Author Topic: Evans in Trouble?  (Read 8702 times)

Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #25 on: October 31, 2018, 07:40:26 am »
Yesterday, I was interested in buying a discounted clearance bike from Evans but this morning I read of the takeover by Sports Direct so today I’m not.

As an aside, is what’s happening to Evans similar to what Patisserie Valerie is going through? That is, nothing wrong with the basic business model of selling cakes, (or bicycles) but are their financial problems down to the behind the scenes machinations of capitalism; borrowing from banks to finance the purchase then loading the business with debt whilst the venture capitalist owners pay themselves vast dividends?
I am often asked, what does YOAV stand for? It stands for Yoav On A Velo

Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #26 on: October 31, 2018, 07:55:22 am »
Maybe so, as Halfords are busy opening bricks and mortar stores - many close to existing Evans' stores - so they at least se a market for the walk-in trade, albeit possibly at a lower price point.
We are making a New World (Paul Nash, 1918)

vorsprung

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Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #27 on: October 31, 2018, 08:21:59 am »
There might be an opportunity for some cheap stuff as Evans goes down the pan but long term it's the end for this retailer as somewhere to get a good bike

First person to spot a lawnmower at Evans wins. Or football kit.  Or a hammock

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Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #28 on: October 31, 2018, 09:07:26 am »
Probably said it before but will say it again, sports direct (and by implication anything they own) has a tactic of using their size and power to get brands to produce lower quality and thus lower cost lines just for them. So an "Adidas" tracksuit from sports direct will not necessarily have the same quality as an Adidas tracksuit from elsewhere, that you would expect of Adidas.

This is why I pretty much never trust anything from sports direct or any shop they own.


Is that actually verifiably true?

I know that SD own many of the brands they stock - eg Karrimor, Lonsdale, Dunlop - and that quality of those brands is not what it might have been once upon a time (as they are produced to a price) but I’d be surprised if they had any say over quality of third party brands.

Anyway, you can bet this isn’t good news for the excellent Pinnacle range of bikes.

Can't find the proof but I remember I once asked a question to a manufacturer's own website, about why was a product I'd seen on the sports direct website not available on the manufacturer's own website.
Since they were the manufacturer, they should sell, or certainly know about, all the products they make, surely.
I got a fairly coy response along the lines of "products that you see on sports direct may only be available from sports direct - for the best shopping and product experience we recommend you buy from our own website."


It is what it is. It's not what it's not, so it must be what it is.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Eating all the pies and drinking all the tea.
Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #29 on: October 31, 2018, 09:54:25 am »
Probably said it before but will say it again, sports direct (and by implication anything they own) has a tactic of using their size and power to get brands to produce lower quality and thus lower cost lines just for them. So an "Adidas" tracksuit from sports direct will not necessarily have the same quality as an Adidas tracksuit from elsewhere, that you would expect of Adidas.

This is why I pretty much never trust anything from sports direct or any shop they own.


Is that actually verifiably true?

I know that SD own many of the brands they stock - eg Karrimor, Lonsdale, Dunlop - and that quality of those brands is not what it might have been once upon a time (as they are produced to a price) but I’d be surprised if they had any say over quality of third party brands.

Anyway, you can bet this isn’t good news for the excellent Pinnacle range of bikes.

Can't find the proof but I remember I once asked a question to a manufacturer's own website, about why was a product I'd seen on the sports direct website not available on the manufacturer's own website.
Since they were the manufacturer, they should sell, or certainly know about, all the products they make, surely.
I got a fairly coy response along the lines of "products that you see on sports direct may only be available from sports direct - for the best shopping and product experience we recommend you buy from our own website."
I'm surprised that brands with a reputation, such as Adidas, would agree to that.
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #30 on: October 31, 2018, 09:59:44 am »
Can't find the proof but I remember I once asked a question to a manufacturer's own website, about why was a product I'd seen on the sports direct website not available on the manufacturer's own website.
Since they were the manufacturer, they should sell, or certainly know about, all the products they make, surely.
I got a fairly coy response along the lines of "products that you see on sports direct may only be available from sports direct - for the best shopping and product experience we recommend you buy from our own website."

Well, I'm not convinced that's evidence of what you think it is, but it's probably evidence of some kind of sharp practice!

Like Cudzo I would be very surprised if Adidas would agree to anything like that. And can you imagine, say, Brompton doing likewise for Evans? I can't.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #31 on: October 31, 2018, 10:09:19 am »
I'm surprised as well, but certainly wouldn't brush it off as "couldn't possibly happen".
It is what it is. It's not what it's not, so it must be what it is.

citoyen

  • Occasionally rides a bike
Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #32 on: October 31, 2018, 10:14:22 am »
Much like the oft-repeated myth about Wetherspoons buying short-dated beer, it's not naive to be wary of such claims without evidence to back them up.
"The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles."

Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #33 on: October 31, 2018, 10:17:35 am »
Even the great John Lewis has "special purchase" items in it's sale, often from mainstream manufacturers of, for instance, TV's, so it certainly does happen that specific lines are sold to certain retailers.
We are making a New World (Paul Nash, 1918)

Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #34 on: October 31, 2018, 10:36:46 am »
Much like the oft-repeated myth about Wetherspoons buying short-dated beer, it's not naive to be wary of such claims without evidence to back them up.

You might be right to be wary, 'cos you've only heard it from me - but I've heard from a manufacturer - so I'm going to be wary. To be fair, the bit about them being lower quality - that's what I've chosen to infer, but that certain lines are unique to sports direct - yes, I've heard that from a manufacturer.

If I were the manufacturer, then it's worth my while doing it as sports direct are a significant enough chunk of the market to be worth doing it. They will hold out on the standard lines for other retailers as they would possibly not be prepared to walk away from buying the standard line, but sports direct are simply not going to stock high priced items, it's not what they're about.

Sports direct are generally penny-pinching, nickel-and-diming, and feel they can sidestep rules they don't wish to abide by.
Such as those on allowing refunds within 14 days. Paying the minimum wage being another example.

Ignoring the fact that you've explicitly said you don't want to pay for a mug, or a catalog. Or receive one for free.
It is what it is. It's not what it's not, so it must be what it is.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Eating all the pies and drinking all the tea.
Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #35 on: October 31, 2018, 11:14:19 am »
Yes, I've also heard manufacturers make special lines for Sports Direct, John Lewis (and who knows maybe Evans was big enough too? though probably not) but I find it doubtful a brand like Adidas (or Bosch or whoever) would make something deliberately more failure prone. It might be a cheaper product with fewer whistles and bells, or whatever whistles and bells equate to for trainers, but that doesn't mean shoddier.
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #36 on: October 31, 2018, 11:42:51 am »
... but that doesn't mean shoddier.

No, but it may mean made in a non-core factory, so cheaper; to a lower spec (thinner materials for instance, or less reinforcement) which mean ultimately less long lived. A bit like the lambswool jumpers I bought from M&S recently - made in Madagascar and really quite thin compared to what they used to be. (and actually quite shoddy - I had the "V" stitching on one, and the hem stitching on another, fail after 3-4 days wear, since repaired by my wife).
We are making a New World (Paul Nash, 1918)

Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #37 on: October 31, 2018, 04:12:20 pm »
Yes, I've also heard manufacturers make special lines for Sports Direct, John Lewis (and who knows maybe Evans was big enough too? though probably not) but I find it doubtful a brand like Adidas (or Bosch or whoever) would make something deliberately more failure prone. It might be a cheaper product with fewer whistles and bells, or whatever whistles and bells equate to for trainers, but that doesn't mean shoddier.

Yes as rafletcher says it's not deliberately shoddier, but lower quality by virtue of it being made to fit an enforced cheaper price point.

I just find it dishonest, as what they are effectively doing is simply buying the name.
It is what it is. It's not what it's not, so it must be what it is.

Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #38 on: October 31, 2018, 05:34:53 pm »
Adidas are arseholes. They have factories all over the world. Most of which they don't own - they just buy the labour. Usually 12 year old children. I can well believe they would agree to give Sports Direct an exclusive range of shite produced by kids in India or somewhere in SE Asia....
Those wonderful norks are never far from my thoughts, oh yeah!

Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #39 on: October 31, 2018, 07:40:14 pm »
I've heard that it's impossible to buy any* clothes that are completely 100% ethical all the way down the supply chain.

* this may have been conditional on material type, not sure.
It is what it is. It's not what it's not, so it must be what it is.

Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #40 on: October 31, 2018, 08:16:28 pm »
So, Ben, you've never shopped in Sports Direct, but you are certain that their products are shoddy?

I've bought from sports direct, many times.

The staff in the stores, when I asked them directly, stated that they enjoyed working there and said that the hours and pay were decent.

I've never had any issues with any of the products I've bought from Sports Direct shops. I don't buy adidas or nike products, they are just a fancy tag on stuff made in the same sweatshops as anywhere else.
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Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #41 on: October 31, 2018, 09:13:37 pm »
I used to work for a bed manufacturer, we did special lines for the likes of M&S and John Lewis and we also made special lower speced "sale" versions. So such things did happen.
The Pinnacle and Hoy ranges of bikes would be a loss if they go, as will the likes of Cannondale and BH going from the high street.

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Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #42 on: October 31, 2018, 10:34:07 pm »
So, Ben, you've never shopped in Sports Direct, but you are certain that their products are shoddy?

I've bought from sports direct, many times.

The staff in the stores, when I asked them directly, stated that they enjoyed working there and said that the hours and pay were decent.

I've never had any issues with any of the products I've bought from Sports Direct shops. I don't buy adidas or nike products, they are just a fancy tag on stuff made in the same sweatshops as anywhere else.

Oh I've bought from sports direct in the past, don't any more though as all they sell is cheap tat, and can't trust them as far as I could throw them to give good customer service or honour their obligations if anything goes wrong.
It is what it is. It's not what it's not, so it must be what it is.

Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #43 on: November 01, 2018, 12:25:03 am »
The staff in the stores, when I asked them directly, stated that they enjoyed working there and said that the hours and pay were decent.

I find this a bit disturbing. You actually converse with staff in a shop?! I don't just mean saying hello and passing pleasantries, but you start asking them about their working conditions and rate of pay?

You fucking weirdo.  :P
Those wonderful norks are never far from my thoughts, oh yeah!

Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #44 on: November 01, 2018, 08:45:38 am »
The staff in the stores, when I asked them directly, stated that they enjoyed working there and said that the hours and pay were decent.

I find this a bit disturbing. You actually converse with staff in a shop?! I don't just mean saying hello and passing pleasantries, but you start asking them about their working conditions and rate of pay?

You fucking weirdo.  :P

Yeah that is a bit weird. They probably thought you were some high-up manager, and that their immediate supervisor was going to unfairly get it in the neck if they admitted it was a sweatshop.
It is what it is. It's not what it's not, so it must be what it is.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Eating all the pies and drinking all the tea.
Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #45 on: November 19, 2018, 09:40:06 am »
Apparently almost every one of the stores was trading profitably when Mike Ashley bought out the chain. The losses were at head office.
https://road.cc/content/news/252037-nearly-all-evans-cycles-stores-were-profitable-when-chain-entered-administration
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #46 on: November 19, 2018, 09:56:29 am »
I've heard that it's impossible to buy any* clothes that are completely 100% ethical all the way down the supply chain.

* this may have been conditional on material type, not sure.

Harris Tweed sewn into a suit made in England. Can's see where there will be anything unethical in that supply chain.
Loake shoes (from one of their made in Kettering ranges).

Thats what came to mind easily. What you wont find is an ethical t-shirt for £2 like they sell at Primart.
I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that.

jiberjaber

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Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #47 on: November 19, 2018, 10:28:30 am »
Yes, I've also heard manufacturers make special lines for Sports Direct, John Lewis (and who knows maybe Evans was big enough too? though probably not) but I find it doubtful a brand like Adidas (or Bosch or whoever) would make something deliberately more failure prone. It might be a cheaper product with fewer whistles and bells, or whatever whistles and bells equate to for trainers, but that doesn't mean shoddier.

Yes as rafletcher says it's not deliberately shoddier, but lower quality by virtue of it being made to fit an enforced cheaper price point.

I just find it dishonest, as what they are effectively doing is simply buying the name.

This is certainly true of some other brands which are owned by Mike Ashley (from wikipedia, Donnay, Slazenger, Firetrap, Everlast, Kangol, Karrimor and Lonsdale) where the name might have previously associated with a certain level of quality may no long be so... I'm not sure he would have similar influence over Adidas but that wouldn't rule it out.
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Joergen

fuaran

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Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #48 on: November 19, 2018, 08:58:34 pm »
Harris Tweed sewn into a suit made in England. Can's see where there will be anything unethical in that supply chain.
Apart from the abuse of sheep, getting beaten and kicked as they are sheared. Then killed when they are no longer of use. https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/disturbing-footage-shows-horrific-abuse-13433945
And sheep are a major cause of deforestation. Why are there hardly any trees left on Harris?

Karla

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Re: Evans in Trouble?
« Reply #49 on: November 20, 2018, 01:02:01 am »
The staff in the stores, when I asked them directly, stated that they enjoyed working there and said that the hours and pay were decent.

I find this a bit disturbing. You actually converse with staff in a shop?! I don't just mean saying hello and passing pleasantries, but you start asking them about their working conditions and rate of pay?

You fucking weirdo.  :P

Yeah that is a bit weird. They probably thought you were some high-up manager, and that their immediate supervisor was going to unfairly get it in the neck if they admitted it was a sweatshop.

Have you met mrcharly?  I doubt anyone would rise to being a manager in Sports Direct and still have his hairdo  ;D