Author Topic: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas  (Read 1170 times)

Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« on: January 20, 2014, 04:30:09 pm »
Hi All

I will be cycling Euro Velo 6 in the Loire section in May

I noticed the GPX file has over 7000 points.



Would it be necessary to filter\edit the number of points to a certain level?

thanks for any guidance

Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2014, 06:05:28 pm »


Of all that lot, those are the only ones that need to be there.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2014, 06:32:10 pm »
Looks like a track that's been converted to a route at some point.  Better to use it as a track, so it appears as a line rather than a zillion waypoints, or as Ningishzidda suggests, create a Route containing only those necessary for navigation.
To ride the Windcheetah, first, you must embrace the cantilever...

fuaran

  • rothair gasta
Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2014, 06:33:33 pm »
7000 points for what? Is that the whole Euro Velo route, or just part of it? What sort of distance?

If you are using a large number of points, it would be more useful to convert it to a GPX track, not a GPX route.
Also from that image in your post, you could simplify the track a lot, without losing detail. There's no need to have lots of points for a straight road. About 1/5 of the points should still follow the road well enough.

You can use Garmin Basecamp to convert it to a track, then use the filter option to simplify it.

Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2014, 06:44:58 am »
The supplier of the GPX has simply converted a recording. Shame on them.

A half decent Org will do some work to de-complicate the multi waypoint track into something a Garmin will use without confusing the recipient.

Its OK to issue the big GPX, cus some Garmin users like to do their own adaptions, but FHS, there are Garmin novices out here who are still unsure about editing GPXs.

frankly frankie

  • I kid you not
    • Fuchsiaphile
Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2014, 09:08:51 am »
But that works both ways.
Should an organiser assume that some riders don't know one end of a GPX file from the other?
Or should the rider assume that some organisers don't know one end from t'other?

Because both are true, but if everybody keeps falling over themselves to make life easier for the other fellow, that way madness lies.

I think that there are more variables at the rider end - different GPSs, different routeing preferences etc - and therefore it is principally down to the rider to adapt (or adapt to) whatever is made available.

(The above is clearly a Track that has at some point been downloaded as a Route, which is an error that is all too easy to make with some planners and download sites, and caused partly by the endless confusion over the double meaning of the word 'route'.)
"This is a complex subject, with a need for more than one highlighter pen."

Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2014, 09:20:49 am »
Indeed. I'm creating GPX routes for Audax Organisers that aren't GPS savvy (reminds me, need to finish off a couple based on final tweaks). When looking at what people use I found:-

Audaxers use GPS routes in various ways:-
1) Minimalist route (one route point at each junction)
2) Minimalist route (one route point just before each junction)
3) Minimalist route (one route point just after each junction)

Then there are those that use tracks:-
a) GPX tracklog for the entire ride (out and back or including loops)
b) GPX tracklog for each section between controls
c) GPX tracklog split into logical segments (one for out, another for back, or done per day, etc)
each of which may or may not be required to be reduced to 500 points.

Users of GPSes that take non-standard stuff:-
i) Extended GPX route containing thousands of points (using GPXX extensions) for the Garmin Edge 705
...etc...

So the simplest answer, when having to provide just one thing, is a single GPX file that contains one or more tracklogs each reduced to 500 points and split at a logical point (half way usually).

GPS savvy people will then be able to munge it into whatever they want, but the average person just wants something to upload to their GPS and go.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2014, 10:28:13 am »
The most arrogant Org will issue several TomTom ITN files and let the riders convert them to Garmin usable files.
The most respected Orgs issue a routesheet and no electronic GPS files.

The remaining Orgs do their best to keep the riders happy with a wide varying quality of GPX files, and there is always someone who complains.
 ;)

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2014, 03:26:53 pm »
So the simplest answer, when having to provide just one thing, is a single GPX file that contains one or more tracklogs each reduced to 500 points and split at a logical point (half way usually).

Is the approach I've used:  A GPX 'track' that follows the intended route as accurately as possible (in practice I generally end up piecing together cleaned up segments of recorded track logs and/or tracing an OS map), with sufficient resolution that it is unambiguous when overlayed on a map.  I'll filter to 500 points as a convenience for GPS users, but if you want to get clever, the line on the map is canonical and you can roll your own data from that.

I certainly wouldn't bother providing a navigable Route for any device but my own.  I don't know what software or maps you're using.
To ride the Windcheetah, first, you must embrace the cantilever...

Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2014, 04:18:29 pm »
Thank you everyone for your thoughts, they have clarified a couple of points for me

'Should an organiser assume that some riders don't know one end of a GPX file from the other' probably in my case, this would be true.

My wife purchased the etrex 30 for us thinking that it would act as a tom-tom on a bike notwithstanding that I have a few questions

Numpty warning:

What is the advantage of planning a 'route' as opposed to a 'track'?

Does a route give a rider warnings ie turn right etc

I have found Basecamp route planning not very good for me. I feel more comfortable using Google Maps and then importing that into Basecamp  but im just getting started with Basecamp etc

thanks again for any support

Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2014, 07:27:49 pm »
Try Tyre toTravel.
You won't need to use Basecamp ever again.

If you can sort out a route on Googlemaps, Tyre toTravel will transition seamlessly.

andyp

  • Andrew Preston
Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #11 on: January 27, 2014, 08:35:11 am »

What is the advantage of planning a 'route' as opposed to a 'track'?


I got an Etrex30, about 18 months ago, and I experimented with routes a bit at the start, but my problem with them on Audaxes were that it felt like it would be easy to miss (or think you'd missed) the warnings about junctions if the road was busy, or I was chatting, and once you've gone past an instruction there didn't seem to be anything to tell you that you were pedalling off course. There is also an as the crow flies solid line from the beginning of the route to the end, which could be confusing...

Tracks on the other hand, are a line on the road that always tells you that you're in the right place. It takes half a second as you approach a junction to glance down and see if you're turning off here (in much the same way as you might check a routesheet) and at any point on the ride you can look at the Garmin and see that you're on-track, which is reassuring.

So for me, tracks won.

Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #12 on: January 27, 2014, 12:03:08 pm »
Remember though, you don't have to choose between tracks or routes (on most modern GPSes) as they can do both.

Display the track on the map and have it prompt you by following the route.

Saying that, I've all but abandoned routes in favour of just displaying a track on a map now.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2014, 07:05:24 pm »
'Try Tyre toTravel.
You won't need to use Basecamp ever again.

If you can sort out a route on Googlemaps, Tyre toTravel will transition seamlessly.'


really great advice Ningishzidda and so true...Tyre is brilliant  :)

Thanks Andyp and Greenbank, tracks it is :) done a couple of experiments and your spot on with your advice for a numpty such as myself

frankly frankie

  • I kid you not
    • Fuchsiaphile
Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2014, 10:31:53 pm »
I tried it and couldn't believe how awful it was.  Oh well, it takes all sorts, I suppose.
"This is a complex subject, with a need for more than one highlighter pen."

Re: Another Etrex 30 GPS for Xmas
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2014, 07:38:43 am »
I tried it and couldn't believe how awful it was.  Oh well, it takes all sorts, I suppose.

That was my conclusion regarding Garmin's entire philosophy on a guidance system for a cyclist. So yes, it takes all sorts,,,  ;)