Author Topic: Adjusting a QR cup and cone wheels  (Read 677 times)

Gattopardo

  • Lord of the sith
  • Overseaing the building of the death star
Adjusting a QR cup and cone wheels
« on: July 20, 2019, 06:16:01 pm »
Tried searching and there only seems to mention the new shimano hubs.

Is there an easy way of adjusting cup and cone hubs so I don't overtighten them?  Or is it a trail and error job.

robgul

  • HoECC & Cycle:End-to-End webmaster, S Warwickshire Bike Shop in Wellesbourne
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Re: Adjusting a QR cup and cone wheels
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2019, 07:55:46 pm »
Tried searching and there only seems to mention the new shimano hubs.

Is there an easy way of adjusting cup and cone hubs so I don't overtighten them?  Or is it a trail and error job.

Trial and error - tighten with cone spanner (usually 13mm front and 15mm rear) and ordinary spanner for locknut (normally 17mm for both) - assuming you're using an axle vice, spin the wheel in the vice to get a feel of the axle/tightness ... remove wheel and turn axle by hand to feel for tightness/roughness in bearings - fine tune to taste.  (Method - hold cone with spanner, undo locknut - move cone spanner 1 spoke (looser or tighter) re-tighten lock not holding cone spanner in position - retest and contine) 

When the wheel is back in the frame check for any sidways play as sometimes the skewer will "stretch" the axle and give some sideways play.

That's what I was taught by Cytech - this might be useful  https://www.parktool.com/blog/repair-help?query=&sort=postDate+desc&area%5B%5D=56

Rob

Re: Adjusting a QR cup and cone wheels
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2019, 08:47:52 pm »
the skewer always compresses the axle and preloads the bearing (if it was set to  have no clearance) or removes the last bit of free play (if the bearings were correctly adjusted, i.e. so that there was a tiny bit of free play without the skewer fully tight).

With traditional cup and cone hubs it is possible to use a special tool ( 'hub vice') (see Sheldon Brown) to simulate the QR loads during adjustment, and thus get the hubs set up 'perfectly' i.e. so that there is just no free play with the locknut tight and the QR pressure applied.

Sheldon Brown on hub adjustment

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/cones/index.html including details of his special tool made from an old cone and short length of axle

Jobst Brandt on hub adjustment
https://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/cone-adjustment.html

FWIW the typical compression of a steel axle is ~80um; (the rear is typically longer and fatter (10mm) than the front (9mm); the result is that both compress about the same amount).  You can use this to get very close to the correct adjustment; just back off the cone 1/12th of a turn (if the axle has a 1mm pitch thread) from the adjustment that (with the locknuts tight and no QR pressure applied) just gives a play-free adjustment.

cheers

zigzag

  • unfuckwithable
Re: Adjusting a QR cup and cone wheels
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2019, 10:10:32 pm »
my method was to tighten the locknuts until the bearings start binding, then back off a quarter of a turn, put the wheel into a fork and clamp the skewer. only very tiny adjustments were needed after that to make it spot on.

Gattopardo

  • Lord of the sith
  • Overseaing the building of the death star
Re: Adjusting a QR cup and cone wheels
« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2019, 12:19:28 am »
my method was to tighten the locknuts until the bearings start binding, then back off a quarter of a turn, put the wheel into a fork and clamp the skewer. only very tiny adjustments were needed after that to make it spot on.

That has been my usual method. Then use the sheldon method

the skewer always compresses the axle and preloads the bearing (if it was set to  have no clearance) or removes the last bit of free play (if the bearings were correctly adjusted, i.e. so that there was a tiny bit of free play without the skewer fully tight).

With traditional cup and cone hubs it is possible to use a special tool ( 'hub vice') (see Sheldon Brown) to simulate the QR loads during adjustment, and thus get the hubs set up 'perfectly' i.e. so that there is just no free play with the locknut tight and the QR pressure applied.

Sheldon Brown on hub adjustment

https://www.sheldonbrown.com/cones/index.html including details of his special tool made from an old cone and short length of axle

Jobst Brandt on hub adjustment
https://www.sheldonbrown.com/brandt/cone-adjustment.html

FWIW the typical compression of a steel axle is ~80um; (the rear is typically longer and fatter (10mm) than the front (9mm); the result is that both compress about the same amount).  You can use this to get very close to the correct adjustment; just back off the cone 1/12th of a turn (if the axle has a 1mm pitch thread) from the adjustment that (with the locknuts tight and no QR pressure applied) just gives a play-free adjustment.

cheers


I used to use that method but with thinish nuts instead but can't find the nuts.  Was wondering id there was another way.  Currently the wheels have been rebuilt so will need fettling after they have bedded in.

Re: Adjusting a QR cup and cone wheels
« Reply #5 on: July 22, 2019, 01:03:20 am »
FWIW you can use a stack of M10 washers as dummy dropouts if you like. This at least allows you to check the adjustment fairly quickly, even if the QR pressure isn't being applied as the adjustment is being made.

cheers

Re: Adjusting a QR cup and cone wheels
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2019, 11:00:50 am »
I use a stack of M3 *M5 penny washers, that way I can make adjustments the same as Sheldon Brown's method.
Quicker & easier as I didn't have an old axle to cut down.

Edit *