Onion]

Excellent thanks! Forewarned and armed and all that.

[JonBoy]

Well, it's not utter impunity, because of the potential for HASSLE.  I'd rather avoid confrontations with civil enforcement officers who wish they were police officers.  And of course you have further potential for extreme bullying from the Zils who have been assured that there won't be any pesky cyclists on their red carpets.  So I'll be avoiding them.

But legally speaking as long as you don't end up giving them your details I don't see how they could have you.

Well, thankfully in my case I won't be anywhere near London - I'm just concerned that this could set a precedent re: civil enforcement officers.

As for the no <X> turns etc., the usual circumvention method of dismount and push, then remount may be helpful - as long as there isn't a civil enforcement officer out to get you.

[mrcharly-YHT]

Well, thankfully in my case I won't be anywhere near London - I'm just concerned that this could set a precedent re: civil enforcement officers.

You worried that they will be/believe they get extra powers?  I agree with you, it is a major concern.

[Domestique]

Looking at the way anyone was/has been dealt with for encroaching the Olympic Torch 'Bubble' I would be staying out of them.
I am not in London, so it will be life as normal here.

[mattc]

P.S. Volgas were more attractive than Zils.


Zil


Volga. Had many a fun taxi ride in them. 

My money is on the Volga getting smashed up in a Bond movie first.

[Ham]

Well, I can't say if ALL the lanes are marked in a similar manner, but the ones around Stratford have possibly the best surface, ever. It's dimpled and has none of the slipperyness associated with road paint. I have, rather strangely, been able to experiment in the wet over recent days. (hard to believe I know)

As a result, I will from choice be riding ON the lines.

Now, is that in, or out?

[matthew]

neither, and as your not in either lane expect cars to pass you on both sides without deviating from their line!! 

[Viking]

Well I will be boycotting the Olympics on the grounds of extreme commercialism detracting from the original point of the games.  The number of businesses in Londonshire that have been renamed, shut, moved etc in order  not to violate the sponsors message is, to be frank, shite!

[Domestique]

I would like to be at CM this month 

[AndyK]

It's the Olympics. You're driving in London. The left lane turns into a bus lane so you have to merge right. Hang on…

[TimO]

What in gods names do those arrows mean?  "Swerve left and right in a confused manner" ?

I'm guessing the left lane is (was?) a bus lane, so the left arrow pointing rightward was initially telling cars to move thataway to avoid the bus lane.  Then they've recently added in a Games lane, with a new arrow on the right hand side, to point people away from that lane.  The left hand arrow should probably have been removed when the put the new one in, and likewise the set of dotted lines on the bus lane, so it's clear that the bus lane is no longer in effect.

I guess it's possible that this will yet be done, when someone points out how ludicrously stupid it is.  This also demonstrates the downside of having relatively gormless order following people putting these markings down, and clearly never questioning the sanity of them.

Presumably at midnight on one day, the bus lane will cease to operate, and the games lane will kick in, and good luck to anyone who misses that exact day, and doesn't shift across appropriately.

[Valiant]

It's a helpful guide to drifting for the beginner.

[Redlight]

Coming along the Embankment today I noticed a lot more traffic in the left hand (non Olympic) lane than in the Zil lane, even though the latter isn't in use yet. Trouble is, with all the parked up coaches, etc, the left hand lane is not wide enough for a car to pass a cyclist, let alone for a lorry to do so.  The confident among us will need to take primary and put up with the punishment passes, etc., or take to the Zil lanes. I worry for the safety of the less confident.

[Zipperhead]

From the BBC

A group of MPs have called for transport chiefs in London to let cyclists use the Olympic Games Lanes.

The 30 miles (50km) of road lanes have been put aside for athletes, VIPs and the media and anyone else using them faces a fine.

Liberal Democrat MP Tom Brake said cyclists should be exempt.

Transport for London (TfL) said cyclists could not use them as they were mainly outside lanes which they would not use anyway.

[clarion]

EDM421

That this House recognises the outstanding development and success of professional cycling in the UK over the past 10 years, as well as the welcome growth of amateur cycling in the UK; but raises concern about the logistical impact of Olympic Games Lanes on the daily commute of cyclists; and calls on Transport for London (TfL) to monitor on a daily basis whether cyclists need to be excluded from the Games Lanes which will exacerbate congestion and send the wrong message about the importance of commuting by bike.

Principal Sponsor: Tom Brake
Sponsors: Peter Bottomley, Jeremy Corbyn, Andrew George, Simon Hughes
No further sigs so far.  Get your MP to sign.

[delthebike]

This has popped up on BBC
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-18885587

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