Yet Another Cycling Forum

General Category => The Knowledge => Topic started by: quixoticgeek on August 19, 2019, 11:39:37 am

Title: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on August 19, 2019, 11:39:37 am

On Saturdays Audax, we got comprehensively soaked. Even after the rain stopped, my chamois never actually dried for the remainder of the ride.

I was using chamois cream (reapplied after the rain stopped too). Had a saddle bag working as an arse saver, and wore a waterproof* jacket. But the amount of rain meant my shorts got well and truly soaked.

I've tried using waterproof trousers in the past, they are fine for the commute, but over longer distances I find they make my knees hurt by the way they move over the knee.

Has anyone found a good solution to keeping your arse dry on wet rides? The damp conditions lead to some rather uncomfortable chaffing, which I'd like to avoid. This was just a 300k ride, had I had to get up the next day and do it again, it would have been agony.

I'm wondering if waterproof mtb overshorts are the answer?

Thanks

J


*for values of, seems my rapha waterproof jacket... isn't...
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: tatanab on August 19, 2019, 12:02:09 pm
Old pair of decent waterproof over trousers cut down to make over shorts.  Cut long enough to still cover shorts as legs move.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Brucey on August 19, 2019, 12:19:48 pm
worth asking yourself where/how the water got in exactly. If your jacket isn't keeping the water off you are doomed to be damp, but it'll run off even a good waterproof and soak into the first non-waterproof thing it encounters which is often the shorts. Longer-cut rain jackets might look a bit weird but can delay the onset of wet shorts considerably.

cheers
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Chris S on August 19, 2019, 12:31:01 pm
Does your bike have mudguards? No guards is a guarantee of a wet arse if it rains - and will keep your arse wet for as long as the roads remain wet.

Problem with waterproof shorts is, this time of year at least, you trade a rainy arse for a sweaty arse, and I'm not sure that's an improvement!
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on August 19, 2019, 12:35:43 pm
Does your bike have mudguards? No guards is a guarantee of a wet arse if it rains - and will keep your arse wet for as long as the roads remain wet.

The big saddle bag works as a partial mud guard, keeps the worst off. It's one of the big bike packing saddle bags, so sticks out about 300mm from the back of the saddle over the wheel.

Quote
Problem with waterproof shorts is, this time of year at least, you trade a rainy arse for a sweaty arse, and I'm not sure that's an improvement!

TBH, I'd rather the sweat than the rain, The sweat is produced at a finite rate...

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: bludger on August 19, 2019, 12:44:12 pm
I only found out these exist the other day... https://www.bikeradar.com/news/finally-the-waterproof-enduro-onesie-youve-been-longing-for/

(https://images.immediate.co.uk/production/volatile/sites/21/2019/03/tmarv-1507731947823-1ql6ckhop99hi-2ea193b.jpg?quality=90&resize=425%2C239)

It seems a bit extreme for big rides but if the terrain is long and consistent and you can control your temperature I could see it working...

The light edition might be a better bet? Surprisingly the pricing actually seems reasonable.

https://dirtlej.com/dirtsuit-light-edition
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on August 19, 2019, 01:09:29 pm
I've never used them, but I think the waterproof mtb shorts sound a potentially good idea. Easier to put on than a onesie and more breathable, if only because there will be some ventilation between jacket and shorts. I don't think they'd need to be as long as your shorts if the idea is to keep your chamois dry, it's unlikely water would be drawn up from the end of the shorts legs to the chamois. It would after all be against gravity. You'd just have to not mind waterlogged thighs.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Kim on August 19, 2019, 01:26:06 pm
Mudguards if it's coming from the wheel, Rainlegs[1] if it's coming from the sky, drain hole if your hardshell recumbent seat is collecting run-off.  (Pay no attention to the smug velomobile riders, they'll get their comeuppance on the next big climb.)  If it's coming from your skin, you're basically doomed, I think.

I've never found waterproof trousers worth bothering with, but that's mostly because on the short journeys I'd consider them for, it's generally easier to go earlier or later and avoid the heavy rain.  Riding longer distances in boil-in-the-bag clothing does not appeal.

Someone will be along in a minute to suggest capes...


[1] Preferably the magic ones that cause the rain to stop as long as you keep wearing them.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Paul H on August 19, 2019, 02:07:49 pm
Does your bike have mudguards? No guards is a guarantee of a wet arse if it rains - and will keep your arse wet for as long as the roads remain wet.

The big saddle bag works as a partial mud guard, keeps the worst off. It's one of the big bike packing saddle bags, so sticks out about 300mm from the back of the saddle over the wheel.

J
I think you may be overestimating just how partial that is, I doubt it's as much as 50% compared to full guards.  Fashion or a dry arse, your choice.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Frank9755 on August 19, 2019, 02:20:56 pm
Agree^
Was just going to post the same. 
I've never had a problem in any amount of rain when using mudguards.  But I got the worst saddle sores I've ever had when I did a wet 300km on my TT bike with none.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: chrisbainbridge on August 19, 2019, 02:32:50 pm
Does your bike have mudguards? No guards is a guarantee of a wet arse if it rains - and will keep your arse wet for as long as the roads remain wet.

The big saddle bag works as a partial mud guard, keeps the worst off. It's one of the big bike packing saddle bags, so sticks out about 300mm from the back of the saddle over the wheel.

J
I think you may be overestimating just how partial that is, I doubt it's as much as 50% compared to full guards.  Fashion or a dry arse, your choice.

Not done your levels of mileage but agree that full mudguards that come from brake level down to bottom bracket make a big difference to a wet bum
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: T42 on August 19, 2019, 02:35:18 pm
Can't remember ever having wet-bum problems even without mudguards, I always had a good long rain jacket. OTOH mudguards make for less muck to clean off.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: mzjo on August 19, 2019, 03:18:45 pm
Well i like capes but would accept that they are inadapted for audaxing and probably a nuisance in windy dutch weather. I can't help thinking that for the weight involved one reasonably effective solution would simply be to take a dry pair of shorts and a microfibre towel in your luggage which, combined with guards or a suitably designed waterproof jacket, would allow you to regain a bit of comfort.

I have travelled too many miles sitting in a lake of water on a motorbike where the rain has gone through the waterproof seams in front and not found another way out to put any trust in waterproof shorts!
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Brucey on August 19, 2019, 03:34:56 pm
on a related point there have been heavy showers today here and I just saw a chap who had been riding his fatbike.   He'd avoided being in the rain itself but not its consequences;  just through riding a fairly short way on wet roads he had a wet stripe about a foot wide, front and rear.

Those fat tyres do throw a lot of water about!

cheers
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Aidan on August 19, 2019, 05:13:37 pm
Ive used a pair of these as overshorts  to good effect

https://www.sigmasports.com/item/Endura/Hummvee-Waterproof-Short/L12L?utm_source=google&utm_medium=base&co=GBR&cu=GBP&glCountry=GB&id=981177&gclsrc=aw.ds&&gclid=CjwKCAjwkenqBRBgEiwA-bZVtrrU-OGlxlWrVoOgdbVyzNsh7ge7ftXCM6r8dWJYcF7wALAJrTUBLhoC_CsQAvD_BwE
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Galloper on August 19, 2019, 07:02:52 pm
Plus 1 for mtb shorts, they will, in most cases, fit over a pair pf chamois shorts.   I also recall seeing a pair with a waterproof section at the back with the rest of the shorts made with a normal material.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on August 20, 2019, 01:58:32 pm

It seems women's specific waterproof MTB shorts are few and far between. I couldn't find the women's version of the Humvee on the Endura website, so emailed them:

"We don’t do a fully waterproof ladies specific short I'm afraid.  We have a few
that have DWR coating for drizzle and spray (Singletrack, Hummvees and MT500)   
but nothing that's a fully waterproof fabric.  The MT500 Spray shorts have a   
waterproof rear.  We only to the full waterproof short in MT500 in a gents     
specific only."

Seems they don't make a women's version.

I emailed back asking why they think this is acceptable in 2019. I await their disinterested reply...

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: bludger on August 20, 2019, 02:21:51 pm
This thread puts me in mind of my favourite classic GCN video

(https://i.imgur.com/R4BeuFr.png)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BhZZnTgxrDM

I keen meaning to get round to making some good mudguards. The ones that come as standard from the shop just don't cut it, I need to get the milk jugs and zip ties out to do a proper job on it myself. The roobike had some bespoke ones I made out of milk jugs on it until this summer, zip tied to the down tube and seat tube, they did a terrific job.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Kim on August 20, 2019, 05:08:23 pm
It seems women's specific waterproof MTB shorts are few and far between. I couldn't find the women's version of the Humvee on the Endura website, so emailed them:
[...]

Seems they don't make a women's version.

I emailed back asking why they think this is acceptable in 2019. I await their disinterested reply...

To be fair, they don't even do a version of the Humvee that fits women who have both  a) lard  and  b) quads.

I've accidentally managed to fit mine (their largest size) properly this year, by converting some of (a) into more of (b).  Prior to that they were fine for walking around in, but too tight for any real cycling.

On the gripping hand, they *do* make winter tights for women with arses who aren't 8ft tall, and should be commended for this radical approach.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on August 20, 2019, 05:53:27 pm
On the gripping hand, they *do* make winter tights for women with arses who aren't 8ft tall, and should be commended for this radical approach.
I've met some tall women and a few who were arses, but never any whose arses were 8ft tall.  :D ::-)



Yes, that's my coat, the waterproof romper suit.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on August 21, 2019, 11:22:39 am
I think you may be overestimating just how partial that is, I doubt it's as much as 50% compared to full guards.  Fashion or a dry arse, your choice.

Nah, I tested it...

I stuck on a pair of crud roadracer mk3's to my bike over the winter, and took the bag off. There was no noticeable difference in the splatter pattern up my back between the two. The pattern starts about around my bra strap and goes up. The lower back and bum gets next to nothing.

My bike doesn't have a brake bridge to attach guards too, so I am limited in what guards I could fit if I wanted to. Especially as I run 32-42 mm tyres.

Women's fit water proof shorts seem to be a rarity. A lot of companies, including Vaude, seem to have discontinued theirs, some companies think only men cycling in the wet, and others think the women that do cycle in the wet are tiny pixies.

Taking a pair of scissors to my Altura waterpoof trousers, is looking like the least worst option of the lot.

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Brucey on August 21, 2019, 11:34:20 am

My bike doesn't have a brake bridge to attach guards too, so I am limited in what guards I could fit if I wanted to.....

a couple of P clips and a bit of meccano will sort that out

cheers
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on August 21, 2019, 11:34:52 am

P clip?

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on August 21, 2019, 11:38:42 am
"Are they for growing peas?" asked the woman in the hardware store when I was looking for them.

No, they're not.

(https://media.rs-online.com/t_large/R8726094-01.jpg)
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on August 21, 2019, 11:40:58 am
Women's fit water proof shorts seem to be a rarity. A lot of companies, including Vaude, seem to have discontinued theirs, some companies think only men cycling in the wet, and others think the women that do cycle in the wet are tiny pixies.

Taking a pair of scissors to my Altura waterpoof trousers, is looking like the least worst option of the lot.

J
They don't really have to be cycling shorts if they're to go over padded shorts, do they? Could you find something for hiking, say?
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: trekker12 on August 21, 2019, 11:56:24 am
It seems women's specific waterproof MTB shorts are few and far between. I couldn't find the women's version of the Humvee on the Endura website, so emailed them:
[...]

Seems they don't make a women's version.

I emailed back asking why they think this is acceptable in 2019. I await their disinterested reply...

To be fair, they don't even do a version of the Humvee that fits women who have both  a) lard  and  b) quads.


That seems normal for virtually all female specific cycling clothing. We've given up trying to find cycling clothes that fit Mrs Trekker and have gone down the general outdoors walking equipment as that industry seems to acknowledge women aren't all stick thin.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: phantasmagoriana on August 21, 2019, 11:58:39 am

Women's fit water proof shorts seem to be a rarity.


I've been mulling over some of these for a while: https://www.rutlandcycling.com/clothing/legwear/scott-trail-mtn-dryo-50-womens-shorts-black_466815

Haven't (yet) taken the plunge, so I don't know if they're any good - but they're cheap compared to some.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: JenM on August 21, 2019, 12:15:24 pm
Evans Cycles are selling Madison DTE Women’s Waterproof Shorts

https://www.evanscycles.com/madison-dte-women-s-waterproof-shorts-EV361865 (https://www.evanscycles.com/madison-dte-women-s-waterproof-shorts-EV361865)
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Auntie Helen on August 21, 2019, 12:24:22 pm
Mudguards if it's coming from the wheel, Rainlegs[1] if it's coming from the sky, drain hole if your hardshell recumbent seat is collecting run-off.  (Pay no attention to the smug velomobile riders, they'll get their comeuppance on the next big climb.)
we avoid hills for a reason.

But I actually have a pretty leaky Velomobile. But am still drier than other cyclists, just not on my chest and face.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Kim on August 21, 2019, 12:30:45 pm
I think you may be overestimating just how partial that is, I doubt it's as much as 50% compared to full guards.  Fashion or a dry arse, your choice.

Nah, I tested it...

I stuck on a pair of crud roadracer mk3's to my bike over the winter, and took the bag off. There was no noticeable difference in the splatter pattern up my back between the two. The pattern starts about around my bra strap and goes up. The lower back and bum gets next to nothing.

My instinctive reaction to that is "try some real mudguards", but...


Quote
My bike doesn't have a brake bridge to attach guards too, so I am limited in what guards I could fit if I wanted to. Especially as I run 32-42 mm tyres.

...Would appear to make that difficult, unless you fitted a rack you could use as scaffolding, maybe.   :-\

OTOH, I'm still a firm believer in the "modify the bike to suite the rider, rather than modify the rider to suit the bike" approach.


If you're getting splattered from your bra strap upwards, that must be from the very back of the wheel, surely?  In which case I think you either need a full mudguard with AUK-compliant flap, or something long and wide above the wheel.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on August 21, 2019, 01:19:20 pm
Or a bike which can take proper mudguards Or get your current bike adapted by having eg Argos braze in a mount there?
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Kim on August 21, 2019, 01:21:17 pm
Or a bike which can take proper mudguards Or get your current bike adapted by having eg Argos braze in a mount there?

This is how bikes turn into touring bikes.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: mzjo on August 21, 2019, 08:14:35 pm

My bike doesn't have a brake bridge to attach guards too, so I am limited in what guards I could fit if I wanted to.....

a couple of P clips and a bit of meccano will sort that out

cheers

If this is the Vagabond, I have just looked at a picture and the 2018 Vagabond has mudguard eyes and the rack mounts ideally placed to fit a substitute brake bridge for hanging the rear guard. The only problem that I see is the clearance between seat tube and wheel and I would presume absence of a chainstay bridge, and there are ways of getting round that with a guard ending higher up above the rear mech and a suitable collar. It even makes it possible to rotate the guard towards the back to come a bit lower, although that is sub-optimal compared to a decent mudflap. Of course if the bike concerned is the race bike then I don't know what I'm talking about  but otherwise if it was mine and I needed guards it would get them (bodged in my case - I have my reputation to think of  ??? ). Probably wouldn't even need the brazing torch!!

Edit: I didn't think Crudcatchers went wide enough for QG's usual choice of tyres; certainly my Raceblades (wide version but from a few years ago) only just cover 28mm. Finding guards to cover 40x622 and over could be the real problem (wide guards in 26" don't seem to be such a problem). If the guards aren't wide enough to do the job properly then the arse will remain wet (all the ingenuity in the world can't overturn the laws of physics!)
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: andrew_s on August 22, 2019, 01:18:19 pm
Taking a pair of scissors to my Altura waterpoof trousers, is looking like the least worst option of the lot.
Don't chop too generously, at least to start with.

My experience is that it's better that they are long enough to cover the knee at the top of the pedal stroke.
The end of the shorts leg works back and forth as you pedal, and if you get rain on the top of the knee, the dampness gets spread upwards by the movement (not a lot, but it's better avoided if easy).
If it irritates behind the knee, you can cut the back a bit shorter.

I started on rainlegs, but non-breathable fabric, unsealed seams, and water running off the edge all meant that they got replaced by waterproof shorts for all but commuting. I'm now using what got replaced by Gore C5 waterproof shorts.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on August 22, 2019, 05:19:19 pm

My instinctive reaction to that is "try some real mudguards", but...

Do I have to reiterate yet again just how much I detest mudguards? They are a right total complete, utter PAIN IN THE ARSE, and for my use case wholly unsuitable.

Quote
...Would appear to make that difficult, unless you fitted a rack you could use as scaffolding, maybe.   :-\

OTOH, I'm still a firm believer in the "modify the bike to suite the rider, rather than modify the rider to suit the bike" approach.

Have I mentioned how much I dislike racks too?

Quote
If you're getting splattered from your bra strap upwards, that must be from the very back of the wheel, surely?  In which case I think you either need a full mudguard with AUK-compliant flap, or something long and wide above the wheel.

Or a waterproof jacket. Take off at end of ride, let dry, shake off dust. Done. No rattling, no gumming with mud or snow, no weird noises from cross winds. But my summer jacket doesn't go down far enough to cover my arse. I must admit to being less than pleased with the rapha waterproof I've got. They did replace it for me this week as it hadn't kept the rain out at the weekend, but I'm thinking for next summer I'm going to go for something that is longer, has a hood, and a slightly looser fit. For longer rides, the comfort increase is worth the penalty of a baggier, heavier unit.

Or a bike which can take proper mudguards Or get your current bike adapted by having eg Argos braze in a mount there?

Yes, I should sell my bike, and replace it with a Pashley Guvner, with 3 speed sturmey archer, drum brakes, ply wood mudguards, front and back racks, sit up and beg handlebars, and a carbide lamp...

Or pay out lots to have someone welding bits to the current bike...

Or I could cut up a €40 euro pair of trousers...

Or a bike which can take proper mudguards Or get your current bike adapted by having eg Argos braze in a mount there?

This is how bikes turn into touring bikes.

Or Oma fiets...

If this is the Vagabond, I have just looked at a picture and the 2018 Vagabond has mudguard eyes and the rack mounts ideally placed to fit a substitute brake bridge for hanging the rear guard. The only problem that I see is the clearance between seat tube and wheel and I would presume absence of a chainstay bridge, and there are ways of getting round that with a guard ending higher up above the rear mech and a suitable collar. It even makes it possible to rotate the guard towards the back to come a bit lower, although that is sub-optimal compared to a decent mudflap. Of course if the bike concerned is the race bike then I don't know what I'm talking about  but otherwise if it was mine and I needed guards it would get them (bodged in my case - I have my reputation to think of  ??? ). Probably wouldn't even need the brazing torch!!

I don't need guards, I just need waterproof shorts, or a longer jacket, or both...

There's loads of space between the tyre and the seat tube, it's one of the things I love about this frame. Means I don't have to stop to clear the snow out as much. Means I can fit the studded tyres in winter, and the GP5k's in summer. I'd like to not gum up that space with some piece of plastic.

Quote
Edit: I didn't think Crudcatchers went wide enough for QG's usual choice of tyres; certainly my Raceblades (wide version but from a few years ago) only just cover 28mm. Finding guards to cover 40x622 and over could be the real problem (wide guards in 26" don't seem to be such a problem). If the guards aren't wide enough to do the job properly then the arse will remain wet (all the ingenuity in the world can't overturn the laws of physics!)

The box claims up to 35mm. I got them as an experiment, and they confirmed everything I already hated about guards.

Depending on the ride I use either
- 32mm GP5K (Summer)
- 28mm GP 4 Seasons (Spring and Autumn, purchased in error, had wanted 32mm, will replace with 32's when these die)
- 37mm Conti Topcontact winter (Winter below 5°, but snow/rain/ice isn't forecast)
- 40mm Schwalbe G+One allround (offroad inclinations, spring through Autumn, when I can be arsed to swap the gp5k's off)
- 42mm Schwalbe Marathon Winters (ice ice baby!)

I really love how the vagabond can take all of these, how I can bomb round on the MTB tracks, or do a 300k audax. All on one bike (I may even try cyclocross on it!)

Don't chop too generously, at least to start with.

My experience is that it's better that they are long enough to cover the knee at the top of the pedal stroke.
The end of the shorts leg works back and forth as you pedal, and if you get rain on the top of the knee, the dampness gets spread upwards by the movement (not a lot, but it's better avoided if easy).
If it irritates behind the knee, you can cut the back a bit shorter.

The movement of the fabric of the trousers over the knee cap over 260km last winter really buggered my knees. It's one of the reasons I'm not just opting for using waterproof trousers. So I'm gonna cut to be at least just above the knee. I'm not fussed if my thighs get damp. I just want to keep the area that is basically contacted by the chamois dry, my legs I don't care about.

Quote

I started on rainlegs, but non-breathable fabric, unsealed seams, and water running off the edge all meant that they got replaced by waterproof shorts for all but commuting. I'm now using what got replaced by Gore C5 waterproof shorts.

Gore appear to no longer make fully waterproof cycling over shorts for women.

Neither do Vaude.

Scott's don't go big enough...
Neither do Madison's...
and Maloja's largest size is just about big enough for my thigh...

Apparently there's not enough women, especially larger women, that like riding in the wet enough to drive demand...

*sigh*

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on August 22, 2019, 05:20:14 pm
They don't really have to be cycling shorts if they're to go over padded shorts, do they? Could you find something for hiking, say?

Hiking clothing isn't designed for being sat in for long periods of time.

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on August 22, 2019, 05:47:21 pm
https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=113093.0









 :D :o :hand: 8) :facepalm: ::-) :demon:
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: phil w on August 22, 2019, 06:06:49 pm
Do you wear a pair of outer shorts over an inner padded liner?  If so, I'd consider washing the outer shorts in one of Nikwax's fabric waterproofing products.  There are various versions but I generally use T.X. Direct with normal clothing and it works well.

https://www.nikwax.com/en-gb/products/productdetail.php?productid=3&itemid=-1&fabricid=-1
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on August 22, 2019, 06:23:24 pm
Do you wear a pair of outer shorts over an inner padded liner?  If so, I'd consider washing the outer shorts in one of Nikwax's fabric waterproofing products.  There are various versions but I generally use T.X. Direct with normal clothing and it works well.

https://www.nikwax.com/en-gb/products/productdetail.php?productid=3&itemid=-1&fabricid=-1

No, I wear a pair of rapha shorts.

I'm looking at options for a waterproof outer short to wear over the top.

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on August 22, 2019, 07:04:27 pm

My instinctive reaction to that is "try some real mudguards", but...

Do I have to reiterate yet again just how much I detest mudguards? They are a right total complete, utter PAIN IN THE ARSE, and for my use case wholly unsuitable.
What actually is your use case? In addition to wanting a dry arse and not wanting mudguards. You say you get wheel splatter from your bra strap up, which suggests the shorts are not getting wet from below. So it's either general road spray from passing vehicles or rain from the top soaking in and eventually soaking the chamois – presumably a bit of both, but if you're mostly on fietspads then there'll be correspondingly less spray. So maybe Rain Legs would work, by keeping the top of the shorts dry?
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Chris S on August 22, 2019, 07:34:07 pm
Do you wear a pair of outer shorts over an inner padded liner?  If so, I'd consider washing the outer shorts in one of Nikwax's fabric waterproofing products.  There are various versions but I generally use T.X. Direct with normal clothing and it works well.

https://www.nikwax.com/en-gb/products/productdetail.php?productid=3&itemid=-1&fabricid=-1

No, I wear a pair of rapha shorts.

I'm looking at options for a waterproof outer short to wear over the top.

J

I'm not a girl, but I do have an arse and I'm betting this combination will just be worse. It's probably great for a trip to the shops, but 18 hours of randonneuring is a different thing, and from my experience (extensive, but waning in relevance as I've kinda retired) you really really only want ONE layer between your arse and your saddle. Anything else causes inter-layer friction, prevents fabric breathing (that you've paid a premium for - modern fabrics are fantastic) and is a solution to a problem that shouldn't exist in the first place.

Just take a look at photos of miriad randonneurs who have gone before you. They nearly all, to a man and woman, use mudguards. Go figure.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: phantasmagoriana on August 22, 2019, 08:11:30 pm

Gore appear to no longer make fully waterproof cycling over shorts for women.

Neither do Vaude.


Not listed on their website before, but the "Drop" shorts seem to be available on a few different websites, e.g. here (https://www.bike24.com/p2239804.html) (and Amazon seem to have XL ones in a rather garish colour very cheap (https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Vaude-Womens-Shorts-Trousers-X-Large/dp/B076KTJ9ZB/ref=sr_1_fkmr1_2?keywords=Vaude%2BWomen%27s%2BDrop%2BShorts&qid=1566500684&s=gateway&sr=8-2-fkmr1&th=1&psc=1); other sizes and colours are much more expensive, in true Amazon random pricing style).

I almost bought some of the Gore women's ones when they were being sold off cheap as they were discontinued. Of course I didn't actually get around to buying any... :facepalm:
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Kim on August 22, 2019, 08:13:40 pm
(and Amazon seem to have XL ones in a rather garish colour very cheap (https://smile.amazon.co.uk/Vaude-Womens-Shorts-Trousers-X-Large/dp/B076KTJ9ZB/ref=sr_1_fkmr1_2?keywords=Vaude%2BWomen%27s%2BDrop%2BShorts&qid=1566500684&s=gateway&sr=8-2-fkmr1&th=1&psc=1)

 :o

I suppose that's better than having the red and black the other way round...
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on August 22, 2019, 09:14:24 pm
They are a bit noobab, aren't they. My nephew recently rode from London to Paris for a breast cancer charity. The riders were given jersey and shorts in the foundation's colours; I haven't seem them but apparently the shorts are bright pink with black stripes up the side. However, he had a dry arse the whole ride thanks to the weather.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Frank9755 on August 22, 2019, 10:49:07 pm
I don't like mudguards very much either.
But I put them on most of my bikes because I really like having a dry arse.
Same with gloves, I'm not a big fan of them, but I like warm hands..
I'm not that keen on oil but I like my chain not to squeak. I don't like pumps but I find my bike more comfortable with air in the tyres....
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Paul H on August 22, 2019, 11:53:22 pm
Do I have to reiterate yet again just how much I detest mudguards? They are a right total complete, utter PAIN IN THE ARSE, and for my use case wholly unsuitable.
J
Again?  What, where, when?  Not on this thread.
Did you start detesting them before you tested them and proved they didn't work or after? 
As for your use case - the scenario in the initial post was a 300 k Audax, there is no disadvantage in that case and they're easy enough to remove and refit as your use case changes.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Kim on August 23, 2019, 12:20:34 am
Quixoticgeek is also into endurance racing, which I think differs from audax in terms of what is considered cool gets prioritised for performance vs long-term practicality.  I can certainly see that while mudguards are a no-brainer for those attempting the Fecund Ferret RTTY series, they might be more trouble than they're worth on the TCR (especially if you've already got luggage doing most of the job).

The tyre clearance issue for studs, snow etc. is a different trade-off, and in my mind one that's most effectively achieved by n+1.

What I can't see is how endurance riding in anything overtrousersy works.  Something's surely going to rub?

On the gripping hand, if it's not actually spray from the wheel causing the problem, but run-off from a suboptimal jacket, then mudguards aren't actually the solution, no matter how wonderful we might think they are.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: mzjo on August 23, 2019, 11:18:29 am
Quixoticgeek is also into endurance racing, which I think differs from audax in terms of what is considered cool gets prioritised for performance vs long-term practicality.  I can certainly see that while mudguards are a no-brainer for those attempting the Fecund Ferret RTTY series, they might be more trouble than they're worth on the TCR (especially if you've already got luggage doing most of the job).

The tyre clearance issue for studs, snow etc. is a different trade-off, and in my mind one that's most effectively achieved by n+1.

What I can't see is how endurance riding in anything overtrousersy works.  Something's surely going to rub?

On the gripping hand, if it's not actually spray from the wheel causing the problem, but run-off from a suboptimal jacket, then mudguards aren't actually the solution, no matter how wonderful we might think they are.

After due consideration it seems that compromises have to be made:

Rain is sub-optimal (for cycling) but sometimes can't be avoided (speaking as one who lives in a country with regular 4 month droughts it is less sub-optimal than one might imagine).
Mudguards are the sub-optimal solution chosen by a lot of non-sporting cycling disciplines (and one or two sporting ones if one accepts audax as sporting) but is not an acceptable compromise here.
The vast majority of sporting cycling disciplines accept a wet arse as a price to pay for not using mudguards. Depending on the length and nature of the sporting event the type of waterproof jacket will vary from sophisticated to non-existant.
The vast majority of sporting events are shorter in duration than audax or ultra-racing events so participants suffer correspondingly less with their wet backsides.
The percentage of world cycling time and of world cycling expenditure devoted to audax and ultra-racing disciplines is very small compared to the whole (someone care to give me a figure?) limiting the incentive of manufacturers to produce specific equipment (even though these disciplines may actually spend considerably more time in adverse conditions than other cycling activities - although I am not sure about that).

 Given all of that if QG does not accept mudguards (her right to do so), does not want a wet arse, does not want to avoid riding in the rain (not inclines to DNS - or use the bus to commute) and can't find a readily available commercial solution, then there remains only one possibility - create the solution yourself. This could be making overshorts, finding a man's design breathable rainshort in a large size and either taking needle and thread to modify it to her shape or finding a dressmaker to do it for her, or in the extreme sourcing fabric and making her own from scratch. (Don't laugh, many a commercial product has started from that basic process - and a few successful companies as well). Just make sure your design is well protected from copying.

North America having a potentially bigger pool of ladies in this situation, there may be a forum the other side of the ditch with a solution that we don't know about or a small manufacturer capable of responding better to your demands than in Europe, not something I would know about.

Edited to lengthen the drought!
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: bludger on August 23, 2019, 02:44:09 pm
If mudguards really are off the table then a bike with a very fat down tube can make them less necessary. My dad's carbon norco cross bike has a down tube the girth of a gorilla's forearm. Not tried it in anger but I bet it would help keep a dry front much better than my own slim tubed bike especially with a saddlebag and frame bag on it.

My roobike has a fender in the style below. It's not the most effective one in the world but has no issue with foot rub, frame rub etc, it is fit and go. I also extended the bottom of it with some old milk bottle and zip ties, I have a nice dry bum so long as I'm doing straight lines and not weaving around with the front wheel too much. (https://www.tritoncycles.co.uk/images/pdw-origami-front-downtube-mudguard-p408-32904_image.jpg)
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Kim on August 23, 2019, 02:55:44 pm
If mudguards really are off the table then a bike with a very fat down tube can make them less necessary. My dad's carbon norco cross bike has a down tube the girth of a gorilla's forearm. Not tried it in anger but I bet it would help keep a dry front much better than my own slim tubed bike especially with a saddlebag and frame bag on it.

My experience of racing the Red Baron without a front mudguard[1] in traditional dePreston conditions supports this: The wide bit of frame tube between the headset and seat that approximates the downtube of a DF bike does an admirable job of keeping the spray off the rider's crotch and face.  Lower legs and outer thighs still get a thorough splattering, as does the drivetrain, but that's fine because it's all over in a few hours.


[1] Marginal gains, innnit: While removing the mudguard is unlikely to have much aero/weight benefit, keeping it fitted is unlikely to have much keeping-things-clean benefit, as under race conditions the majority of the splatter is from the rider in front.  Especially if they're riding an unfaired trike[2].
[2] AKA 'mud fountain'.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: bludger on August 23, 2019, 03:05:55 pm
If weight wheenie concerns are up there e.g. for ultra racing, since it's common to carry a spare tyre in the case of the worst scenarios it could be wrapped in clingfilm and somehow fitted to the downtube, acting as a kind-of fender as well. Oh the possibilities...
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: grams on August 23, 2019, 03:14:54 pm
I had a strip of duct tape along my back rack as a mudguard. I did consider artfully replacing it with my folding spare tyre.

The problem with short mudguards of all kinds is they can be quite good at focusing spray rather than keeping it off. You’ll get very wet feet with the wrong front mudguard and a short tear mudguard will - depending on angle and speed - focus spray on either the riders head or the rider behind’s face.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Davef on August 26, 2019, 07:46:22 am
I have got very wet and never had an issue drying out quickly. By very wet I include 4km swims in  triathlons and an unplanned swim across the Ouse with my bike. Perhaps consider shorts with a less spongey seat pad for when heavy rain is forecast.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Frank9755 on August 27, 2019, 11:28:06 am
It's not an ultra-racing thing.  Plenty of people do (on-road) races with mudguards.  Not a majority, but a good few. 
Off-road, they are pretty rare. 
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: zigzag on August 27, 2019, 12:02:06 pm
i rode both tcr's with mudguards and was very glad for that decision - no saddle sores and more pleasant riding on wet roads.

rode pbp without them and was fine as the ride is much shorter and faster (27kph vs 19kph), the only annoyance was pedaling with wet feet for the whole day.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on August 28, 2019, 11:15:25 am
I'd be interested to know what solution QG has adopted or will adopt for this.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: nobby on August 28, 2019, 02:13:07 pm
Perhaps consider shorts with a less spongey seat pad for when heavy rain is forecast.

Very good. That sounds like a zen approach to a damp problem.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on August 30, 2019, 12:29:28 pm
I'd be interested to know what solution QG has adopted or will adopt for this.

I haven't decided yet. I know I won't be:

- Having stuff welded to the frame
- Bodging mudguards with Mecano.
- Searching for shorts with a different pad

I'm debating between trying to buy some over shorts that are the right size (non trivial task, I have a big arse). Cutting down my waterproof over trousers to see how they work.

I'm also thinking I want to get a different summer waterproof jacket, that goes a bit lower. I've realised that the waterproof I wear during the colder months is long enough to cover my arse, which is probably why I've not had this problem before.

Looking at the clothing riders on the SRMR wore, the overshorts thing seems popular.

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: andrew_s on August 30, 2019, 12:58:03 pm
I'm also thinking I want to get a different summer waterproof jacket, that goes a bit lower.
There are (or have been) some waterproofs that use a fold-down flap rather than an extended tail, held in place inside with poppers (or velcro) when not in use. That which I have (discontinued long ago) has considerably more coverage than any waterproof I've used without such a flap.
It strikes me that there may be scope to DIY on this front, as stitch holes right by the lower hem won't be much of a problem.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on October 18, 2019, 07:59:28 pm
I'd be interested to know what solution QG has adopted or will adopt for this.
I'm debating between trying to buy some over shorts that are the right size (non trivial task, I have a big arse). Cutting down my waterproof over trousers to see how they work.

With the prospect of a wet 200 tomorrow, and the realisation I have 2 pairs of waterproof trousers, I just took a pair a scissors to one of them. Making a pair of shorts that cut just above the knee cap when seated. I'm not certain they will remain like that, I may add velcro to make them tighter at the knee, and I may still chop some more length off so they don't annoy the knee cap.

Will see how they go tomorrow.

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on October 18, 2019, 08:01:31 pm
Hope that goes well for you! I think I might have been tempted to cut them off below the knee, but it does depend on their shape.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on October 18, 2019, 08:08:20 pm
Hope that goes well for you! I think I might have been tempted to cut them off below the knee, but it does depend on their shape.

One of the problems I've had on long rides in the wet before is that my knees get irritated by the waterproof trousers rubbing over the top of the knee cap. Hence wanting something shorter. I've intentionally cut these off so they don't touch the knee.

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Ian H on October 18, 2019, 08:49:09 pm
The real answer is mudguards, even if only the plastic tail-like clip-on kind.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on October 18, 2019, 09:01:09 pm
The real answer is mudguards, even if only the plastic tail-like clip-on kind.

How will that provide more protection than my large ortlieb saddle bag sticking out over the wheel?

I really fucking hate mudguards.

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Ian H on October 18, 2019, 09:24:24 pm
The real answer is mudguards, even if only the plastic tail-like clip-on kind.

How will that provide more protection than my large ortlieb saddle bag sticking out over the wheel?

I really fucking hate mudguards.

J

You get a wet arse.  So do I when I ride without guards.  When I ride with guards my arse stays pretty dry.

But whatever.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on October 18, 2019, 09:54:33 pm
You get a wet arse.  So do I when I ride without guards.  When I ride with guards my arse stays pretty dry.

But whatever.

Mud guards squeak, and rattle, and make weird noises in the wind, and they gum up with mud and other crap...

Maybe I'm just very unlucky, but I find them to be a right total utter completer pain in the arse.

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: jsabine on October 18, 2019, 09:59:18 pm
You get a wet arse.  So do I when I ride without guards.  When I ride with guards my arse stays pretty dry.

But whatever.

Badly fitted Mud guards squeak, and rattle, and make weird noises in the wind, and they gum up with mud and other crap...


FTFY

Quote
Maybe I'm just very unlucky, but I find them to be a right total utter completer pain in the arse.

Maybe.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: grams on October 18, 2019, 11:10:14 pm
I'm not a huge fan of mudguards (because most of them are painful to adjust, often literally) but properly fitted they're less worse than all of the other options.

There was someone on the very wet Flatlands ignoring the mudguards rule but they had one of them big long saddlebags. They were absolutely covered in crap last I saw them.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: bludger on October 18, 2019, 11:38:23 pm
I saw some really, really nice mudguards fitted to a bike sold in a shop in London a few months ago. They were a gunmetal grey colour and fixed on really strongly, no risk of rattle at all. The problem for me is if I want full length guards that good I'd probably have to move down from 32mm to 28 at the widest and boy do I love me my comfy tyres.

On the town/Deliveroo bike I've gotten around this by chopping up bits of old milk bottle and zip tying them to the frame tubes which works surprisingly well. Ugly as sin though.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Auntie Helen on October 19, 2019, 06:27:24 am
The real answer is a Velomobile!
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on October 19, 2019, 07:00:25 am


(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EHOC6VAXUAARh6D.jpg)

Can someone explain the physics of how water gets from the wheel to the small bit of arse below my jacket, past this saddle bag?

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: The French Tandem on October 19, 2019, 07:38:34 am
Can be water spraying from the FRONT wheel as well. If I'm right, you won't stay dry unless you fit full front and rear mudguards. I can see that your fork seems to have quite a generous clearance, so fitting a mudguard should note be a problem.

A
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: fboab on October 19, 2019, 07:42:09 am
Rode in that lovely horizontal rain here in your Netherlands yesterday. Dry arse... Mudguards work. Your waterproof shorts will give you (or, when I tried them, gave me) an uncomfortably sore sweaty arse. No one likes mudguards, they're just the lesser of two evils.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Andy64 on October 19, 2019, 07:50:28 am


Can someone explain the physics of how water gets from the wheel to the small bit of arse below my jacket, past this saddle bag?

J
It did with my (similar) Blackburn seatpack. My shoulder blade area still got the spray, and it trickled downwards
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: mattc on October 19, 2019, 07:59:52 am


Can someone explain the physics of how water gets from the wheel to the small bit of arse below my jacket, past this saddle bag?

J
It did with my (similar) Blackburn seatpack. My shoulder blade area still got the spray, and it trickled downwards
With some setups it doesn't even need to trickle down - you have a huge low air-pressure zone around your bum, so inevitably some water will get sucked in. The effect may even be worse at higher speeds - I haven't seen any science on the matter.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: orienteer on October 19, 2019, 08:28:48 am
Water is flung off the wheels tangentially. Drawing a tangent off the rear wheel up past the end of the bag probably reaches your upper back, whence it trickles down.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Paul H on October 19, 2019, 08:30:27 am
I doubt there’s an explanation that would satisfy you, but at least your photo shows your objection doesn’t come from not wanting to attach stuff to the bike.
The tyres throw water into the air and you ride into it.  There’s no static diagram and there’s no magic.  You’ll still get wet, just not as wet and not as quickly. That’s the experience of so many, it’s hard to see how yours could be different.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: canny colin on October 19, 2019, 10:44:58 am
The Real answer is an up wrong trike .
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: andrew_s on October 19, 2019, 12:40:55 pm
One of the problems I've had on long rides in the wet before is that my knees get irritated by the waterproof trousers rubbing over the top of the knee cap.
Shorts are not the same as trousers.

Trousers have a considerable length of material between ankle and knee to drag, especially when there's a bit of dampness to encourage it to stick. They also are frequently tight or fastened around the ankle to keep the end out of the chainset.
As a result, the material across the knee can be under a fair bit of tension when the knee is bent, which provides extra friction for skin irritation, and may also cause the kneecap to be dragged about in a manner that may cause eventual problems.

5 cm or so of loose material extending past the bent knee is under no tension, and is very unlikely to cause any problem.

On the other hand, as I said back in August, when the top of the knee is exposed at the top of the pedal stroke. it gets wet. At the bottom of the pedal stroke, the end of the shorts leg drops down over the wet knee, getting the inside of the shorts leg wet. It then drags up as the pedal rises, spreading the dampness up on to that part of the leg that is covered at the top of the pedal stroke, which in turn gets the inside of the shorts leg damp higher up.
Spend a long time pedaling in the rain, and the dampness spreads right up the leg.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on October 19, 2019, 03:58:56 pm

Update.

My arse.

It is dry.

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Jurek on October 19, 2019, 04:36:00 pm

Update.

My arse.

It is dry.

J
You have to tell us how....
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on October 19, 2019, 04:46:23 pm


Can someone explain the physics of how water gets from the wheel to the small bit of arse below my jacket, past this saddle bag?

J
It did with my (similar) Blackburn seatpack. My shoulder blade area still got the spray, and it trickled downwards
With some setups it doesn't even need to trickle down - you have a huge low air-pressure zone around your bum, so inevitably some water will get sucked in. The effect may even be worse at higher speeds - I haven't seen any science on the matter.
This only happens if you haven't eaten the beanz.  :D
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Zed43 on October 19, 2019, 07:21:26 pm

Update.

My arse.

It is dry.

J
You have to tell us how....
Local Warming. Spray evaporating before reaching arse. (that, or a rare case of a dry audax day in .nl)
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Kim on October 19, 2019, 07:33:36 pm
The Real answer is an up wrong trike .

Those (well, any trike without mudguards, really) are mostly a way to distribute as much water as possible onto whoever's sneaking up behind you.  (DAHIKT.)
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: canny colin on October 20, 2019, 11:19:49 am
But on a up wrong trike in  wet weather . You do get to wheel suck behind  conscientious bike riders . Who fit BFO mudguards and flaps . I do fit a front mudguard because I hate wet feet  and its cheaper and less aggro than replacing 7 speed transmission components .   
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Brucey on October 20, 2019, 11:38:13 am


(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EHOC6VAXUAARh6D.jpg)

Can someone explain the physics of how water gets from the wheel to the small bit of arse below my jacket, past this saddle bag?

J

wake vortex.

(https://www.donbur.co.uk/gb-en/images/uploads/standard-windtunnel.jpg)

you can see that some of the air is moving back towards the truck. It is this that allows people to ride a bicycle at ~150mph behind a suitable vehicle; they are literally being pushed along. It is also this which

- makes the back of vehicles dirty
- lets CO from vehicle exhausts into car cabins when the rear windows are open
- gets your arse wet, if you are throwing water into this part of the airflow

IMHO mudguards are a really good idea. Bad mudguards are not.

If you have dry bum now, what made the difference?

cheers
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: fboab on October 20, 2019, 12:28:38 pm
It didn't rain.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on October 20, 2019, 06:10:14 pm
It didn't rain.

Certainly pissed down where I was.

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Frank9755 on October 21, 2019, 10:32:59 am


(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EHOC6VAXUAARh6D.jpg)

Can someone explain the physics of how water gets from the wheel to the small bit of arse below my jacket, past this saddle bag?

J

It doesn't matter why.  It's an emprical result based on extensive testing.  That is far more useful than a theory!
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on October 21, 2019, 11:25:54 am
It doesn't matter why.  It's an emprical result based on extensive testing.  That is far more useful than a theory!

http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/C/cargo-cult-programming.html

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: phil w on October 21, 2019, 11:39:10 am


(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EHOC6VAXUAARh6D.jpg)

Can someone explain the physics of how water gets from the wheel to the small bit of arse below my jacket, past this saddle bag?

J

As well as getting flung upwards and forwards the water is also flung outwards. The further from the point where it leaves the wheel the larger the plume.  Your saddle bag being quite far from the tyre means a large plume of water and/ or mud is able to fly over the top or around your saddle bag into the low pressure behind your arse, then pulled in via the air vortices flowing into that gap. In effect your saddle bag only stops a relatively small amount of the water being picked up by your tyres and flung in your direction helped along by air pressure and currents.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: quixoticgeek on October 21, 2019, 03:21:35 pm

As well as getting flung upwards and forwards the water is also flung outwards. The further from the point where it leaves the wheel the larger the plume.  Your saddle bag being quite far from the tyre means a large plume of water and/ or mud is able to fly over the top or around your saddle bag into the low pressure behind your arse, then pulled in via the air vortices flowing into that gap. In effect your saddle bag only stops a relatively small amount of the water being picked up by your tyres and flung in your direction helped along by air pressure and currents.

Funky!

Thank you. That makes sense.

J
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Nightmare-1 on October 23, 2019, 03:50:11 pm
If you want to have a dry arse, the rear mudguard has to extend below the rear axle's level otherwise the water will get flicked off of the tyre in a forward direction (towards your arse).
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: zigzag on October 23, 2019, 04:23:48 pm
If you want to have a dry arse, the rear mudguard has to extend below the rear axle's level otherwise the water will get flicked off of the tyre in a forward direction (towards your arse).

rear mudguard extending to ten o'clock position is enough, because it sits (ideally around 1.5cm) away from a tyre and makes a vertical tangent line with it. for protection of others - it needs to end lower and have a mudflap which ends around 5cm above the ground (mudflaps like "raw" are too short, fwiw). to have a whole group of riders with the right length mudflaps is zero (unless it's a special one-off exercise), so i don't bother myself either and avoid riding in groups on wet/muddy roads.
i'm trying to think of a quickly detachable front mudflap for my hack bike, for those rare wet rides - to keep my feet and drivetrain drier/cleaner.
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: Tail End Charlie on October 23, 2019, 07:19:58 pm
If you want to have a dry arse, the rear mudguard has to extend below the rear axle's level otherwise the water will get flicked off of the tyre in a forward direction (towards your arse).

rear mudguard extending to ten o'clock position is enough

Or two o'clock from the other side!  ;)
Title: Re: Dry arse.
Post by: zigzag on October 23, 2019, 07:40:29 pm
If you want to have a dry arse, the rear mudguard has to extend below the rear axle's level otherwise the water will get flicked off of the tyre in a forward direction (towards your arse).

rear mudguard extending to ten o'clock position is enough

Or two o'clock from the other side!  ;)
if the bike is photographed from the wrong side - yes.