Author Topic: Fuel duty freeze  (Read 5730 times)

Fuel duty freeze
« on: October 03, 2018, 12:08:55 pm »
...Appears to be the Maybot's latest wheeze to convince the great British public that she really cares about us normal hard-working plebs families. I've seen figures suggesting that this will cost the treasury ~38 billion over the next three years; is there anyone actively campaigning against the freeze? (Greenpeace?)

sib

Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #1 on: October 03, 2018, 12:31:18 pm »
it's been frozen for 9 years..IFS reckon the cost is £9bn p.a.

Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #2 on: October 03, 2018, 03:15:01 pm »
Don't forget taxes are set to rise to pay for the NHS.......sigh.
Get a bicycle. You will never regret it, if you live- Mark Twain

Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2018, 10:10:18 pm »
The price has gone up so much that they're getting lots of extra VAT, so they don't *need* to raise duty.  Nothing to see here.
Never tell me the odds.

Basil

  • Um....err......oh bugger!
  • Help me!
Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2018, 10:16:57 pm »
But.  Anyone got an idea what the price would be today if the freeze hadn't been for the last few years.

No agenda, just wondering.

And cba to work it out for myself.
Quote from: Kim
And remember that friends who organise things on Facebook aren't proper friends anyway.

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2018, 10:59:47 pm »
How could I afford a Wank Tank if I had to pay more for fuel  ??? ???
If you don't like your democracy, vote against it.

Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #6 on: October 04, 2018, 11:12:55 pm »
But.  Anyone got an idea what the price would be today if the freeze hadn't been for the last few years.

No agenda, just wondering.

And cba to work it out for myself.

The average price of a litre of unleaded last week was 131p, so that works out at just over 51p before duty and VAT. Osborne scrapped a planned 4p rise on duty from 58.95p/litre to 62.95p/litre (a 6.7% increase) and cut a penny instead, which is where it's been ever since.

<plays with Excel for a few minutes>

If we assume that Osborne went ahead with the 4p rise in 2011 and duty had gone up by 4p a year thereafter, fuel duty would have risen to 90.95p/litre this year, giving a forecourt price of around 170p/litre.

If duty had gone up by a similar percentage each year after the planned rise in 2011, you'd be looking at around 175-182p/litre.

ETA - had the escalator been kept after 1999, with an inflation+6% rise each year:

Average annual inflation for period 1989 to 2018 = 2.58% (source: https://tradingeconomics.com/united-kingdom/inflation-cpi)

Fuel duty in 2000 was roughly 51p/litre.

Applying a 8.58% increase in duty year-on year from 2000 would put fuel duty at 224.4p/litre.

Assuming a pre-tax price of 51p/litre, you'd be looking at 330.5p/litre!
"Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And when you look long into an abyss, the abyss also looks into you." ~ Friedrich Nietzsche

Jaded

  • The Codfather
  • Formerly known as Jaded
Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #7 on: October 04, 2018, 11:20:27 pm »
Our economy relies on low fuel prices, but our planet doesn’t.
If you don't like your democracy, vote against it.

Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2018, 01:29:38 pm »
It's a little off topic but some of us rely on high fuel prices.

Earlier this year (or might have been end of last year) Brent Crude was around $50 it's now in excess of $80. For those of us working in companies supplying the oil and gas market, this is a good thing. At the beginning of the year our order book was 1/3 of what it is today and our products take six months to manufacture so we have hardly invoiced this year. Next year should be better and I can rely on keeping my job for another year or so.

I cheer when the petrol station sells me petrol at 130p. I know others don't but ying and yang and all that.

Although as highlighted above, tax is tax, as long as the VAT on it is covering the freeze it's a moot point. It all goes into a big chamber under the house of commons.
Duct tape is magic and should be worshipped

Cudzoziemiec

  • Solar powered, tea fuelled cycle-wol
Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2018, 02:36:11 pm »
The price has gone up so much that they're getting lots of extra VAT, so they don't *need* to raise duty.  Nothing to see here.
This didn't seem right to me, so I googled. The price now is lower than it was between 2011-14 and barely more than in 2009.
https://www.racfoundation.org/data/uk-pump-prices-over-time
sideways bounding monkey lounging under fruit tree

ian

  • fatuously disingenuous
    • The Suburban Survival Guide
Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2018, 09:21:26 pm »
Fuel is so cheap that people can sit there, going nowhere, and not feel the need to switch their engine off. Of course, the costs of that kind of behaviour to everyone else are high.
!nataS pihsroW

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2018, 10:29:27 pm »
Fuel is so cheap that people can sit there, going nowhere, and not feel the need to switch their engine off. Of course, the costs of that kind of behaviour to everyone else are high.

I think that's because people who are mostly using their car for bicycle journeys don't really associate use of the engine with having to fill the tank once an n; cars just get hungry and need feeding some Expensive Car Food occasionally.

Which is a symptom of fuel being cheap, of course.
To ride the Windcheetah, first, you must embrace the cantilever...

citoyen

  • Cat 6 Racer
Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2018, 10:39:58 pm »
Which is a symptom of fuel being cheap, of course.

Every time I see some cunt sitting with their engine idling in Tesco’s car park or at a level crossing, I have to resist the urge to knock on their window and ask if fuel isn’t expensive enough for them.

Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #13 on: October 06, 2018, 11:29:24 am »
Why not set it as a percentage of the price per litre?

It seems most other taxes and duties are, eg income tax, NI, VAT, import duties etc.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #14 on: October 06, 2018, 01:42:18 pm »
... cars just get hungry and need feeding some Expensive Car Food occasionally.

For me, a sign of how wealthy people are is when they tank themselves up with Starbucks/Costa/Café Nero coffee at around £9 per litre. Petrol, on the other hand, is less than a sixth of the price at around £1.33 per litre.

Yes, I don't really understand that, either.  I mean, sometimes you accept overpriced coffee as the cost of somewhere warm to sit with loos and WiFi, but getting a takeaway Costabucks on every commute seems like bad planning.
To ride the Windcheetah, first, you must embrace the cantilever...

Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #15 on: October 06, 2018, 02:15:25 pm »
I work in an office that has its own professional piece of coffee making kit, and still people walk in the door every morning clutching (yet) a(nother) cardboard cup of unbelievably expensive coffee from one of the chains.
Rust never sleeps

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #16 on: October 06, 2018, 02:24:40 pm »
Makes sense.  If they went to the effort to carry a re-usable container, they might as well fill it with Brown Drink before they leave.

I can't help thinking that this is about fashion, rather than caffeine.
To ride the Windcheetah, first, you must embrace the cantilever...

ian

  • fatuously disingenuous
    • The Suburban Survival Guide
Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #17 on: October 07, 2018, 10:33:56 pm »
... cars just get hungry and need feeding some Expensive Car Food occasionally.

For me, a sign of how wealthy people are is when they tank themselves up with Starbucks/Costa/Café Nero coffee at around £9 per litre. Petrol, on the other hand, is less than a sixth of the price at around £1.33 per litre.

Yes, I don't really understand that, either.  I mean, sometimes you accept overpriced coffee as the cost of somewhere warm to sit with loos and WiFi, but getting a takeaway Costabucks on every commute seems like bad planning.

To be fair, it's a lazy convenience, it's nice to have a hot coffee handed to me before I get on the train. That said, I'll use the machine on the mothership. It's not the greatest coffee ever but it's wet, caffeinated, drinkable, and free. Silly price, of course.

That said, fuel will be expensive when it costs more than coffee and beer.
!nataS pihsroW

Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #18 on: October 08, 2018, 09:06:37 am »
People still buy bottles of water at close to £1 for 750ml, that's about the same as petrol right now.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #19 on: October 08, 2018, 09:58:23 am »
Further off-topic, there's a Costa drive through opened near us. Holding a piping hot drink whilst negotiating the large double roundabout next to said drive through really encourages keeping both hands on the wheel and concentrating on the road ahead at all times.

I refuse to use it but presumably you hand your re-usable cup through window 1, get it passed back at window 2 from where you are encouraged to park in the car park and enjoy your coffee whilst listening to Popmaster?
Duct tape is magic and should be worshipped

Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #20 on: October 08, 2018, 10:02:04 am »
The Big Red Wagon likes Shell V Power unleaded (it has a 14:1 compression engine; it will run on normal unleaded, but it's a bit close to the edge of the envelope).

I paid £1.65 a litre to fill it up on Saturday.  Luckily it does 45mpg.
Never tell me the odds.

Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #21 on: October 30, 2018, 08:55:21 am »
What the country needs is a massive fuel cut - not a meaningless freeze. Commuting by car is so expensive.
Frequent Audax and bike ride videos:

https://www.youtube.com/user/djrikki2008/videos

Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #22 on: October 30, 2018, 09:14:27 am »
Well, ride a bicycle then.
I am often asked, what does YOAV stand for? It stands for Yoav On A Velo

ian

  • fatuously disingenuous
    • The Suburban Survival Guide
Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #23 on: October 30, 2018, 09:19:21 am »
What the country needs is a massive fuel cut - not a meaningless freeze. Commuting by car is so expensive.

For everyone, yes.
!nataS pihsroW

Re: Fuel duty freeze
« Reply #24 on: October 30, 2018, 12:15:14 pm »
Well, ride a bicycle then.

Not everyone works close to home ruling out travel by bike.  And given how busy the motorways are every morning there are many other people do not have that option either.
Frequent Audax and bike ride videos:

https://www.youtube.com/user/djrikki2008/videos