Author Topic: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax  (Read 4506 times)

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #25 on: July 18, 2017, 09:17:04 am »
Double ordering at Pete's Eats.

Did not enjoy the subsequent excursion around Cefn Du.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #26 on: July 18, 2017, 09:23:11 am »
Thanks to everyone who's taken the time to reply. I'm intrigued by the whole Keto thing, but I just don't have the focus/resources to be able to make it work for me as my lodgers (girlfriend and 3 year old) are unlikely to want to go full on keto too. I would be intrigued to find out if there are keto devotees with families who do manage to make it work though.

I will be thinking much more carefully about my fueling. I'm riding a perm 300 with a pal on Sunday and will look to structure and schedule my eating better. I will also be taking a spork to open up the options of stuff like yoghurt/tins of rice pud. I recall feeling like I could've demolished some yoghurt half way through day 2 of Mille Pennines. I think another factor is that Mille Pennines was such an extreme leap forward for me that my digestive system was in shock from the dramatic increase of demands placed on it and just shut down in response.

I do like the Ella's kitchen baby food idea, stands to reason that it should be easily digestible.

Manotea

  • Just 1 sob, Vassily
Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #27 on: July 18, 2017, 12:13:51 pm »
Yes, the downside of living in a 'non Keto household' is that I do most of the shopping and cooking nowadays. It's the only way I get anything to eat... it's always a laugh buying cake and pasta , 'to keep the druggies happy'. As is the quality of my diet has vastly improved, and I eat far more veggies than I used to. The produce board of California who dreamt up the 5 a day scam would be proud of me.

The angry chef is a card. I've no doubt he's right and Keto is terrible for you for all sorts of reasons. On the other hand I know exactly what a so called mainstream balanced diet which it turns out was based on no science at all but entirely driven by the food industry has been doing to me my entire life. #IMAHAINGTTIAM #YPYPATYC

PS, the problem with the kiddie sachets is that they actually only contain about 100-150 cal or so, i.e., about 10 minutes worth. See also gel sachets. And guess what the primary ingredient of this easily digestable foodstuff is.... save your money and buy a can of beans with a ring pull lid, if you must...

mattc

  • "Hannibal"
  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #28 on: July 18, 2017, 12:21:55 pm »
Thanks to everyone who's taken the time to reply. I'm intrigued by the whole Keto thing, but I just don't have the focus/resources to be able to make it work for me as my lodgers (girlfriend and 3 year old) are unlikely to want to go full on keto too. I would be intrigued to find out if there are keto devotees with families who do manage to make it work though.

The ketonauts say otherwise, but I'm absolutely convinced of the benefits of going "part-keto"; cut right back on your everyday sugar, do more fasted riding, and fuel as much exercise as you can with non-carby stuff. There is science showing that some adaptations occur, and they're beneficial. I've certainly benefitted.

<resists urge to post tedious long-distance fat-burning anecdote ... >
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #29 on: July 18, 2017, 12:36:25 pm »
cake ... , 'to keep the druggies happy'.
Funnily enough, the idea of sugar as an addictive substance came up in conversation recently about slavery.
When the sun is up it is always shining
On cloudy days you see the silver lining

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #30 on: July 18, 2017, 01:09:41 pm »
PS, the problem with the kiddie sachets is that they actually only contain about 100-150 call or so, is, about 10 minutes worth. See also gel sachets. And guess what the primary ingredient if this easily digestable foodstuff is.... save your money and buy a can of beans with a ring pull lid, if you must...

You burn over 600 calories an hour audaxing ?    Half of that more like.

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #31 on: July 18, 2017, 02:43:12 pm »
Thanks to everyone who's taken the time to reply. I'm intrigued by the whole Keto thing, but I just don't have the focus/resources to be able to make it work for me as my lodgers (girlfriend and 3 year old) are unlikely to want to go full on keto too. I would be intrigued to find out if there are keto devotees with families who do manage to make it work though.

The ketonauts say otherwise, but I'm absolutely convinced of the benefits of going "part-keto"; cut right back on your everyday sugar, do more fasted riding, and fuel as much exercise as you can with non-carby stuff. There is science showing that some adaptations occur, and they're beneficial. I've certainly benefitted.

<resists urge to post tedious long-distance fat-burning anecdote ... >


This ^^^^  I went fully Keto for 6 months - lost loads of weight... long distance benefits are amazing but I found it impossible to maintain with a pregnant other half and 5 year old child.   Now im just very low carb and little or no sugar wherever possible.   We eat real food, with an emphasis on low carb.  I don't eat bread ect.   I still get most of the fat adapted benefits of keto with the added benefit of not worrying about eating some carbs before and after exercise.

My two biggest issues with a traditional (BAD) diet was gut problems during distance events and massive hunger and over eating once finished.   Both of these problems have gone now.   I feel so much better on a low carb diet on a day to day basis that I don't ever see myself going back.

I find I am fat adapted enough to without carb loading and comfortable with fasted exercise in order to do away with the massive over eating that used to sustain my cycling and recovery.

Im also convinced that doing away with sugar and carbs after exercise helps with recovery as your body has less inflammation to deal with.

LMT

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #32 on: July 18, 2017, 08:20:20 pm »
Thanks to everyone who's taken the time to reply. I'm intrigued by the whole Keto thing, but I just don't have the focus/resources to be able to make it work for me as my lodgers (girlfriend and 3 year old) are unlikely to want to go full on keto too. I would be intrigued to find out if there are keto devotees with families who do manage to make it work though.

The ketonauts say otherwise, but I'm absolutely convinced of the benefits of going "part-keto"; cut right back on your everyday sugar, do more fasted riding, and fuel as much exercise as you can with non-carby stuff. There is science showing that some adaptations occur, and they're beneficial. I've certainly benefitted.

<resists urge to post tedious long-distance fat-burning anecdote ... >


This ^^^^  I went fully Keto for 6 months - lost loads of weight... long distance benefits are amazing but I found it impossible to maintain with a pregnant other half and 5 year old child.   Now im just very low carb and little or no sugar wherever possible.   We eat real food, with an emphasis on low carb.  I don't eat bread ect.   I still get most of the fat adapted benefits of keto with the added benefit of not worrying about eating some carbs before and after exercise.

My two biggest issues with a traditional (BAD) diet was gut problems during distance events and massive hunger and over eating once finished.   Both of these problems have gone now.   I feel so much better on a low carb diet on a day to day basis that I don't ever see myself going back.

I find I am fat adapted enough to without carb loading and comfortable with fasted exercise in order to do away with the massive over eating that used to sustain my cycling and recovery.

Im also convinced that doing away with sugar and carbs after exercise helps with recovery as your body has less inflammation to deal with.

What?? :facepalm:


dim

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #33 on: July 18, 2017, 10:27:45 pm »
on long hard rides, you need sugar ...thats why the guys who rode Inipak were eating Conneto and Magnum ice creams etc , and thats why many people who ride long Audax always stop and eatc chocolate cake ...

 gels have a high sugar content, but it's artificial sugars similar / spin off of asparatine (which is very very bad for you)... rather use the baby food fruit stuff  which has natural sugars .... banana and cononut flavour has a high sugar content (from my personal taste)

and if you arce cycling and your body needs more food, it will tell you, and you will crave for what is needed (such as fish and chips, pizza, macdonalds etc) ....

when you really need a boost, have a Frijj chocolate milkshake

and forget about these fad diets ....

make a good smoothie everyday with a nutribullet (add stuff like spinnach, fresh beetroot, fresh fruit, coconut water etc), and have that for breakfast with cooked oats ....

eat sensibly for lunch and dinner, then go on a ride of approx 25 miles at pace most mornings, and you will loose weight, get fitter and ride faster


I'm speaking from experience  :)
“No great mind has ever existed without a touch of madness.” - Aristotle

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #34 on: July 19, 2017, 07:01:17 am »
Thanks to everyone who's taken the time to reply. I'm intrigued by the whole Keto thing, but I just don't have the focus/resources to be able to make it work for me as my lodgers (girlfriend and 3 year old) are unlikely to want to go full on keto too. I would be intrigued to find out if there are keto devotees with families who do manage to make it work though.

The ketonauts say otherwise, but I'm absolutely convinced of the benefits of going "part-keto"; cut right back on your everyday sugar, do more fasted riding, and fuel as much exercise as you can with non-carby stuff. There is science showing that some adaptations occur, and they're beneficial. I've certainly benefitted.

<resists urge to post tedious long-distance fat-burning anecdote ... >


This ^^^^  I went fully Keto for 6 months - lost loads of weight... long distance benefits are amazing but I found it impossible to maintain with a pregnant other half and 5 year old child.   Now im just very low carb and little or no sugar wherever possible.   We eat real food, with an emphasis on low carb.  I don't eat bread ect.   I still get most of the fat adapted benefits of keto with the added benefit of not worrying about eating some carbs before and after exercise.

My two biggest issues with a traditional (BAD) diet was gut problems during distance events and massive hunger and over eating once finished.   Both of these problems have gone now.   I feel so much better on a low carb diet on a day to day basis that I don't ever see myself going back.

I find I am fat adapted enough to without carb loading and comfortable with fasted exercise in order to do away with the massive over eating that used to sustain my cycling and recovery.

Im also convinced that doing away with sugar and carbs after exercise helps with recovery as your body has less inflammation to deal with.

What?? :facepalm:


Im doing much better in life now on a fat-protein-based diet because it's packed with more of the nutrients that are used to rebuild muscle, such as protein. The low carb foods I eat are rich in antioxidants, which generate less inflammation and free radicals than sugar/carbs. For pure efficiency's sake, fat burns "cleaner" than sugar in that it leaves less metabolic junk behind in the mitochondria.

I can only speak from my own experience but I find my body recovers better after exercise when filled up with fats and protein rather than carbs and sugar.   

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #35 on: July 19, 2017, 07:54:14 am »
Fascinating to get such a wide range of perspectives. It seems that something that suits one person can be entirely unsuitable for another and diets that would once have been considered extreme are now accepted as almost mainstream.
Please keep your viewpoints coming. Whilst some of the dietary solutions seem to require full on commitment to see tangible results, I'm planning to pick and choose a few ideas that gut instinct is telling me might work for me and see how they go.

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #36 on: July 19, 2017, 10:09:13 am »

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #37 on: July 19, 2017, 10:26:59 am »
HK and I find that as we get fitter, we naturally shift to a 'lean burn' metabolism. Nutritional needs drop, dips in performance level out and so on. There is no particular shift in our diets, a fair mix of carbs, fats and protein.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

hellymedic

  • Just do it!
Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #38 on: July 19, 2017, 12:17:45 pm »
LWaB makes a good point. The non-zealots shift to fat-burning with adaptation.

Some folk can neither absorb fat from food nor access body fat quickly enough to sustain anything more than minimal progress.

They either need to eat some carbs or move slowly.

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #39 on: July 19, 2017, 01:56:46 pm »
Quote
on long hard rides, you need sugar
This is demonstrably untrue.  You need a source of fuel for your muscles and just like hybrid cars we are bifuel.  We can run on FFA or glucose.  Glucose/glycogen is in very limited supply and needs topping up regularly (think car battery).  The Free Fatty acids, FFA, are to all intents and purposes limitless.

We have to define what we mean by a long hard ride.  An Olympic triathlon or marathon is defined by many as an endurance sport but we in this group are realistically talking about 24+hours of exercise at Zone2/3 power levels. 

if you are Chris Froome then you need to fuel on glycogen because it is the fast response total power fuel.  We are doing manily zone 2/3 exercise and do not need glycogen/glucose as a major energy source.  I expect that I will run on FFA upto the hills and then probably drop into glucose metabolism for the hills and then have some carbs before setting off south again.  Until thirsk I am planning essentially zero carbs

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #40 on: July 19, 2017, 02:20:30 pm »
My fuzzy memory of metabolism says that a normal non-adapted person runs on a mixture of energy pathways, normally breaking foods down to glucose/glycogen but also using some under the FFA pathway directly. Some Glycogen released slowly from stores in the liver.
Is that vaguely correct?

Whenever I've done super-long (more than 24hrs without sleep) stints of anything (with or without physical exertion), I reach a point where my body loathes the idea of ingesting any more sugary substances and craves savoury things, particularly savoury liquids. Soup or savoury stew seems like food of the gods then.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #41 on: July 19, 2017, 02:30:41 pm »
I would also make the point that high performance doesn't necessarily go hand in hand with good long term health.   The way professional athletes are required to fuel in order to win isn't normally very "good" for them in the long term.

For the average audaxer... do you really need to be eating cakes, energy bars, gels and sports drink constantly through a ride and after?   I certainly didn't and it only took a few weeks for my body to adjust.   

My diet may not be the best possible way to fuel peak performance in a time trial....but ive lost the best part of 5 stone on this diet which I'm pretty sure has a bigger impact than being to access energy from sugar quickly.   

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #42 on: July 19, 2017, 04:38:30 pm »
I fuel purely from sports food (carb) when I ride TTs.    For audax it's normal food at controls and snacking on sports food between controls.

I found that my digestion worked better with little and often rather than large meals at 3-4hr intervals.   

Also don't forget hydration.   Many a well-planned feeding strategy has been ruined by forgetting to drink and then feeling too sick to take food on.

hellymedic

  • Just do it!
Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #43 on: July 19, 2017, 04:50:31 pm »
Don't forget chilling/cooling/warming when thinking of hydrating and fuelling!

You won't absorb effectively if you're too hot or cold.

dim

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #44 on: July 20, 2017, 06:53:41 am »
Thanks to everyone who's taken the time to reply. I'm intrigued by the whole Keto thing, but I just don't have the focus/resources to be able to make it work for me as my lodgers (girlfriend and 3 year old) are unlikely to want to go full on keto too. I would be intrigued to find out if there are keto devotees with families who do manage to make it work though.

The ketonauts say otherwise, but I'm absolutely convinced of the benefits of going "part-keto"; cut right back on your everyday sugar, do more fasted riding, and fuel as much exercise as you can with non-carby stuff. There is science showing that some adaptations occur, and they're beneficial. I've certainly benefitted.

<resists urge to post tedious long-distance fat-burning anecdote ... >


This ^^^^  I went fully Keto for 6 months - lost loads of weight... long distance benefits are amazing but I found it impossible to maintain with a pregnant other half and 5 year old child.   Now im just very low carb and little or no sugar wherever possible.   We eat real food, with an emphasis on low carb.  I don't eat bread ect.   I still get most of the fat adapted benefits of keto with the added benefit of not worrying about eating some carbs before and after exercise.

My two biggest issues with a traditional (BAD) diet was gut problems during distance events and massive hunger and over eating once finished.   Both of these problems have gone now.   I feel so much better on a low carb diet on a day to day basis that I don't ever see myself going back.

I find I am fat adapted enough to without carb loading and comfortable with fasted exercise in order to do away with the massive over eating that used to sustain my cycling and recovery.

Im also convinced that doing away with sugar and carbs after exercise helps with recovery as your body has less inflammation to deal with.

What?? :facepalm:


Im doing much better in life now on a fat-protein-based diet because it's packed with more of the nutrients that are used to rebuild muscle, such as protein. The low carb foods I eat are rich in antioxidants, which generate less inflammation and free radicals than sugar/carbs. For pure efficiency's sake, fat burns "cleaner" than sugar in that it leaves less metabolic junk behind in the mitochondria.

I can only speak from my own experience but I find my body recovers better after exercise when filled up with fats and protein rather than carbs and sugar.   

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doo-R1eY_vI

“No great mind has ever existed without a touch of madness.” - Aristotle

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #45 on: July 20, 2017, 11:14:21 am »
Thanks to everyone who's taken the time to reply. I'm intrigued by the whole Keto thing, but I just don't have the focus/resources to be able to make it work for me as my lodgers (girlfriend and 3 year old) are unlikely to want to go full on keto too. I would be intrigued to find out if there are keto devotees with families who do manage to make it work though.

The ketonauts say otherwise, but I'm absolutely convinced of the benefits of going "part-keto"; cut right back on your everyday sugar, do more fasted riding, and fuel as much exercise as you can with non-carby stuff. There is science showing that some adaptations occur, and they're beneficial. I've certainly benefitted.

<resists urge to post tedious long-distance fat-burning anecdote ... >


This ^^^^  I went fully Keto for 6 months - lost loads of weight... long distance benefits are amazing but I found it impossible to maintain with a pregnant other half and 5 year old child.   Now im just very low carb and little or no sugar wherever possible.   We eat real food, with an emphasis on low carb.  I don't eat bread ect.   I still get most of the fat adapted benefits of keto with the added benefit of not worrying about eating some carbs before and after exercise.

My two biggest issues with a traditional (BAD) diet was gut problems during distance events and massive hunger and over eating once finished.   Both of these problems have gone now.   I feel so much better on a low carb diet on a day to day basis that I don't ever see myself going back.

I find I am fat adapted enough to without carb loading and comfortable with fasted exercise in order to do away with the massive over eating that used to sustain my cycling and recovery.

Im also convinced that doing away with sugar and carbs after exercise helps with recovery as your body has less inflammation to deal with.

What?? :facepalm:


Im doing much better in life now on a fat-protein-based diet because it's packed with more of the nutrients that are used to rebuild muscle, such as protein. The low carb foods I eat are rich in antioxidants, which generate less inflammation and free radicals than sugar/carbs. For pure efficiency's sake, fat burns "cleaner" than sugar in that it leaves less metabolic junk behind in the mitochondria.

I can only speak from my own experience but I find my body recovers better after exercise when filled up with fats and protein rather than carbs and sugar.   

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doo-R1eY_vI

no one is arguing Chris Froome should be on a low carb diet.

I will just repeat what I said above that elite performance doesn't necessarily go hand in hand with good long term health.   Audax UK isn't The Tour and fuelling constantly with refined sugar isn't a very good idea...and certainly isn't necessary.

The original poster was saying he couldn't fuel effectively with sugar and carbs without having bloating and stomach problems.   That's the exact issue I had and it wasn't solved by just eating different products or eating them in different quantities at different durations.   A high fat, low carb diet has helped me and many others with that exact issue with the added bonus that I lost loads of weight and became a much healthier person.   I am only offering an opinion.  Do your own research and make your own decisions until you find something that works.... but don't compare elite professional fuelling with good long term healthy diets for amateur endurance athletes.

mattc

  • "Hannibal"
  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #46 on: July 20, 2017, 03:27:59 pm »
The OP asked about nutrition on a 1000k-in-3-days event. Typically 50hrs of riding over very hilly terrain. Chris Froome doesn't do anything like those durations, so it's quite possible that his optimum diet is very different. (most tour stages are 4-6 hours?)
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #47 on: July 20, 2017, 06:39:30 pm »
The OP asked about nutrition on a 1000k-in-3-days event. Typically 50hrs of riding over very hilly terrain. Chris Froome doesn't do anything like those durations, so it's quite possible that his optimum diet is very different. (most tour stages are 4-6 hours?)
The power requirements for a hilly/mountainous stage are huge - there's no way anyone can produce 400W for an hour when burning fat, so it would make sense that the diet would have to be different to doing epic distances somewhat slower. 
I would argue that the dietary requirements for someone to do 1000km in 3 days are also extreme, just in a different way. It may well be that a keto style diet works better for that sort of athletic endeavour - given how nutrition (especially sports nutrition) is so personal, the only way for the OP to find out is to try it.

I like Angry Chef, and much of his argument is against woo when it is claiming to be able to do things that it really shouldn't be going anywhere near (such as eating disorders, cancer treatment etc). I'm sure he would be fairly critical of the sugar based diet of TdF riders if presented to him out of the TdF context. Fueling for extreme athletic feats is not really in scope for his ranting, so I'm not sure he'd be that bothered by a lower carb diet as a means of riding extreme distance events. I would find it interesting to hear his take on this discussion - I don't think there has been much un-adulterated evangelising here.

LMT

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #48 on: July 20, 2017, 09:20:07 pm »
Thanks to everyone who's taken the time to reply. I'm intrigued by the whole Keto thing, but I just don't have the focus/resources to be able to make it work for me as my lodgers (girlfriend and 3 year old) are unlikely to want to go full on keto too. I would be intrigued to find out if there are keto devotees with families who do manage to make it work though.

The ketonauts say otherwise, but I'm absolutely convinced of the benefits of going "part-keto"; cut right back on your everyday sugar, do more fasted riding, and fuel as much exercise as you can with non-carby stuff. There is science showing that some adaptations occur, and they're beneficial. I've certainly benefitted.

<resists urge to post tedious long-distance fat-burning anecdote ... >


This ^^^^  I went fully Keto for 6 months - lost loads of weight... long distance benefits are amazing but I found it impossible to maintain with a pregnant other half and 5 year old child.   Now im just very low carb and little or no sugar wherever possible.   We eat real food, with an emphasis on low carb.  I don't eat bread ect.   I still get most of the fat adapted benefits of keto with the added benefit of not worrying about eating some carbs before and after exercise.

My two biggest issues with a traditional (BAD) diet was gut problems during distance events and massive hunger and over eating once finished.   Both of these problems have gone now.   I feel so much better on a low carb diet on a day to day basis that I don't ever see myself going back.

I find I am fat adapted enough to without carb loading and comfortable with fasted exercise in order to do away with the massive over eating that used to sustain my cycling and recovery.

Im also convinced that doing away with sugar and carbs after exercise helps with recovery as your body has less inflammation to deal with.

What?? :facepalm:


Im doing much better in life now on a fat-protein-based diet because it's packed with more of the nutrients that are used to rebuild muscle, such as protein. The low carb foods I eat are rich in antioxidants, which generate less inflammation and free radicals than sugar/carbs. For pure efficiency's sake, fat burns "cleaner" than sugar in that it leaves less metabolic junk behind in the mitochondria.

I can only speak from my own experience but I find my body recovers better after exercise when filled up with fats and protein rather than carbs and sugar.   

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doo-R1eY_vI

no one is arguing Chris Froome should be on a low carb diet.

I will just repeat what I said above that elite performance doesn't necessarily go hand in hand with good long term health.   Audax UK isn't The Tour and fuelling constantly with refined sugar isn't a very good idea...and certainly isn't necessary.

The original poster was saying he couldn't fuel effectively with sugar and carbs without having bloating and stomach problems.   That's the exact issue I had and it wasn't solved by just eating different products or eating them in different quantities at different durations.   A high fat, low carb diet has helped me and many others with that exact issue with the added bonus that I lost loads of weight and became a much healthier person.   I am only offering an opinion.  Do your own research and make your own decisions until you find something that works.... but don't compare elite professional fuelling with good long term healthy diets for amateur endurance athletes.

If you are referring to keto here with an emphasis on animal products then it's not long term and it ain't certainly ain't healthy.

dim

Re: Long Distance Nutrition - Audax
« Reply #49 on: July 20, 2017, 09:43:20 pm »
Thanks to everyone who's taken the time to reply. I'm intrigued by the whole Keto thing, but I just don't have the focus/resources to be able to make it work for me as my lodgers (girlfriend and 3 year old) are unlikely to want to go full on keto too. I would be intrigued to find out if there are keto devotees with families who do manage to make it work though.

The ketonauts say otherwise, but I'm absolutely convinced of the benefits of going "part-keto"; cut right back on your everyday sugar, do more fasted riding, and fuel as much exercise as you can with non-carby stuff. There is science showing that some adaptations occur, and they're beneficial. I've certainly benefitted.

<resists urge to post tedious long-distance fat-burning anecdote ... >


This ^^^^  I went fully Keto for 6 months - lost loads of weight... long distance benefits are amazing but I found it impossible to maintain with a pregnant other half and 5 year old child.   Now im just very low carb and little or no sugar wherever possible.   We eat real food, with an emphasis on low carb.  I don't eat bread ect.   I still get most of the fat adapted benefits of keto with the added benefit of not worrying about eating some carbs before and after exercise.

My two biggest issues with a traditional (BAD) diet was gut problems during distance events and massive hunger and over eating once finished.   Both of these problems have gone now.   I feel so much better on a low carb diet on a day to day basis that I don't ever see myself going back.

I find I am fat adapted enough to without carb loading and comfortable with fasted exercise in order to do away with the massive over eating that used to sustain my cycling and recovery.

Im also convinced that doing away with sugar and carbs after exercise helps with recovery as your body has less inflammation to deal with.

What?? :facepalm:


Im doing much better in life now on a fat-protein-based diet because it's packed with more of the nutrients that are used to rebuild muscle, such as protein. The low carb foods I eat are rich in antioxidants, which generate less inflammation and free radicals than sugar/carbs. For pure efficiency's sake, fat burns "cleaner" than sugar in that it leaves less metabolic junk behind in the mitochondria.

I can only speak from my own experience but I find my body recovers better after exercise when filled up with fats and protein rather than carbs and sugar.   

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doo-R1eY_vI

no one is arguing Chris Froome should be on a low carb diet.

I will just repeat what I said above that elite performance doesn't necessarily go hand in hand with good long term health.   Audax UK isn't The Tour and fuelling constantly with refined sugar isn't a very good idea...and certainly isn't necessary.

The original poster was saying he couldn't fuel effectively with sugar and carbs without having bloating and stomach problems.   That's the exact issue I had and it wasn't solved by just eating different products or eating them in different quantities at different durations.   A high fat, low carb diet has helped me and many others with that exact issue with the added bonus that I lost loads of weight and became a much healthier person.   I am only offering an opinion.  Do your own research and make your own decisions until you find something that works.... but don't compare elite professional fuelling with good long term healthy diets for amateur endurance athletes.

well watch this and give your comments:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NoU_7E_DIxU

“No great mind has ever existed without a touch of madness.” - Aristotle