Author Topic: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK  (Read 15569 times)

Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« on: 19 March, 2023, 09:21:11 am »
Good or bad?

Open to government abuse and big brother or essential service to keep the general populous informed in times of crisis and emergency?

I'm interested in people's perceptions. 

For my part I find the concept to be good and of course the PR is well drafted but I find myself never able to trust Big Brother and expect the inevitable abuse of the system once established by untrustworthy politicians and other nefarious actors.

Also, is such a system possible to hack and thus spread misinformation and potential chaos?

Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #1 on: 19 March, 2023, 09:38:03 am »
The Netherlands has a similar system. If I recall, it is tested on a Wednesday every month and everyone jumps up together.

Clare

  • Is in NZ
Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #2 on: 19 March, 2023, 10:03:05 am »
We have emergency mobile alerts in NZ, run by Civil Defence. They only happen in genuine emergencies and have never been abused as far as we are aware.

Beardy

  • Shedist
Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #3 on: 19 March, 2023, 11:18:58 am »
I suppose it makes sure that more people are aware of their imminent doom, as this process will give everyone with a phone the 4 minute warning.
For every complex problem in the world, there is a simple and easily understood solution that’s wrong.

robgul

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Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #4 on: 19 March, 2023, 11:48:33 am »
Positive  :thumbsup:

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #5 on: 19 March, 2023, 12:06:54 pm »
Cell broadcast[1] is a standard GSM feature that civilised countries implemented as a means to send emergency messages years ago, and the UK eschewed.  They're now playing catch-up.

Good or bad depends on what they use it for.  Technically, it has the advantage of being a broadcast transmission, so avoiding the network congestion that an equivalent SMS or voice call to all users would cause.  It's also cell-specific, which is potentially very useful with small cells.  (You could, for example, send an evacuation message to everyone in a stadium or railway station.  But not to the point where it'll become a useful replacement for sodding fire pagers, because modern life is rubbish.)

Potentially useful for severe flooding, fires or terrorist incidents or whatever.  Less so if they decide to fill it with the sort of guff[2] you get on council or emergency services twitter feeds.  Or worse, as a propaganda outlet for the Conservative party.


As for hacking, sure.  Either you set up a rogue cell[3] and send a legitimate message to the phones currently associated with it, compromise a cellular operator's equipment, or you somehow find your way in to whatever government IT project is responsible for conveying the legitimate messages to the cellular operators.  It's absolutely the sort of thing that 1337 h4xx0rs or disgruntled employees might do for the lols, but I'd expect they'd send something harmless like a rickroll or a "$telco suxx0rz" rather than a 4-minute warning.  Hopefully they won't set the password to the sort of thing an idiot would have on his luggage.


[1] Back in the Nokia days, Orange would transmit the cell's STD code via Cell Broadcast, so you could display it on the home screen.
[2] Cell Broadcast supports multiple channels, so if they did decide to do this, they could do so in a way that you could filter out.
[3] The sort of thing the police are allowed to do for the usual policey reasons, but Ofcom will throw the book at you for if caught.

rogerzilla

  • When n+1 gets out of hand
Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #6 on: 19 March, 2023, 02:39:24 pm »
I suppose it makes sure that more people are aware of their imminent doom, as this process will give everyone with a phone the 4 minute warning.
I'm off to listen to "Two Tribes" now.
Hard work sometimes pays off in the end, but laziness ALWAYS pays off NOW.

PaulF

  • "World's Scariest Barman"
  • It's only impossible if you stop to think about it
Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #7 on: 19 March, 2023, 02:58:42 pm »
My new hat will keep me safe



;D

Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #8 on: 19 March, 2023, 03:17:10 pm »
Shouldn't it be opt in? Otherwise it's spam.

Would have been used to announce the Queen's death, no doubt.

I'd say leave it to the BBC.

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #9 on: 19 March, 2023, 04:20:07 pm »
The BBC has been emasculated, and often waits until another news outlet has published a story.
It is simpler than it looks.

T42

  • Apprentice geezer
Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #10 on: 19 March, 2023, 04:25:07 pm »
Cell broadcast[1] is a standard GSM feature that civilised countries implemented as a means to send emergency messages years ago, and the UK eschewed.  They're now playing catch-up.

But if you ask them they're leading the world.  As ever.
I've dusted off all those old bottles and set them up straight

barakta

  • Bastard lovechild of Yomiko Readman and Johnny 5
Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #11 on: 19 March, 2023, 04:51:48 pm »
I'm generally in favour, I know of deaf people who didn't know about fires in the USA last year who were only saved cos neighbours broke into their houses and woke them up so they could evacuate/escape.

As for opt in, there is an opt out in phone settings where you can turn alerts off. The BBC's video mentioned this even though they recommended people keep the options on.

I haven't read other sources yet, but the impression I get is that this is genuinely very rarely going to be used. Floods, fires, etc. I think OfCom would be unhappy if a government/council abused them. Being able to check against a central webpage www.gov.uk/alerts for legitimacy is also quite sensible.

Kim

  • Timelord
    • Fediverse
Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #12 on: 19 March, 2023, 05:28:54 pm »
Cell broadcast[1] is a standard GSM feature that civilised countries implemented as a means to send emergency messages years ago, and the UK eschewed.  They're now playing catch-up.

But if you ask them they're leading the world.  As ever.

I wouldn't be surprised if it was Brits who invented it, like with AML.

Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #13 on: 19 March, 2023, 07:19:09 pm »
I can think of a few times where this probably would have been utilised to good effect in the UK over the last decade.  Severe weather stuff with obvious threat to life like the threat of storm surges to very specific and low lying parts of the east coast (Jaywick, Heybridge Basin, Canvey Island all spring to mind).  I think I have been involved in 3 knock on doors at very very early o’clock evacuation efforts that could have been made much easier with this technology.

I can’t see it being used and abused.  At the first sign of abuse, people will opt out which defeats the object.  Used sparingly, it could be a real life saver.  There would need to be careful integration with other Govt advice though.  At first glance, use to warn of a marauding terrorist incident might seem sensible but the current Govt advice to anyone caught up in such an incident is Run Hide Tell.  If you are in Hide mode with a terrorist close by, you won’t thank some well meaning Civil Servant for setting off a warning siren on your phone  and overriding the silent mode you so carefully set.

Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #14 on: 19 March, 2023, 09:31:31 pm »
A four minute warning of MP's lies would be most welcome.
Get a bicycle. You will never regret it, if you live- Mark Twain

Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #15 on: 19 March, 2023, 09:55:08 pm »
Make that four decades ...

Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #16 on: 19 March, 2023, 10:01:14 pm »
What Jelly Legs says makes so much sense to me with the only exception being that I can see it being abused. 

Sometimes people with power beyond their intellectual ability and moral compass to control it do stupid things just because they can.

FifeingEejit

  • Not Small
Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #17 on: 19 March, 2023, 11:46:55 pm »
Promoting people beyond their competence is the British way...oh shit.

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robgul

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Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #18 on: 20 March, 2023, 07:51:39 am »
Diamond Geezer has some stuff on this today  https://diamondgeezer.blogspot.com/ 

Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #19 on: 20 March, 2023, 08:38:32 am »
Diamond Geezer has some stuff on this today  https://diamondgeezer.blogspot.com/
I think they have it spot on

Quote
This is a risk-based alert system based on physical danger, more likely to be triggered by experts and the emergency services than scheming ministers. And yet a lot of people seem unable to decouple their dislike of politicians from the actions of government, seeing conspiracy in everything because blinkered opinions are easier than rational thought.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #20 on: 20 March, 2023, 08:46:50 am »
A four minute warning of MP's lies would be most welcome.

Or a "Tory MP visiting your place of work" alert.

rogerzilla

  • When n+1 gets out of hand
Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #21 on: 20 March, 2023, 09:26:26 am »
Or "Boris has spawned again"  :facepalm:
Hard work sometimes pays off in the end, but laziness ALWAYS pays off NOW.

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #22 on: 20 March, 2023, 11:11:15 am »
The Netherlands has a similar system. If I recall, it is tested on a Wednesday every month and everyone jumps up together.

First Monday of the month at noon. It's most alarming...

J
--
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Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #23 on: 20 March, 2023, 02:11:58 pm »
Apparently the warnings go out via the local mobile 4G or 5G cell. Since most people at home are on wi-fi, they're not going to receive any warning.

rogerzilla

  • When n+1 gets out of hand
Re: Public emergency alerts by text in the UK
« Reply #24 on: 20 March, 2023, 02:31:55 pm »
Apparently the warnings go out via the local mobile 4G or 5G cell. Since most people at home are on wi-fi, they're not going to receive any warning.
???

I still get phone calls at home on my mobile.
Hard work sometimes pays off in the end, but laziness ALWAYS pays off NOW.