Author Topic: Novice Audax Tyre Question (Read 18154 times)

Karla · « **Reply #50 on:** 10 November, 2016, 03:08:29 pm »

True, though most club runs manage fine with everyone running normal road tyres. The consequences of a stop or an off can admittedly be more serious on a night ride in winter - which is why I wore a helmet on this year's goth ride when normally I wouldn't bother - but this still keeps coming back to the fact that normal road tyres, used on roads, don't puncture, so battleship tyres are a solution to a problem that doesn't exist for most of their users.

mattc · « **Reply #51 on:** 10 November, 2016, 04:31:06 pm »

OK, I have to bite now - that's 2 consecutive statements that I disagree with Greg!

Do club runs "manage" on light tyres? Depends what you mean - my club probably puncture more weeks than not, 10-20 riders typically (less if it rains properly!). Now it is a cast-iron fact that my Marathon+ 700x25c tyres have punctured less* in many thousand kms than our club does in about 150km. I could find many accounts of similar performance from M+ tyres, so I reckon the data has good significance.

Your ride of 2000km without punctures is clearly NOT statisisististically significant. Of course I'm pleased you got round P-free, and I'm far from surprised, but I've punctured enough newish decent tyres to know the contrary. Add in all the other riders' deflations that I've witnessed ... well, I'm somewhat astounded by your statements.

If you wear a tyre down, it punctures more. If you make it with more rubber, the opposite occurs. There is some fine detail to the exact correlations, but broadly it is as simple as that. QED

_{* 0 (zero) times, to be precise}

Banjo · « **Reply #52 on:** 10 November, 2016, 10:52:42 pm »

Had a fairy visit today on a diy .Slipping the tyre on and off my new Mavic A119 rims was almost pleasureable... Almost.

Cudzoziemiec · « **Reply #53 on:** 10 November, 2016, 11:30:21 pm »

Pharti: I'm not assuming that a light/supple/fast tyre is more liable to puncture nor that a heavy/stiff/slow tyre is any sort of proof against it. It can be that way, M+ being the iconic example and your Dugast track tub used on the road the its opposite example, but it can equally be the other way. Quality of construction and design play a part.

But the question wasn't "I need new tyres for my audax bike, should I get M+ or Open Corsa?" it was "The tyres on the bike I use for commuting, shopping, touring, school run, etc etc, are in perfectly decent condition, but now I've started to use it for audax too I'm wondering if it's worth getting faster tyres. Will they actually make me faster?"Different question with multiple answers.

My answer would still be stick with what you've got until you feel a need or benefit in changing. Though having said that, it might be a nice idea to try two sets of wheels: stock wheels with present tyres for most riding, lighter wheels with faster tyres for audaxes (and maybe summer Sundays!). It's quicker and easier to change a whole wheel than a tyre (IMO) and you get more benefit cos more changes.

Kim · « **Reply #54 on:** 10 November, 2016, 11:33:23 pm »

Quote from: Cudzoziemiec on 10 November, 2016, 11:30:21 pm

My answer would still be stick with what you've got until you feel a need or benefit in changing.

Indeed.

Quote

Though having said that, it might be a nice idea to try two sets of wheels: stock wheels with present tyres for most riding, lighter wheels with faster tyres for audaxes (and maybe summer Sundays!). It's quicker and easier to change a whole wheel than a tyre (IMO) and you get more benefit cos more changes.

This sounds like a half-arsed approach to n+1 that makes sense if stealth is required to get the process past the Management...

Cudzoziemiec · « **Reply #55 on:** 10 November, 2016, 11:35:10 pm »

Barakta's in charge of your finances, is she?

Kim · « **Reply #56 on:** 10 November, 2016, 11:48:27 pm »

I'm definitely not allowed any more bikes until I'm able to ride the ones I've got

(She has recently suggested that I invest in some new tyres^[1] though. Something to do with a dodgy looking sidewall and not having a blowout that might result in another injury that leaves me moping round the house being irritable for weeks.)

_{[1] For all-weather utility purposes, including mild CORing, but hopefully not any actual audaxes. So I'll wait for this thread to reach a consensus and buy the opposite}

mattc · « **Reply #57 on:** 11 November, 2016, 07:29:30 am »

Quote from: Kim on 10 November, 2016, 11:33:23 pm

Quote
Though having said that, it might be a nice idea to try two sets of wheels: stock wheels with present tyres for most riding, lighter wheels with faster tyres for audaxes (and maybe summer Sundays!). It's quicker and easier to change a whole wheel than a tyre (IMO) and you get more benefit cos more changes.

This sounds like a half-arsed approach to n+1 that makes sense if stealth is required to get the process past the Management...

Joking aside, I find the "spare wheels" approach works pretty well. It's very useful to have spares setup ready to go anyway [cos stuff does break n wear out when you are least prepared

]. A lot less space and cost than a spare bike, and they're the quickest spare to "hot-swap".

Cudzoziemiec · « **Reply #58 on:** 11 November, 2016, 09:53:03 am »

"Hot-swap"?!

I'm reminded of a thread which involved a mattc-specific definition of "n+1".

LMT · « **Reply #59 on:** 11 November, 2016, 10:18:15 am »

ime punctures come from riding in the gutter, I don't ride in the gutter so rarely get punctures.

jsabine · « **Reply #60 on:** 11 November, 2016, 09:42:37 pm »

But are you looking at the stars?

Kim · « **Reply #61 on:** 11 November, 2016, 10:49:32 pm »

IME falling off your bike comes from looking at the stars.

jsabine · « **Reply #62 on:** 12 November, 2016, 02:19:05 am »

Or vice versa ...

Banjo · « **Reply #63 on:** 12 November, 2016, 09:31:04 am »

Or looking at the bottom of one too many pint glasses

mrcharly-YHT · « **Reply #64 on:** 18 November, 2016, 04:23:48 pm »

Greg has mentioned Rubino pro - those were my go-to commuting tyre on one bike. Reasonably quick, and fairly durable. I bought them for MsC and her partner when they were going touring, they managed a week in France/belgium without a puncture and are still riding on those tyres.

To answer a question about 'fattest tyres in an audax'; my first and to date only audax was an Easter Arrow, which I completed on 50mm Kojaks.

In retrospect, I could have done with picking a faster bike and tyres given we were plodding into a headwind for 150miles of the ride (and I had mudguards like airbrakes on Concorde), but they got me round. I certainly didn't suffer from any road buzz.

Simon E · « **Reply #65 on:** 18 November, 2016, 08:47:10 pm »

Quote from: LMT on 11 November, 2016, 10:18:15 am

ime punctures come from riding in the gutter, I don't ride in the gutter so rarely get punctures.

Although I would agree IME most punctures are caused by thorns and road positioning makes no difference (most of my riding is on rural lanes and B roads).

The trade-off between a supple, comfy and fast(er) tyre vs a stiffer, more puncture-resistant tyre is a personal choice.

I've just put the Durano Plus back on my SCR for winter. They roll well enough on smoother roads but the stiffer construction means the bike communicates even more of the many imperfections on the roads of Shropshire than the standard Durano and Pro4 Endurance I used previously. I am not enjoying this. They are also considerably more effort to get onto the rim so I sincerely hope I do not end up wrestling with tyre levers on a cold, wet January evening half way home.

quixoticgeek · « **Reply #66 on:** 12 February, 2017, 05:58:05 pm »

Quote from: mattc on 11 November, 2016, 07:29:30 am

Joking aside, I find the "spare wheels" approach works pretty well. It's very useful to have spares setup ready to go anyway [cos stuff does break n wear out when you are least prepared ]. A lot less space and cost than a spare bike, and they're the quickest spare to "hot-swap".

Agreed. On my big bike with disc brakes I have three sets of wheels, one set has 700x23's (random road slick), one set has 700x32 (Marathon Plus), and one set has 26x1.5" (soon to be Marathon's (non plus)). Which wheel set I use depends on what I'm doing. The bike came with the 26x1.5's, but I swapped to 700's for a reason I'm sure made sense 10 years ago... but can't actually remember now. I think any future bikes I have will have disk brakes so I can have this flexibility in swapping around wheel sets.

Sorry for going OT.

J

dim · « **Reply #67 on:** 12 February, 2017, 08:07:05 pm »

maybe it's time to start looking at these?:

http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/videos/cycling-tech/tubeless-tyres-tested-destruction

Peter · « **Reply #68 on:** 12 February, 2017, 09:18:12 pm »

Quote from: Phartiphukborlz on 10 November, 2016, 03:08:29 pm

True, though most club runs manage fine with everyone running normal road tyres. The consequences of a stop or an off can admittedly be more serious on a night ride in winter - which is why I wore a helmet on this year's goth ride when normally I wouldn't bother - but this still keeps coming back to the fact that normal road tyres, used on roads, don't puncture, so battleship tyres are a solution to a problem that doesn't exist for most of their users.

Bit late to this, Greg, sorry!

Do you mean the chances of coming off are greater - or that the road is harder in winter?! It seems that basically you are saying, "if you come off it's a good idea to be wearing a helmet."

PS Movers may move, if they are so moved but the quote is from this thread.

Wycombewheeler · « **Reply #69 on:** 12 February, 2017, 10:56:56 pm »

Quote from: LMT on 11 November, 2016, 10:18:15 am

ime punctures come from riding in the gutter, I don't ride in the gutter so rarely get punctures.

In my experience, punctures come from riding in the flinty chilterns, but as this is where I live, ho hum, last club ride there were two punctures (different wheels) and the week before there was one. Overall it's more common for a group (8-10) ride to stop for multiple punctures than for none at all.

Quote from: dim on 12 February, 2017, 08:07:05 pm

maybe it's time to start looking at these?:

http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/videos/cycling-tech/tubeless-tyres-tested-destruction

I already have, and I haven't had a failure yet, taken to commuting and short solo rides without a spare, carrying a tube only on club rides, or audaxes.

Karla · « **Reply #70 on:** 13 February, 2017, 10:52:48 am »

Quote from: Peter on 12 February, 2017, 09:18:12 pm

Quote from: Phartiphukborlz on 10 November, 2016, 03:08:29 pm
True, though most club runs manage fine with everyone running normal road tyres. The consequences of a stop or an off can admittedly be more serious on a night ride in winter - which is why I wore a helmet on this year's goth ride when normally I wouldn't bother - but this still keeps coming back to the fact that normal road tyres, used on roads, don't puncture, so battleship tyres are a solution to a problem that doesn't exist for most of their users.

Bit late to this, Greg, sorry!

Do you mean the chances of coming off are greater - or that the road is harder in winter?! It seems that basically you are saying, "if you come off it's a good idea to be wearing a helmet."

PS Movers may move, if they are so moved but the quote is from this thread.

I mean that "The consequences of a stop or an off are more serious in winter".

For reasons that are too obvious to state, having everyone in the group stand around while you fix your puncture or patch up your cuts and bruises, is a bad idea when it's freezing cold, blowing a gale, pi$$ing with rain and 10 miles from the nearest civilization - in ways that don't really matter when it's warm and sunny. It's not a vast leap of logic to realise that it can be wise to take extra preventative measures, such as heavier tyres, when the former conditions apply.

So basically, exactly what I said!

Peter · « **Reply #71 on:** 13 February, 2017, 11:00:14 am »

Yes, those reasons are too obvious to state, which is why I wasn't referring to them. What I am curious about is your reason for wearing a helmet - does it help with the punctures, or is it to do with what might happen if your head hits the ground?

mrcharly-YHT · « **Reply #72 on:** 13 February, 2017, 11:08:23 am »

Someone who has previously had a traumatic brain injury has good justification for being very cautious about a repeat bang on the head.

The chances of a sudden slip are higher in winter, so the chances of a slip and thump on the noggin are higher.

Karla · « **Reply #73 on:** 13 February, 2017, 11:10:00 am »

Because the consequences of everyone having to stop, whether to patch up a puncture or to patch up my cuts and bruises, are more serious in winter than in summer, for all the same obvious reasons.

Peter · « **Reply #74 on:** 13 February, 2017, 06:07:51 pm »

I'm pretty sure you are right to wear the helmet, Greg (I certainly would in your shoes). I was puzzled because you were justifying it on the grounds of not keeping people waiting in the cold.

Maybe see you at Graeme's Ordination II?

Peter