The way of online communities?

[Hummers]

Now before I start, if it's going anywhere, I would rather this thread didn't become a character assasination of people past or present, a new vehicle for the grinding of axes or an excuse to resume the picking of scabs. OK?

It has been suggested that as sure as night follows day, forums form, grow and implode on a regular basis - it was always thus and forever shall be. Whether that statement is true or not, it got me thinking about what it means to be part of an online community.

Compared to some, I am relatively new to online communities but have found them;

1. a valuable resource for information,
2. a source of inspiration,
3. an opportunity to spend time and exchange views with people I may otherwise would not have met and,
4. at different times over the last 3 years, a level of support.

I suspect that some readers will be reaching for the 'Oh FFS it's only a forum button'. Whilst I understand this reaction, I don't think I'm alone in thinking that I am part of an online community rather than just a forum. I know what I've got out of it and conversely, would expect to bring to any community, online or otherwise.

Just like in real life, you don't get on with everyone that you share a community with but building these things takes a level of time and commitment from everyone if they are going to work properly. But what effect does this cycle of Internet forum boom and bust have on us? Is it a case of once bitten, twice the reluctant poster? Does it make us less willing to commit and to contribute next time if we've found ourselves (perhaps more than once) part of forum that has gone supernova?

I'm not so sure that in that sense, virtual communities follow reality: I was part of a real-world community that exploded in 2005, with all the factions, recriminations, vitriol, sadness and mischief that you'd find with any Internet community's demise. It has taken me 3 years to even comtemplate getting involved in anything like that ever again- and yet I am on here and posting as if all that has happened is a forum skin change.

And if this new home didn't exist (or anything like it), with no context, would the relationships I have formed online and in real life fizzle out?

Questions, questions.

Over to you.

What is your view on this forum malarky?

H

[Frenchie]

THIS is a community for me; one I care about and I consider a lot of people good friends on here.

[Greenbank]

Being a hardened cynic, and having been around the Internet for ages:

FFS it's only a forum.

[EDIT] But that's my personal view obviously.

[slowfen]

To me a forum is dynamic, changing entity.

It grows develops and although with out some-one pulling the plug wont die, but can decline.

Sometimes to regrow again, but with a different character

[Hummers]

To me a forum is dynamic, changing entity.

It grows develops and although with out some-one pulling the plug wont die, but can decline.

Sometimes to regrow again, but with a different character

That's my take on these events too.

I joined the C+ exodus three years ago but not everyone left.  C+ rolled on regardless although I think its spiritual home seems be Cycle Chat.

H

[Maladict]

WHERE IS THE REAL HUMMERS AND WHAT HAVE YOU DONE WITH HIM?

[mattc]

Being a hardened cynic, and having been around the Internet for ages:

FFS it's only a forum.

I think this would be a bl00dy sensible view - in a world where (y)acf didn't exist!

Seriously, these forums have redefined my view of online communities. I think there are people who are getting more out of it than me - probably because they have made more offline relationships with forum members.(I'm also not comfortable with sharing very personal stuff online - eewgh). However, I still rate the xACF experience way above all other forums/groups I have seen.

I may not get on with or agree with everyone here, but the overall atmosphere/usefulness is, IMHO, well worth looking after (where-ever it ends up)!

Mind you, the tricky thing is always going to be the practical vs community balance. I see this as the ongoing evolution/battle ground ...

[andygates]

I've seen the same behaviour in plenty of real-world clubs over the years.  Groups that are bound more by necessity tend to stay together but grumble bitterly (Eastenders style) while more trivial ones explode with flouncing.  Internet groups are particularly prone to flouncing.

Once upon a time I thought I was a Club Jonah - I'd join a cool club, they'd go mental and collapse with sniping and flouncing.  It wasn't until I figured out this dynamic that I stopped being worried that I was the cause of it all!   

"It's only a forum" doesn't wash with me.  I first fell in love online in 1989, dammit, I've seen it all.  Forum relationships are real - if perhaps a little more shallow and dropable than meatspace ones. 

[bobajobrob]

It's not just a forum for me, I have met a few people on here and will meet more. The people I have met I would consider friends.

I have also felt comfortable enough to post personal things here and found it a very rewarding experience.

As I have said before it's about the quality of people reading and posting. I wouldn't feel as comfortable posting on just any old forum.

As for the implosion of the old forum, the URL may have changed but that's about it. I see no reason not to carry on as if nothing happened, albeit slightly wiser from the experience.

[Hummers]

WHERE IS THE REAL HUMMERS AND WHAT HAVE YOU DONE WITH HIM?

Calm yourself, my son.



Normal service will be resumed shortly.

H

[David Martin]

The first online forum, for want of a generic term, that I got involved with was Unaccess, which some may remember. 1989, live chat and a fairly lively bunch of geeks. Found an interesting house share in Harrow through that forum.

A purely electronic forum is not a terribly exciting place. The great thing about this forum is that it has become a virtual meeting ground for people who do know each otehr and meet up in real life. There is a physical community outside the electronic and that makes it something more.

..d

[Rapples]

I think forums are a bit like the local pub.

You go in because you like the look of it.

You go back because you meet new, (and maybe some old) friends.

You don't get on with everybody, some you like, some you tolerate, some you really don't like, but you try to avoid them if possible.

People tend to stay in their own like minded groups, but will migrate from group to group.  i.e someone you like, may like someone you don't.  You either tolerate them or concentrate on others in the group or move to a new group.

The landlord provides the drinks, and a freindly atmosphere.  A bit of occaisional banter, (sometimes used to keep the house in order).

When the landlord leaves some stay some don't.

When the pub closes people find a new pub.  Not all the customers find the same one. They like different pubs, but like minded people i.e the groups, tend to gravitate together in the same pubs.

In your new pub you meet new, (and maybe some old) friends.

And the cycle continues

[C-3PO]

Please bear in mind Imperial Decree number 8, Masters, and ensure this stays non-specific.

Special rule (and this really is a rule): derogatory or strongly opinionated posts and threads about other Internet forums or their administrators will be moved or deleted.  We do not normally post a "moved topic" message in these cases.

Master Yoda is watching, and his Emma Freuds are playing up again.  This puts him in a bad frame of mind.

Thank you for your time.

[rower40]

I got sent these in a PM.  They sum up the whole forum thing for me...

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/7s8WxhgsbsE&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/7s8WxhgsbsE&rel=1</a>

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/DuisMYrK9FY&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/DuisMYrK9FY&rel=1</a>

 

[Hummers]

I got sent these in a PM.  They sum up the whole forum thing for me...

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/7s8WxhgsbsE&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/7s8WxhgsbsE&rel=1</a>

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/DuisMYrK9FY&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/DuisMYrK9FY&rel=1</a>

 

 

Avenue Q!

I gotta get me some of this.

H

[ParrettPedaller]

The good things about the (x)ACF forum are...

1.  There is a good knowledge base of all forms of cycling on here, based on experience.
2.  In general the posting is good humoured, well written, informative and sometimes entertaining
3. It doesn't suffer from commercial sponsorship, thus all the unnecesary crap that fills the screen - that for me is a big plus
4.  There's enough off-fourm interchange via Audaxes etc to give a sense of real community, without it becoming too cliquey
5.  the amount of effort and commitment given on/off forum is down to individual choice. This is not a substitute for marriage, deep meaningful conversations  or whatever.  It is only a forum.
6. Ultimately its about sharing common experiences that we enjoy doing - cycling that is! If we can't get along with (some of the) others who share a common pastime, then what does it say about us!

[domesticated ape]

I've been a member of quite a few other forums, and it seems to me that it is the ones where members have real-life connections that are the best ones. I think it's because when forums are purely online the temptation to say whatever you want and have no consequences in real life is too much for some people (i.e. Youtube comments!).

ACF/YACF and a unicyclists' forum are the two that I have been a member of that fit the criteria of being real-life communities as well as online ones, and I think this feature definitely makes them more than just forums.

As far as how forum upheaval affects me, I didn't know anyone from ACF personally but if the unicyclists' forum went belly-up I'd still be in contact with other people I originally met through the forum, as would a lot of other users, and this would almost certainly mean that the community would find a replacement, much as ACF has done.

[TimO]

Like others have said, I think that an Internet community (be that forum or whatever) has to have some form of actual real life contact to have some chance of lasting.

Having said that, the one which I've been using the longest is Slashdot, and I never had any real world contact with anyone on their.  Actually, that's not strictly true, I've had contact with people who also read/post on Slashdot, but that isn't the reason I've met them in real life, there was normally some other contact, and I later on found out that they are on Slashdot.

Slashdot is full of uninformed nonsense, flame wars, Goatse, etc, but it's also often full of some fascinating and amazing stuff.  Of course, it's not really a forum, so there is some minimum quality threshold to get onto the front page (honest there is, it just seems like any old crap can get posted on there!).

User IDs on Slashdot are approaching one million (if they haven't already exceeded it), and mine is a lowish five digit one, so I've been on there quite a while, and I'm hardly unique in that.  I suspect it has a pretty high churn rate, but it also clearly has a very large number of people reading it at any given time, hence the efficacy of the Slashdot effect! Of course, there are a lot more than one million people reading it, since you can read it without registering.

Hmm, I think I've just argued against my original statement!

[rogerzilla]

Slashdot is full of uninformed nonsense, flame wars, Goatse, etc, but it's also often full of some fascinating and amazing stuff.  Of course, it's not really a forum, so there is some minimum quality threshold to get onto the front page (honest there is, it just seems like any old crap can get posted on there!).

<ahem>

http://science.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/01/29/1447203

It got the highest number of replies that day, I think 

ZtU is my alter ego, as you may have gathered from Usenet.

[MSeries]

ZtU is my alter ego, as you may have gathered from Usenet.

arse bandits ! after all these years, you've decloaked. I never realised.

[rogerzilla]

ZtU is my alter ego, as you may have gathered from Usenet.

arse bandits ! after all these years, you've decloaked. I never realised.

I thought I'd revealed that before.

It was a name I saw scrawled on a pool table in the Chem Eng Dept at Birmingham University about 20 years ago, and I liked it.

[toekneep]

This and its predecessor are the only fora I have really been involved in. Frankly, I have been amazed at how much a part of my leisure and social life it has become. I would never have believed I would feel so much a part of a community on line, having only met a handful of members in real life. I still feel slightly awkward quoting posts to non forum friends. I suspect they might think it a bit odd that I talk about forum members as if they were friends. So, in answer to the original post, it seems that I really do feel part of this community and what happens to it really matters to me.

[simonali]

I first fell in love online in 1989, dammit

How is Flossie these days? Are you still together? 

[Martin]

Mrs Zoom used to refer to acf (and u.r.c. C+ etc) as "my virtual friends" but having met some of them even she agrees (a bit) with me about what it's all about. And the last few Audaxes would have been unbearable without them.

I don't think cycling forums implode as such (unless someone throws a grenade with the word Giro on it into them); people just move on

[Treewheeler]

Will the old place wither and die...?
 For me, when I ride an audax event, often sharing days together with others I have only met at the start, I don't normally get into discussions that inflame, wound or cause a my wheelmen to thrust a pump into my spokes.
 Yet online, even with the aid of smilies, I have done just that.
It's all to easy to upset others with points of view that are after all only words not deeds and are not necesserally actualities. (where is the fucking spell check...?)