Author Topic: Dyno light connectors.  (Read 922 times)

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Dyno light connectors.
« on: October 06, 2020, 01:55:17 pm »


I have an Edelux II front light, and a B&M Secula rear dynamo light. I'm pondering augmenting the rear light with a dyno light fitted to my bag. But the bag is removable, which means any wiring also needs to have a disconnect in the middle somewhere.

Does anyone have any recommendations for durable, easy to use, waterproof connectors, suitable for use with a rear dynamo light? Ideally something that can handle a few thousand connect/disconnect cycles without damage.

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2020, 02:01:34 pm »
Maybe something like this? https://ebay.us/vDlYVj
Most of the stuff I say is true because I saw it in a dream and I don't have the presence of mind to make up lies when I'm asleep.   Bryan Andreas

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2020, 02:05:41 pm »
Maybe something like this? https://ebay.us/vDlYVj

That could do it. I wonder how plausible it would be to cross thread it when tired...

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2020, 02:08:55 pm »
I use Tamiya connectors for this (rear lights on the Baron and trike to facilitate rack/mudguard removal, and for easy connection of an e-Werk or similar on my touring bike).  The female part (confusingly the one with the male pins) can be cable-tied to a convenient bit of bike without interfering with the mating procedure.  While it isn't waterproof, it's non-shorting when wet and open enough that it dries out properly.  I reckon this is a better approach if the bike's going to be ridden without anything connected, as (unless you use a dummy plug) a truly waterproof connector will tend to collect water when exposed to the elements.





The top photo dates from 2010.  That bike's done about 31000 miles and many overnights outdoors since then, in all sorts of weather.  No issues.  (The connector's not had that many mating cycles, admittedly.  Maybe a hundred?)
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2020, 02:13:14 pm »
I use Tamiya connectors for this (rear lights on the Baron and trike to facilitate rack/mudguard removal, and for easy connection of an e-Werk or similar on my touring bike).  The female part (confusingly the one with the male pins) can be cable-tied to a convenient bit of bike without interfering with the mating procedure.  While it isn't waterproof, it's non-shorting when wet and open enough that it dries out properly.  I reckon this is a better approach if the bike's going to be ridden without anything connected, as (unless you use a dummy plug) a truly waterproof connector will tend to collect water when exposed to the elements.

Sounds interesting. I presume you mean these:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tamiya_connector

How well would one fair unplugged if left in the spray of an unmudguarded rear wheel?

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2020, 02:17:26 pm »
Sounds interesting. I presume you mean these:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tamiya_connector

How well would one fair unplugged if left in the spray of an unmudguarded rear wheel?

That's the badger.

The connector would probably be fine electrically, but if it fills up with mud it might need squirting with something before you can plug into it.  On both my bikes with normally-disconnected Tamiyas I've positioned it away from wheel spray (easy with mudguards), so it only has to cope with rain.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2020, 02:20:39 pm »
The alternative approach would be something like the Delphi Weatherpack connector, shown here supplying voles to the motor on barakta's trike:



It's designed for motor vehicle wheel wells and engine compartments, so is more than up to the job.  But it's bulky and really needs to stay plugged in.

(Just to the left is a proprietary less well-engineered 6-pin waterpoof connector for the motor control wiring.  That sort of thing should be readily available from suppliers of Chinesium e-bike parts.)
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Zed43

  • prefers UK hills over Dutch mountains
Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2020, 06:38:58 pm »

Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #8 on: October 06, 2020, 07:28:05 pm »
FWIW I once owned an Italian motorcycle which used multi-pin versions of connectors that looked like Tamiya ones, but made by Molex.  These were poorly positioned on the machine so collected all kinds of crud like it was going out of fashion.  However it turned out it  didn't really matter where they were placed, road spray still got into them, and in the winter that meant they would start corroding (because of road salt) unless otherwise protected.  I have encountered similar problems with various electrical connectors on bicycles.   If you never ride on damp/gritted roads there is less to worry about in this regard.

In the OP's position the extra light is presumably to be run in parallel with the usual rear light, so it arguably isn't the end of the world if the connection isn't perfectly reliable.  Given that the wish list is to be compromised to some extent, maybe waterproofness is worth compromising on to better arrange the other qualities desired?

With this in mind I'd favour either

a) installing a socket in the existing rear light housing (e.g. for a small jack plug) or
b) installing trailing leads with trailing bullet connectors on them near the rear light.

In both cases water resistance and corrosion protection would be obtained by using something like waxoyl on all the exposed metal parts. I have found this is adequate for otherwise unprotected dynamo connections.

The other thing is that some B&M rear lights have two types of connection to them; e.g. 2.8mm blade connections and bare wire connections.  This makes it easy to install a second rear light in parallel, using the second set of connections.

I don't remember if the secula has a second connection on it or not, but if not then a different main light (with two connections) and using the secula (with a suitable bracket) as a 'bag light' might work as easily as anything else.

'Toplight line plus' has two types of connection as described



'some manufacture of brackets required'

hth

cheers

FifeingEejit

  • Not Small
Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #9 on: October 06, 2020, 07:32:03 pm »

Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #10 on: October 06, 2020, 08:34:24 pm »
If you are directly connecting to a dynamo hub alternator there is no electrolytic corrosion a serious water + DC problem. Also on the primary alternator side  open circuit  Voltage (about 50V) will negate any mild oxidation.


Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #12 on: October 07, 2020, 06:38:53 am »
Neodymium magnets corrode. Tatty cable terminations Overpriced problem not a solution.

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #13 on: October 07, 2020, 11:22:42 am »
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #14 on: October 07, 2020, 11:27:44 am »

Does anyone have any recommendations for durable, easy to use, waterproof connectors, suitable for use with a rear dynamo light? Ideally something that can handle a few thousand connect/disconnect cycles without damage.

J

I could easily see me forgetting to unplug and I leave the bike a minute to grab a coffee. This could be quite comical/dramatic

Anyone look at magnetic connectors?

Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #15 on: October 07, 2020, 03:05:32 pm »
If you are directly connecting to a dynamo hub alternator there is no electrolytic corrosion a serious water + DC problem. Also on the primary alternator side  open circuit  Voltage (about 50V) will negate any mild oxidation.

the only time the voltage gets to 50V is when the load is not enough to hold it down.  It is a bad idea to run a rear light only from a hub generator; it specifically tells you not to do this in most B&M instructions. If you connect the rear light to the hub generator directly then it doesn't turn on and off with the main light switch, so you will be doing this at least some of the time.

Lightly corroded wires at the main connection to the generator can become intermittent, such that the light goes on and off with speed, but this usually just means you didn't put any waxoyl/Vaseline/silicone grease on the plug.  With the headlight connected and working, the rear light connection can go intermittent and it won't restart so easily because the voltage never gets much above 6V.

So in several respects you are better off routing the rear light through the headlight, not connecting it to the generator directly.

cheers

Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #16 on: October 07, 2020, 08:19:21 pm »
In line trailer light connectors anyone? Humongously huge and fugly but not actually that heavy if you get the plastic ones. Cheap, designed to be plugged and unplugged ad infinitum (not really, no manufacturer is that stupid/complacent!), relatively easily fixed when it doesn't work, designed to be left unconnected in cruddy places. Enough spare pins to wire loads of gadgets. Ok there's a lot not to like (being designed for 12v means that their normal use tolerates a voltage drop/resistance that would be embarassing on a bike) so why hasn't someone made the equivalent bicycle plug? (Thinks, out with the 3D printer! :P  )

Ed. Follow up to this: how well do lego blocks take to being regularly unhooked? I now have my dynamo front light working well, except that I am going to have to unplug it every time the bike needs to go in the car (when I need to take the front wheel out) which might be fairly frequently (more often than for incidental deflations in my experience). I am wondering about simply organising a front light mount that allows me to unhook wheel and light together without touching the block but this might be a hammer to crack a nut!

Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #17 on: October 07, 2020, 10:03:17 pm »
if you mean the usual shimano plug on the hub generator, then the copper strands in the wires fail by abrasion, eventually.  Then you need to re-prep the wire ends and remake the connection.

cheers

Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #18 on: October 07, 2020, 11:54:15 pm »
Neodymium magnets corrode.
That's why they are nickel/copper coated, which doubtless explains a bit of the £££

Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #19 on: October 08, 2020, 01:49:56 am »
https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/dynamos/dynasnap-magnetic-wire-connection-2-pack/

A bit spendy

No more so than the SON stuff.


J
Have you found a cheaper supplier than the one linked?
If not it's over twice the price.
The Supernova connectors also look tidy, though like the magnetic they're also singles.
https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/lighting-spares/supernova-qr-gold-connector-set-with-integrated-shrink-wrap/

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #20 on: October 08, 2020, 12:14:31 pm »
Quote
No more so than the SON stuff.
Have you found a cheaper supplier than the one linked?

No, I was looking at the price on the SON website...

Quote
If not it's over twice the price.
The Supernova connectors also look tidy, though like the magnetic they're also singles.
https://www.sjscycles.co.uk/lighting-spares/supernova-qr-gold-connector-set-with-integrated-shrink-wrap/

Those are just 4mm Banana plugs, gold plated. They provide no protection from water, dirt, or shorting against each other...

I do like the idea of the dyna snap ones, as if I forget to unplug, they will just detach eventually, assuming the solder joint is stronger than the magnet...

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #21 on: October 08, 2020, 12:30:34 pm »
Quote
No more so than the SON stuff.
Have you found a cheaper supplier than the one linked?

No, I was looking at the price on the SON website...
Magnetic USB cables are much cheaper, athough modifying one could be a bit of a hassle. Some of them work better than others: https://www.youtube.com/embed/Euz00E3otlQ

Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #22 on: October 08, 2020, 12:43:51 pm »
Quote
No more so than the SON stuff.
Have you found a cheaper supplier than the one linked?

No, I was looking at the price on the SON website...
J
At least one of us is confused, though it wouldn't be unusual for it to be me  :-[
The SON coaxial connector in the link above is 12 euro and the pair of magnetic connectors in the link above is 27 quid ???

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #23 on: October 08, 2020, 12:47:32 pm »
At least one of us is confused, though it wouldn't be unusual for it to be me  :-[
The SON coaxial connector in the link above is 12 euro and the pair of magnetic connectors in the link above is 27 quid ???

It would probably be me. I've no idea what numbers I was thinking of, looking back at the SON website, they look much more affordable than I remembered:

https://nabendynamo.de/en/products/wiring/son-coaxial-connector-system/

Maybe it's the €190 box in the bottom left corner that scared me...

J
--
Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Dyno light connectors.
« Reply #24 on: October 08, 2020, 12:50:28 pm »
Maybe it's the €190 box in the bottom left corner that scared me...

J
Yes, maybe that price includes someone coming round and doing the soldering for you and the hovering and washing up while they're there.