Yet Another Cycling Forum

Off Topic => The Pub => Food & Drink => Topic started by: mllePB on December 06, 2019, 09:21:18 pm

Title: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: mllePB on December 06, 2019, 09:21:18 pm
Some years ago we gave up on the bottle delivery and went plastic like the other 99+% of the 2000s population. In recent years we've had an arrangement with our local organic shop to deliver milk a couple of time a week as we were on the route of their veg delivery round. Unfortunately the new owners of the business have turned it vegan so we're back on lugging milk from Sainsbury's local.

So I'm toying with trying milkperson delivery again. Glass bottles appeal too,  rather than adding to the plastic mountain.

Anyone else gone back to bottles and think it's worth it?
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on December 06, 2019, 09:27:07 pm
Milk bottles delivered/ collected for over a decade here.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: andrewc on December 06, 2019, 09:36:24 pm
Being 4 floors up & behind 3 locked doors it's not really practical.   Think the parents still get deliveries but cartons rather than bottles.

Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Tewdric on December 06, 2019, 09:47:49 pm
We are just getting deliveries back here in our small Wye Valley village.  We are pretty much unanimously supporting it, including, as it does, locally sourced bread, butter,q cheese and bacon.  I am not unhappy about this! :)
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: pcolbeck on December 06, 2019, 10:04:08 pm
Never stopped here in North Yorkshire. Been getting milk deliver to the doorstep for all of the 23 years we have lived in this tiny village. Milkman gets here even when the postie and delivery drivers say they cant make it due to snow etc.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: pcolbeck on December 06, 2019, 10:05:41 pm
I have noticed that bluetits have forgotten how to peck through the foil caps and get at the milk though. When I was a kid they were always doing it now it never happens.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on December 06, 2019, 10:06:33 pm
My milk is delivered by milkandmore.co.uk, now part of Müller, three times per week.

A pint of semi-skimmed in a glass bottle is slightly more than a 2 pint plastic Sainsbury's bottle.

My milkman delivers 7 pints per week, compost for the garden and occasional 'distress' purchases, which is handy for a car-free household with a housebound inmate.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: rr on December 06, 2019, 10:32:50 pm
I have noticed that bluetits have forgotten how to peck through the foil caps and get at the milk though. When I was a kid they were always doing it now it never happens.
Once the blue tits had opened it our dog used to drink the top third of the bottle.

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Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on December 06, 2019, 11:02:04 pm
Most milk is homogenised and many now take semi-skimmed, so the tits get scant cream should they peck the tops.

Milk firms sell cool bags and milk minders which keep the tits out...
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Basil on December 06, 2019, 11:27:23 pm
We do have a bottled milk delivery here in Llandismal, but our milk consumption is so random that we can't really commit.
Luckily they supply the local (not very) supermarket so we are able to buy bottles there as and when. 
Bit of a pain having to take the empties back.  Particularly when I've forgotten several times and have to lug a large bag full.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: JennyB on December 07, 2019, 10:50:36 am
I have noticed that bluetits have forgotten how to peck through the foil caps and get at the milk though. When I was a kid they were always doing it now it never happens.


Morphic resonance (https://impossiblekisses.blogspot.com/2010/09/bluetits.html) at work? Helly's answer seems plausible, but I remember when bluetits were able to distinguish between full cream and buttermilk by the colour of the tops.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: rafletcher on December 07, 2019, 10:52:10 am
We don’t. We could I think, our neighbour does, and he’s an early bird, around 4:30. We buy 2l containers and freeze them.  Recently the thickness of the (Tesco) plastic bottles has got thinner still (no bad thing, the farm shop ones are at least double the thickness) so one or two split ones due to expansion. However milk containers are one of the most recycled of plastics, the tops being coloured recycled container plastic.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on December 07, 2019, 11:11:09 am
I have noticed that bluetits have forgotten how to peck through the foil caps and get at the milk though. When I was a kid they were always doing it now it never happens.


Morphic resonance (https://impossiblekisses.blogspot.com/2010/09/bluetits.html) at work? Helly's answer seems plausible, but I remember when bluetits were able to distinguish between full cream and buttermilk by the colour of the tops.

I suspect birds aren't too stupid. If one top is YUM and another is f*cking close to water they'll both learn by association and quite possibly pass this knowledge onto their young.
Milk deliveries were daily back then and delivered milk might have been warmer. The milkman of my childhood was still on his rounds at 4pm, after being out all day and an extended 'coffee' break with Mrs ? at #** on our street.

Our milk is now delivered between 2-3am three times per week.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on December 07, 2019, 09:12:08 pm
One of the neighbours used to. I think it was Milk & More and therefore presumably, as Helly says, plastic bottles. I can't ask the neighbour because she died last winter.  :(

There is a shop nearby that's recently installed a machine to fill your own milk bottles. You can bring your own bottle or buy a glass 1-litre bottle for £1. The milk is unhomogenised, so nice and creamy.  :) They've installed this at the request of the dairy, which is in Bruton (Somerset) but maybe there's something of that kind near you?
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on December 07, 2019, 09:50:46 pm
I have GLASS bottles from Milk and More and plastic from Sainsbury's.
(I have just checked what I posted upthread.)
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: FifeingEejit on December 07, 2019, 09:51:47 pm
Are McQueens in your area?

They seem to have expanded significantly recently well away from their St Andrews / Glasgow bases and into England.



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Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on December 07, 2019, 09:52:20 pm
Ditto, glass from M&M here too.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on December 07, 2019, 10:12:31 pm
I have GLASS bottles from Milk and More and plastic from Sainsbury's.
(I have just checked what I posted upthread.)
So you do. Sorry. Memory cells fading.  :hand:
(In fact, I thought I remembered clinking glass sounds when I occasionally used to hear the Milk & More van – only very occasionally cos it used to be around 4 a.m. – but was sure you'd mentioned plastic, so...  :facepalm:)
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: vorsprung on December 07, 2019, 10:34:58 pm
The thing about the old milk floats is that they sound like a startup

 - milk delivered to your door
 - our delivery system is electric vehicles
 - the staff work for us for peanuts
 - promoted by a viral video featuring Benny Hill

Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: T42 on December 08, 2019, 09:02:44 am
Curious system around here: folk would hang a bucket on their fence with clothes-pegs clipped on the rim to indicate the number of litres they wanted. The milk came in 1L plastic sachets rather than poured into the bucket, though.

Haven't seen that for a year or so, I guess the supermarkets have clobbered it, as with everything else.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on December 08, 2019, 10:06:42 am
I recall milk in plastic bags in Oz when I was small, along with delivery bottles. I think it is mostly supermarket plastic there now.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: JennyB on December 08, 2019, 11:04:02 am
I recall milk in plastic bags in Oz when I was small, along with delivery bottles. I think it is mostly supermarket plastic there now.


When cartons first became a thing, I remember an old man saying, "Strange people, the English. They have milk in paper bags."
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on December 08, 2019, 12:32:30 pm
Plastic sachets and a 'jug-it' jug for them were a Thing around 2010.

Discontinued after I'd bought a few jugs...
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: ian on December 08, 2019, 01:01:07 pm
I pass a Milk & More depot on my travels through the steppes of South Croydon, so I guess it's a thing even in the Big Smoke. That said, not seen anything more local. Milk delivery was a big thing when I was growing up, of course, mostly to support the 'he looks like you he does' meme used when defaming someone's parentage.

I'm not sure, to be honest, who needs so much milk. I'm sure we used to get several pints a day back then. We get a box of UHT semi-skimmed and it lasts for ages. Perhaps they bathed, like a cheaper version of Cleopatra, in gold top.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Kim on December 08, 2019, 01:04:18 pm
I'm not sure, to be honest, who needs so much milk.

It's to make the cornflakes more sexy.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: ian on December 08, 2019, 01:09:28 pm
Surely that defeats Mr Kellogg's stated purpose.

I don't like breakfast cereal on account that it's cardboard that we've somehow been cultured to eat.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: T42 on December 08, 2019, 01:17:49 pm
The 1960s Tetrapack used to explode most gratifyingly when tossed from the third floor. I suppose you could call that a doorstep delivery.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Kim on December 08, 2019, 01:18:02 pm
Surely that defeats Mr Kellogg's stated purpose.

Not if you use skimmed...   :hand:
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on December 08, 2019, 03:30:34 pm
As a kid, our household would get 4-6 pints of full-cream milk every day for parents & 5 kids.

Mum never had breakfast cereals, though everyone else did. Quite a lot of milk was used in cooking, custard and hot drinks for the grown-ups.

Mum drank up to two pints per day when I was younger and she was pregnant or feeding.

We get through a pint at breakfast time and more for our hot drinks later in the day so use about 9 pints per week.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Mr Larrington on December 08, 2019, 03:31:28 pm
Plastic sachets and a 'jug-it' jug for them were a Thing around 2010.

Discontinued after I'd bought a few jugs...

Still de rigeur in (parts of) Canada, apparently.  Not the bits of Canada I've made tea in though.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on December 08, 2019, 05:03:42 pm
Plastic sachets and a 'jug-it' jug for them were a Thing around 2010.

Discontinued after I'd bought a few jugs...
I remember those in Poland a few years earlier. Actually could have been as early as 2002. It wasn't around long, I think people found it went off quickly.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on December 08, 2019, 05:05:32 pm
Surely that defeats Mr Kellogg's stated purpose.

Not if you use skimmed...   :hand:
Skimmed milk is simply blue water in a milk bottle, and bluewater is sexy because, as every good BRITON knows, bluewater is shopping and shopping is sexier than sex. JennyB's old man was right...
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on December 08, 2019, 05:10:58 pm
The 2-pint Jug-It Pouches were available from Sainsbury's for a couple of years and then discontinued. Milk was slightly cheaper than in plastic bottles.
The milkman also supplied these, but stopped.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Butterfly on December 08, 2019, 05:15:11 pm
We get milk from McQueens dairies because milk and more don't deliver here. They don't have the range that milk and more have, and you have to be more organised than I to change your order, so I have it set at a minimum (2 pints on Mondays, 3 pints and a litre of apple juice on Thursdays) and top up with 4 pints in plastic most weeks. Milk and More required much less planning as they have an app and you can change the order up until 9 pm the night before.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Kim on December 08, 2019, 05:24:30 pm
I've just looked, and apparently Milk and More would deliver here, and do Lactofree at an appropriately steep markup.  Then I remembered it would just get nicked by BloodyStudents unless we installed some sort of high-security milk bunker.

Not that it really matters, the stuff has a long shelf life and 6 litres (reasonable maximum for fridge and pannier) will last barakta a couple of weeks.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: campagman on December 08, 2019, 06:53:07 pm
I've having a pint a week off McQueens for the last couple of months. I only use it for making milk kefir. I've not noticed any taste change over the supermarket milk I used to buy but the Mk grains love it and have been growing well which they were very reluctant to do before.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: pumpkin on December 20, 2019, 03:20:02 pm
we get 3 ltr per week but it comes in plastic bottles. Pints would come in glass but are more expensive.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on December 20, 2019, 04:05:36 pm
One pint of homogenised semi-skimmed in a glass bottle from Milk & More cost me 81p.
Two pints of homogenised semi-skimmed in a plastic bottle from Sainsbury's is 80p.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: MikeFromLFE on December 20, 2019, 04:27:17 pm
We have our semi-skimmed delivered once a fortnight by Mr Tesco along with most of the rest of our groceries
We buy the filtered own-brand Cravendale-like stuff and we've never had any go off.
I doubt there's any green difference between a Tesco van delivering to us and a dozen other households compared to us driving to the retched place, but it's so much better for my stress levels.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on December 20, 2019, 04:44:25 pm
I get a Sainsbury's grocery delivery as needed, every 5-10 days. We are car-free and online shopping reduces stress and gives me a chance to consider my purchases MUCH more carefully than in a shop.

We get 7 pints of milk delivered per week and about 2 pints of Sainsbury's milk.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: phantasmagoriana on December 20, 2019, 04:49:28 pm
No one will deliver here, because we're in a flat. I'd like to get glass bottles really, but plastic is the only stuff available - so Cravendale (or the Tesco version) it is.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on December 20, 2019, 07:51:30 pm
We seem to have cut our milk consumption almost to zero now that Mrs Cudzo has decided a growing boy needs a proper breakfast, especially in the winter, especially if he gets up early to deliver papers, rather than cornflakes or whatever the name of his second favourite cereal was.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: robgul on December 20, 2019, 08:03:48 pm
Sadly, having been a supporter of the milkman and glass bottles for about 30 years we've stopped the service . . . for a number of reasons:

1  The delivery was about 0430 and the truck rattled over the cobbles/paving in our cul de sac making a noise that was annoying to the neighbours (we sleep at the back of the house)
2  When the truck threw itself into a 3 point turn the rattling increased and the full-beam headlights blasted 4 adjacent houses, again annoying people at the ungodly hour
3  The milk used to come from a depot about a mile away (presumably shipped there in a refrigerated truck) - it now comes on the open delivery truck from the environs of Birmingham probably 20 miles away - the result, with the slightest warmth in the weather, is that the milk is on the doorstep at 0430 until about 0800 and warms up - thus going off rather faster than it should.

It's a real pity - we've moved onto plastic (although it's great fun using the steam wand on our coffee machine to heat and flatten the plastic bottles for the recycling bin)

Rob
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on December 23, 2019, 12:28:23 pm
I am disgruntled!
Milk deliveries are cancelled on Christmas Day, Boxing Day and New Year's Day. Fine, no problem, we've known months ahead.

Milk and more have sent numerous emails explaining 'cancelled' supplies would be delivered in advance, as they have done in the past. Today's delivery contained no extra milk; they've sent an email stating non-supplies will be refunded. If I did not have a good reserve supply of frozen milk I would have been without milk for Christmas, which would be horrible.

I'm all right Jack but pity those who really depend on their doorstep milk delivery.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: pumpkin on December 26, 2019, 11:20:12 am
Sadly, having been a supporter of the milkman and glass bottles for about 30 years we've stopped the service . . . for a number of reasons:

1  The delivery was about 0430 and the truck rattled over the cobbles/paving in our cul de sac making a noise that was annoying to the neighbours (we sleep at the back of the house)
2  When the truck threw itself into a 3 point turn the rattling increased and the full-beam headlights blasted 4 adjacent houses, again annoying people at the ungodly hour
3  The milk used to come from a depot about a mile away (presumably shipped there in a refrigerated truck) - it now comes on the open delivery truck from the environs of Birmingham probably 20 miles away - the result, with the slightest warmth in the weather, is that the milk is on the doorstep at 0430 until about 0800 and warms up - thus going off rather faster than it should.

It's a real pity - we've moved onto plastic (although it's great fun using the steam wand on our coffee machine to heat and flatten the plastic bottles for the recycling bin)

Rob

Neighbours, eh!. Many years ago some friends and I were on a train spotting trip in South Wales (Kidwelly). One of the older members was driving the Transit we were in but took a bend too fast and we ended up hitting a full milk float parked at the roadside and the Transit turned on its side. That really woke the neighbours!!
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on December 26, 2019, 12:01:30 pm
No use crying over...
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: drossall on December 27, 2019, 11:08:05 am
We've never stopped (in suburban North Hertfordshire) using the local dairy to deliver in the traditional way. It's changed hands a number of times, but we still do the whole glass bottles and crate-with-a-dial (to indicate the required number that day) thing.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Canardly on January 07, 2020, 12:03:09 pm
I did float this with the Mrs (See what I did there) but she was not keen as previous experiences were that of huge unreliability.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on January 07, 2020, 01:15:31 pm
I have been underwhelmed by my deliveries over the Festive Season but will continue with Milk and More for now.
The lack of extra milk on 23 December would have left me short if I hadn't always frozen some Sainsbury's supply.
The milk delivered on 27 December went sour before the date embossed on the top.
The milk delivered on 3 January had a very short date.

Hopefully, things are getting back to normal now...
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: lastant on January 07, 2020, 02:06:31 pm
Plastic sachets and a 'jug-it' jug for them were a Thing around 2010.

Discontinued after I'd bought a few jugs...

Still de rigeur in (parts of) Canada, apparently.  Not the bits of Canada I've made tea in though.

Yep, confused me no end on my first visit to the in-laws in Ontario. Still does to be honest...picking up a bag of milk just doesn't sound right!
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: mllePB on January 25, 2020, 11:09:40 am
We signed up for milk & more several weeks ago and have been filling the milk shelf of the fridge with glass milk bottles but best of all I've now discovered that they also deliver old-style silver top milk.

Milk like-it-used-to-taste, i.e. non homogenized  ;D
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: andrewc on January 25, 2020, 11:14:14 am
Have the local birdlife remembered how to peck through the tops of the bottles before you get to them ?
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on January 25, 2020, 03:43:07 pm
I think homogenisation and the trend to semi-skimmed milk have induced lack of memory.

I doubt 2% fat milk is worth the effort, unlike that nice thick cream layer, which might have had five to ten times the fat concentration.

Our milk round is currently short-staffed, with late deliveries.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: rr on January 25, 2020, 06:04:49 pm
Have the local birdlife remembered how to peck through the tops of the bottles before you get to them ?
Our dog used to finish what the birds started

[img]https://photos.app.goo.gl/qwEFSTSAnpjR7MjG7[\img]

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Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on January 26, 2020, 01:02:02 pm
We signed up for milk & more several weeks ago and have been filling the milk shelf of the fridge with glass milk bottles but best of all I've now discovered that they also deliver old-style silver top milk.

Milk like-it-used-to-taste, i.e. non homogenized  ;D
This is how I like milk too.  :thumbsup:
(Although actually I seem to have given up with milk now, not through conscious decision but just change of breakfast habits.)
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on January 26, 2020, 01:31:12 pm
The unhomogenised full-fat milk our milkman left us (I don't know if this was a genuine error or a covert sales ploy) a few months ago was gorgeous.

It cost significantly more than the usual offering and I stayed with the semi-skimmed.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: mllePB on March 21, 2020, 12:07:15 pm
Feeling very smug now for signing up to milk&more in January.
Doorstep is the perfect no contact delivery assuming desperation doesn't extend to doorstep theft.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on March 21, 2020, 12:54:59 pm
I’m sure our normal Saturday dawn delivery will turn up eventually. The M&M website was getting overwhelmed during the week. Surprised much?
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on March 21, 2020, 01:14:40 pm
Our deliveries are Monday, Wednesday, Friday.
Tried the milkandmore website earlier today to see what groceries they carried.
Crowd queueue.

Didn't wait.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: orienteer on March 21, 2020, 02:06:35 pm
Added a 2 litre bottle of milk to our weekly Riverford organic veg delivery a few months ago. Now managed to add another, along with a box of 6 eggs.

Riverford have suspended accepting new customers, they've been somewhat overwhelmed.

Managed to get some otherwise unavailable items from the two Holland & Barret shops in Uxbridge.

Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on April 08, 2020, 04:30:20 pm
Milk and More has decided to give its milk delivery staff Easter Saturday and Easter Monday off. They would have delivered Monday's milk next Wednesday. I initially ordered extra milk for Friday to supply me for Monday & Tuesday but there is not enough space in my fridge for 6 glass bottles and I can't freeze milk in glass bottles.
Amending orders on their website is a PITA so I have cancelled Friday's order and increased my Sainsbury's plastic milk order.

I feel guilty about this.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Mr Larrington on April 11, 2020, 12:30:52 pm
M&M's deliveries to Lt. Col. Larrington (retd.) are in plastic 2-pint wossnames.  My own milk consumption is low enough that a pint does me a week, but Mr Sainsbury's House Of Toothy Comestibles hasn't had pints since the Coronalurgi started and I end up pouring a pint of moo juice down the sink every week >:(
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: rafletcher on April 11, 2020, 01:27:29 pm
M&M's deliveries to Lt. Col. Larrington (retd.) are in plastic 2-pint wossnames.  My own milk consumption is low enough that a pint does me a week, but Mr Sainsbury's House Of Toothy Comestibles hasn't had pints since the Coronalurgi started and I end up pouring a pint of moo juice down the sink every week >:(

Why don’t you freeze it? A pop bottle will do. We always freeze our milk - and even unfrozen it stays palatable for a week (‘though we generally have skimmed, semi-skimmed at a pinch).
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on April 11, 2020, 05:44:39 pm
The two of us go through about 9 pints of milk per week - a pint for breakfast and the rest for drinks, custard and cooking. The fridge door holds 5 glass bottles or two-pint plastic jobs. I've decided not to feel guilty if m&m go 5 days between deliveries and I choose other supply.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: citoyen on April 12, 2020, 08:18:50 am
Is M&M delivering in glass bottles a new thing?

We used to get milk delivered in glass bottles from a local dairy (local as in less than three miles away), then they stopped selling milk (they still make the most excellent cheese though) and their delivery business was bought up by Express, so we were getting milk delivered from Canterbury instead. Then they got taken over by M&M, and suddenly our daily delivery was coming in plastic bottles from over 20 miles away, so we cancelled it.

Maybe it’s a regional thing - whether you get glass or plastic bottles may depend on who your local M&M supplier is.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on April 12, 2020, 11:48:36 pm
I have had glass bottles for the 15+ years in which I've had doorstep delivery.
Express Dairy had a local depot, which has closed. Express became milkandmore, which was sold to Mūller.

My glass bottles initially bore the Express logo, then Dairy Crest, I think. Bottles are mostly blank now.

We had 'stray' bottles from Kirby and West, who had supplied us as kids in Leicester and we frequently get Cotteswold Dairy bottles.

I suppose I'm a bottle nerd.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on April 13, 2020, 01:29:15 pm
There ought to be a word for a bottle-ologist but I don't know it.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Giropaul on April 13, 2020, 04:43:03 pm
We’ve had glass bottles for about 40 years. Originally local person, but now M&M. Faultless service. On hot days he carefully places bottles in a cool bag we leave out.
Apparently, since the virus, demand has gone through the roof. They are desperately recruiting milk deliverers. Let’s hope these new customers stay with them.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on April 13, 2020, 04:46:49 pm
At 81p per pint, I doubt this!
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: citoyen on April 13, 2020, 04:54:50 pm
Back in the day, my best friend's dad was a milkman. IIRC, he operated as a franchise, so his income was based on the size of his round. I don't suppose you would be able to make a living doing that these days.

Would be interesting to see if that changes following this crisis.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on April 13, 2020, 09:19:23 pm
The vendor of the house I own was a milkman, who retired to Poole 20 years ago. Does not look like he was struggling.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Davef on April 13, 2020, 11:46:33 pm
The price of milk in supermarkets is low at 60 ppl, considering the farm gate price of 30 ppl, and is almost certainly loss leader for other sales.


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Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: citoyen on April 16, 2020, 09:17:13 pm
M&M's deliveries to Lt. Col. Larrington (retd.) are in plastic 2-pint wossnames.  My own milk consumption is low enough that a pint does me a week, but Mr Sainsbury's House Of Toothy Comestibles hasn't had pints since the Coronalurgi started and I end up pouring a pint of moo juice down the sink every week >:(

You know, I don't remember the last time I bought an actual BRITISH pint of milk...

For those of you who still get glass bottles delivered, are the bottles still pints or have they been metricalised as well?
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on April 16, 2020, 09:27:35 pm
They are 568ml (or a pint in old-fashioned parlance).

Plastic supermarket milk comes in pints unless it's fancy or lacto-free doesn't it?

I'm sure my Sainsbury's plastic semi-skimmed, delivered today, was 2 pints.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: LittleWheelsandBig on April 16, 2020, 09:28:57 pm
I think they’re still pints but it isn’t printed on the outside.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on April 16, 2020, 09:29:50 pm
I was going to say the same as Helly. Sainsboghorror's plastic bottles of milk are in pints. OTOH Bruton Dairy and Chew Valley from local shops here are in litres. Thus clearly proving that Somerset dairy farmers are more modernly metricationised than stupormarkets.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: citoyen on April 16, 2020, 10:05:15 pm
Plastic supermarket milk comes in pints unless it's fancy or lacto-free doesn't it?

You know, I just assumed it was all sold in (whole) litres these days, but I never really pay that close attention. I checked the flagon in the fridge, which I took to be 2L, and it is labelled as "2.272L (4 pints)" - which seems like the kind of compromise that is designed to make no one happy.

We buy our milk from Aldi, so I'm slightly surprised.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on April 16, 2020, 10:20:22 pm
I think the glass bottles are embossed with 568ml above the base.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on April 17, 2020, 10:59:37 am
I wonder if it's down to the relative power of purchaser and supplier? A supermarket can say, "Bottle maker, please make us bottles in pints" whereas a smaller dairy has to take the standard sizes. Or it might be a different judgment of the mindset of the milk consumers (that supermarkets expect their customers to be pint-minded). But as the volume is usually marked on the label not the bottle (for plastic bottles) it could also be the same bottles filled to a different amount.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Mr Larrington on April 17, 2020, 12:07:26 pm
Mr Sainsbury's House Of Toothy Comestibles solved my "pouring milk down the sink" problem yesterday by having NO. FRESH. MILK. AT. ALL! >:(

Apart from a handful of bottles of unhomogenised Jersey milk which is foulness personified in tea.  I ended up with some "probiotic" semi-skilled stuff at twice the price of standard cow jus which – thankfully – does the job acceptably in my cuppa.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Paul H on April 17, 2020, 12:52:40 pm
I think it's only milk in returnable containers and draught beer which are permitted to be sold as pint units.   Seems a bit silly, when you can sell whatever quantity you want but it probably made someone happy.  I expect the supermarkets just kept it for the sake of comparison, though I doubt many people make it or even realise.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: citoyen on April 17, 2020, 01:04:54 pm
The best solution to this non-existent problem would be for the government to officially redefine the pint as a metric unit (nicely rounded to 500ml). That would properly wind up the gammonariat.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: ian on April 17, 2020, 01:10:22 pm
The best solution to this non-existent problem would be for the government to officially redefine the pint as a metric unit (nicely rounded to 500ml). That would properly wind up the gammonariat.

Or simply redefine 500 ml as the 'German pint' and mandate the serving thereof.

I picture the scene at the end of Kingsmen, where all the heads explode.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: grams on April 17, 2020, 01:20:58 pm
I think it's only milk in returnable containers and draught beer which are permitted to be sold as pint units.

The bottle of M&S Organic semi-skinned in my kühlschrank says "4 pints" on it in the same size font as litres.

It does say it second, because national humiliation etc.

I've always assumed the companies that sell milk in two litre bottles do it so they can sell you 10% less milk for the same price.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Paul H on April 17, 2020, 01:43:11 pm
I think it's only milk in returnable containers and draught beer which are permitted to be sold as pint units.

The bottle of M&S Organic semi-skinned in my kühlschrank says "4 pints" on it in the same size font as litres.

Yes, all very silly, but here's the law
https://www.gov.uk/weights-measures-and-packaging-the-law
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: hellymedic on April 17, 2020, 08:41:42 pm
I think redefining bottle sizes and scrapping existing reusable glass bottles would be the end of doorstep milk delivery.

I believe the average glass bottle is used 25 times. With about a week's turnaround time it will last half a year.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on April 17, 2020, 08:50:48 pm
If I've understood that summary of the law correctly, it would merely require the bottles to be labelled 568ml rather than 1 pint. If Helly's projection of the average life of a glass milk bottle is correct, it wouldn't be too much of a disruption to do this. Or even to start using 500ml (or 1 litre or whatever) bottles. However, I can't see any of this happening. Is anyone even asking for it?
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: drossall on April 18, 2020, 09:01:42 am
Jam still comes in 454g jars as well. One day I really am going to find a jar which only contains 453g, and complain to customer services.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on April 18, 2020, 09:26:34 am
Yeah, that's a weird one. I've just looked at the jars of jam and honey in our cupboard and they are all labelled 454g (well not all, a few are smaller) with no mention of 1lb. I guess it's just a continuation of the jar size that was available? Possibly counterintuitively, the Polish brand of jam from the polskish sklep is the only thing marked in imperial: 280g / 9.9oz. So even that's not a particularly round number.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: drossall on April 18, 2020, 09:49:17 am
Yes, that's right. But convention (at least in science) means that 454g is an assertion that there will be between 453.50 and 454.49g in the jar, so it's pretty precise - they need to get the amount of jam right to within about 0.1%, if I'm not to arrive at customer services complaining. By contrast, 1lb could mean anywhere vaguely near, and even within 10% would be hard to argue against. (All this assumes that they get it right on average of course.)

Pretty obviously, none of the marketing guys would stand for doing the obvious thing, and reducing the claimed accuracy by marking the jar 450g, because then the competition would appear to be offering an extra 4g per jar. Even though it gives the production team a massive headache getting the amounts that accurate :P ;D

Of course, they probably avoid all this by erring on the slightly generous side anyway. Maybe ;D
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: rogerzilla on April 18, 2020, 09:51:54 am
Did it for a while but (a) was difficult to exactly match supply and demand (b) was twice the price and (c) the diesel milkfloat woke me up at 4am.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: drossall on April 18, 2020, 10:03:13 am
Supply and demand is the point of the milk crate with an indicator of course. It has taken effort to train our milkman to respond to that and not just deliver a standard amount regardless of what we need. Even now I'm not sure he manages it. It's worse if someone's covering while he's on holiday.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: citoyen on April 18, 2020, 10:13:11 am
I guess it's just a continuation of the jar size that was available?

Could well be that - I mean, it's not quite 50 years since we went metric, got to give people a chance to adapt...

By contrast, 1lb could mean anywhere vaguely near

 ???

Not legally it couldn't.

Quote
Pretty obviously, none of the marketing guys would stand for doing the obvious thing, and reducing the claimed accuracy by marking the jar 450g

Not entirely sure if you're being serious here...
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: drossall on April 18, 2020, 10:44:40 am
The emoticons were an attempt to answer that question. But it's pretty dumb that the commonsense approach of marking jars as 450g is (presumably) prevented by marketing considerations.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: citoyen on April 18, 2020, 10:51:39 am
The emoticons were an attempt to answer that question.

Good, I suspected as much. Just me being a bit dense this morning!
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on April 18, 2020, 10:54:12 am
I guess it's just a continuation of the jar size that was available?

Could well be that - I mean, it's not quite 50 years since we went metric, got to give people a chance to adapt...
It's 100 years or more for Poland and they're still using 280 rather than 250 or 300. I need to find some French/German/etc stuff now and see what they do. Or for that matter USA or Liberia.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: citoyen on April 18, 2020, 11:07:48 am
It's 100 years or more for Poland and they're still using 280 rather than 250 or 300.

Maybe just because it's a nice amount of jam? Similarly, a pint of beer is a nice serving. A 500ml bottle of beer always feels a few mouthfuls short of the right amount, which is why you end up needing to open a second bottle, and then you're in trouble...

I guess the point is that using metric measurements doesn't have to mean rounding up or down to 100s or 50s. Even if milk and beer are still sold as pints, that's only on a superficial marketing level - for legal purposes, the containers are surely defined in ml.

Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on April 18, 2020, 12:11:52 pm
Even if milk and beer are still sold as pints, that's only on a superficial marketing level - for legal purposes, the containers are surely defined in ml.
Dunno. The legal stuff linked to upthread rather implied that milk and beer were exceptions and for them, the containers were indeed defined in pints. But it was only a "how to apply the law" rather than the law itself.

The bigger thing about 280g is that it does seem to be a size used in various countries including here, so there's something about it but I don't know what.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: SteveC on April 18, 2020, 01:15:29 pm
I think the legal definition of a pint is now 568ml, and not by reference to any other standard.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: citoyen on April 18, 2020, 02:52:05 pm
I think the legal definition of a pint is now 568ml, and not by reference to any other standard.
Exactly.
Title: Re: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: Paul H on April 18, 2020, 02:53:32 pm
I think the legal definition of a pint is now 568ml, and not by reference to any other standard.
Exactly.
Except for milk in returnable containers and draught beer, see earlier link.
Title: Doorstep Milk delivery
Post by: citoyen on April 18, 2020, 03:03:56 pm
I think the legal definition of a pint is now 568ml, and not by reference to any other standard.
Exactly.
Except for milk in returnable containers and draught beer, see earlier link.
But the question is how do you define a pint?

In fact, SteveC is only partially correct - a pint is defined as 1/8 of a gallon, but a gallon is defined as 4.54609 litres.

(Until 1976 a gallon was defined as the volume of 10lb of water at 62F.)