Yet Another Cycling Forum

General Category => The Knowledge => Camping It Up => Topic started by: Charlotte on July 12, 2010, 04:09:06 pm

Title: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 12, 2010, 04:09:06 pm
I haz maded one  :D

(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b187/vicechair/fdb2d30f.jpg)
(Photo by Annie)

Frustrated by the "no campfires" rule at most sites I've been to, but unable to sensibly carry a barbecue, I decided that I wanted to build something that would still allow me to cook on a wood fire.

Technically, this is a Top-Lit Downdraft Wood Gasification stove.  If you're interested in the theory of how it works, there's a lot of information out there about the different designs.

(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b187/vicechair/7c7cfdfe.jpg)

I tested it out on the WARTY this weekend and it was a complete success.  Should you feel like building one, I have blogged (http://bicycleslut.wordpress.com/2010/07/12/my-first-diy-woodburning-camp-stove/) about it.

Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Zipperhead on July 12, 2010, 04:18:44 pm
Excellent, but if Jonathan makes one, will it still be a camp stove?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on July 12, 2010, 04:19:58 pm
I feel a trip to Wilkos coming on...
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 12, 2010, 04:22:46 pm
Excellent, but if Jonathan makes one, will it still be a camp stove?

I don't see a problem with it being a butch stove if he prefers...
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: andygates on July 12, 2010, 07:28:25 pm
More rivets. Very butch!

Nice bit of work, that.  Your burny ingenuity continues apace.  When will you start running lighting mantles from sleeping-bag farts?  :)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Adrian on July 12, 2010, 08:08:53 pm
I haz maded one  :D


Nice one.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Pedaldog on July 12, 2010, 08:29:20 pm
That is wunnerful innit!  I iz going to be having a go at that in the not too distant future.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wobbly John on July 12, 2010, 11:24:05 pm
Want!  :D

Another project for the list.

Are the feet really needed? Are they just to stop it scorching the ground?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Pedaldog on July 12, 2010, 11:42:35 pm
Want!  :D

Another project for the list.

Are the feet really needed? Are they just to stop it scorching the ground?

Which end will you put the Castors on Wobbleski?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: CrinklyLion on July 12, 2010, 11:46:32 pm
I think that the fire-making-device was probably the deciding factor for CrinklyCub who is, I suspect, now somewhat besotted with Charlotte.  Rides a bike? Tick!  Owns a tandem? Tick! Likes camping?  Tick!  Likes Setting Fire to Stuff?  Gigantic tick!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on July 12, 2010, 11:51:03 pm
Well, you can't really argue with those criteria...
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Jaded on July 13, 2010, 12:55:16 am
I had a gigantic tick once.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Pedaldog on July 13, 2010, 01:03:49 am
You can get Crean=m to help with that....... Allegedly!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: TimO on July 13, 2010, 01:15:12 am
I'm actually going to have to bring a rocket next time, to compete with that, aren't I. ;D
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Oscar's dad on July 13, 2010, 01:32:11 am
Charlotte, that is what is commonly known as "fooking clever".  Once you have perfected your design how much would you charge if I asked you to make me one?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 13, 2010, 08:31:51 am
Want!  :D

Another project for the list.

Are the feet really needed? Are they just to stop it scorching the ground?

The feet are there to make the whole caboodle more stable.  Nine times out of ten, this will be set up on uneven ground.  Three feet makes it self-leveling and means that a pan of boiling water won't topple it over.  Thinnish bolts mean that if it's still unstable, you can push it into the ground.

When the ground is hard, even two hours burning won't scorch the grass.

Charlotte, that is what is commonly known as "fooking clever".  Once you have perfected your design how much would you charge if I asked you to make me one?

I'm afraid I'm not for hire.  Making it was surprisingly labour-intensive.  I started at about two in the afternoon and wasn't finished until at least six.  Fair enough, I'll be faster the next time I make one, but drilling stainless is a massive pig and takes ages.  Simillarly, snipping and folding it all took time and effort.

What I can do is to offer limitless help if you want to make your own.  Or, at such time as I ever get round to making a MkII (maybe later this summer, I don't know), I'll happily give you first refusal on this one.  How's that?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Oscar's dad on July 13, 2010, 08:49:39 am
Sounds fair  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: andygates on July 13, 2010, 01:21:08 pm
Your next challenge: build a Grilliput!

http://aswatersportsequipment.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=38_115&products_id=776
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: bikenerd on July 13, 2010, 01:28:02 pm
These things are awesome - I first became awayre of them through the charities that provide them to the developing world.

Does anyone know if anyone is making these commercially as either an alternative to a wood burning stove in a house (to heat a room) or a garden heater (to heat the proximity and cook food on) to replace a chiminea and barbeque?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on July 13, 2010, 01:30:37 pm
These things are awesome - I first became awayre of them through the charities that provide them to the developing world.

Does anyone know if anyone is making these commercially as either an alternative to a wood burning stove in a house (to heat a room) or a garden heater (to heat the proximity and cook food on) to replace a chiminea and barbeque?
The more advanced wood-burning stoves already use the gassification techniques.  The air intake and stoves are shaped so that the gas given off burns in the main chamber.

The better ones in Australia have been like this for a long time - with a large glass window in the front, you can see a 'flame roll' burning well above the wood. Quite fascinating to watch.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 13, 2010, 01:35:35 pm
The best commercial version of a larger, super-efficient outdoor cooking stove I've found is this:

Rocket stoves | Wild Stoves - Effective outdoor cooking on wood (http://wildstoves.co.uk/rocket-stoves/)

Were it not for the fact that I'd rather make one to my own specifications, I'd be tempted to pick one up for the garden.  It's not a gasification design, though.  Just very high temperature pyrolysis...
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: mark on July 13, 2010, 01:36:36 pm
These things are awesome - I first became awayre of them through the charities that provide them to the developing world.

Does anyone know if anyone is making these commercially as either an alternative to a wood burning stove in a house (to heat a room) or a garden heater (to heat the proximity and cook food on) to replace a chiminea and barbeque?


ZZSTOVE - HOME of the SIERRA and SIERRA TITANIUM STOVES
 (http://www.zzstove.com/)

Home (http://www.kellykettle.com/)

Not sure if either one is big enough for what you want. I remember seeing a zzstove years ago, it was more of a one person campstove.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 13, 2010, 01:46:35 pm
Updraft gasification stoves like that are awesomely powerful - they're effectively a very small fire with someone continuously blowing on it.  Problem is, you need a fan to do the blowing.  That means that:

a) You need to feed it batteries (albeit the latest ones can spin out a set of AAs for hours and hours)
b) If the fan packs up in the middle of nowhere, you've got yourself a very small and not very useful firebucket.

My feeling on the matter is that anything which introduces what is likely to be a modified computer fan to a small fire ain't going to last that long when used the way it's intended.  Passive stoves like mine are an order of magnitude more elegant and reliable - all you need are twigs and some way of setting fire to them.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: mark on July 13, 2010, 02:21:54 pm
Fair enough, your stove is impressive and i enjoyed reading the blog. Not too many of us own a drill press, though, and not too many of us seem to have the metal working skills that you have. Any chance that you'll go commercial with your design?

Batteries could be an issue, although I would guess that a pair of lithium AAs would give a fair bit of cooking time.

FWIW, I first saw the ZZip stove in a shop in the mid 80s. I've never seen one since, but apparently they've sold enough of them to stay in business for 20+ years, so their just might be something to them.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: cyclone on July 13, 2010, 02:44:58 pm
Impressive skills! Well done  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on July 13, 2010, 05:58:25 pm
I know from tedious experience that you can get high-temperature muffin fans if you search hard enough, but they tend to be mains-powered, and therefore even sillier.

I think the KISS principle wins on something like this.  If you're going to be reliant on electrical gubbins, you might as well rely on gas cartridges or meths, which have the advantage of still working when the wood's wet/hard to find.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: ScumOfTheRoad on July 13, 2010, 06:05:37 pm
Why do you need batteries?
You have a bicycle with a dynamo, no?

Actually, I was rather thinking of the wind-up torches - surely one of them could drive a fan if you connected it up?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: TimO on July 13, 2010, 06:44:14 pm
I would think for a fan driven stove, the battery is the easy and relatively reliable bit.  The fan itself is what is going to be unreliable, and fail.

You could probably power the fan with a small thermocouple arrangement, but I suspect you could also just have a small hand powered mechanical fan, or directly mechanically linked to a bike drive mechanism.  I wonder if there would be enough oomph in a small wind up clockwork motor?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Zoidburg on July 13, 2010, 08:43:13 pm
I would use a set of foot driven bellows.

Just like any village workshop in the developing world.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Butterfly on July 13, 2010, 08:53:20 pm
Next stop - the Fell Club ;D
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: TimO on July 13, 2010, 09:15:28 pm
I would use a set of foot driven bellows.

Just like any village workshop in the developing world.

Bit bulky though, for a portable camping stove.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Zoidburg on July 13, 2010, 09:17:06 pm
Not really, I am sure you could make up a concertina design thats packs flat made from modern materials, it doesnt even have to be that large, this is small scale stuff.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: nuttycyclist on July 14, 2010, 12:07:01 am
Drill press?  Check.

Scrap metal?  Possibly.

Fettling skillz?  I haz my opinions.



To the workshops Igor!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Oscar's dad on July 14, 2010, 07:38:41 am
Well done Nuts. So not only will you require an ambulance but the Fire Brigade too. Can't you come up with a project that will require the attendance of all the emergency services?  We don't want the police and AA feeling left out.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: pcolbeck on July 14, 2010, 08:24:05 am
These things are awesome - I first became awayre of them through the charities that provide them to the developing world.

Does anyone know if anyone is making these commercially as either an alternative to a wood burning stove in a house (to heat a room) or a garden heater (to heat the proximity and cook food on) to replace a chiminea and barbeque?

For a house I think the Dunsley Yorkshire Stove (http://www.dunsleyheat.co.uk/yorkshirestove.htm) works on a similar principle:

(http://www.dunsleyheat.co.uk/images/yorkdiag.gif)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: nuttycyclist on July 14, 2010, 09:57:05 am
Well done Nuts. So not only will you require an ambulance but the Fire Brigade too. Can't you come up with a project that will require the attendance of all the emergency services?  We don't want the police and AA feeling left out.

Fit woodburner to home built steam carriage for journey to work?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Oscar's dad on July 14, 2010, 10:43:45 am
Something like that. 

Haven't you got a Windcheeter?  Take off the chainset / cranks and attach a firebox to the boom between your legs.  The engine bit behind you on the rear rack.  What could possibly go wrong?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: tom_e on July 14, 2010, 11:04:00 am
Visions of nutty steaming down the road (grabbing sticks as he goes), funnel rising up behind him, steam whistle "wheeee wheeee" in place of airzound, trailer getting heavier as passers-by leap aboard....
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: nuttycyclist on July 14, 2010, 11:39:08 am
.....
I tested it out on the WARTY this weekend and it was a complete success.  Should you feel like building one, I have blogged (http://bicycleslut.wordpress.com/2010/07/12/my-first-diy-woodburning-camp-stove/) about it.



More photos please?  (Showing each part and how it is drilled)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kathy on July 14, 2010, 11:42:25 am
Well done Nuts. So not only will you require an ambulance but the Fire Brigade too. Can't you come up with a project that will require the attendance of all the emergency services?  We don't want the police and AA feeling left out.

AA? What about the Coastguards and Mountain Rescue?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 14, 2010, 11:48:15 am
More photos please?  (Showing each part and how it is drilled)

I'll try and take some more tonight for you, Nutty  :-*
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Oscar's dad on July 14, 2010, 12:27:34 pm
Well done Nuts. So not only will you require an ambulance but the Fire Brigade too. Can't you come up with a project that will require the attendance of all the emergency services?  We don't want the police and AA feeling left out.

AA? What about the Coastguards and Mountain Rescue?

The AA did call themselves "the 4th Emergency Service".  I'm not sure that Alcoholics Anonymous have much to offer in this instance.  If Nutty was thinking of using a meths burner they might suddenly become interested.

There is an Essex Mountain Rescue Facebook group so I will alert them.  As Nutty lives by the sea we had better have the Coastguard on standby.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: PhilO on July 14, 2010, 01:10:08 pm
Nice work, Charlotte!  :thumbsup:

Of course, for real minimalism, you should just carry your knife, and fashion one from tin cans found at the side of the road... A friend recently built one based on this design (http://www.bushcraftstuff.com/tutorials/how-to-make-a-hobo-stove-from-tin-cans/) and reckons it worked quite well. I haven't seen it running yet, though.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: hatler on July 14, 2010, 01:12:17 pm
Well done Nuts. So not only will you require an ambulance but the Fire Brigade too. Can't you come up with a project that will require the attendance of all the emergency services?  We don't want the police and AA feeling left out.
Ahem.

Despite their ludicrous advert claims, I'd rather think of the Coastguard and Mountain Rescue as the 4th and 5th emergency services.

Now, Nutty, getting all of them out in one go truly would be an achievement.

Perhaps climbing up the White Cliffs of Dover whilst carrying a lit camping stove ?

Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: TimO on July 14, 2010, 03:03:33 pm
Despite their ludicrous advert claims, I'd rather think of the Coastguard and Mountain Rescue as the 4th and 5th emergency services.

The Coastguard are certainly allowed to use blue flashing lights, although I'm not sure about the Mountain Rescue bods.

The AA are stuck with flashing amber, the same as used by anyone else who vaguely feels like turning on such, eg rubbish trucks driving perfectly normally along roads at 30mph, who feel the need to warn you that they are about. :-\
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wowbagger on July 14, 2010, 04:16:07 pm
Well done Nuts. So not only will you require an ambulance but the Fire Brigade too. Can't you come up with a project that will require the attendance of all the emergency services?  We don't want the police and AA feeling left out.
Ahem.

Despite their ludicrous advert claims, I'd rather think of the Coastguard and Mountain Rescue as the 4th and 5th emergency services.

Now, Nutty, getting all of them out in one go truly would be an achievement.

Perhaps climbing up the White Cliffs of Dover whilst carrying a lit camping stove ?

To be fair, IIRC the AA advertisement states that "to our members we are the 4th emergency service. Which begs two questions. Is the AA in question Alcoholics Anonymous? And if not, does it not say a good deal about the horizons of that particular brand of homo sapiens that joins the Automobile Association and then spends the greater part of its curtailed, wheezing life behind the wheel of its 4 * 4?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wobbly John on July 14, 2010, 04:37:59 pm
Coffee sugar & biscuit tins purchased (£2.12 - I has staff discount card  ;) ).  :thumbsup:

I think I'll make some jigs up at work to aid with the drilling, in case I want to make more and also, because I can.  :P

Looking forward to pics of coffee tin drilled base, Charlotte.  :-*
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Oscar's dad on July 14, 2010, 05:02:58 pm
Coffee sugar & biscuit tins purchased (£2.12 - I has staff discount card  ;) ).  :thumbsup:

I think I'll make some jigs up at work to aid with the drilling, in case I want to make more and also, because I can.  :P

Looking forward to pics of coffee tin drilled base, Charlotte.  :-*

I think there is a market for these things.  As already stated I'd buy one assuming it was reasonably priced.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 14, 2010, 10:23:44 pm
As requested, chaps:

(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b187/vicechair/Stoves/b2e83b32.jpg)

More on my blog (http://bicycleslut.wordpress.com/2010/07/14/more-stove-pics/)  :)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: andygates on July 15, 2010, 01:28:56 pm
You're just addicted to polishing the paint off product tins!

You are Naomi Klein AICMFP.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 15, 2010, 01:33:06 pm
No logos removed at all; that's how they come.  I didn't ever take the sticker off the bottom!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 15, 2010, 04:50:24 pm
Just been told about this:

http://biolitestove.com

Clearly, I'm behind the curve  :o
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: TimO on July 15, 2010, 05:29:58 pm
Using thermocouples with stoves isn't exactly novel.  They've certainly been used in the past, basically chuck a lump of thermocouples into a fire, and use the resultant power.

This is the first time I've seen such a thing almost commercially available though, and it would be rather neat to be able to charge up your phone or GPS whilst making your tea.  I do suspect that the efficiency isn't very good, so it may not be a practical (or particularly cheap) way of producing electricity.  It may be easier to plug things into a hub dynamo, and do a couple of turns around the block.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: dkahn400 on July 15, 2010, 06:20:21 pm
Want!  :D

Another project for the list.

Are the feet really needed? Are they just to stop it scorching the ground?

For a moment there I thought you meant Charlotte's feet, which have multiple uses.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Adrian on July 15, 2010, 08:14:10 pm
Just been told about this:

http://biolitestove.com

Clearly, I'm behind the curve  :o

You're just sold on the music for the 60 second demo
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 15, 2010, 08:30:25 pm
Needed Quicktime, so didn't watch it...
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Gruff on July 15, 2010, 08:47:52 pm
Needed Quicktime, so didn't watch it...

The demo's available on youtube:


      YouTube
            - BioLite Camp Stove Demonstration
    (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmHCIBvI6vE)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: TimO on July 15, 2010, 09:09:48 pm
Interesting watching it in use, and hearing the fan whirring away.

It does occur to me, that one of the problems with this sort of stove (Charlotte's included), is that it's reliant on a predictably dry climate.  I've had plenty of camping experiences where dry wood would not be trivially easily found, due to some degree of precipitation prior to setting up camp.

Getting wet wood to burn in one of these stoves is undoubtedly possible, but I suspect it would require a significant amount of dry combustibles initially.

I guess if the weather is dry, and you know it's going to stay dry, then it's a useful solution.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on July 15, 2010, 09:13:51 pm
Wouldn't be hard to stick a meths burner inside it when necessary, but yeah.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 15, 2010, 09:14:04 pm
Needed Quicktime, so didn't watch it...

The demo's available on youtube:


      YouTube
            - BioLite Camp Stove Demonstration
    (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmHCIBvI6vE)

Now THAT is clever  :thumbsup:


Tim - what you're saying is true, but stoves like this use a very small quantity of fuel indeed.  You can either pick stuff up as you walk/cycle and store it in your bag for the evening's cooking or, and this would be my preferred solution, go looking for dead and dry twigs in the branches of trees.

I've already noticed that even when it's been pissing with rain and all the wood on the floor is sodden, the dead stuff caught up in the branches of trees is fine.

Last ditch solution: pack a white box stove or simillar and a bottle of alcohol.  Even better - bring vodka instead of fuel.  That way, you'll have to be really sure there's no combustible wood before you burn your booze!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: clarion on July 15, 2010, 09:16:29 pm
I :heart: Appropriate Technology
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on July 16, 2010, 11:33:14 am
The swedish army use the thermocouples - there is a system that goes round a trangia. Peltier devices work better when there is a good temp gradient, so are ideal for really cold weather conditions.

As for wet weather and fuel - if you are in a forest, its usually possible to find some dry stuff. Old pine cones burn well once they catch. Dry branches still on a tree are fine - you do need a knife to fuzz them (which is a good excuse for buying a strong sheafknife - I use a mini GB axe).
   
Cotton wool is a good starter - daughter and I even managed to start a fire in the rain with a flint and steel on cotton wool (couldn't manage it with just bark and stuff).
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: nuttycyclist on July 16, 2010, 09:30:56 pm
Drill press?  Check.

Scrap metal?  Possibly.

Fettling skillz?  I haz my opinions.



To the workshops Igor!

I have found a small metal pedal bin in the garage  :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wobbly John on July 20, 2010, 10:24:16 pm
Made one of these today.

It wasn't as easy as I expected.  >:(

Burnt out a tank-cutter blade trying to cut the big hole in the lid.   :(

Cutting it out with an oxyacetylene torch was not a good idea - but fun.  :demon:

It's not as neat as Charlotte's - she really is a wiz in the workshop for a gurl.  ;)

It certainly brewed me a half pint mug of tea using a fraction of the fuel that a campfire would.  :D

(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y252/wobblyjohn/stove2.jpg)

(http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y252/wobblyjohn/stove3.jpg)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Tim Hall on July 20, 2010, 10:29:53 pm
Nice work there WJ.

Assuming I still have a job next week, I'll see if the Gert Big Hydraulic Stamping Out Machine (http://www.kingsland.com/multi_range.htm) in the factory can fit a Wilkos bickie barrel.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 20, 2010, 10:48:40 pm
It's not as neat as Charlotte's - she really is a wiz in the workshop for a gurl.  ;)

for a gurl I deliver a fine roundhouse kick too  :demon:

Nice work there, Wobbles.  Wascally Weasel is building one to the same design, too.  We ought to have a cook-off at Dunwich.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wowbagger on July 20, 2010, 10:50:33 pm
It's not as neat as Charlotte's - she really is a wiz in the workshop for a gurl.  ;)

for a gurl I deliver a fine roundhouse kick too  :demon:

Nice work there, Wobbles.  Wascally Weasel is building one to the same design, too.  We ought to have a cook-off at Dunwich.

Three course meal, obviously.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wascally Weasel on July 20, 2010, 11:47:02 pm
Oh crap, I'm scared.  Not only are my (crap) engineering skillz being called in to question, I have to back up the end result with a cook-off  (Thinks, adds chilli powder, nutmeg and retires).

All joking aside, I can't think of a project that has got me as excited as this in a long time (and I don't think I'm alone) - having seen the Mk 1 in action, I'm ridiculously excited to be giving the Mk 1A version a go (almost as much as Guderian was to see how the early Panzers performed in France following the poor show in Austria).  There you go.  A technical thread auto-Godwined.  I will be very happy to share my thoughts and experiences with all, post build attempt.  If it goes well I promise not to invade France, at least not in a non consensual way (I do have a toy Marmot that a friend has left hung up in the hall with a 'Collaborateur' tag round it's neck but I think this may need a little historical revisionism (both now and about in 20 years).

For me it says freedom and a lot of great future wild camping experiences (unless I royally fuck up, in which case it says great expense for lots of drilling bits).  Ultimately, the build and the end result will be cool.  I'm still stoked over the sword rack I built about five years ago from an old futon frame.  I'm easily pleased.

Thing is, due to the attitude to camping of my older relatives I have only ever wild-camped.  I have never camped on a camp site and even the concept seems odd to me (I don't mean so because I'm an experienced camper, more that I'm not used to camp sites with amenities (of course you crap in the woods).

So for me, this thing is a mini camp fire that I can have in a more straight lacey camp site that I would have otherwise avoided.  My view has always been, if there's no fire it isn't camping.

 
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: vorsprung on July 21, 2010, 09:14:51 am
I have been to Wilkos and have the tins
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 21, 2010, 09:49:28 am
Three course meal, obviously.

Baggsie I get to make the bananananana custard  :D

I have been to Wilkos and have the tins

I ought to get a commission  ;D
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wowbagger on July 21, 2010, 09:52:05 am
I can hang my head in shame and bring along a wood burning stove which was constructed by a friend of the last US president.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: clarion on July 21, 2010, 09:52:39 am
Three course meal, obviously.

Baggsie I get to make the bananananana custard  :D

Will your cohab have posed for a photo with the banananana and a glass-topped table?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wobbly John on July 21, 2010, 11:31:53 am
We ought to have a cook-off at Dunwich.

Chalotte's Cool Camp-stove Cook-off, featuring Wobble's, Wascally Weasel's & Wowbagger's Wonderful Wilkinsons Woodburners.  ;D
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Regulator on July 21, 2010, 01:15:21 pm
Despite their ludicrous advert claims, I'd rather think of the Coastguard and Mountain Rescue as the 4th and 5th emergency services.

The Coastguard are certainly allowed to use blue flashing lights, although I'm not sure about the Mountain Rescue bods.

The AA are stuck with flashing amber, the same as used by anyone else who vaguely feels like turning on such, eg rubbish trucks driving perfectly normally along roads at 30mph, who feel the need to warn you that they are about. :-\

On the telly programme I watched recently, the Mountain Rescue team's vehicle had blue lights.  I think they have the same sort of legal status as private ambulances.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wascally Weasel on July 22, 2010, 07:39:32 am
Mine is built, after some helpful advice and loaned use of a rather impressive array of tools.

Charlotte's right about how many drill bits you get through and I would echo what WJ said about Charlotte's skills, as mine is also a lot less neater.

Still, it works as I discovered late last night  :thumbsup:

Lit first time with one match (it was dry and not windy which helped).

In honour of it's humble origins, I'm calling it a FireBiscuit.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 22, 2010, 08:58:26 am
(http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b187/vicechair/Stoves/2ef12183.jpg)

Nice job there, Iain.  Looking forward to seeing it fired up  :D
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: clarion on July 22, 2010, 09:02:33 am
Tremendous piece of work

*far more likely to buy one than build :-[ *
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Gruff on July 22, 2010, 12:34:04 pm
Charlotte's right about how many drill bits you get through

You may be using too high a speed.

You want medium/slow speed on the drill, and plenty of pressure. Cutting oil will help too.

If you attack stainless with a high speed, the drill bit will quuickly overheat and the cutting edge will be destroyed instantly. You're then basically left drilling holes with a nail.

You should always see a nice neat little curl of swarf rising out of the hole when drilling stainless, that shows you are cutting metal. No swarf exiting can mean your drill bit is just spinning instead of biting, which will build heat and bugger the bit.

The stove looks great, nice work!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wowbagger on July 22, 2010, 12:42:03 pm
We ought to have a cook-off at Dunwich.

Chalotte's Cool Camp-stove Cook-off, featuring Wobble's, Wascally Weasel's & Wowbagger's Wonderful Wilkinsons Woodburners.  ;D

Sadly, I can claim no credit for the construction of mine: as my previous post was meant to indicate, it's a Bush Buddy.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 22, 2010, 04:47:07 pm
If you attack stainless with a high speed, the drill bit will quuickly overheat and the cutting edge will be destroyed instantly. You're then basically left drilling holes with a nail.

You should always see a nice neat little curl of swarf rising out of the hole when drilling stainless, that shows you are cutting metal. No swarf exiting can mean your drill bit is just spinning instead of biting, which will build heat and bugger the bit.

Yeah, it's a bugger of a job alright.  I've worked with stainless on lathes and milling machines and it's easier to run slowly on them (as well as to set up a recycled stream of coolant/lubricant).  My little drill press is somewhat less refined.  Although it's still possible, I'll grant you.

Also, I suspect that the grade of stainless used by whoever makes these things for Wilcos doesn't help.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: dkahn400 on July 22, 2010, 04:54:22 pm
Tremendous piece of work

*far more likely to buy one than build :-[ *

Yes, it looks most impressive. I'd love to have a go at one but I don't think I'd have much chance with a hand held Black & Decker and a selection of already totally knackered drill bits.

Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wobbly John on July 22, 2010, 06:00:13 pm
I didn't break or blunt any drill bits in making mine.  ???

Apart from when I tried using a tank cutter to do the lid.  :facepalm:

I think we must be running the drill presses slower than Charlotte.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Chris S on July 22, 2010, 06:16:43 pm
I've found a rather handy accessory that will make you the envy of any campsite.


      YouTube
            - stirling engine mobile charger
    (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EEv2mwEQGik)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: clarion on July 22, 2010, 09:28:09 pm
I love Stirling engines.  Ever since I saw Adam Hart-Davis playing with one.  But surely this is the camoing version (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqmeYc8GWmA&feature=related) ;)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: TimO on July 22, 2010, 10:33:10 pm
Now this is rocket science, Stirling engines are being considered to be used on some space missions to replace RTGs (Radio-isotopic Thermoelectric Generators).

They're more efficient than thermocouples at generating electricity, but produce a lot more vibration, which means that they aren't a good idea on something like an orbiting observatory, but are useful on manned spacecraft which already have a lot of vibration (from people!)

One place where NASA was considering using them was on a next generation version of the Lunar Rover, which would have had 6 wheels instead of 4, and could be driven remotely from Earth as a teleoperated device when not being driven around by an astronaut.

So, they would be a sensible choice for a camp fire powered generator, could one be built small and lightweight enough.

OT ramble:  The original Lunar Rovers cost $38 million dollars to develop, and travelled just over 56 miles in total, so that works out at around $677000 per mile, which makes the running costs of my Corsa seem quite reasonable. ;D
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 28, 2010, 10:19:45 am
Update - the stove really does gassify rather than burn.  Here's what I emptied out of it at Dunwich after I'd cooked my dinner:

(http://lh4.ggpht.com/_Ua9XvuIKzVk/TE9QXO98N9I/AAAAAAAABK0/hkxORMy_W1Q/s800/DSC_0201.JPG)

Mrs Pike knows charcoal when she sees it:

(http://lh3.ggpht.com/_Ua9XvuIKzVk/TE9RykBhtRI/AAAAAAAABR0/qQEeURytAnk/s800/DSC_0565.JPG)

(http://lh4.ggpht.com/_Ua9XvuIKzVk/TE9RxbYveyI/AAAAAAAABRw/LlTw2TFXE80/s800/DSC_0564.JPG)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on July 28, 2010, 10:26:49 am
Now that you're officially a charcoal burner, you need an adder! (as in Swallows and Amazons).
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Tim Hall on July 28, 2010, 02:06:03 pm
The key question is will Charlotte be Susan or Titty?


(Mind you I've always seen her more in the Nancy role)


And in other news: Went to Wilko's today. A transaction was carried out. Let the drilling begin.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on July 28, 2010, 02:08:53 pm
Nancy Blackett, definitely.

Aaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgh!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: clarion on July 28, 2010, 02:13:17 pm
I always saw Regulator as a nancy...
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on July 28, 2010, 02:39:29 pm
Turns out Nancy is the only one to have her own Wikipedia page. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nancy_Blackett_%28character%29
Quote
Nancy is sometimes critically viewed as a subversive character for girl readers, suggesting an alternative choice to feminine domesticity, and one commentator obliquely hinted Nancy would have fulfilled a lesbian destiny.
Hmm
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: andygates on July 28, 2010, 09:06:56 pm
Wood burners, I notice, mean that all my kit smells all campfirey and nice.   :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wascally Weasel on July 29, 2010, 12:48:17 am
Turns out Nancy is the only one to have her own Wikipedia page. Nancy Blackett (character) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nancy_Blackett_%28character%29)
Quote
Nancy is sometimes critically viewed as a subversive character for girl readers, suggesting an alternative choice to feminine domesticity, and one commentator obliquely hinted Nancy would have fulfilled a lesbian destiny.
Hmm

Nancy Blackett is one of the coolest female child/teenage characters in fiction.  When I don't grow up I want to be just like her.

This bit from the end of the wiki article says it all for me:

"Today, Nancy is viewed as a subversive figure who, in the context of interwar Britain, offered young girls the possibility of an alternative route to adulthood. The character has been cited by feminist author and academic Sara Maitland  as a childhood role model "who transcended the restriction of femininity without succumbing to the lure of male-identification" and a "hero who had all the characteristics necessary for the job; who lived between the countries of the material and the imaginary".

There are some odd bits here and there in the Ransome books but the invention of Nancy Blackett forgives all faults IMHO.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wascally Weasel on July 29, 2010, 01:15:02 am
Wood burners, I notice, mean that all my kit smells all campfirey and nice.   :thumbsup:

On balance I think the portable campfireness is the major plus for me (against the slower than gas or meths cook time).  It would feel wrong to go home from a camp without that smell.  Smells like victory the outdoors should.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on July 29, 2010, 01:41:20 am
It would feel wrong to go home from a camp without that smell.  Smells like victory the outdoors should.

On balance I'm inclined to agree.  Not all that good for my Stupid Lungs thobut, so perhaps not entirely sensible for cycle touring when the wind can't be relied on to blow in a consistent direction.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Tim Hall on July 29, 2010, 07:39:39 am


Nancy Blackett is one of the coolest female child/teenage characters in fiction.  When I don't grow up I want to be just like her.


With this is mind, do you see the phrase "Prize galoot" replacing "donkey felching cock womble" in the lexicon of the cyclist-about-town?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wowbagger on July 29, 2010, 08:26:04 am


Nancy Blackett is one of the coolest female child/teenage characters in fiction.  When I don't grow up I want to be just like her.


With this is mind, do you see the phrase "Prize galoot" replacing "donkey felching cock womble" in the lexicon of the cyclist-about-town?

POTD!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: clarion on July 29, 2010, 08:58:59 am
Ransome was a red under the bed.  He incorporated his vision of socialist fulfilment into the freedom of discovery exercised by the children, and his belief in gender equality very strikingly in Nancy Blackett.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Oscar's dad on July 29, 2010, 09:30:58 am
Whilst on holiday in the Lakes earlier this year we took a boat trip on Coniston.  We sailed past the end of the field which was supposed to be the setting for the scene at the beginning of Swallows and Amazons where the children run "tacking" down the field towards the lake.

I just thought I would throw that in. As you were  :-*

PS: challenge for the day, let's see if someone can find the clip on You Tube.  You've got 30 mnutes starting now.  Don't phone in, it's just for fun.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: andygates on July 29, 2010, 10:41:04 am
Question: Since Charlotte's stove was gasifying and Weasel's one was behaving a tad more like a fire bucket, was there a noticeable difference in cooking power?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 29, 2010, 10:51:30 am
I don't know, that's a good question.  I was boiling kettle after kettle of water, no problem. 
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wascally Weasel on July 29, 2010, 11:03:23 am
I think I had less cooking power for sure, it took me about the same length of time as Charlotte to boil our kettle the first time but I started before her and was boiling less water I think.

I think the issue is probably in the seal at the top.  Charlottes version is sealed quite neatly while mine suffered from more inept tinsnippery and fitting.  I think I could probably do a better job of sealing those gaps than I originally tried and will see if that makes a difference.

I think it’s worth trying that because otherwise the only difference between the two stoves is the size of the bottom row of holes in the outer can, which I think were 8mm on mine and 11mm on Charlotte’s – I think the poor seal is the issue though, still I was very happy to have it working but a bit ashamed that the first thing I did with it (other than the cup of tea I made the Thursday before when trying it out) was to make a pot noodle.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on July 29, 2010, 11:11:26 am
High-temp silicone is your friend.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 29, 2010, 11:15:04 am
JB Weld, in fact.  Did you seal it, WW?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Polar Bear on July 29, 2010, 11:17:53 am
I am absolutely no expert on this but...

When I look at the pictures comparing the two stoves, Charlotte's seems to have no obstructions behind any of the holes, top inner or bottom outer.   WW's appears from the piccie to me to have some obstructions.   If this is the case I would imagine that this reduces airflow significantly perhaps contributing to the way the wood burns.   

 
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wascally Weasel on July 29, 2010, 11:18:55 am
JB Weld, in fact.  Did you seal it, WW?

Partly but evidently not enough.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wobbly John on July 29, 2010, 11:21:22 am
Mine seems to alternate between gasification and fire bucket. I end up with powdery white ash after use.

The jet holes are smaller on mine (3.5mm) on the basis that it was a adaption that Charlotte was considering, and the fact that you can always make the holes biggerer.

Draught holes on mine were 9.5mm (sharperer drill bit than my 10) and then reamed with a taper reamer to debur. I think I did them on a 25mm spacing.

I want to have another go at the lid for mine - to make it neater and to raise the inner can a bit - I've done mine so that flange fits inside the smaller can rather than outside like the other stoves.

Having seen the amount of charcoal from Charlotte's stove on the Dun run, I think I'll have a go at packing more twigs into mine to see if that helps gassifification.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 29, 2010, 11:36:42 am
One tip I've read about is that these stoves should be really well packed, with bigger stuff at the bottom and as many of the twigs as possible laid horizontal.  The fire should burn down as much as up and if it's smoky, it's not working.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wobbly John on July 29, 2010, 11:44:59 am
Right - off to make a brew with a tightly packed combustion chambre (before I hang the washing out.  :smug:

The smoke definitely goes once you get gasslification on mine.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on July 29, 2010, 03:58:18 pm


Nancy Blackett is one of the coolest female child/teenage characters in fiction.  When I don't grow up I want to be just like her.


With this is mind, do you see the phrase "Prize galoot" replacing "donkey felching cock womble" in the lexicon of the cyclist-about-town?
I'd forgotten about "prize galoot" but it's a wonderful phrase. An effective insult without actually swearing. I have been known to occasionally use "duffer" and "BF" though not in the situation mentioned, and "prize galoot" has far more power.

As for the film, ICBA to find the clip, but I have met the boy who played Roger.

As a child I identified most with the Walkers, probably because they were the obvious heroes of the story, but now I find the Amazons more intriguing. Also Captain Flint and even Timothy "Squishy Hat", who as we all know is not an armadillo.

Ok, that's enough for this thread, back to wood burning.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wascally Weasel on July 29, 2010, 04:02:10 pm


Nancy Blackett is one of the coolest female child/teenage characters in fiction.  When I don't grow up I want to be just like her.


With this is mind, do you see the phrase "Prize galoot" replacing "donkey felching cock womble" in the lexicon of the cyclist-about-town?
I'd forgotten about "prize galoot" but it's a wonderful phrase. An effective insult without actually swearing. I have been known to occasionally use "duffer" and "BF" though not in the situation mentioned, and "prize galoot" has far more power.

As for the film, ICBA to find the clip, but I have met the boy who played Roger.

As a child I identified most with the Walkers, probably because they were the obvious heroes of the story, but now I find the Amazons more intriguing. Also Captain Flint and even Timothy "Squishy Hat", who as we all know is not an armadillo.

Ok, that's enough for this thread, back to wood burning.

Well charcoal burning (and the Billies) are entirely appropriate to this thread.

I forgot, one other difference to my burner is that the holes in the base of the inner can were 4mm.

I'll try both better packing of the burner and attempting a better seal at the weekend I think.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Polar Bear on August 05, 2010, 05:00:27 pm
I spent £2.43 in Wilkos today.   No idea when I'm going to get around to making it though  :-\
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: clarion on August 05, 2010, 05:07:49 pm
I find getting married helps to get a stove done ;)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Polar Bear on August 05, 2010, 05:13:26 pm
There was some genuine benefit for Butterfly then!  ;D  ;)  :-*
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on August 05, 2010, 05:20:01 pm
::-)

I spent £2.43 in Wilkos today.   No idea when I'm going to get around to making it though  :-\

Nice one, PB  :)

They're surprisingly labour intensive.  I've made a couple now and I'm down to about three and a half hours.  But that's with a drill press and other appropriate tools.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Polar Bear on August 05, 2010, 05:21:42 pm
It'd be nice to have tin snips and a drill press...

Mine will be a budget special.   I'm looking forward to it already. 
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on August 05, 2010, 05:22:25 pm
Wilcos sell tin snips quite cheaply too, y'know...
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Polar Bear on August 05, 2010, 05:23:16 pm
Bugger!  I'll have to get back up there tomorrow.   :)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on August 12, 2010, 07:14:36 pm
Finally got round to going to Wilkos today.  Their biscuit/coffee tin selection was disappointing - a choice between plastic, or expensive stainless with a gravity-powered lid.  Tin snips were right out.  So I made do with buying a big bag of washing-up sponges, a bottle of meths and several bars of chocolate.

Various pound shops were similarly useless.

I may have to visit the semi-mythical Northfield Wilkos.  Or worse, venture into central Brum.   :-\
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: rogerzilla on August 12, 2010, 07:33:37 pm
Northfield and Wilko were made for each other.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on August 12, 2010, 07:38:37 pm
Northfield and Wilko were made for each other.

So true.  I might have to take the BSO...
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: rogerzilla on August 12, 2010, 07:40:33 pm
I used to work there.  It was one of our better branches but was also the one where you got most abuse from people trying to get in after closing time on Saturdays.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Cudzoziemiec on August 12, 2010, 09:12:27 pm
So I made do with buying a big bag of washing-up sponges, a bottle of meths and several bars of chocolate.
Sounds like a good evening!  :o
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Tim Hall on August 12, 2010, 10:02:54 pm
when i went, the coffee tins were sold as a set of 3-coffee, tea and sugar. So i've got 2 spare if anyone's interested.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wobbly John on August 12, 2010, 11:20:34 pm
It looks as if Wilkos have stopped selling the biscuit tins used for the stove. None in stock in the stores and no longer available on line.

The new version (not shown online) does not have a tight fitting lid.  >:(
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on August 17, 2010, 12:00:47 am
As I may have mentioned elsewhere, the lovely Barakta presented me with Northfield Wilko's last old-style biscuit tin when I got back from Rutland on Saturday night.  Today I returned to the King[']s Heath branch to invest in the matching coffee/tea/sugar tin set which I'd spotted last week.  As I queued at the tills, I noticed they had individual coffee tins that were a better match for the biscuit tin on a shelf covered with "half price" stickers.  So for the awesome price of 96p I am now the proud owner of two.   :D

A large supply of patience and HSS bits will have to wait until I'm a bit less busy, but those are less likely to be discontinued.
Title: Wood burners
Post by: Wowbagger on August 17, 2010, 12:14:40 am
Last week I had some fun cooking food on a bush buddy.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: clarion on August 17, 2010, 09:56:32 am
We tried out ours at the weekend, with the help of the family pyromaniac (my dad).  Needed two goes to get the mix right, but boiled two pans of water and had plenty of warmth.

I need to remember to light the gas, not the wood, or it gets very smoky :-[
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: dkahn400 on August 17, 2010, 03:38:01 pm
We tried out ours at the weekend, with the help of the family pyromaniac (my dad).  Needed two goes to get the mix right, but boiled two pans of water and had plenty of warmth.

I need to remember to light the gas, not the wood, or it gets very smoky :-[

Don't you need to light the wood first in order to produce the gas?

Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: clarion on August 17, 2010, 03:48:33 pm
Well yes, but the gas wasn't staying lit at first, so I needed to apply flame.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on September 11, 2010, 04:29:11 pm
I've tried making a baby one of these.

Hmm. No 'gassification', but maybe I need to light the gas, like Clarion said.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Marco Stefano on September 18, 2010, 06:45:32 pm
If you don't get gasification and just burn wood, you may have too much air going in. The process relies on enough air to start the fire and heat the fuel enough (750°C +) to release volatiles (CO, H2, CO2, CH4), but the process should be most near anaerobic.

Too much air combusts the carbon in the wood structure, rather than leaving a residue of intact black char in the bottom. Looks like Charlotte's stove is spot on; fuel packing may be critical to a good performance (one may need a stove meet or competition with more stoves, fuel types and beer to find out).

UEA in Norwich have one of these running on woodchips and powering a CHP plant. It's a little bigger.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on September 18, 2010, 06:53:02 pm
I suspect the problem is too small to achieve enough heat.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: cycleman on October 26, 2010, 10:01:10 am
i am thinking about buying a woodstove biomass le from earthhuggers .com. anyone tried one ? :)
Title: Re: Wood burners
Post by: peevafred on October 30, 2010, 06:13:43 pm
Last week I had some fun cooking food on a bush buddy.

I have used the BushBuddy for some extended tours and it has been great  it fits inside a litre pan and I use about 1 inch of old inner tube to get it going. I find that with the  one pint K Kettle ( great for a quick brew.) I have a good combination for cooking.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: David Frank on November 13, 2010, 09:39:49 am
A little OT, but my grandfather ran his car on charcoal during the war.  He lived in Brazil, where they had little petrol but plenty of wood, and American cars with their huge engines.  The charcoal burner bit was built on to a frame which hung off the back of the car, and the gas produced was piped to the engine.  Apparently they got the car going with petrol, then switched to charcoal once moving.  A car could do 40 miles on a fill of charcoal, petrol stations adapted to a quick de-ash and refill service.  Brazil runs a lot of cars on biomass (alcohol from sugar cane) today.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: andyoxon on November 13, 2010, 10:25:30 am
Prolly too large, given that it's a kettle, but works really well.  Had a larger one for walking days in Africa, staying in the car and used when we got back...


Kelly Volcno Kettles's In Different Sizes Medium 1.75 and Large 2.5 pint - Surplus and Outdoors (http://www.surplusandoutdoors.com/shop/army-surplus-uk/army-miscellaneous/fantastic-kelly-volcano-kettle-536749.html)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: alexb on November 13, 2010, 10:32:59 am
A little OT, but my grandfather ran his car on charcoal during the war.  He lived in Brazil, where they had little petrol but plenty of wood, and American cars with their huge engines.  The charcoal burner bit was built on to a frame which hung off the back of the car, and the gas produced was piped to the engine.  Apparently they got the car going with petrol, then switched to charcoal once moving.  A car could do 40 miles on a fill of charcoal, petrol stations adapted to a quick de-ash and refill service.  Brazil runs a lot of cars on biomass (alcohol from sugar cane) today.


Slightly off-topic reply, but we've donme some research at work on biomass fuel production from sugar cane.
One big problem is that it's effectlively grass, so the lkeaves are full of fine silica hairs. When the cane is burnt off for harvest it produces a huge amount of smoke and that smoke is carcinogenic because of the burnt silica in it. So the cane harvesters work in a very dodgy environment.
The "neutrality" of biomass fuels is very questionable when all's considered.

Neat idea to run a car off wood gas though!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: jane on November 18, 2010, 08:31:15 am
Prolly too large, given that it's a kettle, but works really well.  Had a larger one for walking days in Africa, staying in the car and used when we got back...


Kelly Volcno Kettles's In Different Sizes Medium 1.75 and Large 2.5 pint - Surplus and Outdoors (http://www.surplusandoutdoors.com/shop/army-surplus-uk/army-miscellaneous/fantastic-kelly-volcano-kettle-536749.html)
I was given one of these for my birthday.  I have never used it although I love the idea and look of it- it's just too big and bulky for cyclecamping really.  I think mine is the big one and I got these little attachments so you can cook as well as boil water.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wobbly John on May 18, 2011, 02:28:30 pm
If anybody had plans to make one of Charlotte's stoves, but missed out on the Wilkinsons tins - they have similar sized ones in stock now - the lids fit inside the tins this time, but appear to be an even better fit. The body of the tins is ribbed on the new design and the lids are slightly domed.

The price has gone up, of course.  >:(
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on May 18, 2011, 02:33:44 pm
I'm on commission  :D
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on May 18, 2011, 02:36:25 pm
Hmm, still haven't got round to molishing mine. Probably should, given that it's camping season.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: ravenbait on May 19, 2011, 03:29:30 pm
Sorry, haven't had a chance to go through the thread, but has anyone tried one of the Hive stoves from bakcpackinglight?

Sam
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: TimO on May 19, 2011, 04:16:45 pm
Sorry, haven't had a chance to go through the thread, but has anyone tried one of the Hive stoves from bakcpackinglight?

There was certainly some slight discussion of the Honey Stove (http://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=37623.msg912867#msg912867), to which the Hive kit fits, but it wasn't a lot.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on May 23, 2011, 03:34:34 pm
Hmm, still haven't got round to molishing mine. Probably should, given that it's camping season.

Just had an experimental fettle, and have concluded that I'll be here until the heat death of the universe -possibly longer - using any of the drills I have available.  Hand-cranked works best on stainless, but this is a *lot* of holes.  Hmm...
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on May 23, 2011, 03:39:07 pm
Plz to read up on drill speeds for stainless steel.

Apart from buying good quality drill bits, you need to drill much slower than you think.  Use pilot holes, keep it cool, don't use too much pressure and make sure your drill is perpendicular to the job as you go.

Aim to be getting little spirals of swarf pirouetting off your drill bit  :)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on May 23, 2011, 03:48:57 pm
This I knew already.  None of my drills do an appropriately low RPM, apart from the hand one, and my arms really aren't up to drilling that much stainless.  Molishing a pair of brackets to mount lowriders to the forks of my Dawes nearly killed me.

Most of my inept mechanical fettling has been of enclosures for electronics, so I'm only really equipped for drilling plastic, ally and masonry. 

This is, I suspect, an n+1 tools opportunity...
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on May 23, 2011, 04:10:24 pm
*cough I have one very similar to this (http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/cdp5r-drill-press/path/drill-presses-mortisers) cough*
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on May 23, 2011, 04:27:43 pm
And that would make drilling panels neatly for switches and blinkenlights a lot easier...

/me goes for a bike ride before she does something that'll get her into trouble with barakta.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on May 23, 2011, 04:32:27 pm
Soz  ;D
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on May 23, 2011, 04:33:46 pm
A *good* cordless drill is an investment. Get one with two speeds; the lower speed will be low enough. Most of the better cordless have electronic start so you can 'feather' the trigger for lower speeds. I have a ryobi that is a gem and not horrendously expensive. It will handle stainless and steel up to 10mm thick with 12mm bits.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: rogerzilla on May 23, 2011, 06:35:35 pm
Can the charcoal be used for a barbecue after you've used up the gas?  Otherwise it seems like half the fuel is wasted.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Wobbly John on May 23, 2011, 08:11:16 pm
Mine tends to burn it away to grey ash - I empty it on the flower beds.

*cough I have one very similar to this (http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/cdp5r-drill-press/path/drill-presses-mortisers) cough*
I pulled an Ajax one of those out of a skip last month...

... only about 3 times the size!  :D
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on May 23, 2011, 09:07:34 pm
Gah!  Why do I never get the good skips?  Nothing around here but rubble and mouldy fridges.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on May 24, 2011, 01:12:23 pm
Can the charcoal be used for a barbecue after you've used up the gas?  Otherwise it seems like half the fuel is wasted.

If the stove is working properly, in theory yes.  But in reality, it's not a lot of poorly-made charcoal for quite a lot of effort.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on May 24, 2011, 01:25:31 pm
I'd say that in this particular application, burning as much of the wood as efficiently as possible is the optimal outcome.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: barakta on May 24, 2011, 05:46:26 pm
That's a very shiny drill press... 
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: David Martin on May 27, 2011, 09:15:43 am
That's a very shiny drill press... 

Obviously not used enough then..  ;D I have a big drill mounted in a press but I'm not sure it runs slow enough for drilling stainless. I am tempted (though claims of carbon negativity are plain WRONG and in the realm of perpetual motion..)

Now to try to find some biscuit tins of an appropriate size...
Title: Re: Woodburning camp Kettles stoves
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on June 23, 2011, 06:38:18 pm
I arrive home with my bright shiny new soot-blackened 2nd hand Kelly Kettle. And it was raining. Perfect for testing it.

Being scientific, I measured the tap water - 4 mugs, 2 pints worth of the finest spring York water.

Out into the yard, set it up on a stone under a holly bush. Rain pouring down. Start timer.

Gather leaves, twigs, whatever I could grab that wasn't absolutely soaked.

Light fire in base of kettle, get it actually burning and put kettle on top.

5minutes.

Fire is going well, some flames shooting out of top, add some bigger twigs, up to 1/2" diameter.

Water seems to be steaming slightly.

Bubbles appear. Check timer. 9 minutes exactly - 4 minutes since I lit the fire. Turn back to kettle and it is boiling over!

So that's 4 minutes from lighting a fire with damp twigs and leaves to having 2 pints of water at a furious boil.

Picture to be added when I find my card reader.

(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-ukCb0pqls60/TgRSMaJo_XI/AAAAAAAAAOA/H-pd9ZkZRWA/s512/KK.JPG)

See that white stuff? That's steam, that is, not smoke. 4minutes after lighting. I'm well impressed.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on June 27, 2011, 10:08:55 am
Well, that was a good test.

The kettle smoked and ran for  quite a while, due to grass and damp-twig stuffing by crinklycub. Rather nice to see a 'stove' that was safeish for young kids to mess around.

I carried some split up kindling in a bag inside the kettle. The amount I packed would have easily boiled the kettle twice over - so 2l of water. I could have packed twice as much in there.

Bringing my own wood just saved gathering time. The kettle lights incredibly easily - I didn't use paper, just a match on some splinters of wood.

It also works quite well as a marshmallow toaster
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 16, 2012, 04:16:09 pm
Thread necromancy time!

The BioLite stove (http://biolitestove.com/) is now shipping and I'm mighty tempted  :D

Also, for anyone that liked my original stove design (the one in the OP is still going strong, by the way) have a look at this (http://wildstoves.co.uk/wood-cooking-stoves/wood-gas-camping-stoves/wild-wood-gas-stove/):

(http://wildstoves.co.uk/components/com_virtuemart/show_image_in_imgtag.php?filename=Wild_Woodgas_Sto_4f27bd053939d.jpg&newxsize=200&newysize=250&fileout=)

Pretty good value for fifty quid, I reckon.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Polar Bear on July 16, 2012, 04:31:51 pm
I still have the tins awaiting use of a drill press and lots of drill bits and time to do this.   Maybe buying a mark 2 Wild Woodgas Stove will be easier.

I guess then that I could sell on the Wilko tins...   
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Efrogwr on July 18, 2012, 01:29:20 pm
... for anyone that liked my original stove design (the one in the OP is still going strong, by the way) have a look at this (http://wildstoves.co.uk/wood-cooking-stoves/wood-gas-camping-stoves/wild-wood-gas-stove/):
(http://wildstoves.co.uk/components/com_virtuemart/show_image_in_imgtag.php?filename=Wild_Woodgas_Sto_4f27bd053939d.jpg&newxsize=200&newysize=250&fileout=)
Pretty good value for fifty quid, I reckon.

So do I.  I was impressed enough to order one. I hope that it arrives in time to go to Brittany (next week!).

I will report back.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on July 18, 2012, 01:51:37 pm
Oh marvellous  :D
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: TimO on July 18, 2012, 04:31:44 pm
The BioLite stove (http://biolitestove.com/) is now shipping and I'm mighty tempted  :D

I really like the idea of being able to power something electrical using a wood burning stove.

The stove is $129, and shipping to the UK appears to be another $50.  On top of that you'll almost certainly get hit for 20% VAT (I've yet to pay duty on anything I've bought overseas, but it's possible this could also occur).

So, that's $214.80, which currently Google reckons is £137.66.  Whilst not massively excessive, it's more than I'm currently going to spend on what's essentially a bit of a gadget, regardless of how good it'll be as a stove!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Speshact on July 18, 2012, 06:36:35 pm
... for anyone that liked my original stove design (the one in the OP is still going strong, by the way) have a look at this (http://wildstoves.co.uk/wood-cooking-stoves/wood-gas-camping-stoves/wild-wood-gas-stove/):
(http://wildstoves.co.uk/components/com_virtuemart/show_image_in_imgtag.php?filename=Wild_Woodgas_Sto_4f27bd053939d.jpg&newxsize=200&newysize=250&fileout=)
Pretty good value for fifty quid, I reckon.

So do I.  I was impressed enough to order one. I hope that it arrives in time to go to Brittany (next week!).

I will report back.

Um, I seem to have had a bit of mishap with the PayPal button and appear to have inadvertently ordered one  ;D
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Efrogwr on July 18, 2012, 09:30:31 pm
... for anyone that liked my original stove design (the one in the OP is still going strong, by the way) have a look at this (http://wildstoves.co.uk/wood-cooking-stoves/wood-gas-camping-stoves/wild-wood-gas-stove/):
(http://wildstoves.co.uk/components/com_virtuemart/show_image_in_imgtag.php?filename=Wild_Woodgas_Sto_4f27bd053939d.jpg&newxsize=200&newysize=250&fileout=)
Pretty good value for fifty quid, I reckon.

So do I.  I was impressed enough to order one. I hope that it arrives in time to go to Brittany (next week!).

I will report back.

Um, I seem to have had a bit of mishap with the PayPal button and appear to have inadvertently ordered one  ;D

I hope we don't regret it!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Efrogwr on July 21, 2012, 10:15:45 am
It has just been delivered; it looks good. Small, neat and light when packed, and (apparently) no less stable than a gas stove.

We might have a test burn later. We are going to France tomorrow. Are we brave enough to rely on it as our sole source of heat? I've got 24 hours to decide!

Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: rogerzilla on July 21, 2012, 06:33:29 pm
The plus with these is that they can't really fail to work.  The minus is that your pots turn black and you smell.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: TimO on July 21, 2012, 06:45:03 pm
Ah but the smell of a camp fire isn't the most unpleasant (actually I quite like it).  There are far worse things that you can smell of, sweaty cyclist for one. ;D
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on July 21, 2012, 08:21:41 pm
It claims to accept a Trangia burner, which is a pretty neat backup option if finding dry fuel is an issue or you just want a quick(ish) cup of tea.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: rogerzilla on July 21, 2012, 09:51:21 pm
It claims to accept a Trangia burner, which is a pretty neat backup option if finding dry fuel is an issue or you just want a quick(ish) cup of tea.
Tomorrow sometime  ;)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: cuddy duck on July 22, 2012, 10:59:20 pm
It claims to accept a Trangia burner, which is a pretty neat backup option if finding dry fuel is an issue or you just want a quick(ish) cup of tea.
Or if you're driven into a bothy by foul weather.
I use the simmer ring a lot when Trangia cooking.
An open simmer ring extends beyond the diameter of the burner unit.
Could someone who's bought one of these woodgas stoves feed back whether they're large enough to manouevre a half open simmer ring onto a Trangia meths burner?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Speshact on July 23, 2012, 06:24:57 pm
Mine arrived today and folds down small and looks pretty but I've only had time to boil water for a cup of tea so far, which it did straightforwardly with a few handfuls of twigs. First thought is that a pair of secateurs may be a useful addition to the camping pack. Will experiment with a trangia burner when I get a chance later this week.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: turista on July 27, 2012, 12:04:47 pm
I have had one of these since early this year and think it is excellent. I have used twigs etc. where possible and where "all wood fires are forbidden" I use meths. I  can use the simmer ring, I tend to bring stuff to the boil, remove the top ring of the stove to put the simmer ring in place with judicious use of my (metal) cutlery.
Sure cooking over wood makes your pans sooty - I read somewhere that a smear of liquid soap on the bottom of your pans before cooking makes them very easy to clean, I keep meaning to try that, but haven't yet. I just try to make sure I wrap my pans appropriately before packing them if they are sooty.
Thanks to the OP for getting me interested in wood gasification stoves in the first place!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Tom B on July 27, 2012, 12:47:26 pm
the smoke makes a good midge deterrent
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Oscar's dad on July 27, 2012, 01:03:41 pm
I think "gasification" is a great word. And I wish you lot would stop going on about these stoves. I have two meths stoves already and don't need anymore cooking gear no matter how good it is!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on August 07, 2012, 01:33:35 pm
Damn.  Bought one  :D

A place in Twickenham (Funky Leisure (http://www.funkyleisure.co.uk/wild-woodgas-stove-mk-ii-3734-p.asp)) had them for sale at £49.95 and I popped down to have a look at one and to see if it would fit into one of my camping pots.  It did, so I bought one.

So here's what you get:

(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-SCXajxKkMjo/UB7v0VFsC_I/AAAAAAAAFqM/pCBNDiYzCjM/s640/Lyope_001.jpg)

(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-IMVd2f2oFao/UB7v19L7aHI/AAAAAAAAFqY/IXiXZwvmDH8/s640/Lyope_002.jpg)

(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-JauwEl9bVX8/UB7v15_slLI/AAAAAAAAFqU/r18Iukcpmag/s640/Lyope_003.jpg)

A good fill of twigs:

(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-6h8n3FK6x88/UB7v7cLADQI/AAAAAAAAFqk/SE2uAl4d5n8/s640/Lyope_004.jpg)

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-WxDdH7IXAvQ/UB7v7AQUuOI/AAAAAAAAFqo/MqYoP3itL_c/s640/Lyope_005.jpg)

Some smaller stuff and some paper:

(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-HWcooGddsmM/UB7v7yiIBNI/AAAAAAAAFqs/W_U3DahyPpU/s640/Lyope_006.jpg)

Touch a match to it...

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-E92PbWOahdU/UB7wBDEkWGI/AAAAAAAAFrA/Oj49USbYk3c/s640/Lyope_008.jpg)

(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-Z0D-TjsOT1A/UB7wBpHI7yI/AAAAAAAAFrE/TtZyPiAp2rw/s640/Lyope_009.jpg)

Within a couple of minutes, the woodgas catches:

(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-iq9waLNfN54/UB7wEHkyhxI/AAAAAAAAFrU/N0FiG0wfyss/s640/Lyope_011.jpg)

(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-v_krRt3Szq4/UB7wJBVH_aI/AAAAAAAAFrs/rxyIBXID45U/s640/Lyope_012.jpg)

After about twenty minutes (unless you feed it more fuel), you end up with this:

(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-3Ae63tySh_k/UB7wGTCVTUI/AAAAAAAAFrk/ZYIWR0naL5Y/s640/Lyope_013.jpg)

I did feed it some more and kept it burning for about an hour.  Here's the aftermath:

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-LLvaeuc8Jtk/UB7wMuoejyI/AAAAAAAAFr0/xgCfOgzwLPA/s640/Lyope_014.jpg)

Pure charcoal  :)

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-9nFodPnPN-Q/UB7wNfwX9FI/AAAAAAAAFr8/wjUIhcLhEf0/s640/Lyope_015.jpg)

The verdict?  This thing knocks my home made stove into a cocked hat.  Seriously, it's smaller, lighter, cleaner and focusses the heat that much better. 

But wait - there's more...

I was wondering whether there was a way of fitting a Trangia burner into it.  This is the stove with my Tatonka Trangia-pattern burner (same diameter, but stainless rather than brass and has a bigger reservoir).

(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-Ypp_AN0fbEk/UB7wvemMgTI/AAAAAAAAFtA/BYh5AKu9Eas/s640/Lyope_001.jpg)

You *can* just use the upper half of the stove as a pot support and put the burner on the ground like so:

(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-66H7x7vuSjI/UB7wv9n7pFI/AAAAAAAAFtE/0za98bqJtWI/s640/Lyope_002.jpg)

...and the simmer ring works like this:

(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-ddR9yD5Mz3A/UB7wvxKSmVI/AAAAAAAAFtI/HfqSU2Kmk1M/s640/Lyope_003.jpg)

With a pot on it, you get something like this:

(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-7nQTiFkrfnI/UB7wyulw-BI/AAAAAAAAFtc/U2Qrdp1s0VE/s640/Lyope_004.jpg)

It works well enough - the burner's a little low maybe, but it's not bad.  My only criticism of the stove design is that the fold-out pot supports don't go to the horizontal, so you need a big pot to cover them all for maximum stability.  You *can* use a smaller, bushcraft-style pot, but it won't be as steady.

(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-hKGNfT8AQnA/UB7wylRpqRI/AAAAAAAAFtY/Iw-gvkq7L_k/s640/Lyope_005.jpg)

You might want to put the whole thing on a sturdy base - like this:

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-H76PFHFBHK0/UB7w34EJ1VI/AAAAAAAAFtw/swYoxXK1rR4/s640/Lyope_007.jpg)

You might also consider a windshield if you're on meths:

(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-jMJhBnQ3RUg/UB7w4c184zI/AAAAAAAAFt4/cywWupw6-wc/s640/Lyope_008.jpg)

Pondering the issue of how to raise the meths burner to a slightly higher position, I had an idea.  Don't you just love it when things fit together this well?

(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-P31DAg9CYAQ/UB7w5IFVB_I/AAAAAAAAFuA/qs9ibVyPaWc/s640/Lyope_009.jpg)

(Julian hardly ever uses her granny ring these days, anyway  :D)

Now you can see where the burner (and simmer ring) sit when the top goes on:

(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-LLogkIu5Azg/UB7w7Kri8sI/AAAAAAAAFuI/24d8prj6hlI/s640/Lyope_010.jpg)

There's even enough airflow that I can use this sturdy sheet ally windshield as a pot support, like this:

(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-2PFpTu_3clg/UB7w8IvPYRI/AAAAAAAAFuM/mMuzXwXm-aY/s640/Lyope_011.jpg)

(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-0vgPsK0_YWs/UB7w9rzLqXI/AAAAAAAAFuY/cMQthpZH_MM/s640/Lyope_012.jpg)

So there you have it.  A kick-ass, lightweight, top-lit, downdraft gassifying wood stove with added bikey goodness.  A meths burning option for when you don't want to scrub the soot off your pan. 

It all nests together into the first pot in these photos, along with the windshield and the burner.  I'm going to knock up a nice little pair of soot-proof fabric drawstring bags for it all and give it a thorough testing on my first tour with it next week.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on August 07, 2012, 01:50:36 pm
Ooh, shiny.

I wonder why the pot supports aren't horizontal?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on August 07, 2012, 01:53:42 pm
I'm not sure, but I'm tempted to get hacky on them until they are.  I could probably drill the rivets out and replace with some nice little stainless bolts and some custom-fabricated pot supports...

*wanders off in search of 0.5mm stainless sheet*
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: tom_e on August 07, 2012, 02:10:39 pm
Mmm, tempting - I like the alternative fuel concept.  Was wandering myself about getting one and carrying a handful of those solid fuel tablets as a backup, but wasn't sure if they would be too hot.

But it doesn't say it's downdraft - the description fits with what I suspected yours did - burn upwards with an injection of more oxygen near the top.  You might be able to test which is true with some kind of cunning blocking arrangement to force the outside area to ingest air from outside rather than stuff potentially coming down the middle.

Quote
How the Wild Woodgas Stove Works
(http://www.funkyleisure.co.uk/ekmps/shops/funkyleisurel/images/wild-woodgas-stove-mk-ii-[3]-3734-p.jpg)
Wood-gas stoves create conditions where 'primary air' partially combusts wood gas, then inject pre-heated 'secondary air' into the top of the combustion chamber to mix with the remaining smoke, resulting in a very hot, clean burn and quick and easy lighting. A woodgas stove produces less carbon monoxide and particulates than open fires, and even rocket stoves. The images show the hot wood gases meeting the pre-heated air, appearing as jets of yellow flame.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on August 07, 2012, 02:32:16 pm
But it doesn't say it's downdraft - the description fits with what I suspected yours did - burn upwards with an injection of more oxygen near the top.  You might be able to test which is true with some kind of cunning blocking arrangement to force the outside area to ingest air from outside rather than stuff potentially coming down the middle.

I agree.  I can't see how the convection of gas between the walls would be stronger than that heading upwards from the primary fire, to the point where it would invert the flow.  I reckon the way to test it would be to sample the gas mixture between the walls and test for combustibility, but I haven't been allowed near gas syringes since that year 9 hydrogen incident...
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on August 07, 2012, 02:33:48 pm
But it doesn't say it's downdraft

Fair point.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Efrogwr on August 07, 2012, 02:36:37 pm
Charlotte beat me!

I used one as the only heat source on a recent trip. I set off with some wood and scavenged enough from the surrounding area. To get it going I used Flamers firelighters www.certainlywood.co.uk (http://www.certainlywood.co.uk). they are easy to light (even with a spark) and burn fast and hot. I took a Light My Fire sparker rod; this inspired E Minor to do all the firelighting while I did something else.

I think that it is not a downdraught stove, rather a secondary combustion job. I got lots of smoke: some of my pieces of wood were too long and burned above the gas flame,therefore giving off sooty smoke. I also used wood that was a bit thin compared with Charlotte's fuel. I guess that the ideal size  is about the same as a man's thumb.

It certainly packs small; stove, tinder, lighting tools and two pans in the same volume as a Trangia.

It worked well for brews and pasta and was acceptable for vegetables. When I get the hang of fuelling it properly, it will work very well for me/us. It is worth considering a light axe and small saw for fuel preparation.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: clarion on August 07, 2012, 08:25:08 pm
Now there's a lovely little thing!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Ashaman42 on August 07, 2012, 10:23:09 pm
I don't camp enough, or cook enough when I do camp to justify getting one of those lovely little stoves but I wants one precious. Particularly as my homemade out of tin cans one is no good at the burning of sticks.

Rather tempted, might have to wait for a sale but even if I just burn stuff in the garden it'd be fun.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: cuddy duck on August 22, 2012, 12:17:39 pm
Just bought one of these, online direct from WildStoves. Not immediately impressed, have to say. Wonder if I might have been sold an original rather than the allegedly more robust Mark II. Could other purchasers help me confirm which variant I have?

Brown box bears no label, unlike Charlotte’s which clearly announces the content as a Wild Woodgas Camp Stove Mark II. Instead has paper label/sash in green, red and brown describing content as Wild Woodgas Campstove with no indication of model or variant. Dark brown on pale brown Instructions leaflet - “Congratulations! You own a Wild Woodgas Campstove” -makes no mention of this being a Mark II. Drawstring bag is black plastic affair:  I’ve seen what looks like a red fabric job on their site and in youtube reviews.
Nowhere on the packaging/labelling does “Mark II” appear, only on the invoice.
What’ve I got?

Damn.  Bought one  :D

A place in Twickenham (Funky Leisure (http://www.funkyleisure.co.uk/wild-woodgas-stove-mk-ii-3734-p.asp)) had them for sale at £49.95 and I popped down to have a look at one and to see if it would fit into one of my camping pots.  It did, so I bought one.

So here's what you get:

(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-SCXajxKkMjo/UB7v0VFsC_I/AAAAAAAAFqM/pCBNDiYzCjM/s640/Lyope_001.jpg)
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-IMVd2f2oFao/UB7v19L7aHI/AAAAAAAAFqY/IXiXZwvmDH8/s640/Lyope_002.jpg)


Does your instruction leaflet in pic 2 - which I don't have - specify Mark II, Charlotte?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on August 22, 2012, 12:53:34 pm
Not sure.  Post some pictures and we might be able to tell you...
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: cuddy duck on August 22, 2012, 01:01:48 pm
Regret am unable to post pictures of the white instruction leaflet that accompanied your stove, but which is absent from mine...!
Mark II allegedly stronger. Not sure this would be visually discernible from a photo. Plainly I've received a different package to you - you've the red fabric drawstring bag for starters..

Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: loadsabikes on August 22, 2012, 03:38:15 pm
But it doesn't say it's downdraft - the description fits with what I suspected yours did - burn upwards with an injection of more oxygen near the top.  You might be able to test which is true with some kind of cunning blocking arrangement to force the outside area to ingest air from outside rather than stuff potentially coming down the middle.

I agree.  I can't see how the convection of gas between the walls would be stronger than that heading upwards from the primary fire, to the point where it would invert the flow.  I reckon the way to test it would be to sample the gas mixture between the walls and test for combustibility, but I haven't been allowed near gas syringes since that year 9 hydrogen incident...
The velocity of the gases from primary combustion cause a venturi effect thereby pulling air in through the secondary jets to feed the secondary combustion.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on August 22, 2012, 08:16:33 pm
I agree.  I can't see how the convection of gas between the walls would be stronger than that heading upwards from the primary fire, to the point where it would invert the flow.  I reckon the way to test it would be to sample the gas mixture between the walls and test for combustibility, but I haven't been allowed near gas syringes since that year 9 hydrogen incident...
The velocity of the gases from primary combustion cause a venturi effect thereby pulling air in through the secondary jets to feed the secondary combustion.
[/quote]

Yes.  Gas from the primary combustion rises and draws air in through the jets from outside for a secondary burn.

The suggestion was that pyrolysis gas was being drawn *down* from the primary combustion area, mixed with air from outside and then burnt off at the secondary jets.  Nice trick if you can manage it.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Ashaman42 on August 22, 2012, 08:47:15 pm
Regret am unable to post pictures of the white instruction leaflet that accompanied your stove, but which is absent from mine...!
Mark II allegedly stronger. Not sure this would be visually discernible from a photo. Plainly I've received a different package to you - you've the red fabric drawstring bag for starters..

I believe the mk I and mk II are different in size as only the mk II fits inside the stowaway pot. Not sure if the dimensions for both are online but maybe Charlotte would be kind enough to measure hers to compare with yours?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: andrewc on August 23, 2012, 11:43:05 pm
And another http://www.ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/solo_stove_wood_burning_backpacking_stove.html (http://www.ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/solo_stove_wood_burning_backpacking_stove.html)   looks like a Bushbuddy clone.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: cuddy duck on August 29, 2012, 10:05:38 pm
Just bought one of these, online direct from WildStoves. Not immediately impressed, have to say.
Did have the mark II: later product run.
And having returned it and been refunded can now wax on its shortcomings. The collapsible design is genius and somewhere there's an excellent stove struggling to get out. But I thought the execution left something to be desired. Didn't like the pot support ring, seemed v fragile and brittle, reminded me of the plastic used in 1970's toys. The three pot supports are wafer thin, like knife blades, hinged on tiny copper rivets and tiny spot welded to the rim: can't see them enduring repeated flaming and cooling. Integrating the 'wings' into the mould of the pot support ring - they'd be out of the way with the ring inverted when packed up - and beefing the thing up some might be a solution. Or selling it with a cruciform trivet to sit on top.
I may be out of touch with the cost of stuff these days, but I felt I had £20, at most £25, worth of thing in my hands.
Shame.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: turista on September 04, 2012, 09:29:53 pm
I used my WildStove for 36 nights this summer and I am really happy with it. I used a Trangia type burner with meths for about half the time. I put a few aluminium pie dish jobbies underneath it and a fire shield. Using it with meths was reliable and consistent. Using it with wood was a bit hit and miss, maybe because I'm not a very successful pyromaniac! Sometimes the fire was too smoky when getting going -  other times it was easy to get it going. That it burns from the top down seems so counter intuitive to me, but it surely does. I got into the habit of rubbing a drop of liquid soap on the pot bottoms, and when I remembered to do that washing the soot of was a cinch. I wonder if that would work just a well with ordinary soap?
The trangia burner fits in nicely when folding away the stove and the stove fits inside my pots, saving space compared to using the trangia. So far the hinges on the pot stand have been fine - but I agree that they don't look particularly robust. In the UK meths seems expensive, in Brittany this summer it was about 1Eu90cents a litre, but I was pleased that I could save money using bits of wood just lying around some of the time.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: fboab on September 16, 2012, 08:19:49 pm
I have just today broken mine through sheer incompetence. I nested it together wrongly when still hot and then broke it trying to get it apart again, by bashing it without sufficient planning thought. I'm gutted. And have just ordered a replacement.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: turista on June 19, 2013, 08:10:52 pm
THe pot support hinge finally borked on my wild gas stove. However wildstoves.co.uk have re designed the pot stand here
http://wildstoves.co.uk/stove-spares/wild-woodgas-stove-replacement-pot-support-top/
If you contact them they will offer a good discount as an upgrade/replacement.
I haven't used the new pot support yet though!
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Speshact on June 19, 2013, 11:23:44 pm
I meant to mention that we've used ours a few times so far this year. Really enjoyed it, successfully brewed tea and coffee and spent evenings gazing into the flames.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: cycleman on June 20, 2013, 12:16:05 am
i bought one in may but have not used it in anger yet   mine is the mark II t. i tried in the garden and it seem to work well. :)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: clarion on September 04, 2013, 09:30:26 pm
Turista's in action at Mildenhall.  I have to say the potholder is a weak point of this design:

(http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5329/9645648167_cd8c5359b8.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/93751227@N04/9645648167/)
DSCF1871 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/93751227@N04/9645648167/) by TJ Clarion (http://www.flickr.com/people/93751227@N04/), on Flickr

(http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5444/9648872344_170e320163.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/93751227@N04/9648872344/)
DSCF1877 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/93751227@N04/9648872344/) by TJ Clarion (http://www.flickr.com/people/93751227@N04/), on Flickr

(http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3688/9648835872_a066719156.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/93751227@N04/9648835872/)
DSCF1889 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/93751227@N04/9648835872/) by TJ Clarion (http://www.flickr.com/people/93751227@N04/), on Flickr

(http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3682/9645609403_3a19548a70.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/93751227@N04/9645609403/)
DSCF1888 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/93751227@N04/9645609403/) by TJ Clarion (http://www.flickr.com/people/93751227@N04/), on Flickr

(http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7430/9648760174_07c385aea2.jpg) (http://www.flickr.com/photos/93751227@N04/9648760174/)
DSCF1929 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/93751227@N04/9648760174/) by TJ Clarion (http://www.flickr.com/people/93751227@N04/), on Flickr

Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on September 05, 2013, 10:27:40 am
How much heat radiates downwards?

A lot of campsites won't allow disposable bbqs or stoves that sit on the ground, due to scorching of the grass.  I do like my kelly kettle but it has the problem of burning the ground.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: pcolbeck on September 05, 2013, 10:56:21 am
An officious French campsite manager gave me a right shouting at for "destroying the beauty of the campsite" years ago for using a bbq that sat on the ground. If we had had it on grass I could have understood but this was on Mont Blanc and I had the bbq resting on a a slab of igneous rock that must have weighed 200 tonnes, no way was a disposable BBQ going to make any impression on that. Indeed next morning when we chuck the bbq in the bin there wasn't a mark on the rock. We had however bent most f our tent pegs trying to get the tents even slightly fastened down.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: mrcharly-YHT on September 05, 2013, 11:22:24 am
Camping and bushwalking in WA gave me a profound preference for tents that don't require pegs; the soil in the Darling Scarp is often only a few inches deep over solid rock.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Charlotte on September 05, 2013, 11:30:24 am
How much heat radiates downwards?

A lot of campsites won't allow disposable bbqs or stoves that sit on the ground, due to scorching of the grass.  I do like my kelly kettle but it has the problem of burning the ground.

I have one of these (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Draper-30309-Soldering-Asbestos-Free/dp/B0001K9S3O/ref=pd_sim_sbs_diy_5):

(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51GW9XZW59L._SX450_.jpg)

It's a small glass fibre heat resistant mat, made for plumbers to use to shield floor joists and the like when soldering pipes together with a blow lamp.  It rolls up and goes in with the stove kit and makes sure that you don't scorch the grass.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: clarion on September 05, 2013, 12:05:02 pm
I always use a plumbers mat for my stoves.  Not sure how a woodburning stove differs - good or bad - from a gas one in this respect.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Vince on September 05, 2013, 12:13:05 pm
Camping and bushwalking in WA gave me a profound preference for tents that don't require pegs; the soil in the Darling Scarp is often only a few inches deep over solid rock.

Sounds just like the Kent Show Ground

Back OT. Am I right in thinking that the air rising in the jacket is pulling air down through the bottom of the burning pot? Therefore the ratio of size/quantity of the holes around the bottom of the outer jacket compared to those in the base of the burning pot is critical and closing off the holes in the outer will increase the air draft down through the fire?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on September 05, 2013, 01:10:10 pm
Am I right in thinking that the air rising in the jacket is pulling air down through the bottom of the burning pot?

That's how many people describe the process, but I don't see how that can possibly happen without some sort of fan; the hot air in the burning pot (which is never going to be cooler than that in the jacket) will rise, and draw air in through the bottom, as well as through the secondary combustion holes at the top.  I don't believe the jacket is essential to the process, except perhaps by pre-heating the air for the secondary burn.  It does cool the outer wall somewhat, which is handy.

Thought experiment: if the air is being pulled downwards through the fuel, where is it coming from?  Which way are the smoke and flames going?
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Vince on September 05, 2013, 01:48:08 pm
I would like to think the smoke is being pulled down into the hotter part of the fire and combusted, making it cleaner.
Thinking about the jacket and simplifying the model by losing the holes in the outer jacket. The air in the jacket is being warmed and will expand, becoming lighter than the air outside the jacket so will exit the jacket at the top. This leaves a low pressure area which can only be filled by air either coming back down the jacket or being drawn throught the fire. The former I suspect would pulse, the later give the draw down effect described.
Of course this is buggered up by the big holes in the outer jacket which will allow air to be drawn from the outside up through both the jacket and the fire.

(My experience of fires is limited to setting scouts alight helping scouts light fires on camp!)
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: Kim on September 05, 2013, 03:57:29 pm
I would like to think the smoke is being pulled down into the hotter part of the fire and combusted, making it cleaner.

The smoke is mixed with fresh air above the fire and combusted, making it cleaner.  You can see it happening.


Quote
Thinking about the jacket and simplifying the model by losing the holes in the outer jacket. The air in the jacket is being warmed and will expand, becoming lighter than the air outside the jacket so will exit the jacket at the top. This leaves a low pressure area which can only be filled by air either coming back down the jacket or being drawn throught the fire. The former I suspect would pulse, the later give the draw down effect described.

Yeahbut:

The air in the pot is being warmed *more* and will expand *more* and rise, this leaves a low pressure area which can only be filled by by air coming back down the jacket.  This air will contain rather a lot of combustion products, and it will either reach a smouldery equilibrium or go out (indeed, you'd have the same problem if it were being drawn down through the fire).


Quote
Of course this is buggered up by the big holes in the outer jacket which will allow air to be drawn from the outside up through both the jacket and the fire.

Which is how they seem to work in practice.  The experiments to do are to try running one without the jacket in place, and to draw off a sample of the air inside the jacket and test for combustible gasses.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: turista on September 06, 2013, 12:25:31 am
"I would like to think the smoke is being pulled down into the hotter part of the fire and combusted, making it cleaner."
I think this is correct - and is an important feature when larger versions are used in peoples' homes in developing countries. That and the reduced amount of fuel they require.
I find that the lower part of my stove stays surprisingly cool. I cook on top of a collection of pie dishes, I'm much more likely to scorch grass with the bottom of my pan than from the wood  gas stove.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: clarion on September 06, 2013, 08:14:09 am
That's true.  At Mildenhall, there was just a pie dish (no pie) between Turista's stove and a wooden picnic table.  I thought there might be some scorching, but there were no marks.
Title: Re: Woodburning camp stoves
Post by: turista on September 06, 2013, 04:17:37 pm
You can put water in the pie dish if you want to be double plus careful. I have a little pile of the pie dishes (collective noun needed!) - I really ought to keep one out to put the hot saucepan onto, then I wouldn't scorch the grass!