Author Topic: Current Projects  (Read 8752 times)

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #25 on: August 25, 2017, 09:10:45 am »
I semi-accidentally won a Raleigh twenty Stowaway on eBay for ~20 quid. :)
Will see how much work it needs doing on it when I collect tomorrow. Plans are to ride it a little, make sure it fits in the back of my new car, strip it down and paint it, rebuild with bullhorn bars and maybe some nice wheels (I read somewhere you can fit 24" wheels in them) and a new BB and chainset (will need to investigate how to modify the BB shell).

Blodwyn Pig

  • what a nice chap
Re: Current Projects
« Reply #26 on: August 26, 2017, 07:52:09 am »
All of my bikes are current projects.  I can't leave anything alone -


^^^ This. ::-)

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #27 on: August 26, 2017, 12:45:00 pm »
Here it is:
IMG_20170826_093702 by duncancmartin, on Flickr
Headset feels like it's a bit loose, but I guess that's normal for the nylon bushing thing? Tyres and (crappy) brake blocks are new, 3 speed SA gears work, apparently left hand crank bolt (cottered) gets loose sometimes. Gonna try it out a bit today and see how it is to ride.

fruitcake

  • some kind of fruitcake
    • Bailey
Re: Current Projects
« Reply #28 on: August 26, 2017, 02:04:27 pm »
Keep the BB cups even if you change the axle.

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Current Projects
« Reply #29 on: August 26, 2017, 02:15:01 pm »
I believe you can replace the Nylon bush with normal headset parts.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Torslanda

  • Professional Gobshite
  • Just a tart for retro kit . . .
    • John's Bikes
Re: Current Projects
« Reply #30 on: August 26, 2017, 02:20:21 pm »
If those are 20 x 1 3/8 wheels - 451 ETRTO - you may just get 24" - 507 ETRTO - in the forks but not with the mudguards.
VELOMANCER

Well that's the more blunt way of putting it but as usual he's dead right.

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #31 on: August 26, 2017, 04:48:14 pm »
If those are 20 x 1 3/8 wheels - 451 ETRTO - you may just get 24" - 507 ETRTO - in the forks but not with the mudguards.

What's the problem with 20x1 3/8? Unavailable or just fancy something different or with nicer/alloy rims in place of chrome steel. If unavailable from cycle sources are they used at all on wheelchairs (which would give sources of tubes and tyres but probably not cycle friendly rims)?

An alternative tyre size would be 500A which I think was the stock size for one of the rival mid-wheelers (Dawes Kingpin perhaps) or 550A. The old folder hanging in the shed has 500A in a 38 section (one new Raleigh tyre bought quite recently in France) and the Dino has a 500A x28 section on a nice alloy rim (28 spoke radial with a Hutchinson tyre that I am fairly certain is still available). 550A might well be more complicated, I don't have any experience with that one other than seeing bikes with that size in jumble sales.

Torslanda

  • Professional Gobshite
  • Just a tart for retro kit . . .
    • John's Bikes
Re: Current Projects
« Reply #32 on: August 26, 2017, 05:27:14 pm »
No problem, he just mentioned the possibility of fitting alternative wheels...
VELOMANCER

Well that's the more blunt way of putting it but as usual he's dead right.

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #33 on: August 26, 2017, 10:35:28 pm »
They are 451s currently. I'm not a fan of steel rims for something that gets used a lot - braking in the wet tends to be pretty poor. I'd be happy to stick to 451s if I can get some decent rims.
I've seen the http://raleightwenty.webs.com/ website, and they have a headset replacement guide. The BB is a bit more complicated, so will need more thought.
It's surprisingly good to ride, and the handlebar adjustment makes it east to adjust how high the front end is, so it's definitely worth persevering with. I need to find somewhere that can sandblast bike frames - I'm building a collection of rusty ones I want to repaint!

Torslanda

  • Professional Gobshite
  • Just a tart for retro kit . . .
    • John's Bikes
Re: Current Projects
« Reply #34 on: August 27, 2017, 06:08:26 am »
Most powder coaters will soda blast and do a single colour for £££ notalot.

The people I use do a gloss finish as part of the deal and they're good...
VELOMANCER

Well that's the more blunt way of putting it but as usual he's dead right.

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #35 on: August 27, 2017, 09:46:27 am »
Main limitation of the Twenty is the BB shell - very wide (78mm, I think) and Raleigh-threaded.  Without serious machine shop work, nothing fits except the original BB, which limits you to the original cottered cranks.

406mm BMX 20" wheels were used on US market Twenties.  They drop the BB height but it's still over 10" and perfectly acceptable (actually makes it a nice town bike).  Front braking is much improved if you get a new BMX fork with V-brake bosses for about £15; you can then fit a standard headset!  Rear braking is always going to be an issue unless you get a hub with a coaster brake; the rear end is pretty tight but some SA 3-speed coasters will fit, as will a Sachs Duomatic.  406 wheels have a brake drop of about 100mm at the rear, and the available side-pulls in that reach are totally ineffectual.

Design fault: you can never get correct chainline with the standard BB and cranks.  You want to move the sprocket outwards but then the chain fouls the seatstay!  You'll need a bushingless chain and no larger than a 15T sprocket to minimise the issue.

I would also throw away the steel seatpost and get a 400mm Kalloy or something, assuming you don't actually need to make the bike as small as possible for transport.  Same goes for the stem.
Never tell me the odds.

Mr Larrington

  • A bit ov a lyv wyr by slof standirds
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Re: Current Projects
« Reply #36 on: August 27, 2017, 12:15:16 pm »
I'm pretty sure decent 451 ally rims and matching tyres are still available though it's been a few years since I had anything to do with the things.
External Transparent Wall Inspection Operative & Mayor of Mortagne-au-Perche
Satisfying the Bloodlust of the Masses in Peacetime

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #37 on: August 27, 2017, 12:57:38 pm »
The reason for the blasting is that I'd really like to experiment with multi-colour painting using this stuff: https://spray.bike/
But I can't do it on a rusty frame, and my last attempt at cleaning a frame with sandpaper and a nylon clean and strip disc made a huge amount of mess and took ages, hence the blasting...

I definitely want to keep the ability to fold it, but I'm not sure how small it needs to be to fit into the boot of the new car, so I'll wait and see on the stem front. I'll almost certainly get a long kalloy seatpost.
If I can keep the 451 wheel size then I will - it means you don't need a dinner plate chainring and makes sorting out brakes easier. I'm gonna see if dual pivots will fit as well - no need for different forks then. It looks like decent 451 rims are available as some race BMX use them, but they aren't especially cheap. Ultimately it would be nice to slim down the BB shell and fit a sensible BB/crank setup, but that's not something that I would be comfortable doing straight away.

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #38 on: August 27, 2017, 01:26:35 pm »
Headset - in similar circumstances I replaced the upper bearings with  1" threadless parts.
Brakes - on  a 1973 Dawes Kingpin with 451 steel rims I replaced the front brake with a deep dual pivot and modern brake blocks.  A great improvement.  I also replaced both brake cables with modern lined cables to give the brakes every possible chance.  Seems to work just fine.
Gearing - I live in a hilly area so changed the rear sprocket on the Kingpin from 16T to 20T.  This gives a top gear of about 65" and a bottom gear in the mid 30s.  It is very ungainly climbing in such a riding position, so the very low gearing is helpful.  I only use this bike for occasional local shopping and pub trips.  Mine still has the tartan cardboard rack top bag.

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #39 on: September 17, 2017, 05:33:33 pm »
Getting there slowly! The bars and saddle aren't adjusted properly, I haven't worked out where to put the lights, I might need to change the bolt in the rear brake to fit a vestigial rack and I am not entirely convinced by the combination of front hub and low loaders. I have also found it impossible to fit another hub with a quick release with these carriers (can't work out how to close the qr, something always gets in the way). Also need to mod my big panniers to fix to the carriers and adjust the guards a bit.


Eagle-eyed readers will note that I have changed my choice of mechs. Less obvious is that rather than buy the right spokes for the original sf hub for the rear wheel I have rebuilt on a Normandie large flange; this hub has a french thread so I can't use my super wide freewheel and will have to make do with a 13-28 for the time being. This situation won't last long if the bike lives up to expectations.

Torslanda

  • Professional Gobshite
  • Just a tart for retro kit . . .
    • John's Bikes
Re: Current Projects
« Reply #40 on: September 17, 2017, 06:35:32 pm »
Good to see you're making use of the Peugeot.  :thumbsup:
VELOMANCER

Well that's the more blunt way of putting it but as usual he's dead right.

guidon

  • formerly known as cyclone
Re: Current Projects
« Reply #41 on: September 17, 2017, 06:44:57 pm »
Has to be done, when in France do a Peugeot....

dim

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #42 on: September 17, 2017, 07:49:10 pm »
I am currently using a vintage 1981 Koga Miyata Full Pro as my daily commuter .... (bought 3 weeks ago) a superb ride, light and quick and it was a bargain
I need to upgrade the groupset (I want brifters) and I will get good light strong tubeless ready rims/wheels, front wheel will have a Son 28 dynamo hub, back will most probably be DT Swiss or Chris King R45 if I can find a used one within my budget and I will get my LBS to build them

I'm still undecided on the groupset, but it will be Dura Ace .... I'm looking very closely at the Dura Ace 7800 groupset, but I wish to use a 12-32 Casette and I'm not sure if the 7800 rear derailler will be suited?

I wil also be buying some Apidura bags (Tube Pack and a Frame Pack), and I'm hoping to use this bike as my daily commuter aswell as for some Audax rides. I cannot fit wide tyres,and will have to settle on 25's. Mudguards may be another problem

“No great mind has ever existed without a touch of madness.” - Aristotle

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #43 on: September 17, 2017, 09:15:50 pm »
I am currently using a vintage 1981 Koga Miyata Full Pro as my daily commuter .... (bought 3 weeks ago) a superb ride, light and quick and it was a bargain
I need to upgrade the groupset (I want brifters) and I will get good light strong tubeless ready rims/wheels, front wheel will have a Son 28 dynamo hub, back will most probably be DT Swiss or Chris King R45 if I can find a used one within my budget and I will get my LBS to build them

I'm still undecided on the groupset, but it will be Dura Ace .... I'm looking very closely at the Dura Ace 7800 groupset, but I wish to use a 12-32 Casette and I'm not sure if the 7800 rear derailler will be suited?

I wil also be buying some Apidura bags (Tube Pack and a Frame Pack), and I'm hoping to use this bike as my daily commuter aswell as for some Audax rides. I cannot fit wide tyres,and will have to settle on 25's. Mudguards may be another problem

What's the original group for this frame? Presumably 7sp and 126mm OLN at the back. Are you going to cold set it or just spring the back end every time to get the rear wheel in?
A clubmate has a Vitus 797 which he uses with a 11-34 mtb cassette and compact double chainset; he uses mtb mechs and finds it a very good solution.
Tyres do seem to be a problem on a few older frames. My Peugeot has mudguard fittings but won't take anything bigger than a 23 because of the problem forcing the tyre past the chainstay bridge when fitting the rear wheel (which is why I have converted to 650B for comfort). Even the 650B wheels need a bit of forcing, inspite of having cut 6mm off the rear fork-ends to make life easier (they do have 38 section tyres though)

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #44 on: September 17, 2017, 09:32:56 pm »
Good to see you're making use of the Peugeot.  :thumbsup:

It seemed such a waste seeing it hanging there every time I went into the garage. When I converted the mtb back to being a real mtb rather than a utility tourer I had an excuse to do something, even if the only trips forseeable at the moment revolve around fetching the bread at week-ends.

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #45 on: September 17, 2017, 10:44:18 pm »
Currently finishing up the Kinesis 5T mentioned up thread for a mate. Looking nice and sparkly as I've cleaned everything as I've put it together. Has a slightly scratched silver 105 5600 50/34 chainset with new outer ring, Ultegra front and 105 rear mech and a sram 12-28 cassette. Also some nice old Ultegra brifters from here. Some of my wheels - 32 spoke as he's a solid 100kgs - and now waiting on me sorting the brakes and fitting cables and bar tape. Pictures will follow.

Mike

dim

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #46 on: September 18, 2017, 05:05:29 am »
I am currently using a vintage 1981 Koga Miyata Full Pro as my daily commuter .... (bought 3 weeks ago) a superb ride, light and quick and it was a bargain
I need to upgrade the groupset (I want brifters) and I will get good light strong tubeless ready rims/wheels, front wheel will have a Son 28 dynamo hub, back will most probably be DT Swiss or Chris King R45 if I can find a used one within my budget and I will get my LBS to build them

I'm still undecided on the groupset, but it will be Dura Ace .... I'm looking very closely at the Dura Ace 7800 groupset, but I wish to use a 12-32 Casette and I'm not sure if the 7800 rear derailler will be suited?

I wil also be buying some Apidura bags (Tube Pack and a Frame Pack), and I'm hoping to use this bike as my daily commuter aswell as for some Audax rides. I cannot fit wide tyres,and will have to settle on 25's. Mudguards may be another problem

What's the original group for this frame? Presumably 7sp and 126mm OLN at the back. Are you going to cold set it or just spring the back end every time to get the rear wheel in?
A clubmate has a Vitus 797 which he uses with a 11-34 mtb cassette and compact double chainset; he uses mtb mechs and finds it a very good solution.
Tyres do seem to be a problem on a few older frames. My Peugeot has mudguard fittings but won't take anything bigger than a 23 because of the problem forcing the tyre past the chainstay bridge when fitting the rear wheel (which is why I have converted to 650B for comfort). Even the 650B wheels need a bit of forcing, inspite of having cut 6mm off the rear fork-ends to make life easier (they do have 38 section tyres though)

I bought the frame and forks and transfered the groupset from my other Koga Miyata to this one (old 105 Golden Arrow groupset)

The original groupset on the new Miyata was the early 80's Dura Ace AX/EX 6 speed.

The OLN is 130mm and I am currently using my old Giant P-R2 wheels with a 9 speed cassette (11-28), but I will get some decent wheels and change that to a 10 speed cassette and fit the Dura Ace 7800  groupset...

by changing to 10 speed, this will allow me to occasionaly use my other wheels which I have on my Giant TCR (HED Belgium Plus with Chris King R45 hubs (ceramic bearing upgrade) ... and I will not have to change Cassettes every time I switch

On the HED wheels, I will be trying tubeless tyres for winter (2017 IRC Formula Pro RBCC in 25mm wide), and will be able to use these wheels on the Koga Miyata

still lots to do on the Koga Miyata but it fits me well, rides brilliant and I don't mind spending a fair bit of cash to get it sorted
“No great mind has ever existed without a touch of madness.” - Aristotle

MalRees

  • Hayes - centre of no known universe
Re: Current Projects
« Reply #47 on: September 19, 2017, 01:23:26 pm »
My daughters Condor boys bike (rather nice - its got a full 531 frame) is with me for a fettle. Two years in London has pretty much killed all the bearings. Off to source period Shimano 7 speed kit...........

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #48 on: September 19, 2017, 04:10:23 pm »
Main limitation of the Twenty is the BB shell - very wide (78mm, I think) and Raleigh-threaded.  Without serious machine shop work, nothing fits except the original BB, which limits you to the original cottered cranks.

406mm BMX 20" wheels were used on US market Twenties.  They drop the BB height but it's still over 10" and perfectly acceptable (actually makes it a nice town bike).  Front braking is much improved if you get a new BMX fork with V-brake bosses for about £15; you can then fit a standard headset!  Rear braking is always going to be an issue unless you get a hub with a coaster brake; the rear end is pretty tight but some SA 3-speed coasters will fit, as will a Sachs Duomatic.  406 wheels have a brake drop of about 100mm at the rear, and the available side-pulls in that reach are totally ineffectual.

Design fault: you can never get correct chainline with the standard BB and cranks.  You want to move the sprocket outwards but then the chain fouls the seatstay!  You'll need a bushingless chain and no larger than a 15T sprocket to minimise the issue.

I would also throw away the steel seatpost and get a 400mm Kalloy or something, assuming you don't actually need to make the bike as small as possible for transport.  Same goes for the stem.
How bad is the ground clearance with the standard cranks and 406 rims? I checked on the weekend and it will fit in the car assuming I can remove the stem (need to undo the brake bolt and remove that cable). I've found the BMX forks with V bosses, and I've got some 406 rims kicking around, (or I could just buy some new ones), but that way a proper project lies - if it's going to mess up the crank clearance I'll stick to 451s and have to do something different with the headset.

Re: Current Projects
« Reply #49 on: September 25, 2017, 10:53:14 am »
I stripped my fixie down because I want to get it sand blasted and then paint it. I'm going to use Spray.Bike and see if I can get a decent finish with a funky multi-colour design.
Unfortunately I was distracted by the world road race and didn't think through the order in which I should do things. I remembered that crank bolts are usually really tight, so I undid them before I removed the wheels/chain, but I didn't remove the cranks.
I ended up with this:
2017-09-25_09-32-51 by duncancmartin, on Flickr
The left hand crank now has a stripped thread (I screwed it in properly and it took mega power and leverage to get the pusher bolt to move) - the extractor came out with a neat spiral bit of aluminium (6 or 7 turns) in the threads. So I gave up and tried the other side, and now the extractor is stuck in that side! :( The cranks have been on there without removal since I built this bike up in 2004.
I'll have to take it to my friendly bike shop to get it sorted - the cranks were secondhand and an odd pair when I built it, plus the BCD is unusual, so if I can I'd like to keep the BB and ditch the cranks for something new. Will have to see what bits are available in the shop - might go for another secondhand set, and if they are scruffy then paint them at the same time as I do the F&F.