Author Topic: Mechanised doping?  (Read 10628 times)

jellied

  • skip to the end
    • Ealing Bike Hub
Mechanised doping?
« on: May 30, 2010, 05:13:29 pm »
Seeing as it's not 1st Apil I thought this worth a look.

Tiny electric motors in the down tube? What ever next?

http://www.bikebiz.com/news/32235/Former-pro-says-mechanised-doping-is-real
A shitter and a giggler.

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2010, 05:22:00 pm »
what a cunning idea. I have suggest in the past that some riders of my acquaintence carry their batteries in the saddle bags. I don't really see any story there though. A newspaper starts a rumour, a former racer says he's ridden a powered bike.

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2010, 05:28:10 pm »
All "power sports" are suspect; athletics, cycling, rowing, anything where all you need is power, not skill.

Darts is the only incorruptible sport  :)
And Darkness and Decay and the Coronavirus held illimitable dominion over all.

Zoidburg

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2010, 05:33:23 pm »
All "power sports" are suspect; athletics, cycling, rowing, anything where all you need is power, not skill.

Darts is the only incorruptible sport  :)
Like snooker?

Betting rings?

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2010, 09:51:26 pm »
Secret Squirrel Club busted   ;D
Working my way up to inferior.

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2010, 10:31:29 am »
Wow. I'm saving up for one of those as from now! So much less obvious than a stock electrically assisted bike that is on my birthday list for a couple of years time.
Let right or wrong alone decide
God was never on your side.

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #6 on: May 31, 2010, 11:03:34 am »

Is this really suspicious or just tinfoilhatland?

Cancellaras’ Electric bike ??? «  The cycling blog
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #7 on: May 31, 2010, 11:25:14 am »
What I learnt from that is that Cancellara knows that if he changes up a gear and keeps the same cadence he will go faster.

Surely an electric engine of that size wouldn't be able to produce the torque required for such an uphill acceleration? 

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2010, 11:42:52 am »
Quote
"It's unbelievable. You push the button and this gets the bicycle up to speed, no need to pedal, just make it look as though you're pedalling. You can ride at 50 kmh without forcing, without fatigue."

The motor produces a low hum, but not loud enough for bystanders to hear, especially in the middle of a pack of riders.

"The mechanism saves at least 50 watts,

Load of twaddle. One part of the article says the motors output 100W. Then this rubbish.

Even 100W isn't enough to change speed from 40kph to 50kph.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2010, 11:59:07 am »
Wow. I can't believe they're making those accusations so bluntly - surely he'll sue the pants off them?

It would be astounding if it's true - I can only laugh at the thought. All the years of poisoning their bodies with drugs and sneakily hiding blood and all that palaver - and he just gets an engine.

andygates

  • Peroxide Viking
Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #10 on: June 01, 2010, 12:19:24 pm »
It doesn't even pass the giggle test. 

Spectacularly easy to detect, once you start looking. 

And I'm sure there's voodoo in the power numbers quoted.  There's phones that don't run that long on batteries that light.
It takes blood and guts to be this cool but I'm still just a cliché.
OpenStreetMap UK & IRL Streetmap & Topo: ravenfamily.org/andyg/maps updates weekly.

David Martin

  • Thats Dr Oi You thankyouverymuch
Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #11 on: June 01, 2010, 12:30:40 pm »
It doesn't even pass the giggle test. 

Spectacularly easy to detect, once you start looking. 

And I'm sure there's voodoo in the power numbers quoted.  There's phones that don't run that long on batteries that light.

Lithium polymer batteries are easy to reconfigure into interesting shapes. The weights ren't so bad - 1.7kg all up for 45mins at 200W. Try 200W for just a few minutes and it could mak a difference,
"By creating we think. By living we learn" - Patrick Geddes

Rhys W

  • I'm single, bilingual
    • Cardiff Ajax
Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #12 on: June 01, 2010, 12:31:38 pm »
Even 100W isn't enough to change speed from 40kph to 50kph.

I'd say this is in the ballpark at least. I've been tested at around 300W at my anaerobic threshold. I can ride a 10 mile TT at my anaerobic threshold at 40kph (on a good day!) An extra 100W on top of my 300W would be very noticeable.

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #13 on: June 01, 2010, 12:41:01 pm »
It's miles out. an extra 100W will give you 3kph more, not 10.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #14 on: June 01, 2010, 02:20:25 pm »
Spectacularly easy to detect, once you start looking. 
That's the real problem.
It would be end of team if caught too, 'cos it would be difficult to fob off on the rider.

Technically, it's plausible. You could probably come up with something that would give an extra 50-100W for half an hour or so, and still keep the bike under the UCI weight limit.
It would probably be even more useful to the climbers - an extra 1 metre per second on a summit finish would make a lot of difference.

hulver

  • I am a mole and I live in a hole.
Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #15 on: June 01, 2010, 02:49:06 pm »
I've seen a single youtube vid of this motor (so all my comments are of course accurate and well informed) but the noise it made was very noticeable. A high pitched whine that sounded just like a small electric motor.

I think it would be noticed quite quickly.

Rhys W

  • I'm single, bilingual
    • Cardiff Ajax
Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #16 on: June 01, 2010, 07:24:14 pm »
A high pitched whine that sounded just like a small electric motor.

I think it would be noticed quite quickly.

Unless you're Cadel Evans.  ;D

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #17 on: June 01, 2010, 11:44:30 pm »
A high pitched whine that sounded just like a small electric motor.

I think it would be noticed quite quickly.

Unless you're Cadel Evans.  ;D

ROFL  ;D
"Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster.
And when you look long into an abyss, the abyss also looks into you." ~ Friedrich Nietzsche

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #18 on: June 02, 2010, 07:57:23 pm »

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #19 on: June 03, 2010, 12:39:55 pm »
A high pitched whine that sounded just like a small electric motor.

I think it would be noticed quite quickly.

Unless you're Cadel Evans.  ;D

His performance has improved quite a bit recently.... ;D

Rhys W

  • I'm single, bilingual
    • Cardiff Ajax
Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #20 on: June 03, 2010, 05:42:48 pm »
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/8Nd13ARuvVE&rel=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/8Nd13ARuvVE&rel=1</a>

Rhys W

  • I'm single, bilingual
    • Cardiff Ajax
Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #21 on: June 04, 2010, 09:48:33 am »
Quote
FLATULENCE POWER VERBOTEN - just announced: UCI to ban  "pressurized doping". Riders will be­ monitored for the amount of gas they produce. It has been estimated that some riders can produce as much as  50 watts of "back pressure" power. If over a to-be-determined limit, a rider will receive a two year  suspension. WADA has developed a new test called the Flatulence Abundance Recognition Test, or FART.

Late this afternoon, Lance Armstrong twatted that The Radioshack team has removed Tex-Mex food from all it's menus. Floyd Landis, in an interview on Larry King Live, stated that he had gas in the past and that  this was a problem with all his former teammates. Greg LeMond offered support to Landis for "clearing the  air". In a related statement to the press, Alberto Contador denied that he ordered extra helpings of  cassoulet during his recent "scouting" visit  to the Pyrenees. Spanish authorities declined to­ investigate, but CONI is investigating recent Giro  d'Italia results for violations of Italian law.

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #22 on: June 04, 2010, 10:01:12 am »
Quote
FLATULENCE POWER VERBOTEN - just announced: UCI to ban  "pressurized doping". Riders will be­ monitored for the amount of gas they produce. It has been estimated that some riders can produce as much as  50 watts of "back pressure" power. If over a to-be-determined limit, a rider will receive a two year  suspension. WADA has developed a new test called the Flatulence Abundance Recognition Test, or FART.

Late this afternoon, Lance Armstrong twatted that The Radioshack team has removed Tex-Mex food from all it's menus. Floyd Landis, in an interview on Larry King Live, stated that he had gas in the past and that  this was a problem with all his former teammates. Greg LeMond offered support to Landis for "clearing the  air". In a related statement to the press, Alberto Contador denied that he ordered extra helpings of  cassoulet during his recent "scouting" visit  to the Pyrenees. Spanish authorities declined to­ investigate, but CONI is investigating recent Giro  d'Italia results for violations of Italian law.
;D ;D ;D ;D


αdαmsκι

  • Twitter @Dr_AAY Instagram @ucfaaay Strava @ucfaaay
  • Look haggard. It sells.
Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #23 on: June 04, 2010, 10:48:34 am »
BBC have now picked up the story. I read the first line as "It sounds like something you might catch Denis Menchov doing" ::-).
What on earth am I doing here on this beautiful day?! This is the only life I've got!!

https://tyredandhungry.wordpress.com/

Re: Mechanised doping?
« Reply #24 on: June 04, 2010, 03:54:31 pm »
Quote
"I sat at a meeting with the UCI last year and drew on the blackboard exactly how this might work," Boardman told the Telegraph. "I showed them some of the sophisticated boosting technology now available, mainly from F1 teams, that can get a kilowatt out of a single AAA battery."

Erm ... no, big guy, I really don't think so! 1200mAh maybe? Unless you're installing regenerative breaking too ...
1.2Ah x 1.5v=1.8Wh ... it might help if you and your bike weigh about 1.5kg.

Lets relate this to the real world. If I put 6 shiny, freshly charged Ni-Cad batteries into my son's remote control car, he'll get about 40 minutes entertainment out of it before it dies a death - and that's not constant use either.

Utterly, utterly implausible.

I did check the date when the story first broke, but I can't see why it's getting any credence at all.
Allow me to explain through the medium of interpretive dance