Yet Another Cycling Forum

General Category => The Knowledge => OT Knowledge => Topic started by: Mrs Pingu on April 28, 2019, 06:17:46 pm

Title: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Mrs Pingu on April 28, 2019, 06:17:46 pm
I'm getting new kitchen vinyl (see threads passim).
Some of the floor boards (in the most inconvenient places such as right where we stand when chopping and also using the sink) are squeaking terribly and driving me up the wall so I suppose the time to do something about that is now.

Looking at our kitchen renovation photos there is already ply down and it's screwed very regularly. Obviously the correct thing to do would be take it up (unscrewing all those dozens of screws) so I can get at the boards but that's going to be a right pain.
I suppose it would be a very bad idea to attempt a fix with the ply still in place?

Before you ask, yes we are going to get a pipe/cable detector....
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Jurek on April 28, 2019, 06:22:56 pm
I'm not sure why it would be an issue - given your pipe/cable detector, and sufficiently long screws (not a euphamism)
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Kim on April 28, 2019, 06:25:42 pm
This sounds like a t+1 excuse to own a Makita impact driver (or similar).
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Paul on April 28, 2019, 06:29:05 pm
What is under the floorboards?
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Jurek on April 28, 2019, 06:29:17 pm
^
^
Never mind about the floor.
Just buy  a Makita.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Canardly on April 28, 2019, 07:09:14 pm
Screwing down the boards will not nescessarily remove the squeeking. I have recently screwed down all the boards in a small bedroom  with self countersinking screws which are still determined to produce a squeeky version of the Halelujah chorus each time I enter the room. Recent Joiner visit recommended his tip of wedging the end of the boards using folding wedges. (which is easier said than done). I have tried talcum it didn't work. I will look at this again when due to have carpet replaced shortly. I must confess I would also like an impact driver but can't justify the cost of a decent one with a  relevant 4 or 5 Amp hour battery. (Not the longevity it's the power).
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Basil on April 28, 2019, 07:15:07 pm
What is under the floorboards?

Who is under the floorboards?
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Aunt Maud on April 28, 2019, 08:12:06 pm
Shim any cupped culprits and screw away with confidence.

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Mrs Pingu on April 28, 2019, 09:21:22 pm
My neighbour is under the floorboards.

Shim any cupped culprits

???
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: rafletcher on April 28, 2019, 09:50:13 pm
My neighbour is under the floorboards.

Shim any cupped culprits

???

https://www.impressionsflooring.com/2014/06/02/wood-floor-cupping-why-does-it-happen-what-can-you-do/
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Mrs Pingu on April 28, 2019, 10:16:27 pm
Hmm ok. I can't see through ply and I guess I'm not going to be able to tell where to put the screws either....
Think I've managed to persuade my brother to come & lend moral support in lieu of beer next weekend.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: ian on April 29, 2019, 09:16:15 am
Sqweaky boards surely prevent people sneaking up and murdering you. I have noisy boards in the bedroom doorway and I've yet to be murdered in my sleep which I think is proof of this phenomenon.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: andrewc on April 29, 2019, 09:28:57 am
Sqweaky boards surely prevent people sneaking up and murdering you. I have noisy boards in the bedroom doorway and I've yet to be murdered in my sleep which I think is proof of this phenomenon.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nightingale_floor (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nightingale_floor)


It’s a feature, not a problem.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: pcolbeck on April 29, 2019, 10:47:25 am
I must confess I would also like an impact driver but can't justify the cost of a decent one with a  relevant 4 or 5 Amp hour battery. (Not the longevity it's the power).

Buy a corded one. Much cheaper. Battery ones are great but only make sense economically if you use them all the time in your job. For DIY use the inconvenience of a cord isn't that high.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Makita-TD0101F-240v-Impact-Driver/dp/B001TWY2DY
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Mrs Pingu on April 29, 2019, 07:53:18 pm
Sqweaky boards surely prevent people sneaking up and murdering you. I have noisy boards in the bedroom doorway and I've yet to be murdered in my sleep which I think is proof of this phenomenon.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nightingale_floor (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nightingale_floor)


It’s a feature, not a problem.

That is weird!
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Jurek on April 29, 2019, 08:41:14 pm
I have very creaky door hinges in my house for the same reason.
That, and I like the idea of living in the Addam's family house...
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: ian on April 29, 2019, 08:43:02 pm
I have imprisoned actual nightingales under my floorboards.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Mrs Pingu on April 29, 2019, 09:05:02 pm
You people are strange.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Kim on April 29, 2019, 09:15:06 pm
I have complicated computerised electronics[1] for knowing that someone's creeping up the stairs.  You can bet that in the event of an actual murderer, something critical will be busy rebooting.


[1] Crap floorboards are still an important feature, as they allow you to run cat5 between floors without upsetting the landlord.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Jurek on April 29, 2019, 09:35:14 pm
You people are strange.
Thank you.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: ian on April 29, 2019, 09:43:45 pm
They did fix all the creaky boards when we have this place done up. The boards then merely waited for a reasonable period of time for it to be unreasonable to nag the refurbishment company before starting to creak again. It's the natural state of floors to develop their own personalities.

(Apart from the ground floor which is glued down.)
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Jaded on April 29, 2019, 11:09:02 pm
We have a creaky door so we can tell when The Terminator cat is trying to get in the kitchen
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: hbunnet on April 30, 2019, 09:32:52 pm
I had a horrendous creaking problem in our hall.

After years  I discovered it was the gas pipe which was secured across the joists. When someone walked on the floor, the joists flexed slightly and the fixed gas pipe acted like a violin bow across the joists.

Fixed by inserting insulation felt between pipe and joists. 
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Paul on April 30, 2019, 09:46:11 pm
I think you have to lift the ply and maybe even some boards to see what's up, before you drill anything.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Mrs Pingu on April 30, 2019, 09:58:46 pm
I had a horrendous creaking problem in our hall.

After years  I discovered it was the gas pipe which was secured across the joists. When someone walked on the floor, the joists flexed slightly and the fixed gas pipe acted like a violin bow across the joists.

Fixed by inserting insulation felt between pipe and joists. 

If I see something similar I may well do the same. When the washing machine is finishing it's spin it sounds like there's some pipework knocking in the floor....
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: The French Tandem on May 02, 2019, 08:42:40 am
This sounds like a t+1 excuse to own a Makita impact driver (or similar).

I hate impact drivers. They make horrible noise.

A
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: ian on May 02, 2019, 09:13:56 am
Like Radio 2?

I have no idea what an impact driver is, is it something to do with social media?
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: The French Tandem on May 02, 2019, 10:00:23 am
An impact driver is an electric version of the pneumatic tool that mechanics use for tightening wheel nuts, and that goes "bang! bang! bang!" very loudly.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: ian on May 02, 2019, 11:14:48 am
Oh, the sort of thing your neighbour is likely to get out every time there's a sunny day and you fancy sitting out in the garden.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: The French Tandem on May 02, 2019, 05:31:12 pm
 ;D ;D
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Mrs Pingu on May 02, 2019, 06:09:14 pm
I have a machine that goes 'peep' (actually it sounds more like a Clanger) and a box of Screwfix' finest flooring screws.
What could possibly go wrong?  :demon:
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Feanor on May 02, 2019, 06:18:45 pm
I'm well stocked with emergency plumbing supplies...
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Vernon on May 02, 2019, 06:28:36 pm
I have a machine that goes 'peep' (actually it sounds more like a Clanger) and a box of Screwfix' finest flooring screws.
What could possibly go wrong?

What's that Skip? Tiny Clanger is stuck under the floorboards?
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: The French Tandem on May 02, 2019, 06:44:50 pm
What could possibly go wrong? Drive a screw through a pipe or electric cable?
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: ian on May 02, 2019, 07:59:54 pm
You find the dead bodies left by the previous occupants?

Or you open a portal to Hell. That happened here in The Asbestos Palace, it's still there under the hallway floor.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Mrs Pingu on May 02, 2019, 08:31:49 pm
My money's on the latter. A squeaky portal to hell.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Kim on May 03, 2019, 12:14:13 am
What could possibly go wrong? Drive a screw through a pipe or electric cable?

I vaguely recall Charlotte OTP telling me that she once managed to hit gas, so there's something to aim for.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: andytheflyer on May 03, 2019, 07:45:32 am
When you've found the pipes with the screws, remember to mark to positions of the pipes on the plywood before you put the new lino down.  That way you'll remember the day you hit both gas and water pipes.

I have some previous with this.  Refitting a new skirting board I put a nail through the central heating feed to a rad.  Not doing that again.....
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: ian on May 03, 2019, 09:56:07 am
My money's on the latter. A squeaky portal to hell.

Let me know if you do, I have an annual ferry pass for the Styx, and a place in Lower Clandestine.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Mrs Pingu on May 03, 2019, 06:08:12 pm
At the moment I'm planning to try to take the ply up. We'll see how that goes.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Mrs Pingu on May 04, 2019, 06:10:08 pm
This is one of the squeaky areas. Of course the ply (hardboard actually) was laid down with nails every few cm or so, so it was a pain to get up. The offending floorboard end wasn't supported by a joist and it was a long one too so had to prise up quite a lot of the hardboard to remove it and allow a fix.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/46983755384_2aecaf8a0d.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2ezN2A1)IMG_20190504_134307 (https://flic.kr/p/2ezN2A1) by The Pingus (https://www.flickr.com/photos/the_pingus/), on Flickr

Bob screwed some bits of wood to the joist to support the board.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/46983753924_3149a9d973.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2ezN29Q)IMG_20190504_142628 (https://flic.kr/p/2ezN29Q) by The Pingus (https://www.flickr.com/photos/the_pingus/), on Flickr

And left a couple of messages for the next time...
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/46983755494_7a5bebbf99.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2ezN2BU)IMG_20190504_143347 (https://flic.kr/p/2ezN2BU) by The Pingus (https://www.flickr.com/photos/the_pingus/), on Flickr

That took all bloody afternoon. When we peeled back the vinyl to inspect the other really squeaky area it seemed like quite a lot more of the ply would need to come up so we decided to leave it for the day and come back to it later once I've bought some more hardboard and the right sort of screws.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Mrs Pingu on May 12, 2019, 06:14:18 pm
Part 2 of this operation was undertaken y'day.
I spent over an hour digging up the ply covering the width of 2 floor boards. Very quickly found one end of the floorboard. Never found the other end, I dug all the way across to the other side of the kitchen without finding it. And it was nailed down in the middle. >:( So we couldn't take it up and reinforce the joist with some wood.
Tried getting the next floorboard up in the other direction (my brother reckoned it was short and loose) but it disappeared under the cabinets. (So that was 2 floorboards abutting at the short end not screwed in at all.)
Doh.

After some poking around in the slot between the 2 short board ends with a stripping knife we decided there was prolly just enough joist under both ends so we screwed them both down. Then chopped lots of ply and screwed it all down. My brother decided to go round those boards with silicone to help stop creaking, which was a good idea but poorly executed because he decided to do it before we'd got the ply precisely templated to the hole so everything, including him, got covered in the stuff, which was amusing.  ::-)

That appears to be the most irritating offenders not creaking now. Fingers crossed they stay that way.
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Aunt Maud on May 17, 2019, 04:25:04 pm
Did you shim the cupped culprits like I said ?
Title: Re: Anyone screwed down floorboards through ply?
Post by: Mrs Pingu on May 17, 2019, 07:34:51 pm
You are assuming I knew what you were talking about.