Author Topic: Seized Thru Axle (Read 9387 times)

Torslanda · « **on:** 01 November, 2018, 06:07:14 pm »

Any suggestions for dismantling a DT Swiss rear thru axle that's well and truly stuck in a Deore hub?

If it was an alloy frame I could bray it out and/or use a heat gun but this is a Ghost carbon full suspension so the left hand dropout isn't going to react well to a lump hammer.

Can you remove the handle from the axle?

DuncanM · « **Reply #1 on:** 01 November, 2018, 06:46:33 pm »

Is it this sort of thing?
https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/dt-swiss-rws-mtb-plug-in-thru-axle-boost/rp-prod169040
If the threads are seized in the frame, once you've got past the penetrating fluid stage I'm not sure there's much you can do beyond excessive force?

Torslanda · « **Reply #2 on:** 01 November, 2018, 07:42:02 pm »

Yeah. Except it isn't stuck in the frame, it's stuck in the hollow axle of the wheel . . .

Jurek · « **Reply #3 on:** 01 November, 2018, 07:51:36 pm »

Plusgas in large quantities?

Torslanda · « **Reply #4 on:** 01 November, 2018, 08:22:50 pm »

It's already swimming in excess lube, on the discs, frame, wheel etc. Positively marinated...

Told the customer when I first unstuck it, about 18 months ago, to undo & replace it regularly, I even used a ceramic, waterproof anti seize but he hasn't done any of that, just lathered the thing in WD.

Jurek · « **Reply #5 on:** 01 November, 2018, 08:43:09 pm »

Quote from: Torslanda on 01 November, 2018, 08:22:50 pm

It's already swimming in excess lube, on the discs, frame, wheel etc. Positively marinated...

Told the customer when I first unstuck it, about 18 months ago, to undo & replace it regularly, I even used a ceramic, waterproof anti seize but he hasn't done any of that, just lathered the thing in WD.

I should've known better than to suggest any of the above to you....

Torslanda · « **Reply #6 on:** 01 November, 2018, 09:19:46 pm »

I fear this one is going to be expensive. Possibly prohibitively so.

mzjo · « **Reply #7 on:** 01 November, 2018, 09:47:47 pm »

Are there any sacrificial spacers on the hub? The solution being to cut the axle through at the level of the spacers (without touching the frame), drop the wheel out and deal with the axle and hub on the bench. At the extreme better to sacrifice the hub and cassette completely and save the frame. I have never dreamed of this operation on a bicycle but I had to do something similar on a BMW 80/7 when I was despatching. Axle welded to the bearings, had to cut it in 3 pieces to get the wheel out of the frame. I still have the biggest bit of axle in the toolbox as a drift. On this one you would have to make sure there's enough axle sticking out of the frame to unscrew it (which wasn't my problem). Now I know why I don't like thru-axles screwing into the frame!

DuncanM · « **Reply #8 on:** 01 November, 2018, 09:52:27 pm »

Is there any way of locking the hub up so that turning the wheel turns the part of the hub that is in contact with the through axle? Or maybe try and freeze the through axle and hope that the shrinking breaks the seal?
Actually, mxjo is right - worst case scenario you can destroy the wheel (if necessary by chopping the spokes and cutting the hub into pieces) and save the frame.

rafletcher · « **Reply #9 on:** 02 November, 2018, 08:00:20 am »

I'm with mjzo. The wheel's toast IMO. You'll presumable save the rim, disc and cassette.

ETA: I'm assuming you'll hacksaw through the axle to get the wheel out - so may get away with replacing it and the wheel bearings.

PhilO · « **Reply #10 on:** 02 November, 2018, 08:26:55 am »

Is the through axle hollow? You could possibly try applying pipe-freezing fluid to the interior of the axle in an attempt to thermally-shock it, but it's a long-shot.

rafletcher · « **Reply #11 on:** 02 November, 2018, 10:13:44 am »

Quote from: Torslanda on 01 November, 2018, 06:07:14 pm

Can you remove the handle from the axle?

Had a bit of a google. It may be that the handle part has an end cap, under which is a torx screw that can be removed and the handle then pulled off the splines on the end of the axle. How this helps I've no idea

.

Alternatively the handle might just screw into the end of the axle and brute force may just result in it unscrewing, which I don't think will help you much.

Torslanda · « **Reply #12 on:** 02 November, 2018, 11:22:31 am »

Need to unscrew the axle from the RH dropout, then get the handle off the LH side and grind the bejasus out of it.

Once the wheel is released from the frame I can get the tubular hub axle out and use a press to separate them.

Then set about the customer with a clue-by-four...

mzjo · « **Reply #13 on:** 02 November, 2018, 12:33:09 pm »

Time is money! Cut the buxxr out (2 mins with angle grinder), customer pays for new wheel (inflated price 'cos he's been stupid), put 10p towards this week's beer bill.
Oh and tell him the next time he uses a pressure washer on his bike's back end you will use the same on his!

Actually I was thinking of cutting through the cassette and freehub because there usually isn't enough space to cut between them and the frame. Other side it should be possible to cut the axle. This way the customer is only up for a cassette, freehub and axle (plus the bearings which are obviously DOA). The rest of the wheel should be reusable with a less than even quantity of luck.

Little Jim · « **Reply #14 on:** 02 November, 2018, 01:55:05 pm »

I guess a lot of it comes down to the time involved and so the cost. But what about taking the tyre and rim off the hub, remove the spokes then sacrifice the hub. Hopefully you could then salvage the cassette, although if his attitude to servicing and maintenance is anything to go by that was probably completely worn out a few months ago anyway. Then buy a new hub and rebuild the wheel. Having the tyre and rim in the rear triangle wont make removing the hub any easier but you should still have room to work with a hacksaw or grinder. You would probably need to work out a way of keeping the dropouts pushed apart otherwise as you cut through the hub the first time the frame will try and close the cut onto the blade.

quixoticgeek · « **Reply #15 on:** 02 November, 2018, 02:06:45 pm »

Given that a deore hub is about €30, and given the cost of time, would an angle grinder destroying the hub, and rebuilding with a new hub+spokes, not be the way forward?

J

Torslanda · « **Reply #16 on:** 02 November, 2018, 02:09:37 pm »

Yes but I'd prefer to save it if I can.

Brucey · « **Reply #17 on:** 03 November, 2018, 11:13:34 am »

could you drill the LH end of the axle out, then spring the frame and cut the axle close to the LH dropout?

Then run a hacksaw (or angle-grinder with thin cutting disc) through the RH side of the axle. This cut would destroy the end spacer on the hub, maybe the cassette lockring too. But it would get the wheel out and give you a fighting chance of saving the hub.

If the axle turns in the captive nut then once you have cut the LH side you may be able to get the wheel out without any further cutting, provided you can spring the frame enough.

cheers

Torslanda · « **Reply #18 on:** 03 November, 2018, 11:28:24 am »

That's what I'm thinking. It's a multi link rear triangle and - in theory - I should be able to remove the upper link complete with the wheel. Looking at the TX30 bolt heads though, I think someone else has already had a go cos they're chewed up. Being alloy I'm not going there...

mzjo · « **Reply #19 on:** 03 November, 2018, 10:09:45 pm »

How deep are the threads in the frame - what is the thread pitch of the axle? Any chance of putting the whole frame and rear wheel on a big pillar drill - you would need a friend with a big radial drill for this but that must still exist somewhere in Manchester? Then you drill the axle out from each side, going into the hub far enough to clear the bearings. A bit of careful cutting lhs should see enough movement to get room to deal with the rhs although with a bit of luck the axle will break for you. Remains to clear the remnant out of the thread which, if you are right and the axle isn't stuck in the frame, shouldn't pose too much of a problem. I would be uneasy about attempting this with a hand drill though, for safety the job needs setting up properly.

Of course it shouldn't need saying that you drill tapping size on the side with the thread (or a tad smaller) to avoid damaging the thread!

Brucey · « **Reply #20 on:** 06 November, 2018, 08:18:45 pm »

did you prevail?

Torslanda · « **Reply #21 on:** 07 November, 2018, 03:32:45 pm »

Not yet. Need the necessary tuits.

Honestly considering simply telling the punter that it's beyond me. I don't like quitting on a job but - despite the bike being about 2 grand's worth - I don't think there's a margin in it. In fact I'm getting the impression that if he doesn't like the price I'll own the bastard.

Torslanda · « **Reply #22 on:** 07 November, 2018, 03:34:56 pm »

In a Dirk Gently fashion this bicycle has started seriously to lurk ...

rafletcher · « **Reply #23 on:** 07 November, 2018, 03:52:25 pm »

I'm pretty sure the "handle" side drop-out will have an aluminium insert, albeit unthreaded. Unscrew axle from threaded end, remove handle from other. Find shallow cylindrical object - a thick washer perhaps, with appropriate (axle) sized hole and rest on vice jaws. Have companion hold frame horizontally with (handle-less) end of axle positioned over hole in washer. Apply drift and f*** off big hammer to other (threaded) end. Several times, vigorously.

Torslanda · « **Reply #24 on:** 07 November, 2018, 04:13:44 pm »

No thanks. The frame is plastic...