Author Topic: Knees - good article  (Read 988 times)

Knees - good article
« on: February 22, 2020, 09:51:27 am »
Having picked up on research suggesting that running is protective against osteoarthritis in knees, I thought this was interesting

https://amp.smh.com.au/lifestyle/health-and-wellness/how-exercise-saved-my-clicky-knees-but-i-should-have-started-sooner-20200204-p53xqf.html?__twitter_impression=true

Re: Knees - good article
« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2020, 01:27:41 am »
Somewhat related: The best thing I ever did for my back, was to lift heavy weights. 10+ years of back issues when away when I learned how to squat and deadlift.

Re: Knees - good article
« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2020, 10:24:11 pm »
Having picked up on research suggesting that running is protective against osteoarthritis in knees, I thought this was interesting

https://amp.smh.com.au/lifestyle/health-and-wellness/how-exercise-saved-my-clicky-knees-but-i-should-have-started-sooner-20200204-p53xqf.html?__twitter_impression=true

It is interesting. There have been a couple of BBC programmes that have featured similar ideas.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0bbq1gt

Scroll down for the transcript.

Quote
Certainly, we know that if you do MRI scans after people after they’ve just done a marathon or just a high intensity run, when the radiologists look at the MRI scans they can see that there has been indications within the cartilage that it shows that there might be some damage or inflammation.  Now that’s all well and good in the acute phase but there have been some really good studies, particularly one longitudinal study from Melbourne, where they looked at 249 patients over a long period of time and actually what they found was the exact opposite on the MRI scans – patients that did lots of vigorous exercise, almost in a linear fashion, the more vigorous exercise they did the thicker their articular cartilage was.

And Michael Moseley has covered it a few times:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/proginfo/2018/05/the-truth-about-getting-fit

I can’t find a transcript of that one though. I think it also mentions the benefit of higher cadence and shorter strides for joint preservation.

I’m on board with it but it doesn’t stop some lifelong runners like my dad ending up with very dodgy hips.






Re: Knees - good article
« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2020, 06:54:21 am »
Quote
I’m on board with it but it doesn’t stop some lifelong runners like my dad ending up with very dodgy hips.

Just as accurate to say
I’m on board with it as it has stopped some lifelong runners like my dad with very dodgy hips from becoming completely immobile. Delayed his need for surgery, etc

Humans are hard wired to make associative leaps that are often not true.

Re: Knees - good article
« Reply #4 on: February 27, 2020, 07:13:40 pm »
Quote
I’m on board with it but it doesn’t stop some lifelong runners like my dad ending up with very dodgy hips.

Just as accurate to say
I’m on board with it as it has stopped some lifelong runners like my dad with very dodgy hips from becoming completely immobile. Delayed his need for surgery, etc

Humans are hard wired to make associative leaps that are often not true.


I know. It was a flippant remark. The dad in question is 87 now.

Re: Knees - good article
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2020, 08:32:53 am »
Quote
I’m on board with it but it doesn’t stop some lifelong runners like my dad ending up with very dodgy hips.

Just as accurate to say
I’m on board with it as it has stopped some lifelong runners like my dad with very dodgy hips from becoming completely immobile. Delayed his need for surgery, etc

Humans are hard wired to make associative leaps that are often not true.

Hmm I'd resemble that remark.

Not a lifelong runner, but lifelong exerciser, including some running (I go through phases of running).

Dodgy hip from Perthes - theoretical aftereffects of Perthes, and the treatment, suggest heavy exercise are bad.
I'm one of the few who had that specific treatment (toronto split) who don't have severe scoliosis, haven't required an artificial hip and can still walk without stick or crutches.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Re: Knees - good article
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2020, 09:36:40 am »
I look at all this with a very cynical biased mind. I hate running and don't do it in any form for pleasure. I have never had this "runner's high" that is talked about in that Michael Moseley piece (the high that i get is the same as I get bashing my head against a brick wall - it's so nice when the pain stops). Given this I can't see that studying people who run marathons says anything about anyone other than people who have an ability to run marathons. (Given the thousands who go in for popular marathons, I would have thought that the 249 mentioned is a bit small to be a representative sample.) If the sport is meant to be "high intensity" surely studying 200m and 400m runners in an athletics tournament would be more appropriate (or rugby players and american footballers for example).
I note that in professional cricket fast bowlers have a remarkably high rate of breakdown in spite (or perhaps because) of the high intensity of their sport, and that with all the sports medical support that helps them.

If I listen to my GP then the bulk of the studies on arthritis conclude that a major factor is your parentage. (He runs - but he isn't selling it as an activity - just says the important thing is staying active, regardless of the pain, because the pain is never going to go away)

Re: Knees - good article
« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2020, 09:57:45 pm »
I look at all this with a very cynical biased mind. I hate running and don't do it in any form for pleasure. I have never had this "runner's high" that is talked about in that Michael Moseley piece (the high that i get is the same as I get bashing my head against a brick wall - it's so nice when the pain stops). Given this I can't see that studying people who run marathons says anything about anyone other than people who have an ability to run marathons. (Given the thousands who go in for popular marathons, I would have thought that the 249 mentioned is a bit small to be a representative sample.) If the sport is meant to be "high intensity" surely studying 200m and 400m runners in an athletics tournament would be more appropriate (or rugby players and american footballers for example).
I note that in professional cricket fast bowlers have a remarkably high rate of breakdown in spite (or perhaps because) of the high intensity of their sport, and that with all the sports medical support that helps them.

If I listen to my GP then the bulk of the studies on arthritis conclude that a major factor is your parentage. (He runs - but he isn't selling it as an activity - just says the important thing is staying active, regardless of the pain, because the pain is never going to go away)


Why cynical and biased. Lots of people don’t enjoy running - I don’t understand that, but I know it’s true because they tell me so. They also tell me how bad it is for my knees - although the knee surgeon who removed the cyst on my ACL told me the cartledge was in good shape.

After years of the orthodoxy being that runners knees would fail, we’re all delighted to find out that our chosen activity appears protective - base genetics permitting of course. I have a good friend who was told not to run for years because of knee damage (high level rowing I think) and she recently been allowed to start again. This has been brilliant for her, particularly after she had a very nasty fall when we were out together a few years ago.