Author Topic: Building with CX-Rays: which nipples? Do I need washers?  (Read 1559 times)

Porkins

  • Formerly Nick H. And a long time ago etc, Eurostar
Building with CX-Rays: which nipples? Do I need washers?
« on: April 14, 2008, 11:27:09 pm »
I want to build with CX-Rays, partly for the challenge of it.  And because they should last for ever if I build them right. And for the bling.  So I don't care about the cost or the difficulty of working with them.

The wheels are for lightly loaded touring on a mix of surfaces. 36 spoke, three cross with Reflex Ceramics for tubs and Dura Ace 7400 hubs. 

ISTR that the correct tension is hard to judge with CX Rays because they flex differently from ordinary spokes. So I've bought a tension meter.

Last time we had a thread about this the consensus seemed to be brass nipples instead of the polyax aluminium ones that come with the spokes. (Because the latter corrode and seize, I think.) But the Sapim site has a ton of reasons for using the polyax ones:

- no more early loosening
- no time wasted gluing screw heads
- environmentally friendly
- sticking qualities not affected by re-centering wheel
- increases spoke life and overall wheel safety
- also suitable for machine wheel-building

This is all they have to say about the brass ones:

- for "V" section rims and special rim profiles

So can anyone convince me all over again to go for the brass ones? I would go and read the thread at the old place, but ::-).

If I do use brass ones, should I glue the screw heads?

And while we're at it, should I use washers?

border-rider

Re: Building with CX-Rays: which nipples? Do I need washers?
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2008, 11:35:17 pm »
I don't think there's any advantage to Al in terms of sticking, and you certainty don't need to glue brass ones

Al nipples have a propensity to strip and to round, and are also more prone to corrosion.

Biggsy

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Re: Building with CX-Rays: which nipples? Do I need washers?
« Reply #2 on: April 15, 2008, 01:44:47 am »
Looking at http://www.sapim.be/index.php?st=products&sub=nipples .......

The note about "V section rims and special rim profiles" applies to the Hexagonal Head brass nipples.  There are also the more ordinary brass Polyax nipples - that are most sensible to use for most wheels.

The "ton of reasons" apply specifically to the Polyax Sapim Integrated Locking System, rather than Al nipps in general.

Al nipps are used to save weight.  I suspect that the locking system was invented to try and make up for the fact that Al nipps can't be done up so tight, and also to cater for more fancy types of wheels (low spoke-count, radial lacing, etc).  It is not needed for ordinary wheels - especially when using brass nipples.

For a compromise, you could use brass for the rear drive side and Al elsewhere.
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Porkins

  • Formerly Nick H. And a long time ago etc, Eurostar
Re: Building with CX-Rays: which nipples? Do I need washers?
« Reply #3 on: April 15, 2008, 01:42:43 pm »
Thanks chaps. Ordinary brass polyax nipples all round I think. I really don't want to risk stripped or seized nipples on the Plain of Jars.


Re: Building with CX-Rays: which nipples? Do I need washers?
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2008, 04:27:14 pm »
Remember, building a wheel is like kneading dough.  The more you pummel it while making it, the better the loaf comes out.
And Darkness and Decay and the Coronavirus held illimitable dominion over all.