Author Topic: Audaxing on an e-bike  (Read 3236 times)

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Audaxing on an e-bike
« Reply #50 on: October 05, 2018, 04:36:23 pm »
Just enter and ride. AUK's regulations are quite clear that e-bikers can do BPs. Just let the organiser know at the finish that you were on an e-bike.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Re: Audaxing on an e-bike
« Reply #51 on: October 05, 2018, 05:38:22 pm »
Where is the line drawn?

J
Probably where the AUK members' consensus chooses it to be drawn. That won't be the "right" answer - but it will hopefully be a pragmatic answer, acceptable to most members. And it will probably evolve over time.

Where do YOU think it should be drawn? And tell us why your answer is the right one! :)

After about 5 years since my last Audax ride, having been forced to dramatically reduce my cycling due to health issues, I've come across this thread.
I'm a Lifetime Audax member, having started in 1984. I organised Audax events for several years.
Now aged 77, I've been reduced to fairly flat rides (not easy in the Brecon Beacons!). So, I've recently bought a Cube road carbon e-bike to help be so that I can ride up hills without significant breathing issues. The bike has the same gears, mudguards and lights as I would have on my normal Condor Audax bike.

My bike is limited to 25kph, but I only switch on power up the hills, so can make 250w battery last all day. This would of course not work in real mountains, but in Wales it's fine.

I don't want any Audax rides validated, as I can see that I would have assistance during the hardest parts of the ride.

My question is, would I be unwelcome riding BP's ? Should I ask each organizer in advance? Should I just enter in the normal way and get on with it?

Looking at the photo, I think I remember you from my days at Amersham RCC... I even bought a vintage Super Record RD from you!!

As above... you are very welcome at any BP, just let the organiser know, so that validation is not issued. BR will be next, it's just a question of time... e-bikes are still a new thing and people still need to come to terms with them

On a day to day basis, I like them being around, it gives me some extra motivation... catching an e-bike up a gentle slope on my way back from work is an achievement in itself!!  :thumbsup:


wilkyboy

  • "nick" by any other name
    • 16-inch wheels
Re: Audaxing on an e-bike
« Reply #52 on: October 05, 2018, 06:41:40 pm »
Now aged 77, I've been reduced to fairly flat rides (not easy in the Brecon Beacons!). So, I've recently bought a Cube road carbon e-bike to help be so that I can ride up hills without significant breathing issues.

Elderly member of Cambridge CTC — I think he's 85 — uses an e-bike as push-to-climb and pedals himself the rest of the way while the rest of us gurn.  Riding with him completely changed my point of view of e-bikes with respect to changes in health and age-related fitness, and he was awesomely knowledgeable about all things cycling too  :thumbsup:  It helps that it's not too hilly around Cambridge, but it's still not flat if you go south.

Before that I considered all e-bikes to be only good for Deliveroo riders, as most of those seem to be using them in e-moto mode, i.e. push-to-go.
RRTY #6 done; #7 aborted.  Cambridge Autumnals 27 October.

Re: Audaxing on an e-bike
« Reply #53 on: October 10, 2018, 04:33:06 pm »
Like most things in this multi-faceted world of ours, I tend towards live and let live on this sort of thing.  If it gets people out there riding beyond the point where they would normally be forced to give up by deteriorating health then surely that's a good thing.  I can also see a scenario where they offer a route back to fitness for some.

To give something a bit less back of a fag packet for how far would one go, this is quite useful: https://www.bosch-ebike.com/en/service/range-assistant/.



'Accumulating kilometres in the roughest road conditions'...

Re: Audaxing on an e-bike
« Reply #54 on: October 11, 2018, 07:51:50 pm »
Like most things in this multi-faceted world of ours, I tend towards live and let live on this sort of thing.  If it gets people out there riding beyond the point where they would normally be forced to give up by deteriorating health then surely that's a good thing.  I can also see a scenario where they offer a route back to fitness for some.

Absolutely.

BR will be next, it's just a question of time...
This fallacy keeps coming back despite the Board having made it abundantly clear that there is no intention to permit an extension to the use of e-bikes.

Grandad

  • Once upon a time
Re: Audaxing on an e-bike
« Reply #55 on: October 11, 2018, 09:44:19 pm »
Quote
Elderly member of Cambridge CTC — I think he's 85 — uses an e-bike as push-to-climb and pedals himself the rest of the way while the rest of us gurn.
Our slower Saturday ride regulars include 7 octogenarians and 8 who will achieve this sometime in the next 5 years.

4 of them have e-bikes and one has an e-trike.

The rest of us are watching developments in the technology very closely :)

Re: Audaxing on an e-bike
« Reply #56 on: October 12, 2018, 03:13:37 pm »
Here’s my reality check (from my slightly biased stance) on E-Bike & Audaxing from someone who’s ridden seven Audaxes on an Orbea Gain.

First off, and it has been said before, but I’ll say it again, you still have to peddle, you still have to use the gears and you still huff & puff up the hills (well I do anyway). The motor on the Gain is a relatively low powered assistance and if you want to cycle any distance you have to put in most of the effort yourself. You can’t put your feet up and let the motor do the work for you.

Range. At best you’re looking at 60miles, 80miles tops if you’re very economical with the power assistance, off or minimal on the flat & undulating section, keep the assistance for hills and even then cautiously. Throw in a hilly course, use the power a lot and you’ll half the above figure.

In theory you could take your charger with you, (an extra 2 or 3kg in your saddle bag) and if the café will let you, recharge as you have a cuppa. However, at 4 hours to recharge from flat you’re going to add an awful lot of time to your overall ride time and no way is the power assistance going to make up for that. Ah, you say, you could carry spare battery; A, not on the Gain the battery isn’t removable and B, they’re heavy, C, of the bikes I’ve seen that you can remove the battery, they’re very heavy, not suitable for Audaxes and often the E-bike equivalent of a BSO,  and D, that would be plain cheating, (just as it would be if you got a friend with a support car to meet you part way if you were riding regular bike).

Speed. With legit e-biks the powered assistance cuts off at 15.5mph. Any faster than that and it’s your power only. The motor has switched off.

Weight. My Gain weighs 13.5kg (that’s only a fraction more than a Dawes Galaxy) before I’ve added my kit because it has a relatively low powered motor and low capacity battery. Yes, you can get higher torque motors and bigger batteries, but they weight a ton. 25 to 30kg isn’t unheard of for that type of bike, but that extra weight makes them very difficult to ride without the power assistance and the extra weight drains the heavier battery even faster. Something about laws of diminishing returns.

Given the above simple battery range is going to stop anyone riding anything more than a 100k Audax, and even then you’ll be scrapping the bottom of the barrel if it’s a hilly course. Range will come as technology improves and AUK will have to reassess as it does, but at the moment I think the current rules are fare. Allow E-Bike to take part, but not to collect any AAA points or be eligible for any mileage claims.

I’d only ever done one audax before I got my Gain, as I said I’ve done seven since I got it. At the end of the day, it’s bums on seats we want, not an argument as to whether you are a Little or Big Endian.

My question is, would I be unwelcome riding BP's ? Should I ask each organizer in advance? Should I just enter in the normal way and get on with it?
Short answer to this question; You'll be made very welcome. No one has ever raised so much as an eyebrow when I've turned up on my Gain. I don't boast the fact it's an E-Bike, but I don't deny it if someone asks. When they do it's then twenty question about the bike and jokes if they can draft behind me or if I've got a tow rope with me.

Kim

  • 2nd in the world
Re: Audaxing on an e-bike
« Reply #57 on: October 12, 2018, 03:28:43 pm »
I specified the electric assist on barakta's trike to be able to comfortably do a 100km ride.  It's heavy, with a massive battery, but it'll get you round a hilly ride with the assistance at a moderate level throughout.  Charge time about 2.5-3 hours, and the additional weight of the charger would be lost in the noise (all up weight is something like 38kg with battery and motor).  I reckon I could probably do a 200 on it without too much drama, assuming  a) I make a real effort with the pedals to keep the average speed up  and  b) somewhere to plug in mid ride  but that would only ever be an interesting experiement in battery management.

But anyway, the future of e-bikes on audax isn't that - the disabled people with massive batteries compensating for easy-to-ride bikes are mostly going to be doing =<100km social rides.  It's when the systems get light enough to be viable to carry around all day just to use for a boost on the bastard hills.  Eventually I see them being used the way granny rings are today, and perhaps only purists will eschew having a little motor that can give them an extra spurt of acceleration for those uphill scary roundabouts.

AUK can worry about that when it happens.
To ride the Windcheetah, first, you must embrace the cantilever...

CAMRAMan

  • Formerly A Warwickshire Lad
Re: Audaxing on an e-bike
« Reply #58 on: October 12, 2018, 09:46:13 pm »
As a yardstick, the 300W battery on my Bosch/Ortler ebike gets me about 25 miles at 16mph average speed. I'm 85Kg, the bike 20Kg. Upright-ish riding position, 60pse 700 x 35mm tyres.
Haggerty F, Haggerty R, Tomkins, Noble, Carrick, Robson, Crapper, Dewhurst, Macintyre, Treadmore, Davitt.

Re: Audaxing on an e-bike
« Reply #59 on: October 13, 2018, 03:17:19 pm »


BR will be next, it's just a question of time...
This fallacy keeps coming back despite the Board having made it abundantly clear that there is no intention to permit an extension to the use of e-bikes.

Yes, yes... give it another 10 years. When the number of e-bikes on the road will overtake that of conventional bikes, this position will be reviewed. It is premature now, by then there will be another board