Author Topic: eLance  (Read 731 times)

Pingu

  • Put away those fiery biscuits!
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    • the Igloo

Re: eLance
« Reply #1 on: October 05, 2019, 12:42:56 pm »
I find that kinda harsh. He seems to be penalised for riding a bike that he didn't "earn" by riding loads of Zwift miles. Like in the real world the equipment you ride is determined by how many miles you do? He didn't actually cheat in any way during the race itself, and yet he's banned for 6 months from any BC race (including the ones on the road, where, presumably he's not riding that Tron bike)?

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: eLance
« Reply #2 on: October 05, 2019, 05:07:34 pm »
*shrugs*  Since when have BC races had anything to do with real-world cycling?  Arbitrary rules are arbitrary rules...
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Re: eLance
« Reply #3 on: October 05, 2019, 10:10:12 pm »
Apparently he didn’t ‘ride’ the miles. He reduced his weight to 40kg and somehow made his power2000 watts!

Re: eLance
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2019, 09:53:56 pm »
He used an Ant+ "bot" which sent false data to his computer to get Zwift to give him that bike. He did that 6 months before the BC rules were announced. Since using that bot, it seems that he's ridden enough miles/climbed enough meters to have got that bike legitimately.
At the time he did it, it was against Zwift ToC, but not against BC rules, so it seems legit to strip the jersey and ban him from Zwift, but to ban him from racing on the road seems excessive to me.

Re: eLance
« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2019, 12:10:26 pm »
Load of old balls.
I find Jeffers rather loathsome, but I don't he deserves the treatment he's getting. He cheated on a computer game. Big whoop. That BC and now UCI are using the game, sorry "platform", for 'official' racing (and retrofitting the rules therein) is thier problem, not his.


bludger

  • Randonneur and bargain hunter
Re: eLance
« Reply #6 on: October 07, 2019, 12:14:33 pm »
Super weird how BC will find nothing awry with mystery jiffy bags being delivered via motorbike courier but will come down on someone for unlocking a tron bike on zwift....
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Re: eLance
« Reply #7 on: October 07, 2019, 04:34:23 pm »
Especially when some competitors were apparently ‘gifted’ tron bikes.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: eLance
« Reply #8 on: October 07, 2019, 06:08:56 pm »
Does the bike actually do anything other than look pretty?


ETA: Duh!  Presumably it affects how power input is translated to in-game speed.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Re: eLance
« Reply #9 on: October 07, 2019, 06:41:47 pm »
Yeah, the in game physics are affected by the bike - the Tron bike is apparently more aero but a bit heavier. They should all be on equal bikes (or bikes with equal game physics but different logos if necessary) for BC events though - the idea that BC is incentivising people to train on Zwift is wrong IMO.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: eLance
« Reply #10 on: October 07, 2019, 06:50:44 pm »
Yeah, the in game physics are affected by the bike - the Tron bike is apparently more aero but a bit heavier.

Want a real Tron bike?  Come over to the Dark Side.  We have cookies.  And Scotchlite™


Quote
They should all be on equal bikes (or bikes with equal game physics but different logos if necessary) for BC events though - the idea that BC is incentivising people to train on Zwift is wrong IMO.

Agreed that the bikes should be equal.  Not sure about encouraging training on Zwift generally.  Depends on whether you consider it to be cycling, I suppose.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

bludger

  • Randonneur and bargain hunter
Re: eLance
« Reply #11 on: October 07, 2019, 10:15:57 pm »
Before I got big into cycling I was a rower, and supported a heap of indoor rowing competitions including the British Indoors. In indoor rowing everyone rows on the same machine, that calculates the wattage into 'speed' in the same way. Athletes can set their own 'drag factor' for their flywheel but the actual raw wattage is not adjusted for the obvious reason that the point of the indoor discipline is to remove variables like weather conditions, slipstreaming and so on. I just don't get what this entire thing is about. If you want an indoor cycling competition you should arrange it as if it's a bunch of individual time trials running simultaenously. No simulated drafting, no call of duty unlocks, nothing.
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cygnet

  • I'm part of the association
Re: eLance
« Reply #12 on: October 07, 2019, 11:32:42 pm »
Rowing tends not to go uphill :P


I Said, I've Got A Big Stick

cygnet

  • I'm part of the association
Re: eLance
« Reply #13 on: October 07, 2019, 11:58:40 pm »
In erowing I suppose its like assigning each person the same boat hull. I suppose you could fairly consistently (if not accurately) calculate the effect of increased body/boat weight on the drag, but the relative viscocities of air and water mean they haven't got close to the aero benefits vs power loss of body profiles (ignoring make-believe bikes completely) so its not comparable to a cycling TT

This is the Zwift Pro version of the Giro TT:

If the link doesn't work its Conor Dunne (the only pro to rival Stijn Vandenbergh for "cyclist most like a barn door") sitting pretty much bolt upright, aero as a brick. Putting out a "shed load" (boom-boom) more Watts because he doesn't have to worry about aerodynamics.
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My bold

I Said, I've Got A Big Stick

Re: eLance
« Reply #14 on: October 08, 2019, 08:23:15 am »
In erowing I suppose its like assigning each person the same boat hull. I suppose you could fairly consistently (if not accurately) calculate the effect of increased body/boat weight on the drag, but the relative viscocities of air and water mean they haven't got close to the aero benefits vs power loss of body profiles (ignoring make-believe bikes completely) so its not comparable to a cycling TT

This is the Zwift Pro version of the Giro TT:

If the link doesn't work its Conor Dunne (the only pro to rival Stijn Vandenbergh for "cyclist most like a barn door") sitting pretty much bolt upright, aero as a brick. Putting out a "shed load" (boom-boom) more Watts because he doesn't have to worry about aerodynamics.
Tag-line
"Gaming meets a Grand Tour for the first time ever"
My bold
I don't know rowing.

I do know kayaking.

The kayaking equivalent would be putting someone in a Nelo 7 vs a Hobie.

The difference being that it takes a great deal of skill to even paddle a Nelo 7, and even more skill to paddle one hard in race conditions. Power output goes way down when you are using a lot of energy and paddling just to stay upright. There are probably equivalents in rowing shells (but maybe not so extreme, I've been told that the oars help with stability).

Oh, and boats do go 'uphill'. Rivers have currents.
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fboab

  • It's a fecking serious business, riding a bike
Re: eLance
« Reply #15 on: October 08, 2019, 08:57:36 am »
Yeah, the in game physics are affected by the bike - the Tron bike is apparently more aero but a bit heavier. They should all be on equal bikes (or bikes with equal game physics but different logos if necessary) for BC events though - the idea that BC is incentivising people to train on Zwift is wrong IMO.
It's ridiculous. I've got a Tron bike (yay, go me) that I 'earned' by virtual climbing. The first ride I did after 'earning' it was a Zwift Academy Group Ride (NB- ride= non competitive) where all the participants were on the same bike. The Tron bike (I think you'll find that's a Zwift Concept Bike, to be accurate) is faster under almost all conditions. Wheels make a difference too- but it's a bit like modding your weapons in Ratchet & Clank. As you level up, killing things gets easier. No shit. That's how computer games keep you hooked.
Competitive gaming is fine- No1 Son used to watch DOTA tourneys (no, I don't know what that means but he learnt a bit of Korean from the commentary) but claiming that's anything like doing it in the real world is a bit, erm, delusional.
It's all about income, isn't it? Zwift wants UCI/BC rubber stamping so that the Mamils can compare themselves with the pros. I really don't see that what he did justifies an outdoor ban (he defs should be banned from Zwift racing) unless they're going with the whole 'dishonourable conduct' 'bringing the sport into disrepute' angle.
pfft. TL;DR. i like the game, but it's a game....
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Re: eLance
« Reply #16 on: October 08, 2019, 09:17:10 am »
I really don't see that what he did justifies an outdoor ban (he defs should be banned from Zwift racing) unless they're going with the whole 'dishonourable conduct' 'bringing the sport into disrepute' angle.
That's the angle they took.

Re: eLance
« Reply #17 on: October 08, 2019, 10:30:24 am »
Bloody hell, it's a video game connected to your turbo trainer!

From this thread I thought it's to with ebikes ie electric assist bikes!

Anyhow, I don't think there should be even a national "champion" of turbo cycling!

LMT

Re: eLance
« Reply #18 on: October 08, 2019, 12:23:01 pm »
Those who mock Zwift and turbo trainers, Esports is feckng huge and will continue to grow.

LMT

Re: eLance
« Reply #19 on: October 08, 2019, 12:24:48 pm »
Bit naughty of BC to retrospectively bust Cameron. Looking at his recent vids he iss off on tour across France.

Re: eLance
« Reply #20 on: October 08, 2019, 04:36:26 pm »
Looking at his recent vids he iss off on tour across France.

tHAts Wut chEAts do. a tOuR dE franCE!