Author Topic: Sore Knees Ddx  (Read 651 times)

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Sore Knees Ddx
« on: August 12, 2018, 02:53:14 pm »

Am trying to work out why my knees hurt at the end of yesterday's 210k ride. From what I can tell, options are:

A) saddle height wrong

B) I had just ridden the hardest 200 I've ever done, faster than I might normally

C) A+B

D) ???

How does one go about diagnosing knee pain? Does knee pain from saddle height issues feel different from overdoing the effort pain?

Thanks

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Sore Knees Ddx
« Reply #1 on: August 12, 2018, 02:59:12 pm »
Usually knee pain varies depending on cause. Where do they hurt (front, back, side, internal) and what sort of pain (stabbing, ache, grinding) is it? Cleat position is a common cause.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Re: Sore Knees Ddx
« Reply #2 on: August 12, 2018, 06:03:41 pm »
This was your usual bike? With all that you've done on that bike I would have thought that the position would have been pretty well sorted by now, enough not to change things without very good reason. I would be looking at the ride and how you rode it first (and how you prepared for it of course). Unless of course the cleats have slipped, the saddle moved or the pedals worn!

Re: Sore Knees Ddx
« Reply #3 on: August 12, 2018, 08:57:09 pm »
I'd say d, riding faster as usual into a decent headwind.

Re: Sore Knees Ddx
« Reply #4 on: August 12, 2018, 09:41:39 pm »
i've had two types of knee pain:
a) sharp(ish) pain in one knee caused by poor fit - sorted with proper fit
b) dull increasing pain in both knees caused by riding too much too soon in spring - preventable by working up steadily towards big distances

it's hard to tell what's caused the pain in your case - could be a bit of both?..

hellymedic

  • Just do it!
Re: Sore Knees Ddx
« Reply #5 on: August 12, 2018, 10:34:07 pm »
I NEED DATA!

Is there pain at rest? Is pain aching/sharp/intermittent/constant?
What provokes the pain? Stairs/pedalling/walking etc
Where do you feel the pain? Joint line - inner/outer/behind knee cap/behind knee etc
When and how did pain start?

Internet opinions can be useless; this is more likely when there's insufficient information...

Re: Sore Knees Ddx
« Reply #6 on: August 12, 2018, 10:49:30 pm »
I can provide other data as I was present on the ride causing it.
Windforce about 4. Large groups to start out with which splintered as soon as the dike turned into the wind.
For the return leg (into the wind) hardly anyone to draft.
riding several km/h faster as usual.

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Sore Knees Ddx
« Reply #7 on: August 13, 2018, 12:56:49 am »
I NEED DATA!

There is no such thing as too much data!

Quote
Is there pain at rest? Is pain aching/sharp/intermittent/constant?

Not really. There's a faint ache, tho it's now 28+ hours since I stopped pedalling.

Quote
What provokes the pain? Stairs/pedalling/walking etc

Standing up is the main one. Stairs are the worst. Pedaling I don't really feel it.

Quote
Where do you feel the pain? Joint line - inner/outer/behind knee cap/behind knee etc



Pain is bilateral, alas I only have 2 arms, so couldn't point at both knees and also take the photo.

Quote
When and how did pain start?

Well most recently I felt it after doing the hardest 200 I've done, including slogging for 35+km into a force 4 headwind that was coming in straight on the front. Prior to that I had done the fastest 100km of my life (yay for a Peloton + tailwind). I was pushing it quite hard.

Previously I felt it on a 250km night ride, where I spent a long time slogging into a headwind and even had hills to contend...

And prior to that I felt it after doing 325km in 24 hours (300km ride + there and back). Which was also my fastest 300 (17:14 total time)...

I don't feel it on shorter rides,

Quote

Internet opinions can be useless; this is more likely when there's insufficient information...

Is there any other info that would be useful to help diagnosis? Would be considered by many an oversharer on these things if it helps.

Oh, and you can see the ride data at: https://www.strava.com/activities/1765532475

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

hellymedic

  • Just do it!
Re: Sore Knees Ddx
« Reply #8 on: August 13, 2018, 01:12:51 am »
I didn't ask whether your pain was worse going up or down stairs, which was silly, though I hoped you might specify.

Pain going down stairs is often due to problems of patellar tracking.

Static quads exercises may help. Judicious use of Vitamin I can make life bearable.

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Sore Knees Ddx
« Reply #9 on: August 13, 2018, 01:29:40 am »
I didn't ask whether your pain was worse going up or down stairs, which was silly, though I hoped you might specify.

Pain going down stairs is often due to problems of patellar tracking.

Down hurts more than up. But that may be more to do with my using my upper body more to pull myself up, rather than using it to lower me down...

Quote

Static quads exercises may help. Judicious use of Vitamin I can make life bearable.

I took 400mg of Vitamin I last night before bed, but haven't taken any since. I didn't want to kill off the pain, and then do something that made things worse, I figured the pain, while suboptimal will at least warn me before I over do something... at least that was my thought process...

Shall give the exercises a go. Thanks!

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Sore Knees Ddx
« Reply #10 on: August 13, 2018, 07:11:56 am »
Top of the kneecap suggests the saddle is a mm or two low.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

velosam

  • '.....you used to be an apple on a stick.'
Re: Sore Knees Ddx
« Reply #11 on: August 15, 2018, 03:51:40 pm »
This is a timely thread although my pain is in the mid of my left knee.  It only hurts when I pedal.

CrazyEnglishTriathlete

  • Miles eaten don't satisfy hunger
  • 3x Brimstone ancien 3x Pendle/Tan Hill DNF
    • CET Ride Reports and Blogs
Re: Sore Knees Ddx
« Reply #12 on: August 15, 2018, 05:54:13 pm »
Riding into a headwind, my tendency, which I think is shared by many others, is to ride a slightly higher gear at a slightly lower cadence.   That can make my knees feel sore for a couple of days afterwards, a general hard to position pain.  It goes after a couple of days rest or a gentle 20km - 40km ride.  I've always attributed that to general bashing and bruising.  I've got the same sort of feeling in both knees and ankles after a monster run today, which I expect will fade over a couple of days, although I do intend a gentle ride tomorrow.

If it doesn't go away then it's something else that needs more worrying about.
Eddington Numbers 122 (imperial), 165 (metric) 510 (furlongs)  110 (nautical miles)