Author Topic: Grammar that makes you cringe  (Read 454877 times)

Cudzoziemiec

  • Eating all the pies and drinking all the tea.
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5525 on: December 30, 2019, 09:11:44 am »
An Edinburgh restaurant announces proudly on the way in that "our policy is to cloakroom all outdoor coats."

While I don't have a problem with that policy in itself, I'm firmly of the belief that such verbing of nouns should be garbaged.
Or rubbished, to use a more conventionally British verbed noun.
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

T42

  • Old fool in a hurry
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5526 on: December 30, 2019, 09:39:35 am »
An Edinburgh restaurant announces proudly on the way in that "our policy is to cloakroom all outdoor coats."

While I don't have a problem with that policy in itself, I'm firmly of the belief that such verbing of nouns should be garbaged.
Or rubbished, to use a more conventionally British verbed noun.

Egad, Spock, they've got a Klingon cloakrooming device!  Hold on to your Crombie!
I've dusted all those old bottles and set them up straight.

orraloon

  • I'm trying Ringo, I'm trying real hard
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5527 on: December 30, 2019, 07:18:55 pm »
Where does the lead singer of Herman's Hermits fit into all this?
Late catching up but still  ;D

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5528 on: December 31, 2019, 01:24:59 am »
I have to say that I never expected to post on this thread, what with me tending towards dyslexia with a total inability to decode multi-syllable words let alone spell them.

However, I’d like to think that my grammar is reasonably sharp with a tendency to use the right words in the right places.

The reason I’m posting here is people’s 1continued use of the word ran when they should have written the word run. I’m a member of a Facebook running group, the number of people that say I haven been on a ran for xxx, or has anyone ran the xyz marathon.

It really grates, but now that I type the above, I’m beginning to doubt myself. Hrumph.
Sorting my life out, one shed at a time.

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5529 on: December 31, 2019, 06:34:26 pm »
I have to say that I never expected to post on this thread, what with me tending towards dyslexia with a total inability to decode multi-syllable words let alone spell them.

However, I’d like to think that my grammar is reasonably sharp with a tendency to use the right words in the right places.

The reason I’m posting here is people’s 1continued use of the word ran when they should have written the word run. I’m a member of a Facebook running group, the number of people that say I haven been on a ran for xxx, or has anyone ran the xyz marathon.

It really grates, but now that I type the above, I’m beginning to doubt myself. Hrumph.

I ran the marathon is essentially the same as I have run the marathon in my personal view, although I have a tickling memory that I have run is the pluperfect rather than just the perfect.

As someone who stopped latin and english language at O-level 46 years ago to do three sciences, I am surprised i even remember that.

An expert will be along shortly

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5530 on: December 31, 2019, 11:11:54 pm »
Not an expert, but trying to learn Spanish...

"to have" + "past participle" is the present perfect - it is a past tense that indicates a connection with the present.

"I ran the marathon" - implies either some time in the past or probably not going to run another one
"I have run the marathon" - implies either just finished running a marathon or expecting to run more marathons.

Past participles are tricky in English, sometimes they are exactly the same as the simple past tense (I worked/I have worked), sometimes very different (I saw/I have seen - no-one would ever say "I have saw"), and sometimes quite similar (I ran/I have run). When they are similar lots of people get confused which is which and swap them around.
Quote from: tiermat
that's not science, it's semantics.

Wowbagger

  • Dez's butler
    • Musings of a Gentleman Cyclist
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5531 on: December 31, 2019, 11:13:36 pm »
Quote from: Richard Osman
In 2020 my new year's resolution is to upset less grammar pedants
Eating's a serious business. Don't bollocks around wagging your tail.

hellymedic

  • Just do it!
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5532 on: January 01, 2020, 12:27:51 am »
Quote from: Richard Osman
In 2020 my new year's resolution is to upset less grammar pedants

 ;D ;D

T42

  • Old fool in a hurry
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5533 on: January 01, 2020, 09:12:04 am »
I have to say that I never expected to post on this thread, what with me tending towards dyslexia with a total inability to decode multi-syllable words let alone spell them.

However, I’d like to think that my grammar is reasonably sharp with a tendency to use the right words in the right places.

The reason I’m posting here is people’s 1continued use of the word ran when they should have written the word run. I’m a member of a Facebook running group, the number of people that say I haven been on a ran for xxx, or has anyone ran the xyz marathon.

It really grates, but now that I type the above, I’m beginning to doubt myself. Hrumph.

I ran the marathon is essentially the same as I have run the marathon in my personal view, although I have a tickling memory that I have run is the pluperfect rather than just the perfect.

As someone who stopped latin and english language at O-level 46 years ago to do three sciences, I am surprised i even remember that.

An expert will be along shortly

I ran the marathon pins the event to some specific time, whereas I have run the marathon doesn't.

I have run is the perfect; the pluperfect is I had run.

I stopped doing English in 1961 but my teachers were finnicky buggers.
I've dusted all those old bottles and set them up straight.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Eating all the pies and drinking all the tea.
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5534 on: January 01, 2020, 09:16:30 am »
I'd think of the present perfect as a present tense which describes the past.
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5535 on: January 01, 2020, 09:45:44 am »
The point is that they are different tenses of an irregular verb.
I run every day.
I ran yesterday
I have run [not “ran”] today.

There are other, similarly irregular verbs https://www.englisch-hilfen.de/en/grammar/unreg_verben1.htm.

The one I hear used incorrectly most often is ‘ring’, as in “I’ve rang the client”.
L'enfer, c'est les autos.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Eating all the pies and drinking all the tea.
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5536 on: January 01, 2020, 09:52:26 am »
In Beardy's first example it was a noun: "I have been on a ran". Might just be a typo or predictive text, might not be.
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

T42

  • Old fool in a hurry
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5537 on: January 01, 2020, 10:18:29 am »
I'd think of the present perfect as a present tense which describes the past.

They've changed the name since I learnt English. The present perfect was just the perfect when I learnt English and other grammars.
I've dusted all those old bottles and set them up straight.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Eating all the pies and drinking all the tea.
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5538 on: January 01, 2020, 05:05:49 pm »
Right, this is a grammar grumble. Not a cringe. House style explicitly states in several places not to use commas before 'and'. But you've used a comma here, and there, and somewhere else, and in every sentence, and it's not a matter of right and wrong, and it is a matter of Teh Roolz, and thank goodness for 'replace all'. ,and breathe...
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

Wowbagger

  • Dez's butler
    • Musings of a Gentleman Cyclist
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5539 on: January 01, 2020, 06:38:08 pm »
Right, this is a grammar grumble. Not a cringe. House style explicitly states in several places not to use commas before 'and'. But you've used a comma here, and there, and somewhere else, and in every sentence, and it's not a matter of right and wrong, and it is a matter of Teh Roolz, and thank goodness for 'replace all'. ,and breathe...

Wrong thread...
Eating's a serious business. Don't bollocks around wagging your tail.

T42

  • Old fool in a hurry
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5540 on: January 02, 2020, 09:24:22 am »
House style?

I've dusted all those old bottles and set them up straight.

hellymedic

  • Just do it!
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5541 on: January 13, 2020, 02:13:52 am »
Headline on BBC News website...
Quote
The disabled teenagers who's identity crisis led them to modelling careers

Cudzoziemiec

  • Eating all the pies and drinking all the tea.
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5542 on: January 13, 2020, 08:48:50 am »
House style?
Colouring book?  :thumbsup: Which one is yours?  ;D
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5543 on: January 13, 2020, 04:09:28 pm »
Headline on BBC News website...
Quote
The disabled teenagers who's identity crisis led them to modelling careers

I was far too old when I worked out when to use 'whose'.

OTOH, I'm not a journalist.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

T42

  • Old fool in a hurry
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5544 on: January 13, 2020, 05:03:25 pm »
House style?
Colouring book?  :thumbsup: Which one is yours?  ;D

Closest is bottom left, first complete house in, but we've five windows across the front and no dormers.
I've dusted all those old bottles and set them up straight.

cygnet

  • I'm part of the association
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5545 on: January 16, 2020, 11:41:32 pm »
Reasonably Inconsiderate

hellymedic

  • Just do it!
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5546 on: January 16, 2020, 11:58:56 pm »
Had a Lidl booklet shoved into our letterbox today with 'Big on' as its title.

David read this as Bingo, I read it differently.

Thor

  • Super-sonnicus idioticus
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5547 on: January 28, 2020, 11:26:58 am »
BBC news website headline

Quote
Can anyone call themself a therapist or a counsellor?
 

The "gender neutral" personal pronoun.  :facepalm:
It was a day like any other in Ireland, only it wasn't raining

Cudzoziemiec

  • Eating all the pies and drinking all the tea.
Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5548 on: January 28, 2020, 11:57:19 am »
That one's so conventional now that reading older texts with the once equally conventional "Can anyone call himself... " can be slightly jarring if you're not expecting it.
Days become simply the spaces between dreams, spaces between the shifting floors of time...

Re: Grammar that makes you cringe
« Reply #5549 on: January 28, 2020, 12:39:41 pm »
There seems to be a growing trend from across the pond, in the pronunciation of:
Wouldn't - wutten
Couldn't - cutten
Didn't - ditten
Etc, etc.
My sphincter clenches every time I hear it.