Author Topic: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer  (Read 919 times)

I've got a luggage rack which I recently ordered from a recumbent maker, the rack was designed by this recumbent maker for my particular recumbent. I tried to fit it and found it wasn't lining up as it should with the frame bosses. This rack was a small underseat rack for smaller size panniers and cost me the equivalent of UK£115, so not cheap. But it is sturdy.

When I contacted them about this, this was the reply I got ...


Quote
Do not worry, this misalignment is unfortunately inevitable if you combine 2 different handmade 3D welding parts.Please fix the upper bolt first (not tight but at least 4-5 threads)and pull the lowrider forward to fix the lower bolts.The upper tube will create its unique wave to fit perfectly to the very Spirit frame.Tighten all bolts afterwards.

I wasn't very impressed by this but I thought okay I'll try again and give them the benefit of the doubt. Now I'm no Brunel but I have been servicing & putting bikes together for over 30 years. But there was no way this rack was going on unless brute force of not one but 2 people was involved with the risk of threads being stripped. And though I've honestly tried to get it to fit there was no way I was going the inflict further scratches on my paintwork.

This got me really, really peeved is it now too much to ask of a recumbent maker to make IN HOUSE a rack that fits properly. Seriously!!

I'm not going to mention any names but we're talking about a well known maker of quality recumbents. The only way I'll be able to get this to fit will be to make modifications with my Dremmel which I'm happy to do but I'm not paying them full price for something that doesn't fit properly and I've had to bodge.

What would you do?

LMT

Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2020, 10:58:32 pm »
Name the company so others don't make the same mistake of buying from them.

Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2020, 11:14:12 pm »
Oh I will do if they don't come to their senses

Dave_C

  • Trying to get rid of my belly... and failing!
Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #3 on: June 16, 2020, 12:13:09 am »
I would take lots of pictures to illustrate the problem, even video. Then contact the manufacturer and complain that their fix does not work. Ask them for a further suggestion and tell them if that does not work you expect a refund.

If they are a niche market vendor they, A) won't want to piss off their customers,B) will usually give you a reasonable service, as their customer base is small, and C), if you piss them off, you may never get any service from them in future should you need any further parts or such potentially leaving you with a non working bike to try to sell on.

Don't just resort to attempting to black list them, that just pisses off them, which serves little purpose other than to make you feel better for a short time. Try them again, they should be approachable. Good Luck!

Dave C

Sent from my HD1913 using Tapatalk

@DaveCrampton < wot a twit.
http://veloviewer.com/athlete/421683/

Blodwyn Pig

  • what a nice chap
Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #4 on: June 16, 2020, 08:37:51 am »
As you mentioned on another forum,( https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=138540  )   where you have also posted this, your photos show it is not fit for purpose, and your first port of call is the seller of the goods, favour or not.



Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2020, 09:07:41 am »
I agree with the above comments, with the one small cavieat; how certain can we be that the recumbent has been built to the strict dimensions?

<i>Marmite slave</i>

Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #6 on: June 16, 2020, 09:15:44 am »
Yeah, it's entirely possible it's your bike frame that's out of spec, if indeed there is a spec.

However if they know precision isn't their forte they should either make the rack inherently flexible or at least have enlarged holes for easier fit.

But it's not really clear what you're after. A partial refund would be dealt with via the shop you got it from, not the manufacturer.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #7 on: June 16, 2020, 12:06:09 pm »
I had to fit a replacement lowrider to my recumbent from the same manufacturer (I don't know why we're being cagey, it's clearly HPVelotechnik), after the original was damaged through general abuse.  It was an absolute pig of a job, and required me to apply tension to keep things lined up while barakta inserted the suspension bolts.  I wasn't sure if it was actually a tolerance issue, though, as the main problem was keeping the lowrider rack, the main rack and the two parts of the frame all lined up at the same time (and it's entirely possible that the bike's no longer straight, after tens of thousands of miles, including many train journeys and several crashes).

I think they've failed to apply the "if you can't make it perfect, make it adjustable" principle.

To their credit, I was impressed that I could simply email them, get a timely reply, make the appropriate bank tranafer, and have the part within a few days - rather than the recumbent industry standard of people failing to follow-up on things, requiring that you deal with them by phone and so on.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #8 on: June 16, 2020, 01:39:39 pm »
In the UK, you can return it under the distance selling regulations if it was bought by mail order/internet. Other countries have similar laws.

Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #9 on: June 16, 2020, 03:54:03 pm »
I had to fit a replacement lowrider to my recumbent from the same manufacturer (I don't know why we're being cagey, it's clearly HPVelotechnik), after the original was damaged through general abuse.  It was an absolute pig of a job, and required me to apply tension to keep things lined up while barakta inserted the suspension bolts.  I wasn't sure if it was actually a tolerance issue, though, as the main problem was keeping the lowrider rack, the main rack and the two parts of the frame all lined up at the same time (and it's entirely possible that the bike's no longer straight, after tens of thousands of miles, including many train journeys and several crashes).

I think they've failed to apply the "if you can't make it perfect, make it adjustable" principle.

To their credit, I was impressed that I could simply email them, get a timely reply, make the appropriate bank tranafer, and have the part within a few days - rather than the recumbent industry standard of people failing to follow-up on things, requiring that you deal with them by phone and so on.


Yes Kim it was HPV.

After paying £115 for a small luggage rack they are expecting me to be happy to bodge it by forcing it to fit and have inherent tension on the bolts. One of the bolts as you well know which secures the top of the low rider rack is not substantial. I did manage, and it was a struggle, to fit both pivot bolts which are sizeable but then trying to screw home the top insubstantial bolt felt a really bad idea as it had so much tension placed on by the rack pulling on it, it felt like it would shear the threads in the boss. Not only that but for them to say....

Quote
Do not worry, this misalignment is unfortunately inevitable if you combine 2 different handmade 3D welding parts.

That's just nuts  :facepalm:

I would upload image files but this site does not seem to offer that option

Carlosfandango

  • Yours fragrantly.
Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #10 on: June 16, 2020, 04:03:04 pm »
If you're not happy with it ask for a refund, you're not gonna get recompense by wingeing on here.

LittleWheelsandBig

  • Whimsy Rider
Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #11 on: June 16, 2020, 04:12:32 pm »
Host photos elsewhere and link to them.
Wheel meet again, don't know where, don't know when...

Blodwyn Pig

  • what a nice chap
Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2020, 04:15:21 pm »
Host photos elsewhere and link to them.

photos here....................   https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=138540

interestingly, the yellow bike in the link, has a spacer twixt rack and frame, possibly 20mm,  this might alter the angle/ distance, from a fixed point, in an arc.

Yes that's the answer.  Fit 2 pivot bolts, then with a long center bolt thread thro the rack hole,and then into the threaded hole,and measure the distance, when the rack is horizontal.  The rack on the yellow bike, is horizontal, but in your close up of 'missalignment' if you were to bolt directly to frame, then the top rails of rack would slope. It need a spacer.

Blodwyn Pig

  • what a nice chap
Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2020, 04:34:20 pm »
Yep , that's it, sorted.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=i&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.hpvelotechnik.com%2Fde%2F%3Fjet_download%3D12457&psig=AOvVaw0L04j7XcSnmgvg3JXsQmZg&ust=1592407732065000&source=images&cd=vfe&ved=0CAkQjhxqFwoTCLCT2pzThuoCFQAAAAAdAAAAABAF

here is a link to a download of the operating manual for the Spirit,  Pages 21 and 22 clearly show a spacer of maybe 35mm long to level  the rack, where it attaches to the frame.  You just need to order a spacer from your friendly HPV dealer, and possibly the correct bolt as well.

Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2020, 09:07:20 pm »
When I was looking at ordering one of these racks this was one of the photos I saw Blodwyn. Already tried that, though I haven't taken a photo with the rubber washers. These came supplied with my rack and your right having the spacers does improve the angle of the bolt but it still falls too short to screw into the frame's boss and the angle of attack is still off.

HPVs advice was to actually attach this top bolt first 4/5 turns then pull the rack forward and fix the pivot bolts which I struggled but managed to do but not without scratching my frame :(  It really is a 2 man job. Then screw home the top bolt. When I tried to do the last bit I could feel the top bolt if I forced it would strip out the threads in the boss and the bolt was very hard to turn as it was being pulled by what is a very solid and sturdy rack. Quite clearly the rack is too small by several mm and trying to force it means the top bolt is being forced into the boss when it's not at the right angle and this would lead to thread stripping.

Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #15 on: June 16, 2020, 11:24:13 pm »
I've actually given up with HPV. Alex at HPV just sent me an email to do with my original HPV Spirit 20x16 where I'd enquired about getting a rack 2 years ago, see attachment. Where he warned me about the rack fitting. I didn't buy it on that occasion.



2 years later, I've got a newer model, the HPV Spirit 20x20 and when I enquired again I was told I'd need to use code LRHPSRT2 as the rack was different. I ordered and no mention of potential fitting issues was made. But the same issue arises again!!!

I'm not being pig headed, the rack simply does not fit. I've sent a response (gist of it below) back to Alex and washed my hands of further involvement with them.

Quote
If I have to force you to provide proper customer service by sending continuous emails like this then I've now reached the point where I give up. If you are not willing to admit that your luggage rack does not fit properly but you are still happy to charge full price then You win! You win simply because I don't have the time for this anymore.

And I honestly don't

Tomorrow the Dremel comes out and I'll be making adjustments myself and hope to post photos of the finished job. Thanks for your feedback and contributions.

Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #16 on: June 16, 2020, 11:24:49 pm »
I've actually given up with HPV. Alex at HPV just sent me an email to do with my original HPV Spirit 20x16 where I'd enquired about getting a rack 2 years ago, see attachment. Where he warned me about the rack fitting. I didn't buy it on that occasion. I've taken a screenshot of his screenshot that he sent to me regarding my enquiry 2 years ago, see link.

http://photos.app.goo.gl/6w8hwWWkWsK5MQbz6

2 years later, I've got a newer model, the HPV Spirit 20x20 and when I enquired again I was told I'd need to use code LRHPSRT2 as the rack was different. I ordered and no mention of potential fitting issues was made. But the same issue arises again!!!

I'm not being pig headed, the rack simply does not fit. I've sent a response (gist of it below) back to Alex and washed my hands of further involvement with them.

Quote
If I have to force you to provide proper customer service by sending continuous emails like this then I've now reached the point where I give up. If you are not willing to admit that your luggage rack does not fit properly but you are still happy to charge full price then You win! You win simply because I don't have the time for this anymore.

And I honestly don't

Tomorrow the Dremel comes out and I'll be making adjustments myself and hope to post photos of the finished job. Thanks for your feedback and contributions.

Blodwyn Pig

  • what a nice chap
Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #17 on: June 17, 2020, 11:19:10 am »
personally I wouldn't dremel, I'd dummy fit with 2 pivot bolts, then offer up with spacer,  and then clout the rack in the center of the top fixing rail, with something rounded and wooden,  to put a slight bow in it to suit.  or make a offset spacer,  with a flat bit of bar, and 2 holes.

Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #18 on: June 23, 2020, 01:06:57 am »
personally I wouldn't dremel, I'd dummy fit with 2 pivot bolts, then offer up with spacer,  and then clout the rack in the center of the top fixing rail, with something rounded and wooden,  to put a slight bow in it to suit.  or make a offset spacer,  with a flat bit of bar, and 2 holes.

+1^^^

The other option is to return it for either refund or replacement.

Re: Acceptable service from a well known recumbent manufacturer
« Reply #19 on: July 09, 2020, 12:54:45 am »
Well in the end I got my Dremel out and turned the hole into a slot the only way I was going to get this damn luggage rack to fit.

Before
After