Author Topic: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides  (Read 3376 times)

chillmoister

  • King of Compton
Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« on: June 10, 2008, 03:29:44 pm »
I have a basic Garmin eTrex H which I happily use in conjunction with Fugawi mapping software to create routes for Rides in the UK.  However I would like to create 'routes' that i can ride when I will be camping in France during August but Fugawi does not provide detailed maps for France.  Can anyone suggest the best / easiest way of plotting and prepping such routes that can then be uploaded to my etrex h before I go on holiday?
appearing in a tea room near you

Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #1 on: June 10, 2008, 03:33:20 pm »
Plot on Bike Trails, Paths & Routes From Over 40 Countries at Bikely.com

(Disable the auto-follow-road feature and use one point per routepoint).

Save as GPX.

Mangle it into a route using gpsbabel (or a text editor).

Either Fugawi, gpsbabel or GPS Trackmaker to upload it to the GPS.

It's how I create all of my routes for Audaxes for my basic yellow Garmin eTrex although none of them have been in France so I don't know how good Google Maps (which Bikely uses) is for French roads.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

andygates

  • Peroxide Viking
Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #2 on: June 10, 2008, 04:04:06 pm »
Save as GPX.

Mangle it into a route using gpsbabel (or a text editor).

Somehow when I tried that (for the EE), I just got a load of points.  Care to expand?
It takes blood and guts to be this cool but I'm still just a cliché.
OpenStreetMap UK & IRL Streetmap & Topo: ravenfamily.org/andyg/maps updates weekly.

Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #3 on: June 10, 2008, 04:10:40 pm »
Save as GPX.

Mangle it into a route using gpsbabel (or a text editor).

Somehow when I tried that (for the EE), I just got a load of points.  Care to expand?

I don't use gpsbabel but rather a text editor:

0) Download the GPX file from bikely.com (you'll need to save it then go back and look at it again via My Routes).

1) Delete everything from <trk> downwards

2) Add a </rte></gpx> at the end of the file.

3) Add in this before the first <wpt> tag:

<rte><name>routename</name>

4) Search and replace "wpt" with "rtept"

5) Save.

So the top of the file goes from looking like this:-

<gpx with loads of guff><wpt lat="51.5062850445" lon="-0.114026069641">
               <name>Z1 R</name>

               </wpt>
               <wpt lat="51.5008622375" lon="-0.118360519409">
               <name>Z2 R</name>

               </wpt>

to:-

<gpx with loads of guff>
<rte><name>Wibble</name>
<rtept lat="51.5062850445" lon="-0.114026069641">
<name>Z1 R</name>
</rtept>
<rtept lat="51.5008622375" lon="-0.118360519409">
<name>Z2 R</name>
</rtept>
...
</rte></gpx>

For some programs you may need to add:

<metadata></metadata>

between the <gpx> and <rte> tags for it to load properly.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

chillmoister

  • King of Compton
Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #4 on: June 10, 2008, 04:15:19 pm »
thanks Greenbank ...i'll give that a go over the next couple of evenings and let you know.
appearing in a tea room near you

andygates

  • Peroxide Viking
Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2008, 07:46:10 pm »
Yay, that worked.  Ta! :thumbsup:
It takes blood and guts to be this cool but I'm still just a cliché.
OpenStreetMap UK & IRL Streetmap & Topo: ravenfamily.org/andyg/maps updates weekly.

Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2008, 11:43:58 pm »
P.S. Make sure your routepoint names are unique (and across *ALL* routes you'll upload to the GPS).

Odd things will happen if you don't.

Especially when forgetting to rename the points from the default "Point 1", "Point 2" you get on bikely.com, as you only get a maximum of 6 characters to play with.

I started out the inaugural run of my DIY 200km ride up to Cambridge and back on familiar roads so no need for a GPS. 40km in and it was getting a bit hazy from my memory of the London to Cambridge route. No problem, I'll just fire up the GPS!

Since "POINT " is 6 characters it helpfully truncated my entire carefully plotted route to just a single point (the final one in Cambridge). I only added 5km to my intended route and was a lot more careful after that.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

chillmoister

  • King of Compton
Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #7 on: June 11, 2008, 12:51:37 am »
Hi Greenbank ....I've had a go at creating  French ride within Bikely ...however when I output the route to a GPX file and then open that in notepad I do not see the route-point format ...it appears to be in track-point format ...here's the first portion of the file:


<?xml version="1.0"?>
<gpx version="1.1"
creator="Bikely - Bike Trails, Paths & Routes From Over 40 Countries at Bikely.com"
xmlns="http://www.topografix.com/GPX/1/1"
xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance"
xsi:schemaLocation="GPX 1.1 Schema Documentation http://www.topografix.com/GPX/1/1/gpx.xsd">
<trk>
<desc>Castelnau loop</desc>
<trkseg>
<trkpt lat="43.5745459881" lon="0.722351074219">
         <ele>185</ele>
         </trkpt>
         <trkpt lat="43.5765357939" lon="0.718574523926">
         <ele>170</ele>
         </trkpt>
         <trkpt lat="43.5790229588" lon="0.717544555664">
         <ele>174</ele>
         </trkpt>
         <trkpt lat="43.5806395608" lon="0.717029571533">
         <ele>178</ele>
         </trkpt>
         <trkpt lat="43.5858621322" lon="0.710334777832">
         <ele>206</ele>
         </trkpt>
         <trkpt lat="43.5964302358" lon="0.703811645508">


presumably I have missed something along the way !!??    Do I need to transform this gpx file in gpsbabel to get it so it's formatted for routepoints and then follow your steps?  help!
appearing in a tea room near you

Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #8 on: June 11, 2008, 10:24:32 am »
bikely is acting up at the moment, but I think it's because you haven't named any of your points.

You do this by typing something into the "Now In" box for each point.

I use this to put in the instructions at each turn.

If you've created a route with the "auto follow road" option ON (it doesn't look like it) then it would generate far too many points for a route.

If you've named the points you should get a file that is filled with waypoints (<wpt>) first, and then the track (<trk>) section below that. It seems you're missing the waypoint section which is the bit I convert to a route and routepoints.

I'll keep an eye on Bikely.com and if it starts working again I'll have another look.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #9 on: June 11, 2008, 10:50:17 am »
Yup. You only get the wpt section for the points you've given a name.

Open up the route again in bikely and go through each point adding a name. ideally with names along the lines of:-

1 L
2 SO
3 R
4 L

If you're putting multiple days rides on there I'd suggest starting the points for each day with a different letter, i.e.

a1 L
a2 SO
a3 R

then for the next route:-

b1 R
b2 SO
...

You'll get into problems if you have two routepoints (they'll be waypoints on the GPS) with the same name.

Be careful that the next and previous point buttons < and > will sometimes jump multiple points. If you give the point the number you see where it says "Point x of 23" you'll notice if you miss any.

Then when save and then download the GPX file again you'll see the waypoint section as expected. Then use the search/replace instructions to get you to a route.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

chillmoister

  • King of Compton
Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #10 on: June 11, 2008, 12:21:46 pm »
thanks again Greenbank .....I'll have another go tonight
appearing in a tea room near you

Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #11 on: June 11, 2008, 12:33:15 pm »
It's easier if you name the points as you create them.

When you click to create a point the text cursor should be in the "Now In" box ready to accept whatever you type so it doesn't take long, and it's easier than fighting with the Next/Previous Point buttons afterwards as they sometimes skip points.

The downside is that if you want to add in another point after you've labelled them all you have to break the numbering system, i.e.

07 L
07a R
08 SO

Anyway, hope that's enough to get it working for you as I'm away for a week from tomorrow.
"Yes please" said Squirrel "biscuits are our favourite things."

Oscar's dad

  • Cheers!
Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #12 on: June 11, 2008, 01:08:43 pm »
Chillmoister, will your device work with Mapsource City Navigator?  My 2008 NT version has maps for all of Europe.  It costs £92 including shipping from the US but given the area covered and the detail I think it was good value for money.  If you zoom down you can get all cyclable roads but not tracks and bridleways.

Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #13 on: June 12, 2008, 11:16:26 am »
Or you may be able to find the predecessor of current Garmin European mapping, which was called Roads and Recreation v4.0, very cheaply on eBay - I paid £15 for it, and it looks as though it will work in much the way Tracklogs does for me in England. Soon to be tested in Belgium - and I'll be taking a paper map just in case  :)

Update: it worked really well. Two days' excellent cycling on quiet lanes with hardly a wrong turn, despite the complexity of the planned route. The Garmin mapping, when putting in trackpoints (or whatever they actually are), seems to "snap" to junctions; I was concerned that it might not signal turns until too late, but the GPS actually beeped and indicated just before turns (I navigate via the compass arrow screen).

Two caveats: the Garmin mapping, compared with OS mapping, is very hard on the eyes when creating routes, and while it distinguishes between major and lesser roads, it does not distinguish between types of lesser road. Relatively busy B-type roads and the most obscure unsurfaced farm tracks are depicted by the same plain lines. On the ground, we occasionally found ourselves faced with roughstuff, and chose to go round it (the GPS coped with this without fuss - the lanes network in Flanders is so dense that you soon get back on route, most likely without needing to use a major road). For both these reasons, it would, I think, be best to plan a route in a road atlas and only then create it in Mapsource.
Profit or planet?

chillmoister

  • King of Compton
Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #14 on: July 26, 2008, 11:27:15 am »
many  thanks Greenbank ...finally got round to sorting this out in prep for french holiday .....you are correct that the route points need to have a unique name.   I have just plotted a test route on bikely via the back streets of Pompey and it worked perfectly ......bikely GPX, edited in notepad as per your notew and then uploaded to Garmin EtrexH via GPS babel.    :thumbsup:   Now for some fun plotting some real french rides!  thanks again!
appearing in a tea room near you

robgul

  • HoECC & Cycle:End-to-End webmaster, S Warwickshire Bike Shop in Wellesbourne
  • . . cyclist, Cytech accredited, manages an LBS
    • Cycle:End-to-End
Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #15 on: July 26, 2008, 06:23:50 pm »
.... you could just buy the Memory Map IGN CD 1-250k of France and plot on the map - easy. 

We've just plotted a complete route from Calais to Montpellier via Champagne, Burgundy, Rhone valley - and extracted both GPS files and a printed bespoke route map.

... just gotta wait until 12 Sept to start the ride  ;D

Rob

chillmoister

  • King of Compton
Re: Creating Garmin 'routes' for French rides
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2008, 04:15:37 pm »
just a quick post to say 'thanks' for all the help and tips with this ....jsut got back from France where i managed to sqeeze ina couple of great rides during our family holiday.  The routes plotted via Bikely, edited and loaded to my Etrex via GPS Babel worked perfectly.....the only downside is that cycling so 'off piste' meant I got chased by every bloody farm dog in the South of France ...must be the smell of 'Le Roast Beef' !!
appearing in a tea room near you