Author Topic: Grammar that makes you cringe  (Read 352625 times)

Cudzoziemiec

  • Solar powered, tea fuelled cycle-wol
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5075 on: January 15, 2019, 09:12:54 am »
I'm not sure it's a particularly British thing. It might just be Guardian house style. Given the context T42 mentions, it might even be an Australian habit.
An ungovernable laughter, a joyous agitation which makes the summer stretching before you seem like an unrolling canvas on which you might draw those first rude pure strokes that are free. (Capote)

T42

  • Gaulois réfractaire
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5076 on: January 15, 2019, 09:24:38 am »
It has only surfaced recently, and I think I've only seen it in the Graun.  Maybe they've got a new spelling checker.
I've dusted all those old bottles and set them up straight.

Andrij

  • Андрій
  • Ερασιτεχνικός μισάνθρωπος
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5077 on: January 15, 2019, 10:32:29 am »
I'm not sure it's a particularly British thing. It might just be Guardian house style. Given the context T42 mentions, it might even be an Australian habit.

I am not an habitual Graun reader, and have seen said 'style' in numerous publications.
;D  Andrij.  I pronounce you Complete and Utter GIT   :thumbsup:

mattc

  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5078 on: January 15, 2019, 10:36:31 am »
The brain-dead Graun has taken to only putting capitals on the first letters of acronyms. Skimming an article about temperatures in Oz this morning to see if a chum was getting fried, I was wondering what the Bom was (Under the Bom, under the Boo?) until I remembered their idiot propensity and "Bureau of Meteorology" went ding.

I assumed that was a British thing.  Seeing NASA written Nasa drives me up the wall.

if you type "nasa" in WorD it turns it into "Nasa". This may  explain a lot  ::-)

(I don't think the Brits (or the BRITS) can be blamed for WOrd.)
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5079 on: January 15, 2019, 10:38:33 am »
The Graun style guide says all caps if the letters are pronounced, e.g. BBC but initial cap when it’s pronounced as a word, e.g.  Nasa.

Not sure I agree but that’s their choice.
"No matter how slow you go, you're still lapping everybody on the couch."

ian

  • fatuously disingenuous
    • The Suburban Survival Guide
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5080 on: January 15, 2019, 08:46:50 pm »
Most style guides I've encountered (and I've worked in publishing for a bazillion years, so this isn't a new thing) state that acronyms be written in lower case ('laser') and capitalized if proper nouns ('Nato'). It's how I've always done it. Abbreviations should, of course, be capitalized throughout ('BBC'). The Chicago Manual of Style suggests it might be a British thing, but they say that about everything.

That said, carry on, this thread is always the purest and most delectable source of wrongolium.
!nataS pihsroW

Cudzoziemiec

  • Solar powered, tea fuelled cycle-wol
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5081 on: January 15, 2019, 08:53:32 pm »
Words like laser and radar blur the boundary between acronym and, erm, word. I think this just means they are viewed as words in their own right and not thought of as standing for anything. We form other words from them, like, erm, gaydar. T42's "Bom" hasn't reached that level of acceptance and likely never will.
An ungovernable laughter, a joyous agitation which makes the summer stretching before you seem like an unrolling canvas on which you might draw those first rude pure strokes that are free. (Capote)

Auntie Helen

  • 6 Wheels in Germany
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5082 on: January 16, 2019, 05:05:45 am »
Ukip is written now largely in lowercase, whereas my iPad just autocorrected it to UKIP, which is what I would prefer anyway.
My blog on cycling in Germany and eating German cake – http://www.auntiehelen.co.uk


citoyen

  • Cat 6 Racer
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5083 on: January 16, 2019, 08:23:25 am »
As per ian’s experience, initial-caps-only for acronyms has been standard for as long as I’ve been doing this kind of thing for a living. Which is a long time. Is it a British thing? Yeah, could be, but I’m British so get over it.

That said, I suspect T42’s example is a case of house style being rigidly applied in spite of what would be sensible. As custodian of the style guide, I would always rather go against my own style rules than print something that readers won’t understand. Mind you, in my current job (in a content agency), house style is largely defined as “what the client wants”, and I’m sure we’ve all seen the stylistic abominations that marketing people come up with for company and brand names...

Cudzoziemiec

  • Solar powered, tea fuelled cycle-wol
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5084 on: January 16, 2019, 08:34:32 am »
As custodian of the style guide, I would always rather go against my own style rules than print something that readers won’t understand.
Far too sensible.
An ungovernable laughter, a joyous agitation which makes the summer stretching before you seem like an unrolling canvas on which you might draw those first rude pure strokes that are free. (Capote)

citoyen

  • Cat 6 Racer
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5085 on: January 16, 2019, 08:43:13 am »
As custodian of the style guide, I would always rather go against my own style rules than print something that readers won’t understand.
Far too sensible.

No, the sensible thing would be to do a job for which you get paid well and don’t have to worry about such unimportant nonsense.

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5086 on: January 16, 2019, 09:01:55 am »
All of my UK style guides have initial caps as acceptable, though none are prescriptive. My copy of Butcher's suggests that one house style that is common is to use initial cap for acronyms that are 5 letters or longer, but to keep uppercase where clarity and/or custom require, e.g. SALT II, WYSIWYG.

ian

  • fatuously disingenuous
    • The Suburban Survival Guide
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5087 on: January 16, 2019, 09:18:17 am »
TBH, all style guides are about consistency and not correctness. Inconsistency looks unprofessional and is annoying to read or view. No one really cares whether it's Nasa or NASA, but using the two formats interchangeably ought reasonably to be punished by grisly death.
!nataS pihsroW

citoyen

  • Cat 6 Racer
Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5088 on: January 16, 2019, 09:44:24 am »
Note however that consistency doesn’t mean applying style rules with stubbornly pedantic rigidity.

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5089 on: January 16, 2019, 09:58:37 am »
We form other words from them, like, erm, gaydar.
and frickin'-laser...

ian

  • fatuously disingenuous
    • The Suburban Survival Guide
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5090 on: January 16, 2019, 10:15:32 am »
Note however that consistency doesn’t mean applying style rules with stubbornly pedantic rigidity.

Try telling my wife that. She's an editorial tyrant. I can't even leave a note in the kitchen without her getting out the bloody red pen.
!nataS pihsroW

citoyen

  • Cat 6 Racer
Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5091 on: January 16, 2019, 10:41:54 am »
We form other words from them, like, erm, gaydar.
and frickin'-laser...

But not gayser, which is a shame - I’m imagining this to be some kind of superpower where you turn someone into a big old homo by firing rays out of your eyes at them.

mattc

  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5092 on: January 16, 2019, 10:51:00 am »

That said, carry on, this thread is always the purest and most delectable source of wrongolium.

Googlewhack!  :thumbsup:
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

ian

  • fatuously disingenuous
    • The Suburban Survival Guide
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5093 on: January 16, 2019, 11:10:43 am »
We form other words from them, like, erm, gaydar.
and frickin'-laser...

But not gayser, which is a shame - I’m imagining this to be some kind of superpower where you turn someone into a big old homo by firing rays out of your eyes at them.

My father seems to live in genuine fear that gay men have just this very power.
!nataS pihsroW

Cudzoziemiec

  • Solar powered, tea fuelled cycle-wol
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5094 on: January 16, 2019, 11:32:45 am »
We form other words from them, like, erm, gaydar.
and frickin'-laser...

But not gayser, which is a shame - I’m imagining this to be some kind of superpower where you turn someone into a big old homo by firing rays out of your eyes at them.
I thought it would be something to do with high pressure superheated steam shooting out of orifices.
An ungovernable laughter, a joyous agitation which makes the summer stretching before you seem like an unrolling canvas on which you might draw those first rude pure strokes that are free. (Capote)

ian

  • fatuously disingenuous
    • The Suburban Survival Guide
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5095 on: January 16, 2019, 12:25:26 pm »
Reminds me, apropos of orifices and high pressures, I never pulled out my case file on The Jerusalem Artichoke Incident to share.
!nataS pihsroW

Kim

  • 2nd in the world
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5096 on: January 16, 2019, 12:41:10 pm »
We form other words from them, like, erm, gaydar.
and frickin'-laser...

But not gayser, which is a shame - I’m imagining this to be some kind of superpower where you turn someone into a big old homo by firing rays out of your eyes at them.

Surely a gayser is when you amplify gayness by stimulating their emissions...
To ride the Windcheetah, first, you must embrace the cantilever...

Cudzoziemiec

  • Solar powered, tea fuelled cycle-wol
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5097 on: January 18, 2019, 10:24:38 am »
Quote
With a a significant working class and industrial legacy that has left its traces on the cityscape in the lace-market, the extensive network of caves that run under the city, the canal, and derelict industrial-era mill buildings, it is also.
What makes this particularly striking is that it's not buried in the middle of other text, it's the second sentence. From the Graudnia, obviously.
An ungovernable laughter, a joyous agitation which makes the summer stretching before you seem like an unrolling canvas on which you might draw those first rude pure strokes that are free. (Capote)

Kim

  • 2nd in the world
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5098 on: February 05, 2019, 07:26:07 pm »
Since we don't have a "scientific ignorance[1] that makes you cringe" thread, this will have to do:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-norfolk-47132158/drone-captures-southrepps-radiation-fog-daybreak

Quote
The phenomenon has nothing to do with radiation, but refers to the way heat "radiates" from the Earth meaning the air can hold less moisture, so it turns to fog.

 :facepalm:


[1] Or just plain 'meanings of words' ignorance.
To ride the Windcheetah, first, you must embrace the cantilever...

Cudzoziemiec

  • Solar powered, tea fuelled cycle-wol
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5099 on: February 05, 2019, 07:36:08 pm »
Heat radiates, radiators convect, radiation is nasty stuff that gives you cancer and negative mortgage equity. Everyone knows that!
An ungovernable laughter, a joyous agitation which makes the summer stretching before you seem like an unrolling canvas on which you might draw those first rude pure strokes that are free. (Capote)