Author Topic: Landis comes clean!  (Read 5254 times)

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #50 on: May 22, 2010, 11:55:28 am »
Anyways, I reckon if they can get two of the the people Flandis named to corroborate then Armstrong is going down....

.....if they scrub his TdF victories they'll have to go a fair way down the GC list to find the winners.

Absolutely.  This could be a good one - I'm off to stock up on popcorn..

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #51 on: May 22, 2010, 12:16:26 pm »
LeMond Supports Landis In Fight For Clean Cycling | Cyclingnews.com

I think this story is going to run.  Be interesting to see who cracks first in order to cut their losses.  Meanwhile LA is out of the ToC doubtless busy trying to shore everything up.

Wonder if we'll hear nothing for a week or two, then an LA press announcement admitting doping....

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #52 on: May 22, 2010, 12:44:24 pm »
Wonder if we'll hear nothing for a week or two, then an LA press announcement admitting doping....

Not likely. It Lance the Texan. I get the impression that being apologetic or admitting fault is not within him.

mattc

  • n.b. have grown beard since photo taken
    • Didcot Audaxes
Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #53 on: May 22, 2010, 01:00:02 pm »
Sometimes the rider may need to hang on to the team car to allow the mechanic to wield the magic spanner.

But sometimes it is considered illegal to draft the team cars while making up time from a crash. No doubt the commisaires choose when to enforce this rule in an entirely fair way, cos as we know, there is no cheating in professional cycling. Except the drugs.
Has never ridden RAAM
---------
No.11  Because of the great host of those who dislike the least appearance of "swank " when they travel the roads and lanes. - From Kuklos' 39 Articles

Justin(e)

  • On my way out of here
Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #54 on: May 22, 2010, 02:46:13 pm »
If I had to bet my house on these allegations, I'd bet on some/all of them being true.  There is clearly a lot of money tied up in this in all quarters and on all sides...

I'll take you up on that bet.  I'll wager my house against your house that not all of Landis' accusations are true.

PM me if you would like to take this away from the metaphysical realms of cyberspace into lawyer-space.

My take is that Landis is suffering some sort of false repressed memory syndrome.  I am one of those that wanted to believe in him - so I'll accept some egg on my face for that.  However, I am sure that he is delusional at the moment.  How delusional I do not know.


Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #55 on: May 22, 2010, 03:05:43 pm »
No deal. I've heard your house is way shit.

Seineseeker

  • Biting the cherry of existential delight
    • The Art of Pleisure
Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #56 on: May 22, 2010, 03:53:40 pm »
If I had to bet my house on these allegations, I'd bet on some/all of them being true.  There is clearly a lot of money tied up in this in all quarters and on all sides...

Well er yeah, like obviously they are true, but it's been "known" for so long, I can't see it making any difference now. Lance is the Tiger Woods of cycling, they'll do anything to keep him.

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #57 on: May 22, 2010, 04:02:48 pm »
You are entirely wrong about that. If he's busted for doping the whole house of cards falls and he's finished. Besides, it isn't at all known.

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #58 on: May 22, 2010, 05:41:20 pm »
You are entirely wrong about that. If he's busted for doping the whole house of cards falls and he's finished. Besides, it isn't at all known.

That's quite an "if". I'm not aware of any evidence that he's ever cheated and Landis admits that all this is just his say-so. Until anyone fails a test, they're competing fair and square in my eyes.

Isn't this working spectacularly well for Floyd? Throw some mud at everyone else and deflect lots of attention. If Floyd is suffering from a medical condition, then I hope he gets treatment and moves on.

I can see now why Floyd contested the testing results so vigorously if he knew what he had taken, but it wasn't what was detected by the lab. I agree completely with the point made earlier by David Martin that if allegations are to be made that potentially ruin a career, they have to be beyond question. It is not the time or place for half-assed allegations based on bad science.

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #59 on: May 22, 2010, 06:01:11 pm »
You are entirely wrong about that. If he's busted for doping the whole house of cards falls and he's finished. Besides, it isn't at all known.

That's quite an "if". I'm not aware of any evidence that he's ever cheated and Landis admits that all this is just his say-so.

Exactly.  Nothing is 'known' until either traces of chemicals are found in his blood or piss, or several people are willing to dish the dirt on him.

(I still suspect there is some truth in Landis's accusations, though)

Seineseeker

  • Biting the cherry of existential delight
    • The Art of Pleisure
Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #60 on: May 22, 2010, 10:31:41 pm »
You are entirely wrong about that. If he's busted for doping the whole house of cards falls and he's finished. Besides, it isn't at all known.

I just don't think Lance will ever test positive and get busted. It sounds like he already has, and got away with it.

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #61 on: May 26, 2010, 02:39:21 pm »
Not sure if I caught this right, but on Eurosport just now they where saying something about cyclists being caught doping could now also be charged with fraud.
This might not only be specific to cycling, or USA cyclists.

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #62 on: May 26, 2010, 02:42:06 pm »
The UCI have apparently confirmed that Lance promised to pay a $100,000 donation to the UCI in 2002, but didn't actulaly pay up until they sent him a reminder in 2005!

Nothing would suprise me with Verbruggen at the helm.  I don't think McQuaid would have the wit to sanction a cover-up though, which is something.

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #63 on: May 27, 2010, 10:10:14 am »
Floyd Landis information may unlock how to beat biological passport analysis system - ESPN

like I said before, I think this story will run if the investigation is out of the hands of the uci

So floyd is implying bruyneel had an insider giving tip offs of doping tests. Anyone remember Lance's famous 40 minute shower when the inspectors arrived?

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #64 on: May 27, 2010, 11:39:25 am »
Not sure if I caught this right, but on Eurosport just now they where saying something about cyclists being caught doping could now also be charged with fraud.
This might not only be specific to cycling, or USA cyclists.

This is likely to be quite signiicant.

IIUC fraud arises if you take money from a sponsor pretending to be drug-free and use that money to buy drugs!

And why it's important is that this then becomes a "proper crime" not just a sporting crime. So teh guy that investigated Balco is invovled, and he is a seriously big hitter - people went to jail on that one, and folks like Barry Bonds, legendary baseball guy, were stomped all over.

If they can stomp on Barry Bonds they can stomp on Lance.

"What a long, strange trip it's been", Truckin'

andygates

  • Peroxide Viking
Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #65 on: May 27, 2010, 01:00:20 pm »
Isn't the usual sport fraud thing exclusive to France?
It takes blood and guts to be this cool but I'm still just a cliché.
OpenStreetMap UK & IRL Streetmap & Topo: ravenfamily.org/andyg/maps updates weekly.

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #66 on: May 27, 2010, 02:13:54 pm »
Isn't the usual sport fraud thing exclusive to France?

I'm not sure. I do remember reading somewhere a while ago that there was to be a change in English law (in preparation for 2012) to make the taking, possession or supply of banned substances a criminal offence, rather than just something for the governing bodies to sort out.

No idea if it has gone through, a work in progress or canned completely  :-\
Those wonderful norks are never far from my thoughts, oh yeah!

Porkins

  • Formerly Nick H. And a long time ago etc, Eurostar
Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #67 on: May 28, 2010, 12:01:29 am »
Landis isn't credible, but nevertheless I think the truth will out because he will want to look as if he's cooperating with investigators. That means being interviewed by them day after day after day without using prepared answers from lawyers. The story that Landis claims to want to tell (apparently EVERYTHING he knows about doping) involves so many people and events that a trained investigator/interrogator will be able to work out whether he's lying. I think he isn't - I think he's having a full-on Mennonite cathartic guilt-ridden baring of the soul, intertwined with a book deal. So we will all know what Lance did! It will be impossible to prove - but we will still be in no doubt because of rock-solid testimony, not just from Flandis, but from some of the many, many other people in his story, e.g. other accused US Postal teammates, some of whom will crumble, and Lance's ex-wife. Masses of beans will be spilled in the next year or two. Lance's edifice will crumble. He may stay out of court, but he's still going DOWN. It will be fascinating to watch.

Here's an article which agrees with me: Bicycling.com: Did Lance dope? The answer is coming  - Other sports- nbcsports.msnbc.com


Seineseeker

  • Biting the cherry of existential delight
    • The Art of Pleisure
Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #68 on: May 28, 2010, 01:57:54 pm »
Good article that.

I remember when you were Eurostar!

LindaG

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #69 on: May 28, 2010, 02:02:26 pm »
The CW article made a good point, as there are similarities between Pantani's story and Landis's.

Someone needs to look after Landis properly through all this.  A young man who had the world at his feet, then lost it.  And now he's taken on the Armstrong machine.

Cudzoziemiec

  • Dormant but requires tea
Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #70 on: May 29, 2010, 03:35:50 pm »
Are you suggesting some sort of "witness protection" is necessary? That if he is about to tell too much, influential people may make him disappear?
The unwilling rider and the one who leaves each control in turn without reluctance, with no desire to come back, obviously cannot be making the same journey, even though their brevets are identical.

andygates

  • Peroxide Viking
Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #71 on: May 29, 2010, 05:55:50 pm »
His broken body lying at the foot of a flight of stairs, with a yellow rubber wristband placed on his chest?

Mmm, I think not. 
It takes blood and guts to be this cool but I'm still just a cliché.
OpenStreetMap UK & IRL Streetmap & Topo: ravenfamily.org/andyg/maps updates weekly.

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #72 on: May 29, 2010, 06:03:03 pm »
Or maybe buried under pulped copies of his "I'm innocent, honest" book. The police could interview everyone who bought it or clicked "donate here" on his website to fund the on-going battle to prove his innocence.

I've read lots recently about the potential for fraud charges to be brought against those he's accused if his allegations are found to be true. What about the poor people who initially believed him (I did), and spent money on that basis (I didn't)?  ::-)

Porkins

  • Formerly Nick H. And a long time ago etc, Eurostar
Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #73 on: May 29, 2010, 08:21:57 pm »
He must be feeling very, very guilty. And didn't his father in law commit suicide soon after he was busted?

LindaG

Re: Landis comes clean!
« Reply #74 on: May 31, 2010, 07:24:59 pm »
Sorry, just got back from hols.

No, I was suggesting that Landis is a vulnerable and troubled young man, who is in the middle of a life crisis, and has taken on the Armstrong Machine.  I just hope he has strong folk around to support him - doper or not. 

Remembering how Pantani finished up.  No-one deserves that.