Author Topic: E-bike experience (Read 6165 times)

Kim · « **Reply #25 on:** February 24, 2020, 12:37:10 pm »

Quote from: bludger on February 24, 2020, 10:54:17 am

Someone at work had an ARCC unit on their bike which was apparently terrific. So it was good to see that there is now a brommie kit which is apparently very good, reviewed at https://ebiketips.road.cc/content/reviews/electric-conversion-kits/arcc-e-pod-brompton-2317

... and then I realised that this meant it was £1.799 for a retrofit only, and you need to factor in the cost of a Brompton into it too!

I appreciate that technology isn't cheap and you could probably wrangle this on a cycle to work deal somehow but good grief.

I saw one in the flesh on the last Origami ride. A thing of beauty and a joy forever. The owner considered it a fair price to pay to be able to keep cycling.

fruitcake · « **Reply #26 on:** February 24, 2020, 02:38:22 pm »

For many folk, this would be less than they'd spend on public transport during the life of the bike / battery, as I reckon utility cyclists are the biggest market for this tech. Going to work and going shopping specifically.

bludger · « **Reply #27 on:** February 24, 2020, 02:54:13 pm »

Oh for sure I don't doubt it's not worth it in the long run and it looks like it's excellent quality. It's just such a pity that such a pricetag would immediately elicit a HOW MUCH?

reaction compared to a car. Anyway...

orienteer · « **Reply #28 on:** February 24, 2020, 05:44:15 pm »

An electric car is considerably more

The ARCC system is very good and the company gives excellent service should any problem arise.

Adam · « **Reply #29 on:** February 24, 2020, 08:45:18 pm »

I was impressed with the Swytch conversion kits when I was chatting to them at the Birmingham Cycle show last year.

Sergeant Pluck · « **Reply #30 on:** February 24, 2020, 11:03:20 pm »

Oh, what’s that? There seems to be a Tern Vektron P7i over there in the hallway. How did that happen?!

Anyway, that’s the new commuter and general ute. Bosch mid drive, Active Line, the basic one I think. Chosen after much dithering. As well as being foldable, and e-, it needed to suit my partner who is much smaller than me. It’s a well thought out machine that rides really well on London’s clapped out roads. Comes with everything on it - even the (wired-in) lights are good. Saving me a fortune in travel costs and not buying the stuff I buy when I go to work by tube.

However, if small folded size is important to you, the Brompton is still the benchmark.

One general e-bike thing to be aware of - weight. These can be heavy machines - even folders. The Vektron is an awkward lift when folded, for example, and is best suited to situations where you only need to fold it right at the end of your journey. It’s worth actually lifting the bike, trying to carry it, and considering how often you might need to lift it when choosing one. Same for anyone else that might have to lift it.

Or you’ll put your back out.

hubner · « **Reply #31 on:** February 25, 2020, 11:08:04 pm »

£3,000 and 22.5kg!

Perhaps ebikes should be thought of as a low powered moped/motorbike wrt their weight and price.

Kim · « **Reply #32 on:** February 25, 2020, 11:20:40 pm »

Quote from: hubner on February 25, 2020, 11:08:04 pm

£3,000 and 22.5kg!

Perhaps ebikes should be thought of as a low powered moped/motorbike wrt their weight and price.

Would my touring bike also qualify?

Cudzoziemiec · « **Reply #33 on:** February 26, 2020, 08:36:16 am »

Quote from: Kim on February 25, 2020, 11:20:40 pm

Quote from: hubner on February 25, 2020, 11:08:04 pm
£3,000 and 22.5kg!

Perhaps ebikes should be thought of as a low powered moped/motorbike wrt their weight and price.

Would my touring bike also qualify?

Yes! If we consider you as the motor...

I never paid more than a grand for a motorbike (but it was all a very long time ago when I was young and penniless) and even the most minimalistic moped weighs quite a bit more than 22.5kg. Mind you, I never had an electric motorbike.

Sergeant Pluck · « **Reply #34 on:** February 26, 2020, 12:35:17 pm »

Quote from: hubner on February 25, 2020, 11:08:04 pm

£3,000 and 22.5kg!

Perhaps ebikes should be thought of as a low powered moped/motorbike wrt their weight and price.

Some of the cobbled-together ones that whine past me could be thought of as low powered-moped/motorbikes wrt their speed

and not requiring any pedalling.

I'm fairly sure I saw one with front and back hub motors the other day which has got to be an interesting ride.

Sergeant Pluck · « **Reply #35 on:** February 26, 2020, 09:03:20 pm »

And on that very note, today:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-51647068

Quote

Under the law, e-bikes which are fitted with an electric motor can only be driven without a licence or insurance if their power is limited and if the motor automatically switches off at speeds above 15.5 mph.
The court heard Mr Hanlon's bike was capable of going double that speed and as such should have been categorised as a motorbike.

Essentially if it’s not legal you’ll be treated as operating a motor vehicle, you ain’t going to be insured, and as well as the harm caused and the penalties, you could be pursued for costs for the rest of your natural.

Sergeant Pluck · « **Reply #36 on:** March 02, 2020, 10:28:49 pm »

The e-bike rider was acquitted:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-51707616

I’m surprised at the verdict. Not at fault in his manner of driving.

Kim · « **Reply #37 on:** March 02, 2020, 10:32:12 pm »

Acquitted of careless driving. Does he still get prosecuted for riding an illegal motorcycle?

Sergeant Pluck · « **Reply #38 on:** March 02, 2020, 10:37:04 pm »

I don’t see any indication of that happening.

Odd. Nevertheless, licence or not, the jury seem to have treated Hanlon as a motorist in that they applied the same thinking as they often do with motorist / cyclist cases: protect the “motorist” and to hell with the victim.

CAMRAMan · « **Reply #39 on:** March 04, 2020, 08:02:50 am »

My Cube Kathmandu Pro is a very nice machine. I fitted the Badass dongle to it, but it really is too fast for town use in Sport mode. On an empty road I got up to 26MPH and there was more to come. In Tour mode, I actually have to work and still averaged 17MPH on my commute. It does bugger the range up though.

Sergeant Pluck · « **Reply #40 on:** March 07, 2020, 03:10:23 pm »

Has that got the Cx motor?

I’ve looked at those dongles. It’s a pity there isn’t one that simply lifts the cut-off point by 5 km/h or so, that would do me. The level of torque is fine as it is.

And I don’t really want my speed or recorded distance messed up, which these gadgets seem to do.

I just use Tour mode on mine. The higher levels just get you up to the cut off point more quickly. I find I make smoother progress in Eco or Tour.

CAMRAMan · « **Reply #41 on:** March 07, 2020, 03:20:56 pm »

Yes, the Performance CX with a Powerpack 500 battery. It has loads more torque than my previous Active Line one.

By putting it into Tour mode with the Badass dongle, I find it offers a sensible level of assistance and doesn't let the top speed go to silly levels. Anything over 20MPH and you run the risk of having motorists pull out in front of you 'because bikes don't go that fast, do they?'

There are other derestriction options available, as you probably know, but a lot of them require some sort of rewiring.

Sergeant Pluck · « **Reply #42 on:** March 07, 2020, 06:00:05 pm »

Quote from: CAMRAMan on March 07, 2020, 03:20:56 pm

There are other derestriction options available, as you probably know, but a lot of them require some sort of rewiring.

It was those that I was looking at, ones that need the motor cover removed to plug in. I hadn’t been aware of the type that you have, attached to the wheel speed sensor itself.

Unlikely I'll go down that route. The legalities concern me. It would be good if the entire motor unit was upgradeable at some point in the future.

CAMRAMan · « **Reply #43 on:** March 07, 2020, 07:16:26 pm »

It was also the legalities that made me realise that 25+MPH was going to attract the wrong kind of attention.

Sergeant Pluck · « **Reply #44 on:** March 08, 2020, 12:17:21 pm »

The French arecracking down on derestriction - all ebikes, not just eMTBs:

https://ebike-mtb.com/en/france-bans-illegal-emtb-tuning/

Quote

anyone modifying their ebike to exceed the maximum authorized speed – currently 25 km/h for electric bicycles and 45 km/h for speed pedelecs – could now have their bike impounded, face one year in prison and fines of up to €30,000.

(What’s a speed pedelec?)

The article also refers to the Hanlon case discussed above, and its odd conclusion. The legislation also affects those who manufacture dongles etc. for tuning.

LittleWheelsandBig · « **Reply #45 on:** March 08, 2020, 12:48:22 pm »

Some countries have two categories of e-bikes, with different performance requirements and rider responsibilities.

https://www.swov.nl/en/facts-figures/factsheet/pedelecs-and-speed-pedelecs

CAMRAMan · « **Reply #46 on:** March 08, 2020, 01:27:58 pm »

A speed pedelec is an unrestricted ebike. The rider has to register the bike with DVLA, so it has to be type approved, insure it, tax it and wear a helmet as well as displaying a reg. plate. Hardly anyone has bothered because of the hassle.

Salvatore · « **Reply #47 on:** March 08, 2020, 02:31:23 pm »

Quote from: CAMRAMan on March 08, 2020, 01:27:58 pm

A speed pedelec is an unrestricted ebike. The rider has to register the bike with DVLA, so it has to be type approved, insure it, tax it and wear a helmet as well as displaying a reg. plate. Hardly anyone has bothered because of the hassle.

I saw one such a few weeks ago. It looked like a normal-ish push bike with E-gubbins, but what stood out was the big registration plate on the back. I made a note of the VRM and the DVLA website revealed that it was a Sparta.

ETA: It may have been a Spartamet with a 30cc gasoline engine, so off topic.

LittleWheelsandBig · « **Reply #48 on:** March 08, 2020, 02:35:02 pm »

A speed pedelec isn’t unrestricted. It is restricted to 45 km/h, rather than 25 km/h. Similarly for power.

CAMRAMan · « **Reply #49 on:** March 08, 2020, 06:00:14 pm »

Something off the shelf doesn't come cheap: https://urbanebikes.com/products/md11-speed-pedelec?variant=31403581177920