Author Topic: Canyon Grail  (Read 2077 times)


LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2018, 10:56:00 am »
So they've mounted a set of Scott Drop In bars upside down. Whatever.
http://www.bikepro.com/products/handlebars/scottdrop.html
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

citoyen

  • Cat 6 Racer
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2018, 11:12:58 am »
There's a lot of this kind of thing about at the moment. Specialized have updated the Diverge with their Future Shock suspension in the headset, and then there's this from Lauf:
http://www.laufforks.com/true-grit/#LTGIntro


Cudzoziemiec

  • Solar powered, tea fuelled cycle-wol
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2018, 11:24:45 am »
Or they've relaunched the butterfly bar in roadie-acceptable styling. It's potentially clever, but I'm not convinced it's a problem that really needed solving. Do people actually find the drops too flexible and/or the tops too harsh? I suppose track sprinters, for instance, might find drops flexing.* It's not something I've ever felt!

*Edit: Got to wonder how the UCI will react to this shape!
sideways bounding monkey lounging under fruit tree

Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #4 on: March 15, 2018, 11:34:49 am »
It's potentially clever, but I'm not convinced it's a problem that really needed solving.
Pretty much my take on it too.  :hand:

citoyen

  • Cat 6 Racer
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2018, 11:37:05 am »
I'm not convinced it's a problem that really needed solving

Depends what you consider to be the problem they're attempting to solve - some might say it's the problem of cyclists not buying enough new gear... ;)

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2018, 11:46:51 am »
I'd be more impressed if I could mount lights, GPS, etc. to both levels. I've seen plenty of PBP folk with a PVC pipe between their drop bars to support extra lighting.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2018, 11:50:29 am »
I'm not convinced it's a problem that really needed solving

Depends what you consider to be the problem they're attempting to solve - some might say it's the problem of cyclists not buying enough new gear... ;)

Or wanting to increase the stack without buying expensive new frame moulds.  Much like Specialized's riser drop bar. :hand:

Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2018, 12:42:31 pm »
There's a lot of this kind of thing about at the moment.

I think the next innovation will be a pair of pistons in the fork blades to really absorb the bumps. Then fatter tyres. And wide flat bars for better control off road. Maybe some suspension at the back too...

citoyen

  • Cat 6 Racer
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #9 on: March 15, 2018, 12:57:46 pm »

Cudzoziemiec

  • Solar powered, tea fuelled cycle-wol
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #10 on: March 15, 2018, 01:02:25 pm »
I'm not convinced it's a problem that really needed solving

Depends what you consider to be the problem they're attempting to solve - some might say it's the problem of cyclists not buying enough new gear... ;)
Anecdotal evidence (my bank account) would suggest this problem has long been solved!
sideways bounding monkey lounging under fruit tree

Mr Larrington

  • A bit ov a lyv wyr by slof standirds
  • Custard Wallah
    • Mr Larrington's Automatic Diary
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2018, 01:05:18 pm »
A grrrrrrrrrrrrail?

<== the one with "Tim" written across the shoulders
External Transparent Wall Inspection Operative & Mayor of Mortagne-au-Perche
Satisfying the Bloodlust of the Masses in Peacetime

Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #12 on: March 15, 2018, 01:08:54 pm »
Gravel bike.

zigzag

  • unfuckwithable
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #13 on: March 15, 2018, 02:21:34 pm »
the front end looks too busy/messy with all the tangled cables and double-decker bars. from an engineering pov i cannot see how there is more flex on the hoods - they are mounted right above drops which they claim are stiffer than on usual bars..
i have had good experience with their flexy seat posts - there's a lot of spring in them!

Samuel D

Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #14 on: March 15, 2018, 03:22:53 pm »
Looks like a Sopwith Camel.

Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #15 on: March 15, 2018, 03:29:49 pm »
the front end looks too busy/messy with all the tangled cables and double-decker bars. from an engineering pov i cannot see how there is more flex on the hoods - they are mounted right above drops which they claim are stiffer than on usual bars..
i have had good experience with their flexy seat posts - there's a lot of spring in them!
They aren't claiming more flex on the hoods, they are claiming more flex on the flat tops, and stiffer drops.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Cudzoziemiec

  • Solar powered, tea fuelled cycle-wol
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #16 on: March 15, 2018, 03:51:54 pm »
There's a (cursory) review on Grit: http://grit.cx/news/2018/03/first-ride-canyon-grail-cf-slx-8-0and-yes-yes-those-bars
They like the flexi tops but not the drops:
Quote
Bringing my palms to the top, I rested them there and kept turning a plodding cadence up the rough gravel road. And you know what? It was more comfortable. It was almost possible to feel the bar flex under the loading and unloading it underwent as the bike made its way over the chunky aggregate.

I’ll be honest, I’m not sure that I’ve ever thought “these bar tops are just too uncomfortable” before, but the Hover Bar was a pleasant place to be, and over the course of the ride, I started to settle into using them on the many draggy climbs.
Quote
It’s worth spending some time describing riding in the drops on the Grail. Those Hover Bars offer a great little “notch” between the lower cross-piece and the mid-section of the drop. It was perfectly placed for resting my thumb and as a result creating a super-secure, locked in grip. I found this extremely comfortable, and easy to spend a long time in, on smooth trails at least. The down side to this position is that it did feed back more bumps than you’d normally expect to feel in the drops. We rode through jumbled aggregate that would have been brutal on any gravel set up, and the Grail didn’t work miracles, but where the rest of the bike felt like it was working with you, in this particular scenario, the bars didn’t work as well for me. Once clear and on more flowing terrain, calm was restored, and returned to a lower tuck.
sideways bounding monkey lounging under fruit tree

Cudzoziemiec

  • Solar powered, tea fuelled cycle-wol
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #17 on: March 15, 2018, 03:52:54 pm »
Even if this particular design might not work that well, it's good that manufacturers are giving us more shapes of bars to experiment with.
sideways bounding monkey lounging under fruit tree

zigzag

  • unfuckwithable
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #18 on: March 15, 2018, 04:36:38 pm »
the front end looks too busy/messy with all the tangled cables and double-decker bars. from an engineering pov i cannot see how there is more flex on the hoods - they are mounted right above drops which they claim are stiffer than on usual bars..
i have had good experience with their flexy seat posts - there's a lot of spring in them!
They aren't claiming more flex on the hoods, they are claiming more flex on the flat tops, and stiffer drops.

i still don't get their logic - the flexy place is where people rarely hold their hands (usually when climbing steeper hills with virtually no weight on hands), and if one wants to control their bike on bumpy gravel track, they'll have to have their arms wide apart on the hoods where there is no flex and dampening of vibrations.
the way it should be - each shifter/hood should have a shock system i them (~1-2cm travel) and drops should be rigid. tops don't matter, especially for riding off-road.

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #19 on: March 15, 2018, 05:05:45 pm »
When I rode the 259km Paris-Roubaix Cyclo (in 2004?), most of the 50km of pave sectors was ridden with my hands on the tops. Hanging on anywhere else was worse. I didn't need to hold onto the hoods or drops to steer the bike around missing cobbles.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #20 on: March 15, 2018, 05:20:41 pm »

zigzag

  • unfuckwithable
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #21 on: March 15, 2018, 05:55:51 pm »
i agree re cobbles as they are bumpy but not loose unlike some gravel where you need a fair bit of force to keep the bike going where you want to.

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #22 on: March 15, 2018, 07:08:09 pm »
There is often mud on pave and I remember racing MTBs with narrow flat bars back in the late 1980s. Handlebar width is mostly fashion and personal preference. Steeper head angles and light front wheels don't need a lot of muscle to point them in the right direction.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Re: Canyon Grail
« Reply #23 on: March 15, 2018, 07:30:57 pm »
Tops for slops.