Yet Another Cycling Forum

General Category => Freewheeling => Racing => Topic started by: Jaded on June 12, 2019, 02:43:25 pm

Title: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Jaded on June 12, 2019, 02:43:25 pm
Froome out with a broken leg...
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Hot Flatus on June 12, 2019, 03:02:27 pm
That's his career over, I think.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Karla on June 12, 2019, 04:07:09 pm
It will be if Bernal puts in a good showing this year.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: ElyDave on June 12, 2019, 04:13:43 pm
Broken femur, I imagine that'll take a while to recover from and then rebuild capability, even with the attention he'll get.

has anyone ever come back from anything that serious to be a GC contender?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Exit Stage Left on June 12, 2019, 04:16:32 pm
I see Adam Yates is leading the Dauphine.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: rob on June 12, 2019, 04:31:31 pm
has anyone ever come back from anything that serious to be a GC contender?

Pantani
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on June 12, 2019, 04:36:19 pm
Broken femur, I imagine that'll take a while to recover from and then rebuild capability, even with the attention he'll get.

has anyone ever come back from anything that serious to be a GC contender?

Marco Pantani springs to mind.

He placed 2nd at the Giro and 3rd at the TdF (winning the young riders' competition) in 1994. He was only 13th at the TdF in 1995 but won the young riders' competition again, and then shattered his left tibia and fibia in a collision with a car at the Milan-Torino.

He sat out most of the 1996 season before placing 3rd at the TdF in 1997.

Conversely, Joseba Beloki placed 3rd overall in the TdF in 2000, 2001 and 2002, but was never the same rider after that crash in the 2003 TdF.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Hot Flatus on June 12, 2019, 04:40:13 pm
But....Froome is in his mid 30s. If he staged a comeback in 2 years he'd be the oldest TdF winner ever.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Karla on June 12, 2019, 04:42:23 pm
Well ...
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: paddyirish on June 12, 2019, 04:46:34 pm
Don't like seeing anyone out with injury.  Hope he gets well soon.

has anyone ever come back from anything that serious to be a GC contender?

Lemond is the most obvious one.
G has broken multiple bones, most famously his pelvis on Stage 1 of the 2013 Tour
Roche had a severe knee injury in 1986
Dirty Bertie had a cerebral cavernoma


My money is on Bernal now.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Morbihan on June 12, 2019, 05:12:33 pm
Coppi and pasted

1939: he fell and cracked his ankle
1942: on June 23rd , at Vigorelli velodrome in Milan, he fell and broke his collar-bone
1950: at the Giro d'Italia, in Primolano, he fell down and broke his pubis
1951: he fell down in Turin and broke again his collar-bone
1952: he fell down in Perpignano and broke his shoulder blade
1954: while he was training near Pavia , Coppy was collided by a spare wheel lost by a truck. He cracked his skull and injuried the left knee
1956: Coppi caught the typhus
1956: he fell down near Ferrara and needed to wear a special corset due to an injury of the vertebrae
1956: in Copenaghen he fell down and , again, injuried his vertebrae.
1957: Coppi fell down in Sassari and broke his thigh-bone
1959: he was collided by a tractor while he was training and got some injuries at his head
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on June 12, 2019, 05:26:26 pm
But....Froome is in his mid 30s. If he staged a comeback in 2 years he'd be the oldest TdF winner ever.

TBF, ElyDave didn't specifically ask if anyone had come back from a major injury at Froome's age, but certainly taking that into account - and if the injury is as bad as I have seen claimed elsewhere - I'd agree that any more grand tour wins are unlikely.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: pdm on June 12, 2019, 06:43:38 pm
Depends on the injury, the nature of which we do not know yet.
If he has smashed the neck of femur to bits (like Beloki) or if he has suffered a supra-condylar knee fracture, its a huge ask to come back quickly.
If its a simple shaft fracture, the surgery is relatively quick and simple; he'll be up and about non weight bearing with an intra-medullary femoral nail in days, partial weight bearing and spinning in 3-4 weeks and could be back on the bike (with strict instructions not to fall off) in 8-10 weeks. The fracture would be completely united in 12 weeks. His haematocrit should also be back to normal by then.
Speaking from experience, more problems tend to arise with the more extensive surgery required to fix complex fractures...
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mrs Pingu on June 12, 2019, 07:40:30 pm
Nobody French will be sad.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: TheLurker on June 12, 2019, 08:14:50 pm
Well it simplifies the job for the the Team SkyIneos DS this year. No need to work out who the team will be riding for.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: ElyDave on June 12, 2019, 09:37:18 pm
The reason I asked was becaus I (correctly or not) kind of have this idea that a femur fracture is right up there in the "oh f@$k, that's serious" bracket, vs a broken wrist, collar bone, shoulder blade, ankle etc.

Broken pelvis would also go in that category as would spinal injuries.  I know you can have some very nasty ankle  fractures as well - i've seen a few of them - but I'm just generalising here. Also thinking how long it has really taken me to recover from a relatively small fracture in my own pelvis.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: pdm on June 12, 2019, 10:47:34 pm
According to the latest news, it seems he has also broken an arm/elbow and several ribs - quite major polytrauma. Looks like a probable extended recovery period an that case - difficult to mobilise on crutches with a broken arm!. Still no news as to the type of femur fracture as far as I can see...

Edit: Later news indicates even more extensive injury: Hip, femur, arm/elbow and ribs - in intensive care and likely to have more sessions in theatre to stabilise and fix. Very bad news for timely recovery...
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Jaded on June 12, 2019, 11:16:49 pm
Quote
The four-time Tour de France champion, 34, has suffered a fractured right femur, a broken hip, a fractured elbow and fractured ribs and lost consciousness following the crash.

Speaking to Radio 5 Live's BeSpoke podcast, Brailsford said: "He's been operated on to make sure that first phase of medical care is as optimal as possible and we will manage it from there. It's an evolving situation. It is concerning, there is no doubt about that.

"He's not in great shape. There are crashes and bad crashes and this was a bad crash."

So that's quite a lot of crash.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: rafletcher on June 13, 2019, 07:04:33 am
Hip, femur, elbow and ribs. Ouch.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: ElyDave on June 13, 2019, 08:44:03 am
I think the hip might be the biggest problem there, in terms of recovery time.  Look at Andy Murray - return to singles in 2019, not even a mention of challenging for places
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Jakob on June 13, 2019, 09:03:36 am
Apologies. Didn't quite appreciate the extent of his injuries and didn't mean to make light of them.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: fuzzy (retd.) AAGE on June 13, 2019, 09:29:44 am
The reason I asked was becaus I (correctly or not) kind of have this idea that a femur fracture is right up there in the "oh f@$k, that's serious" bracket, vs a broken wrist, collar bone, shoulder blade, ankle etc.

Broken pelvis would also go in that category as would spinal injuries.  I know you can have some very nasty ankle  fractures as well - i've seen a few of them - but I'm just generalising here. Also thinking how long it has really taken me to recover from a relatively small fracture in my own pelvis.

When I got first aid training in the police as guidance for possibly being forst on scene at serious injury collisions etc. we were advised that the risk with a broken femur is the very real possibility of the break also damaging the femoral artery causing life threatening blood loss.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: CrazyEnglishTriathlete on June 13, 2019, 12:03:39 pm
The reason I asked was becaus I (correctly or not) kind of have this idea that a femur fracture is right up there in the "oh f@$k, that's serious" bracket, vs a broken wrist, collar bone, shoulder blade, ankle etc.

Broken pelvis would also go in that category as would spinal injuries.  I know you can have some very nasty ankle  fractures as well - i've seen a few of them - but I'm just generalising here. Also thinking how long it has really taken me to recover from a relatively small fracture in my own pelvis.

Depends on what in the pelvis is actually fractured.  I had an xray for a (fortunately only bruised) hip, and the A&E consultant pointed out where G.'s fracture was and why he was able to carry on riding with it, whereas had it happened somewhere else he would have been out for months.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: ElyDave on June 13, 2019, 12:55:37 pm
With my fracture I wasn't capable of getting on the bike until 6 weeks later - I logged a 20 min turbo session.

The bigger issue is in the upset musculature due to my compensation for the injury.  I had physio every other week whereas I assume these guys have access far more regularly and immediately.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Nuncio on June 13, 2019, 01:08:00 pm
Well it simplifies the job for the the Team SkyIneos DS this year. No need to work out who the team will be riding for.
Thomas or Bernal?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on June 13, 2019, 01:36:30 pm
Well it simplifies the job for the the Team SkyIneos DS this year. No need to work out who the team will be riding for.
Thomas or Bernal?

Looking at results so far this year, it's tempting to say Bernal is the "plan B" rather than Thomas, but I reckon it'll probably come down to whoever's best-placed after the first week/day in the mountains.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on June 13, 2019, 05:33:59 pm
https://www.itv.com/news/2019-06-13/chris-froome-crash-rehabilitation-recovery-cycling/
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Morbihan on June 16, 2019, 11:32:11 am
The reason I asked was becaus I (correctly or not) kind of have this idea that a femur fracture is right up there in the "oh f@$k, that's serious" bracket, vs a broken wrist, collar bone, shoulder blade, ankle etc.

Broken pelvis would also go in that category as would spinal injuries.  I know you can have some very nasty ankle  fractures as well - i've seen a few of them - but I'm just generalising here. Also thinking how long it has really taken me to recover from a relatively small fracture in my own pelvis.

Depends on what in the pelvis is actually fractured.  I had an xray for a (fortunately only bruised) hip, and the A&E consultant pointed out where G.'s fracture was and why he was able to carry on riding with it, whereas had it happened somewhere else he would have been out for months.

Agree.  Pelvis fracture can be life threatening crushing injury as in a car accident or a more simple break. I had a pelvic fracture last year and rode TCR one month later.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Karla on June 18, 2019, 04:12:56 pm
Geraint Thomas has crashed out of the Tour de Suisse

Investigators report multiple searches from Bernal's computer for dictionary sites listing 'Schadenfreude'
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: quixoticgeek on June 18, 2019, 04:20:21 pm

So aside from Team Sky^WIneos, who appear to be having to make substitutions on a daily basis.

Have other teams confirmed their rider line up yet? Do we know which of the Yates is riding?

J
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on June 18, 2019, 04:46:56 pm
The "Dan Brown meets Numberwang!" conspiracy theorists on Tw@tter will be having a field day.

Though from what I've seen, it doesn't look like anything's broken, so Thomas ought to start the TdF, but he'll be under-raced:

https://twitter.com/cyclingreporter/status/1140991591387205633?s=09

The Inner Ring just tweeted (from Dutch media) that as Dumoulin was supposed to depart for high altitude camp, said he "am I ready for this?", stopped and turned around:

https://twitter.com/inrng/status/1140960819154497536

Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: αdαmsκι on July 02, 2019, 10:50:35 am
Cav hasn't been selected. That's his TdF career over then.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: fimm on July 02, 2019, 02:52:31 pm
Both Yates brothers are riding, I believe.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: mattc on July 02, 2019, 08:10:30 pm
Both Yates brothers are riding, I believe.
How can one tell??
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mrs Pingu on July 05, 2019, 05:53:05 pm
Never mind all the cycling, I'm excited hoping for moar fun from Pandemic Productions....
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 06, 2019, 12:05:55 am
Never mind all the cycling, I'm excited hoping for moar fun from Pandemic Productions....

Ph3@r n0t, Mrs P... (https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=112629.0)
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: mattc on July 06, 2019, 07:38:03 am
Never mind all the cycling, I'm excited hoping for moar fun from Pandemic Productions....

Ph3@r n0t, Mrs P... (https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=112629.0)
Good idea. (Life is confusing enough ... )  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: madamemugwump on July 06, 2019, 08:15:49 am
The tour has more interest for me this year than for maybe 5 years now.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Exit Stage Left on July 06, 2019, 06:33:32 pm
Today's stage was dull as racing, but interesting as history, both in terms of the Tour and of Europe. Ned Boulting at one point referred to Simon Winder's latest in his trilogy.
Quote
In Germania, he explores the idea of German-ness that culminated in the deadly fantasies of the Nazis. Danubia examines how the dysfunctional Habsburg family could hold together a sprawling empire of competing national groupings for almost half a millennium. And Lotharingia tells the story of that part of Europe – what is now the Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg, Lorraine in northern France and most of northern Germany west of the Rhine – that has been labelled the “cockpit”, so central has it been to Franco-German rivalry and the course of the continent’s history.
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2019/mar/21/lotharingia-by-simon-winder-review

It's nice to see that Ned has been doing some background reading, and I look forward to further insights. Perhaps ITV4 could publish a reading list.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on July 06, 2019, 06:42:35 pm
I saw Ned's "stand up" tour last year, he is clearly well read both in English and French literature and history. Since he and the tour does go into many a nook and cranny in France, he really gets to see the country's history from both sides (gov.fr vs local.fr) 
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Exit Stage Left on July 06, 2019, 10:38:35 pm
I do wonder if I now know as much as I want to about France. From 2007 I started going to the Semaine Federale, so I've been to all the French areas of Lotharingia. I've seen the battlefields at Verdun, the Ducal place in Dijon, and the disputed parts of Lorraine.

The best introduction I read to France was 'The Discovery of France' by Graham Robb, which introduced me to the 'Tour de France' made by tradesmen, the 'Compagnons du Devoir et du Tour de France'.

The incremental bits of knowledge I pick up aren't as satisfying, and even the French riders can give a convincing interview in English. So I might seek out Simon Winder's book, it might help sustain my interest. A reading list might actually be a good idea. I could even try to read some French.

Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 06, 2019, 11:53:28 pm
I saw Ned's "stand up" tour last year, he is clearly well read both in English and French literature and history. Since he and the tour does go into many a nook and cranny in France, he really gets to see the country's history from both sides (gov.fr vs local.fr)

TV's *** Boulting read Modern Languages at Cambridge, so no great surprise.  He claimed today that this is his 17th Tour too.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Exit Stage Left on July 07, 2019, 01:31:04 am
I saw Ned's "stand up" tour last year, he is clearly well read both in English and French literature and history. Since he and the tour does go into many a nook and cranny in France, he really gets to see the country's history from both sides (gov.fr vs local.fr)

TV's *** Boulting read Modern Languages at Cambridge, so no great surprise.  He claimed today that this is his 17th Tour too.

Ned was an admirer of the late Sid Waddell, whose choices led him away from academia towards darts commentary. Who can forget "When Alexander of Macedonia was 33, he cried salt tears because there were no more worlds to conquer. Bristow's only 27"?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: quixoticgeek on July 11, 2019, 03:12:45 pm

Anyone else finding it hard to tell sunweb and Team Sky^WIneos^WPlastic Hypocracy apart in the aerial shots?

Also, anyone else think it would be a good idea if riders could have their numbers visible on their helmets or sides? Most of the shots of the riders are from the front, and without a number, I find it really hard to tell 100 white men apart... Oh, and the Yates' make it even harder...

J
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 11, 2019, 03:42:55 pm
You can tell the Ineoseri because the dandruff on their shoulders shows up more clearly.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Exit Stage Left on July 11, 2019, 03:47:22 pm
I see that stage 21 starts from Rambouillet, as does Paris Brest Paris, three weeks later.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGkgVVOt4Uc
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: quixoticgeek on July 11, 2019, 05:04:38 pm


At the end of each stage, a group of men in branded t-shirts surround the winner, last year they had a water bottle company branding, this year it's Continental branding. What are they there for?

I watched with amusement as they tried to chase today's winner down the hill again, as they all cross the line, turn round, and head down the way they came.

That was a fun finish to watch.

J
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 11, 2019, 05:18:54 pm
T Ineo$ do at least have the riders' names written on the sides of their jumpers but by the time the camera is close enough for it to be legible you can see who it is anyway.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: TheLurker on July 11, 2019, 09:03:31 pm
T Ineo$ do at least have the riders' names written on the sides of their jumpers ...
Writen!  But any fule kno skool rools sa that namtpaes musst be embroydr embroidere sticched. Before they are stitchedd onto puloverrs.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 12, 2019, 08:41:28 am


At the end of each stage, a group of men in branded t-shirts surround the winner, last year they had a water bottle company branding, this year it's Continental branding. What are they there for?

I watched with amusement as they tried to chase today's winner down the hill again, as they all cross the line, turn round, and head down the way they came.

That was a fun finish to watch.

J

I noticed that they were very careful to push the saddles instead of the blokes' arses.  That was funny.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 12, 2019, 04:11:27 pm
Boring today: missed Roche falling off and D. Martin piddling sans permission.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 12, 2019, 05:24:20 pm
Boring today: missed Roche falling off and D. Martin piddling sans permission.

The tone was set when Rosetto and Offredo clipped off the front and the rest of the peloton just shrugged...
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: mattc on July 13, 2019, 06:51:17 am

Anyone else finding it hard to tell sunweb and Team Sky^WIneos^WPlastic Hypocracy apart in the aerial shots?

Also, anyone else think it would be a good idea if riders could have their numbers visible on their helmets or sides? Most of the shots of the riders are from the front, and without a number, I find it really hard to tell 100 white men apart... Oh, and the Yates' make it even harder...

J
Yes

and yes.

Ever since helmets+shades became the rider uniform, spectators and pundits have commented on this. But the UCI (et al) don't seem to realise that their entire sport is based on people watching on telly, so have done nothing.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 13, 2019, 07:24:25 am
Boring today: missed Roche falling off and D. Martin piddling sans permission.

The tone was set when Rosetto and Offredo clipped off the front and the rest of the peloton just shrugged...

Me too. 10k from the finish I went out to the workshop.

I suppose they can't shove them up mountains every day, but long-distance grinding followed by a seen-it-already-1000-times sprint isn't exactly nail-biting.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: fd3 on July 13, 2019, 10:58:52 am
I've just been watching the highlights - and then only the ones that are not TT or sprint stages (I will FFd to the last 10 mins of a sprint stage).
It's nice to be able to spend the whole day watching the tour, day after day, pref with a beer - irrespective of the stage - but that's a young man's game.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 13, 2019, 05:10:44 pm
Oh, it's an old fart's game as well. Gets you out of mowing the lawn jungle, too.

Anyway, today's made up for it.  Nice seeing Ciccone giving Juju a hug at the end.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 13, 2019, 08:26:39 pm
De Gendt :o
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: mattc on July 14, 2019, 08:08:24 am
Cracking stage! Race within race. Worthy winners (in their different races!). Nice scenery.

Like Stage6 - except completely different!
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 14, 2019, 07:06:53 pm
Di Marchi has a deep laceration on his forehead and has gone to hospital for x-rays and test.  Apparently he was conscious and talking while being seen to at the roadside.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on July 14, 2019, 08:54:24 pm
(https://keyassets.timeincuk.net/inspirewp/live/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2019/07/Screen-Shot-2019-07-14-at-13.11.12-1-1220x703.png)
https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/racing/tour-de-france/spoke-person-took-picture-geraint-thomas-tour-de-france-crash-431075/
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: rafletcher on July 14, 2019, 09:34:26 pm
Di Marchi has a deep laceration on his forehead and has gone to hospital for x-rays and test.  Apparently he was conscious and talking while being seen to at the roadside.

Broken collarbone, broken 4th rib, bruised lung, pneumothorax and cut eyebrow, all left side. Oh and multiple contusions. But awake and chatting.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 14, 2019, 10:01:30 pm
Could be worse, he could be in Lorenzo Gobbo's shoes right now, so to speak.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 14, 2019, 10:34:56 pm
Could be worse, he could be in Lorenzo Gobbo's shoes right now, so to speak.

(Googles)

Ouch!  Didn't J Queally do something like that at Meadowbank once?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mrs Pingu on July 14, 2019, 10:39:04 pm
Jeesus!
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 14, 2019, 10:55:41 pm
Could be worse, he could be in Lorenzo Gobbo's shoes right now, so to speak.

(Googles)

Ouch!  Didn't J Queally do something like that at Meadowbank once?

Yes, indeed - off the top of my head, I don't think it was a through-and-through like Gobbo's.

<Flexes Google-Fu>

Or at least, it missed his thoracic cavity - from the Cycle Chat thread on Malaysia's Aziz Awang getting skewered through his calf in 2011:

Quote from: mcshroom@Cyclechat
It was Jason Queally. From the times online: -

Quote
But Queally is not afraid of the challenge. After taking up cycling in his mid-twenties, he focused on sprinting after an accident in 1996. Knocked off his bike at 35mph, a large chunk of the track became lodged in his back. The piece of wood was 18 inches long, two inches wide and half an inch thick.As Hoy, who was involved in the crash, recalled in his autobiography: “It was more like a fence post than a splinter and Jason’s scream of ‘I’ve got half the f***ing track in my back’ was not unreasonable in the circumstances.”

The crash was to have a profound effect on Queally. “I’ve got a scar a foot long that had 100 stitches in it, but I was scarred mentally as well as physically,” he said. “Thankfully, I’d been a swimmer and I had plenty of muscle in my upper body, so it didn’t pierce my heart or lungs. But after that I wanted to focus on events that did not involve bunching. So it was the kilo and team sprint, and now the team pursuit,”

https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/ouch-that-is-a-big-splinter.71600/#post-1317832
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 15, 2019, 10:12:24 am
(https://keyassets.timeincuk.net/inspirewp/live/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2019/07/Screen-Shot-2019-07-14-at-13.11.12-1-1220x703.png)
https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/racing/tour-de-france/spoke-person-took-picture-geraint-thomas-tour-de-france-crash-431075/


I should think Thomas would want that one up on his wall.  His missus mightn't, though.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Nuncio on July 15, 2019, 09:29:25 pm
Well that was exhilarating. Who needs mountains? Or, from what I could see, echelons?  Just make sure your team is attentive, and can put in the power when it will make a difference (Dekeuninck, Ineos, Bora) and not waste power when it won't (EF).
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Exit Stage Left on July 18, 2019, 08:31:40 pm
Nice to see an acknowledgement of the other side of France at the start. PBP is moving in the other direction, from the banlieue of St Quentin to Rambouillet. Good to see a Lancastrian stage winner.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: quixoticgeek on July 18, 2019, 09:10:13 pm

What happened to Rohan Dennis? Anyone got any more info? cyclingnews.com hasn't really got anything useful.

J
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Giropaul on July 18, 2019, 09:24:22 pm

What happened to Rohan Dennis? Anyone got any more info? cyclingnews.com hasn't really got anything useful.

J

Some rumours about a fall-out with the team management are going around. Bizarre!
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 18, 2019, 10:00:28 pm
It would appear that Rohan Dennis has a reputation as being a bit... emotionally fragile.

Quote
We do know he has genuine problems with explosive, angry responses to relatively innocuous challenges. He’s a hothead. Former teammates, managers, team staff – it seems everyone has a Rohan story. Each rider or team staff member I contacted in the last few hours said some version of the same: Yes, it’s a problem. This isn’t the first time. It’s a pattern.
...

[sports director Gorazd] Stangelj did his best to explain without quite explaining anything.

“He is a special guy, let’s say. All the champions are,” he said. “He’s really 100 percent when he wants something. It’s difficult to make everybody happy in every single moment.

“He’s the guy, he wants to have everything 100 percent. It’s not easy to have everything 100 per cent.”

https://cyclingtips.com/2019/07/inside-the-bizarre-tour-departure-of-rohan-dennis/

EDITED TO ADD:

As the Cycling Tips piece notes, there's talk of Dennis not being happy about his TT bike or part thereof. A more specific rumour I've seen, via today's stage thread on Bike Radar is that it's the wheels:

Quote
From another forum:

It was supposedly discontent with the equipment - the wheels in particular that made Dennis quit the race. According to norwegian news station tv2 Hushovd had a chat with him today where Dennis told about not being pleased with the equipment - claiming to lose 40w to the competitors
https://forum.bikeradar.com/viewtopic.php?f=40002&t=13106483&start=140#p20547745

The other rumour is that he was ordered into the break by his team and he felt this was damaging his best chance of a stage win in tomorrow's ITT and so he had a hissy fit.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: DuncanM on July 19, 2019, 10:07:57 am
He's moved from a team with a great TT setup, to one without. This is what he said after he lost his Aussie TT title in January:
Quote
“Look, the legs are there. the power was good. As good as any other year, if not just a little bit better,” explained Dennis.

“So, it’s just about finding out why I didn’t go as quick now and fixing it for the next race. It’s all about trying to figure out how to go a little bit quicker with the equipment that I’ve got.”
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/dennis-i-was-beaten-by-the-better-guy-on-the-day/

I wonder if there was some issue where parts used in the TdS weren't sponsor correct and that despite winning there he would have to ride the slower, sponsor correct parts today. TTers are very particular about their equipment, and there have been other memorable hissy fits from TTers fed up with what they see as the sub standard machines provided by the team (Millar comes to mind when with Cofidis). However, they usually come after the stage has gone horribly wrong, not beforehand!
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 19, 2019, 01:49:28 pm
There were stories yesterday of some kind of stomach bug affecting Bahrain-Merida, hence the sub-par performance of V Nibbles, but a full-blown wobbly over the TT equipment sounds much more fun :demon:
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 19, 2019, 03:21:14 pm
WvA :facepalm:
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: quixoticgeek on July 19, 2019, 07:54:28 pm

Dutch News reports WvA has had surgery for a deep flesh wound to the hip, and will be in hospital for a few days :(

J
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Auntie Helen on July 20, 2019, 05:31:46 am
It was certainly a very exciting time trial though...
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 20, 2019, 10:30:00 am
[...] exciting [...] time trial

These are words one does not often see together ;D

Was anyone else rooting for:
?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: fd3 on July 20, 2019, 12:18:23 pm
Yes and yes.

On a totally different topic, anyone know what happened to Romain Bardet? He used to be somebody.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: quixoticgeek on July 20, 2019, 12:50:55 pm
Yes and yes.

On a totally different topic, anyone know what happened to Romain Bardet? He used to be somebody.

He thought a bike swap was a good idea...

J
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 20, 2019, 01:00:48 pm
Quote from: the Bike Radar thread on yesterday's stage
Bardet painful. Looked like he and his bike were going through an ugly divorce but trying to put on a united front for the sake of the children.

https://forum.bikeradar.com/viewtopic.php?f=40002&t=13106502&start=160#p20548228
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 20, 2019, 01:42:25 pm
Macrobe just got into Prudhomme's car. Looks like they had a gilet jaune across the back of the seat behind him.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: quixoticgeek on July 20, 2019, 02:50:43 pm

I notice in the bottom of the points classification, there are 5 riders with negative points.

How?!

J
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 20, 2019, 04:50:04 pm

I notice in the bottom of the points classification, there are 5 riders with negative points.

How?!

J

I see only four in negative territory right now.

Rider:Points after Stage 14:  Infraction:
George Bennet-1 ptDocked 6 pts for obstructing another rider on Stage 10
Sebastien Reichenbach  -4 ptsDocked 4 pts for giving a push or handsling on Stage 6
Michael Hepburn-6 ptsDocked 6 pts for slipstreaming behind the team car on Stage 8
Yves Lampaert-6 ptsDocked 6 pts for obstructing another rider on Stage 10

Source: https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/racing/tour-de-france/riders-fined-tour-de-france-2019-429926
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 20, 2019, 04:54:09 pm
From that article:

Quote
Tom Steels (Deceuninck – Quick-Step sports director)

– Non-compliance with the organisation’s instructions (incorrect behaviour at the finish line)
– Fined 300 Swiss Francs (£242)


Makes a change from bottle-related crime, I suppose :demon:

ETA:

Lukas Pöstlberger's "irregular refuting" sounds intriguing too.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 20, 2019, 05:12:00 pm
Given it says "sticky bottle" afterwards, that looks like auto-correct picked up the original speelung pisstoke, but Jonny Long or the copy editor missed the erroneous "correction".

Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: toontra on July 21, 2019, 12:48:21 pm
What is it with Team Sky/Ineos riders when it comes to interviews.  I used to think Froome was insipid, formulaic, robotic and particularly uninformative, but GT has taken it to a new level for me.  All the above, plus chucking in "so yeah..." - lengthy pause - every few words (see "grammar that you find annoying").

I realise they must be knackered at the end of a stage but it's also true for rest-day/morning interviews.  I'm not expecting team tactics - just a bit of their own personality and character rather than trotting the team line.

Alaphilippe is a refreshing change.  Animated and engaging - and I don't think it's just because he's winning at the moment (although I'm sure that helps!).
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on July 21, 2019, 04:20:21 pm
That was a good bit of sports pootling today, enjoyed that
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 21, 2019, 04:31:23 pm
It was certainly engaging.  Couple of more gentle stages now before the next GC battles.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 21, 2019, 07:11:47 pm
What is it with Team Sky/Ineos riders when it comes to interviews.  I used to think Froome was insipid, formulaic, robotic and particularly uninformative, but GT has taken it to a new level for me.  All the above, plus chucking in "so yeah..." - lengthy pause - every few words (see "grammar that you find annoying").

I realise they must be knackered at the end of a stage but it's also true for rest-day/morning interviews.  I'm not expecting team tactics - just a bit of their own personality and character rather than trotting the team line.

Alaphilippe is a refreshing change.  Animated and engaging - and I don't think it's just because he's winning at the moment (although I'm sure that helps!).

G was certainly a lot more animated when he was just another crash-prone domestique headbutting telegraph poles but these days you'd get more entertainment from interviewing his bike.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Beardy on July 21, 2019, 09:58:25 pm
G was certainly a lot more animated when he was just another crash-prone domestique headbutting telegraph poles but these days you'd get more entertainment from interviewing his bike.
That sounds like a job for,P-Pr0d’s inept interviewer whom is not made of the l00ze
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Salvatore on July 21, 2019, 10:46:28 pm

Alaphilippe is a refreshing change.  Animated and engaging - and I don't think it's just because he's winning at the moment (although I'm sure that helps!).

He gets extra points for wearing a proper cycling cap for his interviews.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 22, 2019, 08:24:52 am
G was certainly a lot more animated when he was just another crash-prone domestique headbutting telegraph poles but these days you'd get more entertainment from interviewing his bike.

Head-butting will have that effect.  What became of his plastic hat?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 23, 2019, 03:46:18 pm
Just saw a bloke nose in phone, busy texting as the forlorn hope went past.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Porkins on July 23, 2019, 04:34:56 pm

G was certainly a lot more animated when he was just another crash-prone domestique headbutting telegraph poles but these days you'd get more entertainment from interviewing his bike.

I think he's losing his mojo. He seemed really taken aback by Alaphilippe's success. His public dithering about tactics betrays a lack of confidence. He's not having the sort of ride which defending champions typically get - he's not had a day in yellow and not taken the role of le patron. The race has been all about Alaphilippe and Thibaut so far, he's sharing team leadership with someone younger who is the next big thing and widely expected to win. He's in a lonely position and not likely to have a stage win or a yellow jersey while Bernal is going so well. He needs a dose of fighting spirit.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Hot Flatus on July 23, 2019, 08:46:26 pm
Maybe he just needs a dose of whatever Froome has
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on July 23, 2019, 08:53:19 pm
what a broken hip, now that is going to smart
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 24, 2019, 09:01:12 am
They can fix him. They have the technology.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 24, 2019, 10:57:23 am
They can fix him. They have the technpharmocology.

FTFY :demon:
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 24, 2019, 03:05:14 pm
That too.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 24, 2019, 08:41:44 pm
Crikey! Luke Rowe and Tony Martin have both been slung off the race for a minor case of handbags.  Leaving Bernal, Thomas and Kruijswijk without invaluable assistants for the most crucial stages of the race.  A conspiraloon might wonder whether this was deliberately done to assist Pinot & Alaphilippe :demon:
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 24, 2019, 09:11:11 pm
Crikey! Luke Rowe and Tony Martin have both been slung off the race for a minor case of handbags.  Leaving Bernal, Thomas and Kruijswijk without invaluable assistants for the most crucial stages of the race.  A conspiraloon might wonder whether this was deliberately done to assist Pinot & Alaphilippe :demon:

From what I've read elsewhere, Rowe and Martin had sorted it out amicably on the road afterwards, and both teams are appealing the decision:

https://twitter.com/JumboVismaRoad/status/1154111156128309248
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: SpaceBadger on July 24, 2019, 09:41:52 pm
What appeal option is there? I thought the race jury decision was final.

Looks like they both deserved it. Rowe more than Martin, but a reasonable outcome.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 24, 2019, 09:53:40 pm
What appeal option is there? I thought the race jury decision was final.

Looks like they both deserved it. Rowe more than Martin, but a reasonable outcome.

Compared with the 200 CHF fine and one minute time penalty handed to Nacer Bouhanni after throwing a punch at Jack Bauer during the 2017 Tour?  Of course Gianni Moscon got slung off the race for punching Élie Gesbert last year, but then Gesbert is French </tinfoil_hat>
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: SpaceBadger on July 24, 2019, 10:08:32 pm
Just on the basis of today. If something in the past wasn't dealt with appropriately, that's no reason not to start doing the right thing now.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 24, 2019, 10:23:23 pm
My understanding is that the Commissaires are UCI-appointed, and only one of them is French.

The ITV footage this afternoon only showed Martin trying to shoulder Rowe off the road, and missed Rowe throwing a punch at Martin in retaliation. Though I've seen comments elsewhere that before Martin vs Rowe had kicked off, a TJV rider had forced Thomas out of the line.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Porkins on July 24, 2019, 11:43:04 pm
The commissaires are considering the appeal and can reverse their decision before the start tomorrow.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 24, 2019, 11:45:30 pm
My understanding is that the Commissaires are UCI-appointed, and only one of them is French.

Spoilsport! How is PPTM supposed to blame it all on C Prudhomme now?

Edit: UCI's webby SCIENCE names them as:
CROCETTI GianlucaPrésident du Collège des Commissaires
TORTAJADA VILLARROYA VicenteMembre du Collège des Commissaires
MICHAUD MaxMembre du Collège des Commissaires
VOETS Jean-MichelTV/Support Commissaire
LÉVESQUE AdrienMembre du Collège des Commissaires
but doesn't say from whence they hail.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Salvatore on July 25, 2019, 05:53:04 am
Italy, France, Spain, Belgium, Canada.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: ElyDave on July 25, 2019, 06:08:40 am
seems a bit harsh vs previous, werent there a pair a few years back that stopped by the side of the road for fisticuffs, or am I misremembering?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Porkins on July 25, 2019, 06:23:29 am
The Ineos kit is so horrible. Got to be one of the all time worst. I suppose it's appropriate, as it's as nasty as Jim Ratcliffe's fracking and his hair. It's a pity that the UK can't muster any continental-style sponsors who sell nice things like ham or cheese or milk or ice cream.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Salvatore on July 25, 2019, 06:28:15 am
seems a bit harsh vs previous, werent there a pair a few years back that stopped by the side of the road for fisticuffs, or am I misremembering?

This pair? https://youtu.be/DrvP7_b6yeQ?t=269

Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 25, 2019, 10:00:32 am
Maybe they just misinterpreted "combativity prize".
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: rogerzilla on July 25, 2019, 01:14:21 pm
I can see why Thomas is so keen on helmets.  He's crashed three times so far in this year's race.  Really, he needs to go on one of Woollypigs' training courses.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 25, 2019, 04:16:04 pm
Well, that was fun. These Colombians, eh?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 25, 2019, 05:14:50 pm
What was I Montoya N Quintana's nosebleed all about, eh?  Overdoing the marching powder :demon:
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 26, 2019, 10:47:45 am
It was a gel, he says. She must've hit him.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: rogerzilla on July 26, 2019, 01:12:40 pm
What was I Montoya N Quintana's nosebleed all about, eh?  Overdoing the marching powder :demon:
It happens when he uses his special powers, like Eleven in Stranger Things.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 26, 2019, 02:34:56 pm
WTF? Went out, came back, !Pinot.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Porkins on July 26, 2019, 03:41:57 pm
I wish Ned would shut up. It's just verbal diarrhoea.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Porkins on July 26, 2019, 03:47:44 pm
Climate change. Even the Tour is screwed.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on July 26, 2019, 03:48:54 pm
Feck ! Wow
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: andyoxon on July 26, 2019, 03:49:16 pm
Hail.  Neutralised.   :o
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Porkins on July 26, 2019, 03:53:07 pm
This is stupid. The riders could have coped with some hail.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on July 26, 2019, 03:54:51 pm
Look of the image it did look like loads of hail. Though where it was I don't know
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Tim Hall on July 26, 2019, 03:55:42 pm
This is stupid. The riders could have coped with some hail.
I suspect it's not the falling hail, it's the laying hail on the road increasing the risk of crashing and serious injury that was the problem.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on July 26, 2019, 04:01:45 pm
Just see more, fair bit of water on the road and rumours has hit a landslide too
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on July 26, 2019, 04:08:40 pm
https://twitter.com/cyclingweekly/status/1154768121309388800?s=20
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Karla on July 26, 2019, 04:23:26 pm
Freak weather setting us up perfectly for a very normal Skineos win.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on July 26, 2019, 04:25:10 pm
https://twitter.com/trondiversen/status/1154769912512094208?s=20
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 26, 2019, 05:03:33 pm
https://twitter.com/trondiversen/status/1154769912512094208?s=20

Here's a better picture:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EAaMCz9X4AA4rmi?format=jpg&name=large
Never mind, just seen it above the tweet you linked to.

If the landslide had occurred between two groups, you'd have to neutralise the stage anyway.

If the landslide had occurred just as group barrelled through that section of road? Well, I'm sure you can work that one out...
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 26, 2019, 05:15:27 pm
I think I've geo-located the bit with the hail/slush/water on the road - it's just before the Hotel Les Seracs at La Reculaz..

Footage capture: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EAaPKevXsAAIhpm?format=png

Google maps: https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@45.474455,6.949808,760m/data=!3m1!1e3
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Porkins on July 26, 2019, 05:19:24 pm
It's just occurred to me that in future years it might not be possible for the Tour to be held in the summer. Or they'll have to come up with a way to keep the riders cooler. Maybe vehicles with misting systems. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3sAZREO8Nw
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 26, 2019, 05:40:28 pm
I've found the landslide location.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@45.5089165,6.9246509,3a,75y,82.82t/data=!3m9!1e1!3m7!1sr6dN08FvnUvUQXw_kItbvA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!9m2!1b1!2i40

Compare with this picture: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EAaMCz9X4AA4rmi?format=jpg&name=large

OSINT madskilz FTW.  :smug:
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on July 26, 2019, 05:41:25 pm
Someone on twitter said we should have tour de France on zwift or what ever it is called. I kinda agree as that will stop the hot weather, smoke from fans etc
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 26, 2019, 05:45:01 pm
Surely it's more appropriate if the peloton uses Pelican exercise bikes - or would it be the pelican using Peloton? :demon:
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Socks on July 26, 2019, 06:39:06 pm
And Pinot!

(click to show/hide)
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: quixoticgeek on July 26, 2019, 08:28:09 pm


Tomorrow's stage is going to be truncated. Just 59km...

J
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: rafletcher on July 26, 2019, 08:41:56 pm
That’s one hell of a mountain TT!
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 26, 2019, 08:42:15 pm
Quote
Due to the difficult weather conditions expected tomorrow and land slides noticed, the course of the 20th stage of the Tour de France will be modified.

After taking off from Albertville, the stage will go on the N90 road to head directly to Moutiers and then go on the initial end of stage at the N90 – D915 roundabout, 36kms from the finish.
The start will be given in Albertville at 14:30 for a total distance of 59kms.

All the intial sporting points will be withdrawn except the KOM standings at the finish in Val Thorens.

https://twitter.com/LeTour/status/1154830671115902977

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EAbPPoUXYAU9sE-.jpg


ETA - Foghat called it over on CycleChat earlier today:

Quote
Tomorrow, there's heavy rain forecast for the time the Cormet de Roseland will be traversed. That descent is fairly prone to mudslides and temporary storm-induced over-the-road rivers, being in a ravine and having some serious hairpinage getting down some of the steeper drops in the valley.

So there could be more disruption tomorrow. I've never done Val Thorens, but believe it's more of an open/motorway-type grind-climb, but who knows what the weather has in store.

https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/tour-de-france-2019-spoilers.250277/page-60#post-5690220
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Exit Stage Left on July 26, 2019, 08:51:14 pm
Val d'Isere doesn't have much luck with the Tour. A stage from there to Sestriere over the Iseran had to be cancelled in 1996. The shortened stage to Sestriere set up Riis for his win.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Peter on July 26, 2019, 08:54:09 pm
Wasn't there something else that set up Rijs?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Exit Stage Left on July 26, 2019, 09:11:21 pm
I recall that Virenque was all for riding through the snow. He was a well-known 'mad-dog'.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mrs Pingu on July 26, 2019, 09:13:22 pm
Well, balls.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mrs Pingu on July 26, 2019, 09:17:14 pm
I guess this could lead to a few crazy "no guts, no glory" assault attacks....
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Pingu on July 26, 2019, 09:18:49 pm
I've found the landslide location.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@45.5089165,6.9246509,3a,75y,82.82t/data=!3m9!1e1!3m7!1sr6dN08FvnUvUQXw_kItbvA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!9m2!1b1!2i40

Compare with this picture: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EAaMCz9X4AA4rmi?format=jpg&name=large

OSINT madskilz FTW.  :smug:

That's down the valley after TL SP Tignes le Lac at the scary Revenants dam, innit?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 26, 2019, 09:25:29 pm
I've found the landslide location.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@45.5089165,6.9246509,3a,75y,82.82t/data=!3m9!1e1!3m7!1sr6dN08FvnUvUQXw_kItbvA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!9m2!1b1!2i40

Compare with this picture: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EAaMCz9X4AA4rmi?format=jpg&name=large

OSINT madskilz FTW.  :smug:

That's down the valley after TL SP Tignes le Lac at the scary Revenants dam, innit?

Correct. It's between the tunnel on the D602 that's level with Les Brevières and Le Villaret.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Exit Stage Left on July 26, 2019, 09:29:57 pm
That's certainly on the route, but less relevant than the hail, as they could have diverted over the dam, without going down into Brevieres. I've cycled that way myself, a long time ago.
It explains how the Tour entourage still made it into Tignes.
There's be a lot of moaning about this in Tignes and Val. They already feel that the lift-pass prices have been pushed up by promotions such as this. Very unfortunate for them.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Beardy on July 26, 2019, 09:31:03 pm
I guess this could lead to a few crazy "no guts, no glory" assault attacks....
perhaps they’ll race into Paris, team trial styleee to make up for it  :o
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Beardy on July 26, 2019, 09:38:20 pm
Serious questions though:

Are the riders restricted to which bike they can ride out side of s time trial, or could they chose to ride a TT bike?

And on Sunday, I know it’s convention to just have a ride-in to Paris, but is it actually against the rules if one of the GC teams decided to just go for it?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Pingu on July 26, 2019, 09:50:10 pm
I've found the landslide location.

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@45.5089165,6.9246509,3a,75y,82.82t/data=!3m9!1e1!3m7!1sr6dN08FvnUvUQXw_kItbvA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!9m2!1b1!2i40

Compare with this picture: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EAaMCz9X4AA4rmi?format=jpg&name=large

OSINT madskilz FTW.  :smug:

That's down the valley after TL SP Tignes le Lac at the scary Revenants dam, innit?

Correct. It's between the tunnel on the D602 that's level with Les Brevières and Le Villaret.

Ah, OK, just looked at the route on letour.fr and it went down past the dam and back up through les Brevieres. Could've diverted over the scary Revenants dam, wooooh, oh, no French zombies  :o
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 26, 2019, 10:30:07 pm
Serious questions though:

Are the riders restricted to which bike they can ride out side of s time trial, or could they chose to ride a TT bike?

AFAICT aero-bars are forbidden on road stages so there wouldn't be much point in using a TT bike without them.

And on Sunday, I know it’s convention to just have a ride-in to Paris, but is it actually against the rules if one of the GC teams decided to just go for it?

Vinokourov did a successful attack in Paris a few years back, which lifted him a place or two in the GC.  Nothing against it in the rules, it's Simply Not Cricket.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Karla on July 26, 2019, 10:44:01 pm
Serious questions though:

Are the riders restricted to which bike they can ride out side of s time trial, or could they chose to ride a TT bike?

And on Sunday, I know it’s convention to just have a ride-in to Paris, but is it actually against the rules if one of the GC teams decided to just go for it?

Yes they are restricted.  Tribars, disc wheels etc are banned in bunch races.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on July 26, 2019, 11:19:48 pm
https://twitter.com/NOSsport/status/1154849512793497601?s=20

Tomorrow route is a bit tricky :)
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: hatler on July 26, 2019, 11:38:55 pm
I think I've geo-located the bit with the hail/slush/water on the road - it's just before the Hotel Les Seracs at La Reculaz..

Footage capture: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EAaPKevXsAAIhpm?format=png

Google maps: https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@45.474455,6.949808,760m/data=!3m1!1e3
Very familiar with that spot and recognised it as soon as it came up on the telly. A guide took us out for a day one time on a route which involved him persuading the lift company to open one lift early and looped round with a descent down to the far side of the lake, where a boat would, under normal circumstances, have been waiting. Except this was the one year in 20 where the lake is drained, so we skied down to the very bottom of the lake and then had to climb up the snowy/muddy side in the full glare of the sun, in full ski kit. The two pints of Orangina I had in the Hotel there hardly touched the sides.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Exit Stage Left on July 27, 2019, 12:49:19 am
Serious questions though:

Are the riders restricted to which bike they can ride out side of s time trial, or could they chose to ride a TT bike?

AFAICT aero-bars are forbidden on road stages so there wouldn't be much point in using a TT bike without them.

And on Sunday, I know it’s convention to just have a ride-in to Paris, but is it actually against the rules if one of the GC teams decided to just go for it?

Vinokourov did a successful attack in Paris a few years back, which lifted him a place or two in the GC.  Nothing against it in the rules, it's Simply Not Cricket.

The nearest France got to a TdF winner after Hinault was Fignon in 1989. He was beaten by 8 seconds on GC in a final-day TT by Greg Lemond. That was the only time that the last stage was a TT.

I was rather hoping that Alaphillipe was going to end that 30 years of hurt, but it seems that God is not a Frenchman.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 27, 2019, 08:51:23 am
Frankly, I was really hoping that he would win - he's a good guy. It'd also be nice if, for once, winning wasn't just a matter of funding. Ineos have more than double DCT's kitty and they've used it to keep a lid on the Tour for seven years, making it mostly dead boring. This time around the plaster was beginning to crack, and most comments I've read call it the best TdF in 30 years.

Liked this:

https://twitter.com/LPFrileux/status/1154422090952531968
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 27, 2019, 01:14:02 pm
Looking at Orla Chennaoui's Twitter feed, it was looking pretty grim at the finish in Val Thorens a couple of hours ago, but according to the ASO, the re-sectioned stage is on...

https://twitter.com/SportsOrla/status/1155067971884261382
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: andyoxon on July 27, 2019, 01:31:15 pm
Bernal could pick up polka dot jersey too.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: perpetual dan on July 27, 2019, 01:37:35 pm


Tomorrow's stage is going to be truncated. Just 59km...

J

I could watch it live without consuming the whole day!
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: andyoxon on July 27, 2019, 02:34:41 pm
I'm reminded how painful watching ITV live is, especially tdf coverage which seems to be 10mins cycling, 5 mins adverts, repeat.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: eckagain on July 27, 2019, 02:46:21 pm
I'm reminded how painful watching ITV live is, especially tdf coverage which seems to be 10mins cycling, 5 mins adverts, repeat.
OTOH, the best bit of watching Eurosport's coverage, is Graeme Obree's hilarious advert for Endura.   ;D
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: grams on July 27, 2019, 02:57:37 pm
They front load the adverts when on the boring early bits so the final stretch is advert free.

(And if you can get it, S4C takes ad breaks at different times to ITV4)
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 27, 2019, 03:40:29 pm
They can't be worse than francetvinfo.fr. Nibbles at 700 metres from the line and they cut the feed, the pack of putrid cnts. "Ce direct est terminé".  Jesus fucking WEPT.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on July 27, 2019, 03:52:41 pm
Bravo to the lot of them
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 27, 2019, 04:29:19 pm
Yes.  The great thing about this TdF was that nobody was certain of winning - everyone was fighting the whole way.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: toontra on July 27, 2019, 06:46:13 pm
The weather made the last 2 days slightly anti-climactic for me, sadly.  I was eagerly anticipating yesterday's final climb and sitting down to watch the whole of today's ride. Not saying it would have made any difference to the final result - just would have liked more entertainment (to match the rest of the tour).
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: fd3 on July 27, 2019, 09:44:37 pm
One hell of a sucker punch for the French - Alaphilippe was expected, but Pinot ...  do we need to close the race to non-French riders?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 28, 2019, 10:01:58 am
Pinot whacked his thigh on the bars trying to avoid a crash and tore a muscle. He then rode for two days with cramp-level pain before retiring. How does being French influence that in any way?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 28, 2019, 10:56:48 am
Didn't Barguil sneak into the top 10 yesterday at the expense of Porte?  With that on top of Alaphilippe's stellar performance and Bardet snaffling the KotM the French have done rather better than Italy or Belgium.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 28, 2019, 01:08:59 pm
Pinot whacked his thigh on the bars trying to avoid a crash and tore a muscle. He then rode for two days with cramp-level pain before retiring. How does being French influence that in any way?

It wasn't something that can be legislated for, same as Bardet not being in the same form that he was last year.

Personally, I think the idea that the TdF must be closed to non-French riders so that 30+ years of sporting butthurt can be assuaged is pretty condescending towards Alaphillippe, Pinot, Bardet et al. It's basically implying that they can't win without the intervention of Monsieur Chauvin.

If that's the case, they might as well take up knitting or chess-boxing instead.

I can remember when French riders, Nicolas Vouilloz1 and Anne-Caroline Chausson2 in particular, were absolutely dominating downhill MTB racing - nobody argued that they must be blocked out to give the rest of the world a chance.

1 Vouilloz's palmarès:
World Cup Downhill Champion : 1995, 1996, 1998, 1999, 2000
Downhill Junior World Champion : 1992, 1993, 1994
Downhill World Champion : 1995, 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999, 2001, 2002


2 Chausson's DH palmarès:
World Cup downhill series winner: 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002
Junior downhill World Champion: 1993, 1994, 1995
Senior downhill World Champion: 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2005
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 28, 2019, 01:18:23 pm
Didn't Barguil sneak into the top 10 yesterday at the expense of Porte?  With that on top of Alaphilippe's stellar performance and Bardet snaffling the KotM the French have done rather better than Italy or Belgium.

Yes - in fact, five of the top 20 are French, with 3 Colombians and 3 Spaniards.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Exit Stage Left on July 28, 2019, 01:33:19 pm
It's ironic that a Tour that was designed to play to the strengths of the rising generation of French stars was so disrupted by the weather.

First we had the crosswinds on stage 10, which caught Pinot out, and favoured INEOS's organisation.

The whole tour was skewed towards climbing, with only one individual TT, and that one was short. The sudden storms then turned the final stage into a mountain TT, with predictable results.

The real winner is Dave Brailsford. If Bernal had been in yellow earlier, tensions might have emerged. It was even fortunate that Luke Rowe was thrown off, as it put Thomas back into a road captain role. Geraint not picking up his bottle at the top of the Iseran could have been a problem, but the weather neutralised that.

Bernal's arrival means that ASO can't use climbing to counter INEOS. I wonder what next year's Tour will look like?
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 28, 2019, 01:59:54 pm
A Tour skewed towards climbing would have favoured all the serial winners of the last n years - it's the mountains that determine the GC. Still, I'd be in favour of more time trials, and team TTs at that.

What p's me off now is that the last stage doesn't start until the evening and I don't want to inflict 3 hours of cycling on MrsT. Still, it's usually dead boring.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Peter on July 28, 2019, 02:19:29 pm
I think there has been an over-reaction to fd3's post, which looked tongue-in-cheek to me.  A bit like suggesting that the English cricket team shouldn't contain New Zealanders - especially when they are playing New Zealand!  I think the French have had a great tour.  It would be interesting to see what would happen if there was a spending cap for teams.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Exit Stage Left on July 28, 2019, 02:22:27 pm
Most Tours have had a prologue, a team TT, and two individual TTs, with the final one being on the day before Paris. This year was unusual in having two mountain-top finishes in the days before Paris.

1989 was the only year they tried a deciding TT as the final stage in Paris. That edition had already had 4 TTs including the TTT before they got to Paris.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1989_Tour_de_France
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Porkins on July 29, 2019, 02:19:32 am
Such an exciting race until Pinot dropped out, but after that it became very dull. Bernal may be talented but he didn't do anything spectacular. Not a thing. Neither did G.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 29, 2019, 07:58:49 am
It wasn't dull for those of us who were hoping that Alaphilippe wouldn't fall off the podium.  Pleasing that he got the super-combative in Paris, he's a good bloke.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: citoyen on July 29, 2019, 08:09:44 am
Pinot whacked his thigh on the bars trying to avoid a crash and tore a muscle. He then rode for two days with cramp-level pain before retiring.

Not necessarily related to him being French in any way, but I was thinking how the best riders always seem to be the luckiest, and maybe Pinot needs to think about how he might make himself a luckier rider.

Wasn’t it the Tour of Flanders a couple of years ago where Sagan avoided a rider falling in front of him by bunny-hopping over him?

Getting caught the wrong side of a split in the peloton is the kind of bad luck that Tour winners seem to have the knack of avoiding too.


Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: zigzag on July 29, 2019, 10:54:49 am
a good example of avoiding a crashed rider: https://youtu.be/DFttKvN9X9w?t=78 (https://youtu.be/DFttKvN9X9w?t=78), their reflexes and skills are on another level, but sometimes it's unavoidable (like for the following riders who saw it too late to react).
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: DuncanM on July 29, 2019, 11:05:18 am
Such an exciting race until Pinot dropped out, but after that it became very dull. Bernal may be talented but he didn't do anything spectacular. Not a thing. Neither did G.
Bernal attacked and none of the others could respond. It might not be repeatedly attacking like Pinot, but what Bernal did in the stage that was cancelled was a spectacular display of climbing.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Nuncio on July 29, 2019, 01:01:28 pm
Yes, that was 43km out from (what was thought at the time to be) the finish, with about 6km left of the Iseran and 7.5km of the climb to Tignes to come. Not quite as bold as it would have been without Thomas, but he couldn't help that.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 29, 2019, 03:00:58 pm
A special grumble for the official TdF website, which didn't get the page-foot banner out of the way no matter how many times you accepted cookies and which, as it has done for the last n years, still manages to show the name of the previous stage and that of the next one, but not that of the current one. Sterling work, cheps!
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 29, 2019, 09:17:58 pm
A special grumble for the official TdF website, which didn't get the page-foot banner out of the way no matter how many times you accepted cookies and which, as it has done for the last n years, still manages to show the name of the previous stage and that of the next one, but not that of the current one. Sterling work, cheps!

It barely worked at all on my fondeslab.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 30, 2019, 08:24:23 am
Dead slow & stop on mine.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: woollypigs on July 30, 2019, 09:08:56 am
Same here often the map, stage profile didn't load on chrome/win10 I had to use EDGE or Brave to get it to show. Android/Chrome as also not linking the site.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: rafletcher on July 30, 2019, 12:07:19 pm
I used the Tour Tracker app.  Costs money (£5.99 I think)  for all the bells and whistles, but works well, and covers Giro, Tour, Vuelta, plus this year TDU, Dauphine, TdeSuisse, La Course, and Tour of Utah. Often they add the Tour of Britain too, tho not showing so far this year.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 31, 2019, 12:46:40 pm
A tale of two photo galleries, Part 1 - some cracking photos in this set, courtesy of the Grauniad:

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/jul/28/blood-rain-and-cheers-tour-de-france-2019-in-pictures

Part 2, courtesy of Cycling Tips:

https://cyclingtips.com/2019/07/the-2019-tour-de-france-in-100-frames/
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 31, 2019, 12:53:41 pm
And now for something completely different - Cycling Tips had a play with FaceApp, with results equally hilarious and terrifying:

https://cyclingtips.com/2019/07/a-glimpse-into-the-tour-de-france-2070-grand-masters-edition/
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Nuncio on July 31, 2019, 01:31:56 pm
Marvellous, especially the Guardian ones.

Edited: I wonder why they didn't change Nairo Quintana on that second set.
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: T42 on July 31, 2019, 02:29:26 pm
I don't see anything unusual.  After all:

(https://pbase.com/johnewing/image/156989781.jpg)
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: Mr Larrington on July 31, 2019, 06:37:16 pm
And now for something completely different - Cycling Tips had a play with FaceApp, with results equally hilarious and terrifying:

https://cyclingtips.com/2019/07/a-glimpse-into-the-tour-de-france-2070-grand-masters-edition/

I can't see the difference between the 2019 and 2070 versions of Bethany's Dad Rigoberto Urán :demon:
Title: Re: Tour de France 2019
Post by: spesh on July 31, 2019, 06:56:45 pm
And now for something completely different - Cycling Tips had a play with FaceApp, with results equally hilarious and terrifying:

https://cyclingtips.com/2019/07/a-glimpse-into-the-tour-de-france-2070-grand-masters-edition/

I can't see the difference between the 2019 and 2070 versions of Bethany's Dad Rigoberto Urán :demon:

It's a bit of a struggle WRT Norman Lovett - sorry, Dan Martin - as well.