Author Topic: Community Speedwatch Group  (Read 1874 times)

Community Speedwatch Group
« on: July 24, 2017, 10:32:36 am »
It seems I'm not alone in being fed up with motons ignoring speed limits. Our excellent local councilor has approached the Neighborhood Police Team with a view to setting up a Community Speedwatch group in this area.
We had a village meeting of interested parties and once the vetting, training and risk assessment is done their will be another bit of slightly safer  road for a few hours a month.
" One Cup Of Tea Is Never Enough But 2 Is One Too Many " - John Shuttleworth

Jaded

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  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #1 on: July 24, 2017, 10:36:49 am »
The challenge with ours has been to keep the volunteers engaged, and to get a sustained good level of support from the Police to write the letters, they are really struggling with manpower. We eventually bought a gun.
If you don't like your democracy, vote against it.

Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2017, 10:48:23 am »
The police sergeant who co-chaired the meeting came across as very committed and it seems that all the groups in Wales  send their observations to a central unit who send out the letters and arrange visits etc. So we can but hope.

Is you're group still going?



" One Cup Of Tea Is Never Enough But 2 Is One Too Many " - John Shuttleworth

Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #3 on: July 24, 2017, 10:51:20 am »
We eventually bought a gun.

Goodness - that sounds a little extreme.

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #4 on: July 24, 2017, 10:59:51 am »
Our group is still going, yes, but is sporadic.

We also note liveried vehicles and write to the Head Offices.

A real gun - yes that would be interesting!
If you don't like your democracy, vote against it.

Andrij

  • Андрій
  • Ερασιτεχνικός μισάνθρωπος
Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #5 on: July 24, 2017, 11:09:02 am »
We eventually bought a gun.

Something easily moved and camouflaged, I hope.

;D  Andrij.  I pronounce you Complete and Utter GIT   :thumbsup:

Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #6 on: July 24, 2017, 11:42:09 am »
Easily adapted for Jurek users would be important, too


Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #7 on: July 24, 2017, 12:54:38 pm »
Attempts to start one in the village where I live have failed due to a lack of volunteers.  We were informed that folk using the device would be known to those receiving any letters for travelling too fast and there was concern about recriminations. Cost of the device and training was between £350-400.

ian

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Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #8 on: July 24, 2017, 04:07:40 pm »
It's just an idea, but perhaps we could, oh I don't know, have an organization dedicated to upholding the law. They could have uniforms and cars with lights on the top and say stuff like 'you're nicked, my son.'

Whimsy, I know.
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Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #9 on: July 24, 2017, 08:50:15 pm »
We ran a speed watch session on my street and caught one speeder every minute on average despite 4 uniformed officers (3 in high vis) standing in full view holding a speed gun.

Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #10 on: July 24, 2017, 09:11:40 pm »
A village in our cycle roaming zone held a scarecrow festival a few years ago. One was standing next to the village name sign on the edge of the village was wearing high-viz and armed with a hairdryer.
To a cyclist it was obviously a scarecrow, but as a man in high viz with a sort-of speed gun, he appeared to be a rather successful deterrent.  ;D

Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #11 on: July 24, 2017, 11:01:26 pm »
A village in our cycle roaming zone held a scarecrow festival a few years ago. One was standing next to the village name sign on the edge of the village was wearing high-viz and armed with a hairdryer.
To a cyclist it was obviously a scarecrow, but as a man in high viz with a sort-of speed gun, he appeared to be a rather successful deterrent.  ;D
Saw one in Powys the other week (village called Furnace I think).  The  yellow Marigold hands kind of spoiled the illusion a bit!
Attempts to start one in the village where I live have failed due to a lack of volunteers.  We were informed that folk using the device would be known to those receiving any letters for travelling too fast and there was concern about recriminations. Cost of the device and training was between £350-400.
Our group will be drawn from several villages and we could if we wished do our turn in the other villages if intimidation/recrimination was a worry.
At least that's the way it was sold to us.
" One Cup Of Tea Is Never Enough But 2 Is One Too Many " - John Shuttleworth

Jaded

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  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2017, 12:37:59 am »
If you give in to the threat of intimidation, then it wins.
If you don't like your democracy, vote against it.

MikeFromLFE

  • Previously known as Millimole
Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #13 on: July 25, 2017, 09:03:43 am »
Out riding my bike a year or so ago, I saw a community speedwatch group in action in a nearby village, so I stopped and had a chat. I must have spent 20 minutes with them, and yes they were noting the vehicles going over the limit, but they were also fabricating speeds for 'vehicles they didn't like' - mostly motorbikes, but also two 'hot hatches'. I was appalled at this display of vigilantes at work. Yes - I did contact the County Speedwatch group who funds these nutters, but never got a reply. I've never seen them out again, but that's not to say this isn't still happening.
The take-home message as far as I'm concerned is that there needs to be robust internal & external QA within any group of this nature.


Tapatalk puts this signature here, not me!
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Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #14 on: July 25, 2017, 11:39:35 am »
If you give in to the threat of intimidation, then it wins.

I agree, but trying to persuade others to join is not proving successful.  Not everyone is of stout character.

Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #15 on: July 25, 2017, 11:45:31 am »
Out riding my bike a year or so ago, I saw a community speedwatch group in action in a nearby village, so I stopped and had a chat. I must have spent 20 minutes with them, and yes they were noting the vehicles going over the limit, but they were also fabricating speeds for 'vehicles they didn't like' - mostly motorbikes, but also two 'hot hatches'. I was appalled at this display of vigilantes at work. Yes - I did contact the County Speedwatch group who funds these nutters, but never got a reply. I've never seen them out again, but that's not to say this isn't still happening.
The take-home message as far as I'm concerned is that there needs to be robust internal & external QA within any group of this nature.


Tapatalk puts this signature here, not me!
It was a response to similar behaviour (from Dutch police re an amber light, apparently) that the original Gatso was invented.
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Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #16 on: July 25, 2017, 11:57:36 am »
I am a local CSW co-ordinator for our village(s).  Our CSW group is supported by the parish council (indeed instigated by them) and the Chair of the council is very active regionally in ensuring CSW is well supported by the police.  We only deploy 2-3 times a month - limited mostly by my own available time as co-ordinator and by the need to not overwork our limited pool of volunteers.

In terms of being known to the perpetrators this hasn't been a problem in the two years I've run the local team.  The worst abuse we've had is from White Van Man as they zoom past.

The normal process in Hampshire is that the speeders (35mph and above) get recorded and details have to be input by the police within 2 weeks.  They then get sent a letter. Any one getting a third letter (and this is collated regionally so it picks up speeders in different areas) should receive an "educational visit" from a PCSO or regular copper.

We have pushed for, and now receive support from the police so that we can escalate particular drivers for an swifter police visit (i.e. don't wait for the third offence.) This is triggered where excessive speed is involved (50+ in a 30mph) or potentially also where we catch the same driver doing the same speed at the same time on successive days and where there is a logical likelihood of catching them on subsequent days during their regular commute.

Ultimately though, there is significant discussion among volunteers as to whether we achieve anything other than temporarily slowing some drivers while we're at the roadside.  The police too now see CSW as a first level of policing, therefore this helps them reduce budgets for proper enforcement.  Enforcement is now very much focused on where casualty accidents have happened rather than on locations where the world and his wife fully anticipates imminent death and disaster.

Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #17 on: July 27, 2017, 07:31:10 pm »
I am a local CSW co-ordinator for our village(s).  Our CSW group is supported by the parish council (indeed instigated by them) and the Chair of the council is very active regionally in ensuring CSW is well supported by the police. 

The normal process in Hampshire is that the speeders (35mph and above) get recorded and details have to be input by the police within 2 weeks.  They then get sent a letter. Any one getting a third letter (and this is collated regionally so it picks up speeders in different areas) should receive an "educational visit" from a PCSO or regular copper.

We have pushed for, and now receive support from the police so that we can escalate particular drivers for an swifter police visit (i.e. don't wait for the third offence.) This is triggered where excessive speed is involved (50+ in a 30mph) or potentially also where we catch the same driver doing the same speed at the same time on successive days and where there is a logical likelihood of catching them on subsequent days during their regular commute.


That's pretty much how our scheme is going to operate. The scheme is at the instigation of our ward county councillor and a bit of extra oomph might come from the fact that the local MP lives in this ward as well.
" One Cup Of Tea Is Never Enough But 2 Is One Too Many " - John Shuttleworth

Gattopardo

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Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #18 on: July 27, 2017, 08:54:45 pm »
Fun catching the locals...


Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #19 on: July 28, 2017, 09:46:39 am »
I can't think what you mean ::-) :demon:
" One Cup Of Tea Is Never Enough But 2 Is One Too Many " - John Shuttleworth

Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #20 on: July 28, 2017, 09:56:34 am »
Mrs Q got caught  ::-)  So did the wife of one of the other CSW volunteers.  It just goes to show how many people persistently take the view that "the speed limit is 30 so I'll go just a bit faster and I'll be okay".

It's just as well the law is less flexible on theft, otherwise everyone would think they could get away with "just a little bit of shoplifting".

Gattopardo

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Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #21 on: July 28, 2017, 10:04:00 am »
Also make sure the 'doing someone's job unpaid' people have good enough eyesight to get the correct registration plate.


Mrs Q got caught  ::-)  So did the wife of one of the other CSW volunteers.  It just goes to show how many people persistently take the view that "the speed limit is 30 so I'll go just a bit faster and I'll be okay".


Is it the locals old adage I know the road so I can go faster?

Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #22 on: July 28, 2017, 10:12:33 am »
There is a quality check in the process to ensure correct registrations are taken:
1. minimum 3 volunteers by the roadside during a deployment.
2. our group has one volunteer to solely captures the registration, and this is corroborated by their colleagues.
3. we check our records against public databases to ensure match between registration and noted vehicle details, and filter out any obvious goofs before submitting to the police.
4. we have to capture registration,  vehicle colour, make and model.
5. we have to transpose our records from the roadside into a spreadsheet to ensure we interpret our own handwriting correctly, and submit the roadside records to the police in case any queries are received from the drivers.

To be honest, given that the drivers eyesight is obviously so bad that they didn't see all the speed limit signs I'd be more worried about the visual capabilities of the drivers than the CSW volunteers.

Yes, we do catch a lot of locals - which is great, since it's also the locals that tell us they want something done about the speeding, so ultimately they put pressure on each other to conform.  However, we also record lots of commuters who pass through the parish on their way to work, and delivery drivers, school buses, 8 wheeler tipper wagons doing 50+ etc.  I've heard people say "I always keep to the speed limit in my village, but don't elsewhere" :facepalm:

Gattopardo

  • Lord of the sith
  • Overseaing the building of the death star
Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #23 on: July 28, 2017, 10:18:19 am »
My luck to get one then...when the car was in another country.

Pain in the arse to deal with.  Never did get an apology.

Re: Community Speedwatch Group
« Reply #24 on: July 28, 2017, 10:28:43 am »
It's regrettable that errors do occur, and there are also a lot who get away because they're running on dodgy number plates or vehicles have been cloned.  However, the number of complaints, at least locally, is very, very low, and none I'm aware of within our team after four years of activity.  Errors should be dealt with properly.  Ultimately, the scheme aims to help prevent this sort of comment (edited a bit to remove sensitive info) which I received yesterday:

The policeman said he spoke just now to a lady horse rider in tears - twice almost pushed off the road by speeding vehicles.

Given that Hants highways have stated policy to only focus on casualty sites, near misses are wholly ignored. Cyclist KSI stats have doubled in the county in the last 10 years.