Author Topic: Everesting  (Read 3060 times)

Re: Everesting
« Reply #50 on: December 11, 2018, 06:49:28 pm »
I know a couple of people who've Everested and have great respect for their efforts.  For me it doesn't seem any more obtuse or OCD than a doing a hilly 600 in shitty weather.

The Tenerife suggested above would be more or less guaranteed fantastic weather and stunning scenery (which would certainly bear a few passes).

In terms of ratifying or recognising,  TG probably has it right.  Easiest to keep things as they are.

whosatthewheel

Re: Everesting
« Reply #51 on: December 11, 2018, 07:10:08 pm »
Long distances in AUK are about the journey, not just the number of miles cycled. 


yes, yes, yes...

In Everesting all the elements of an adventure are stripped off

Re: Everesting
« Reply #52 on: December 11, 2018, 07:42:57 pm »
If you're a regular audaxer a lot of rides (probably most) don't go anywhere you haven't been before, and they become as much about how long you can keep the pedals turning for as anything else.

As a physical challenge I'd say audax has more in common with Everesting than, say, the leisurely cycle tours that often feature on the pages of Arriveé that I've never seen anyone complain about.

bairn again

Re: Everesting
« Reply #53 on: December 11, 2018, 07:58:55 pm »
Ive never understood why AUK spends time effort and money promoting stuff that isnt long distance cycling. 

CrazyEnglishTriathlete

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Re: Everesting
« Reply #54 on: December 11, 2018, 09:37:01 pm »
Doesn't AUK recognise the Mersey roads 24hr TT? Isn't that done on a circuit?

That's historical (the 24h TT used to be the only way to qualify for PBP before AUK existed). AUK simply awards points for distance covered in the 24h TT, it doesn't make it an Audax in any way.

When Wilko rode 541 miles on the Sussex 24 Hr TT, I estimated he'd completed 7000m ascent, so a little shy of an Everest.  But not bad for someone setting a distance best on a TT.

The closest I got to Everesting was on the Cambrian 4C, where I'd complete about 7700m ascent at the 24 hour mark. 
Eddington Numbers 125 (imperial), 168 (metric) 518 (furlongs)  111 (nautical miles)

cygnet

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Re: Everesting
« Reply #55 on: December 11, 2018, 10:41:30 pm »
Ive never understood why AUK spends time effort and money promoting stuff that isnt long distance cycling.

How much money are they wasting in your opinion? ::-)
I Said, I've Got A Big Stick

Re: Everesting
« Reply #56 on: December 11, 2018, 10:52:19 pm »
Has anyone noticed there appear to be no lights, red rear reflector or pedal reflectors (hard to confirm I know) on the bike on the front cover? I thought I’d know if the Highway Code had changed 🤔
Bikes are for riding, not cleaning!

frankly frankie

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Re: Everesting
« Reply #57 on: December 11, 2018, 11:28:43 pm »
Audaxers have to ride a machine complying with road traffic laws.  Highway Code doesn't enter into it.
It's not dark yet but it's getting there.

Re: Everesting
« Reply #58 on: December 11, 2018, 11:36:52 pm »
6 pedant points to FF. The Highway Code is a summary of various Road Traffic Laws, we all know what the OP meant.

Technically, to out pedant the pedant, they do not *HAVE* to ride a machine complying with road traffic laws.

Reg 9.3.2 states "The responsibility for ensuring that a machine complies with the road traffic laws rests solely with the rider." i.e. there is no responsibility on the organiser or AUK.

Indeed, very few machines I've seen on Audaxes comply with all of the road traffic laws, so if it was an AUK requirement then plenty of people would have their validated Brevets struck from the lists.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Everesting
« Reply #59 on: December 12, 2018, 06:40:30 am »
Has anyone noticed there appear to be no lights, red rear reflector or pedal reflectors (hard to confirm I know) on the bike on the front cover? I thought I’d know if the Highway Code had changed 🤔

Unless the photo is taken between the hours of sunset and sunrise, then there is no requirement to have reflectors or lights. They are only required by law if you are riding in the hours of sunset and sunrise. There is some debate on if this is the case if you are a foreign national riding a bike from abroad, at which point the vienna convention applies, which seems to have no mention of which hours the lights need to be operational, nor does it specify that the reflectors have to be fitted only at night.

When it comes to road traffic laws as they apply to human powered vehicles, many people don't realise that their bike doesn't comply. When I entered RatN earlier this year, rule 1 said obey Dutch traffic laws. So I ran the text through google translate and read it. Which is when I realised that the race rules regarding reflectors/lights, contradicted Dutch traffic law, when taken at the common interpretation. I put far more effort than I perhaps needed to, into making sure that my bike did comply with both the rules of the race, and the law of the land. I need to put the reflectors back on my wheels (I took them off when truing the wheel), so that it once again complies with the vienna convention before I venture to Germany in a week or so.

J
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Re: Everesting
« Reply #60 on: December 12, 2018, 07:48:17 am »
I’ve no issue with people Everesting, although it wasn’t an Audax (neither was the C2C story in this latest issue, but it still made for good reading if the editor didn’t receive rough Audax reports), but it is obviously dark in the cover photo (car headlights). I know Audax UK wouldn’t condone breaking road traffic laws, I just wondered if this was spotted before the mag was printed.

Aside from that, the only times I’ve ridden up a (short) hill several times have been on an hour’s training ride, hoping to improve my climbing ability. If they became Audaxes, I’d find them easier to dnf. Interesting to read about Everesting, but yes, keep them separate.
Bikes are for riding, not cleaning!

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Everesting
« Reply #61 on: December 12, 2018, 08:08:55 am »
I’ve no issue with people Everesting, although it wasn’t an Audax (neither was the C2C story in this latest issue, but it still made for good reading if the editor didn’t receive rough Audax reports), but it is obviously dark in the cover photo (car headlights). I know Audax UK wouldn’t condone breaking road traffic laws, I just wondered if this was spotted before the mag was printed.

Pedantry. Lighting up time for motor vehicles vs pedal cycles is different. Not to mention that all vehicles in the EU sold since 2011. The presence of a motor vehicle with the lights on is no conclusive indicator that a bike was required to also have lights on.

Quote
Aside from that, the only times I’ve ridden up a (short) hill several times have been on an hour’s training ride, hoping to improve my climbing ability. If they became Audaxes, I’d find them easier to dnf. Interesting to read about Everesting, but yes, keep them separate.

My first DIY Audax was done primarily as an attempt at a hill (Signal de Botrange). I wanted to see if I could do a 100k audax whilst also including a boat load of climbing. Not quite enough for an AAA point, but it was an interesting exercise. 34°C temperatures.

I don't think everesting should be something that AUK actively seeks to include in it's validation system, however if we wanted to do so, then it could perhaps be done as an exception, the say way Mersey Roads is, you'd have to cover at least 200km, you'd have to do it in under 13.5 hours, and you'd get 8.75 points out of it. Validation as done by GPX. I don't think there's any pressing need to do this, but it's perhaps a methodology that would permit it. Tho it does go against the current rules on not normally validating a DIY that uses the same bit of road. The regs say "not normally validated", so I assume there is some discretion in there somewhere.

J
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Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Everesting
« Reply #62 on: December 12, 2018, 08:24:03 am »
Ive never understood why AUK spends time effort and money promoting stuff that isnt long distance cycling.

How much money are they wasting in your opinion? ::-)

I on the other hand have enjoyed Arrive so far, its great to read a breadth of stories such as that of Alice's and also that interview in the most recent issue where they had a professional cyclist and an audaxer asked the same questions.  It was great to read their responses and draw comparisons.

Cycling is cycling.
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Re: Everesting
« Reply #63 on: December 12, 2018, 09:43:56 am »
Doesn't AUK recognise the Mersey roads 24hr TT? Isn't that done on a circuit?

That's historical (the 24h TT used to be the only way to qualify for PBP before AUK existed). AUK simply awards points for distance covered in the 24h TT, it doesn't make it an Audax in any way.

The way that happened was that 24 hour TTs were in decline, and may have disappeared completely. It became obvious that the event was being sustained by Audax riders who were treating it as a challenge. Points were a way of bolstering the Audax support.

The composition of the board, and the AGM attendance, naturally supported an event they had experience of. It's entirely possible that it would be possible to mobilise support for novel forms of validated ride.

The main barrier to following fashion would seem to be the cost of altering the website to accommodate changes.

Re: Everesting
« Reply #64 on: December 12, 2018, 09:48:22 am »
So going by her Strava we have a start time of 5:30 and an elapsed time of 12:30, finishing around 6 pm. Sunrise was 6:01 am and sunset was 8:24 pm on August 19. So I suspect the picture was taken at dawn. Civil twilight was at 5:25 am.

So it was probably still fairly dark when she started but rapidly getting lighter. Seems fair enough to me.

Re: Everesting
« Reply #65 on: December 13, 2018, 01:36:03 pm »
Has anyone noticed there appear to be no lights, red rear reflector or pedal reflectors (hard to confirm I know) on the bike on the front cover? I thought I’d know if the Highway Code had changed 🤔

Does that mean that I won the 24 hour TT in 2015 as I can disqualify all the riders without orange pedal reflectors, a legal requirement when riding in the dark?  I reckon my SPD pedals (with sandals of course) gave me a winning edge.

quixoticgeek

  • Mostly Harmless
Re: Everesting
« Reply #66 on: December 13, 2018, 01:46:42 pm »
Does that mean that I won the 24 hour TT in 2015 as I can disqualify all the riders without orange pedal reflectors, a legal requirement when riding in the dark?  I reckon my SPD pedals (with sandals of course) gave me a winning edge.

Careful. Only throw those stones if you can be 100% certain your bike complies with every single letter of the law. Make sure any reflectors you have comply with the right BS standards, make sure your lights comply with a BS standard, or equivalent EU standard (how this one works come April is anyone's guess...). Plod, at least one who knew their shit, could pretty much stop every single cyclist and fine them for something...

J
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Beer, bikes, and backpacking
http://b.42q.eu/

Re: Everesting
« Reply #67 on: December 13, 2018, 02:00:55 pm »
Has anyone noticed there appear to be no lights, red rear reflector or pedal reflectors (hard to confirm I know) on the bike on the front cover? I thought I’d know if the Highway Code had changed 🤔

Does that mean that I won the 24 hour TT in 2015 as I can disqualify all the riders without orange pedal reflectors, a legal requirement when riding in the dark?  I reckon my SPD pedals (with sandals of course) gave me a winning edge.

Did you have front/rear reflectors too (or lights with built in reflectors that had a BS/EU stamp on them)?

I was pedal reflector legal in the 2016 Mersey Roads 24TT thanks to my Click'r pedals but I didn't have front/rear reflectors (and my lights didn't have built in reflectors), so wasn't fully legal when riding at night.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

Re: Everesting
« Reply #68 on: December 13, 2018, 04:32:20 pm »
Wheel and front white reflectors at night are optional. We had a co-ordinator who’d send letters to the schools saying the kids bikes had to have a red rear reflector on them. We’d point out only at night. Lots of parents were in the habit of buying their kids a new bike ready for Bikeability, then having to take the seatpost reflector off to get the saddle low enough so that they could reach the floor!
Bikes are for riding, not cleaning!

Re: Everesting
« Reply #69 on: December 13, 2018, 04:38:00 pm »
Good point, forgot it's only the rear reflector (and pedal) reflectors that are required at "night".
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

mattc

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Re: Everesting
« Reply #70 on: December 13, 2018, 08:13:18 pm »
Where is that post about making Arrivée more dull? I have an idea for an article ...
Has never ridden RAAM
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Re: Everesting
« Reply #71 on: December 13, 2018, 08:19:43 pm »
So going by her Strava we have a start time of 5:30 and an elapsed time of 12:30, finishing around 6 pm. Sunrise was 6:01 am and sunset was 8:24 pm on August 19. So I suspect the picture was taken at dawn. Civil twilight was at 5:25 am.

So it was probably still fairly dark when she started but rapidly getting lighter. Seems fair enough to me.

The picture is pointing east (the climb is north to south), and the sky is light in that direction, so I'd say you're right :thumbsup: