Yet Another Cycling Forum
General Category => The Knowledge => GPS => Topic started by: rogerzilla on 12 September, 2008, 06:19:47 am
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Out of stock online (so why list it?). Maybe you'll find one in your local branch.
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If anyone does buy one then I have a Python program to convert Bikely GPX output to Garmin Course TCX data and waypoint GPX data. It allows you to navigate up to 13,000 points and increases the usefulness of the unit many fold, even if I do say so myself!
Free to anyone who asks! :thumbsup:
(I got mine from Amazon for £90. Still a bargain, in my eyes.)
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None in the brixton branch, But I doubt they had a clue what I was talking about.
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If anyone does buy one then I have a Python program to convert Bikely GPX output to Garmin Course TCX data and waypoint GPX data. It allows you to navigate up to 13,000 points and increases the usefulness of the unit many fold, even if I do say so myself!
Free to anyone who asks! :thumbsup:
Currys have been out of stock since at least May.
Bikeroutetoaster.com does the conversion, gpx to tcx, as well. Does your one issue a warning at X distance? The toaster one just shows an icon for direction but doesn't beep until you reach the turn even though 200m warning is pre selected in the program.
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If anyone does buy one then I have a Python program to convert Bikely GPX output to Garmin Course TCX data and waypoint GPX data. It allows you to navigate up to 13,000 points and increases the usefulness of the unit many fold, even if I do say so myself!
Free to anyone who asks! :thumbsup:
Bikeroutetoaster.com does the conversion, gpx to tcx, as well. Does your one issue a warning at X distance? The toaster one just shows an icon for direction but doesn't beep until you reach the turn even though 200m warning is pre selected in the program.
Nope, no warning. It converts into a course, so in the menus you select "Training"->"Do Course"->"Course name". I could look into adding the beep / icon to my code. I'll have a look in the XML schema over the weekend and see if I can figure what's going on.
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Not even showing on the website now...
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None in the brixton branch, But I doubt they had a clue what I was talking about.
<spit miaow mode>
That's pretty normal though isn't it Lynx?
</spit miaow mode>
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PC World had them at the same price - whether either store will either have them back in stock, I don't know. The going rate is nearer £100.
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That will be because PC World and Currys are both parts of DSGi along with Dixons or Currys Digital as it's usually branded these days (I work for another business in the same group).
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Reduced by another £10 at Currys to £39.97 - but still out of stock !
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That should be illegal, surely? Bait and switch?
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I sell them for £10 each when I haven't got any.
I've noticed a lot of sites on Google Shopping return very cheap results for an item but, when you follow the link to the shop itself it actually results in the regular price.
Reel 'em in.
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I'm not expecting a response ;)
Sir,
This item:
http://www.currys.co.uk/product.php?sku=518405
has been out of stock for several weeks, and has now been reduced by a further £10, although it's still not in stock. Are you ever expecting to get any of these in, and is it legal to advertise a product at an amazingly low price (40% of the going rate) when you don't have any?
I'd be interested in your thoughts.
Yours,
Roger Cantwell
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I used to rant about this in the works 'restaurant' -
"Fish is off, luv"
"WHAT? It's still on the menu! Don't you realise you're breaking the law" etc etc.
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I used to rant about this in the works 'restaurant' -
"Fish is off, luv"
"WHAT? It's still on the menu! Don't you realise you're breaking the law" etc etc.
Is it against the law to advertise something you don't actually have in stock?
Surely it is only against the law to accept payment for something you don't have to sell?
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North Somerset Council - Trading Standards and Consumer Protection information for the UK (http://www.tradingstandards.gov.uk/northsomerset/link26.htm)
No.6 would seem to cover it.
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Having read through The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008m this is covered under Schedule 1, section 5:
5. Making an invitation to purchase products at a specified price without disclosing the existence
of any reasonable grounds the trader may have for believing that he will not be able to offer for
supply, or to procure another trader to supply, those products or equivalent products at that price
for a period that is, and in quantities that are, reasonable having regard to the product, the scale of
advertising of the product and the price offered (bait advertising).
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It does sound like it should not be possible to do this.
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Somebody needs to give Trading Standards a call. It's called bait advertising according to the regs.
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Somebody needs to give Trading Standards a call. It's called bait advertising according to the regs.
But if they'll agree to supply, say, 30 of the things, to YACFers, at the advertised price, we'll agree to overlook it...
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Somebody needs to give Trading Standards a call. It's called bait advertising according to the regs.
I have just e-mailed Trading Standards asking for advice.
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But if they'll agree to supply, say, 30 of the things, to YACFers, at the advertised price, we'll agree to overlook it...
Pretty much my thoughts ;)
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As predicted, no reply to e-mail and the item is still listed at £39.97. I suppose they'll go bust in the next 12 months anyway - I'm amazed Dixons/Currys have lasted so long, because they truly are hopeless.
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Also sent e-mail to PC World, who theoretically sell it for the same price of £39.97. We have two massive Currys and PC World sheds near here and neither carry any GPS stuff except cat satnav, so it's probably never been available in store either.
Given that no-one else sells it for less than £78.99, and in most places it's well over £100, this looks like a scam. Which Trading Standards office do you complain to for Internet advertising - your local one, or Currys' local one?
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Any, so your local. :thumbsup:
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No reply from PC World either, so complaint sent to Trading Standards. Besides anything else, this sort of behaviour buggers up all the price comparison sites.
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Mrs JT works with someone who's just joined her company from DSG and he's just asked about the Garmin on our behalf. Apparently they now have warehouse stock and limited stock some in stores. The Halifax branch apparently has one but it is ex-display.
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The humungous Swindon stores (Currys and PC World next to each other) only sell car satnav.
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Mrs JT works with someone who's just joined her company from DSG and he's just asked about the Garmin on our behalf. Apparently they now have warehouse stock and limited stock some in stores. The Halifax branch apparently has one but it is ex-display.
The website still shows no stock
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TS have acknowledged my e-mail.
Oh, still no stock.
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Just looked it up, listed for £39.97 - £10 off, still out of stock ofc.... ???
Frere
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Shows how effective Trading Standards are. And once you've made a complaint, you can only contact them by phone, which is crap if you work in an open-plan office during the day.
I went into one of Currys' shops this week for a laugh. Usual subhuman idiot asks if I want any help. I explained what I was looking for.
"Have you tried online?"
"Yes, but they've been out of stock for over a month although they've reduced the price to £40, when everywhere else sells them for more than £100."
"In that case, they know won't be getting any more of them in", he laughed, obviously used to this sort of thing, then tried to sell me a car satnav.
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I spoke to a friend who works in PC World (same company) about this. He said that it only takes one branch to have one product at that price (even if it is missing parts, shop-soiled, etc) and that is the price that will show up across the range.
Apparently the shop staff find it just as annoying as customers because they are regularly asked about these items and are unable to trace them on their system, thus wasting everyone's time.
He says he is going to use some trickery to try and locate the offending item.
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VAT's gone down - price reduced to £39.11.
Still no stock. A pox on DSG and on the wholly ineffectual Trading Standards.
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VAT's gone down - price reduced to £39.11.
Still no stock. A pox on DSG and on the wholly ineffectual Trading Standards.
Surely they are not breaking the law because they are clearly indicating that they don't have any to sell at that price..
Can you place an order in anticipation of a restock?
..d
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No, you can't.
Halfrauds have cut the price of the 205 to £99.99, incidentally, although it still looks expensive compared to the eTrex range because it doesn't do maps. At all.
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VAT's gone down - price reduced to £39.11.
Still no stock. A pox on DSG and on the wholly ineffectual Trading Standards.
Surely they are not breaking the law because they are clearly indicating that they don't have any to sell at that price..
Can you place an order in anticipation of a restock?
..d
They may be breaking the law by bait advertising (http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/guides/baitads-gd.htm). The fact that they have had this advertised for so long, and not stocked it could be implied that it is a deliberate bait. It may be sheer incompetence but they have a duty to ensure that what they advertise is real.
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Roger,
Send TS a follow up email if they're still advertising it. If they are then it is really taking the piss.
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Actually, I've just checked. They are still advertising it.
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And, I've just emailed Warwickshire Trading Standards.
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This reminds me of a tale a workmate used to tell, about a friend, Bob, who went to a scrapyard for a radiator for his lorry:
Bob: "Have you got a radiator for a 10 ton truck?"
Scrapman: "I can do you one for £20."
Bob: "Jones' scrapyard, down the road, only wanted £10 for one!"
Scrapman: "Why didn't you buy it?"
Bob: "He didn't have one in."
Scrapman: "Well - when we haven't got one, our's are only £5" ;D
Bob: "Okay, I'll come back when you haven't got one then."
;D ;D ;D
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We've reported them to the ASA.
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Just went to their site to check again (still OOS) and I got a pop-up survey :demon:
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They replied to me (They being Warwickshire Trading Standards):
Dear Mr Polar Bear,
Thanks for your email. I have checked the site and note that the item is still out of stock. I am not convinced this amounts to bait and switch because it is not obvious what alternative is being offered. Is your argument that the customer is attracted to the Website in general and then may decide to buy an unrelated item?
Yours sincerely,
Not Bothered
So I have just replied...
Dear Not bothered,
Customers looking for that device or similar have been drawn to that website by an advertisement for that device for a price fnitially at £49.97 in September. For a number of weeks now it has been priced below £40. During that time it seems that the product have never actually been available to purchase at the advertised price.
Why would they advertise for so long other than to tempt potential buyers in? An error is an error, but to reduce the price rather than simply to remove the advert appears tantamount to baiting potential customers in my opinion. Might I suggest that you check the price with other retailers? Even online it is impossible to find another one advertised for under £90.
I have been reading here The Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 No. 1277 (http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2008/uksi_20081277_en_2)
I refer to Part 2, Prohibitions, section 5, Misleading Actions:
Part 2, s5 (4) (b) the main characteristics of the product (as defined in paragraph 5);
Part 2, s5 (5) (a) availability of the product;
The legislation does not appear to insist that the bait simply needs to be an inducement.
Since Curry’s have been advertising this on their website at a very competitive price since September, and it is not actually ever available, I conclude that they may be in breach.
Yours,
Polar Bear
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Various supermarkets have got in trouble about this over Christmas because they were offering some very cheap drinks, put lots of advertising showing these prices but had very limited stock.
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I can see the argument with supermarkets, since clearly you have to go there, and find no stock, and end up buying something else again. I guess that it's not quite as true about an online retailer, where the effort involved in going to another store is substantially smaller.
Of course, if the same price is meant to be available in-store, then clearly it could be argued that this is an inducement to go to the store, and in effect it's an advertisement (although not quite so blatant).
As has been said, they don't seem to have bothered to remove the item, and have actually dropped it in price (whilst remaining out of stock...) which does seem either spectacularly stupid, or suspicious.
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It's four bloody months and one price drop. It's being advertised for less than half the price anybody else is advertising it. I bet other advertisers can supply it.
It is grossly and consistently misleading.
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TS have agreed to investigate further. :thumbsup:
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Schedule I (5) is probably more appropriate although the problem here is that the information that it is out of stock arguably negates the potential invitation.
5. Making an invitation to purchase products at a specified price without disclosing the existence of any reasonable grounds the trader may have for believing that he will not be able to offer for supply, or to procure another trader to supply, those products or equivalent products at that price for a period that is, and in quantities that are, reasonable having regard to the product, the scale of advertising of the product and the price offered (bait advertising).
Having said the above I will be looking into the matter further and will tell you the outcome.
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TS have agreed to investigate further. :thumbsup:
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Schedule I (5) is probably more appropriate although the problem here is that the information that it is out of stock arguably negates the potential invitation.
5. Making an invitation to purchase products at a specified price without disclosing the existence of any reasonable grounds the trader may have for believing that he will not be able to offer for supply, or to procure another trader to supply, those products or equivalent products at that price for a period that is, and in quantities that are, reasonable having regard to the product, the scale of advertising of the product and the price offered (bait advertising).
Having said the above I will be looking into the matter further and will tell you the outcome.
I think you may find the words 'not in stock' adequately covered the 'reasonable grounds for believing they will not be able to supply'
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But you can't reasonably have the produce "Not in Stock" for month after month after month. At some point you remove it from the website, and it stops being found by search engines etc
Google Shopping (http://www.google.co.uk/products?q=Garmin+Edge+205&btnG=Search+Products&hl=en); The third return I get is for Currys.
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I only cut and paste'd a section of the email. He did accept that having it advertised but not available for four months, dropping the price in that time, and advertising it consistently for less than half the price of any other outlet for the duration whilst not being able to actually supply whilst other outlets can (at the realistic retail price) seems a little bit strange.
The tough bit was to persuade him that it was bait simply because it was misleading and attracted a potential customer in, not because there was a deliberate higher priced or lesser quality alternative on offer.
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Warwickshire TS have now referred the issue to Hertfordshire as they are the local TS to Currys.
One can only hope... :)
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WIGIG (http://www.currys.co.uk/martprd/store/cur_page.jsp?BV_SessionID=@@@@1698017548.1234210990@@@@&BV_EngineID=ccejadeggldflffcflgceggdhhmdgmi.0&page=GenericEditorial&genericeditorial=DISABLED_PRODUCT_NO_CATEGORY)