Author Topic: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA  (Read 8726 times)

Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« on: September 16, 2012, 10:01:12 pm »
This is the Trangia burner with 2 pots, a frying pan/pot lid, and a 2 piece windscreen/stove holder. The stove is held off the ground in the windscreen, which provides a very stable base for stove and pot. The pot is held just over the stove, with the windscreen providing good wind protection for the stove and the pot. The windscreen has one large opening and lots of perforations, the idea being that the holes can be oriented to provided more wind protection or to provide more airflow to the burner, depending on how strong the wind is. Shielding the pot as well as the stove from the wind makes the stove much more efficient, especially in cool weather. Wind protection with this setup is quite good, almost as good as MSR's windscreen. This stove is also extremely quiet, quieter than any white gas or gas cartridge stove I have used.

Using this stove is extremely simple. Pour some alcohol into the stove, light the alcohol and put the pot on. Adjusting the flame with the simmering ring isn't quite as simple as turning the knob on a gas cartridge stove, but most of my "cooking" isn't sophisticated enough to warrant a more advanced simmering system.

Fuel for this stove is very easy to find. Lots of camping stores sell alcohol specifically for stoves, and lots of hardware stores sell alcohol as a solvent or cleaner. In France and Italy, supermarkets sell 90% alcohol with pink dye and some kind of scent as a cleaning supply, in the household cleaning products section. This stuff left a black residue on my stove, but it was very easy to clean off. I've heard reports of people getting soot on their pots from cooking with alcohol, but this did not happen to me with the French/Italian 90% stuff that I used this spring, or with the denatured alcohol that I bought in the US. The French/Italian 90% stuff comes in a number of different sized bottles from 1-3 liters, and an opened bottle can be closed up and transported in panniers safely.

Alcohol does not contain as much energy as petroleum based fuels (gas cartridge, white gas, etc.), so this stove won't boil water as fast as a lot of stoves. Unlike a white gas stove, an alcohol stoverequires no pumping or priming, and the Trangia in the windshield does not have to be monitored as carefully as a pressurized white gas stove, or a less stable stove. So it is easy and safe to start something cooking on this setup and carry on with other camp chores while the food is cooking.

This is an excellent stove for camping in mild climates. In sub-freezing temperatures, the lower heat output would make for unacceptably long cooking times, but this is not an issue for most cycle tourists. In mild weather, the quiet burning, good fuel availability and extremely simple operation make this the best cooking system I've used on any of my cycle tours.

Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #1 on: September 16, 2012, 10:08:21 pm »
Sooty bottoms can be prevented by adding a little water to your fuel

valkyrie

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Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2012, 10:15:43 pm »
In sub-zero conditions the only way to get a meths burning trangia to really cook is to put another flame under the burner. Once the meths starts to boil you go from "about as useful as a tea-light" to "foot long flames" very quickly indeed. Great for melting snow in a bothy but very hazardous in a tent.
World Class Excuses for Piss-Poor Performances

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2012, 10:19:08 pm »
In sub-zero conditions the only way to get a meths burning trangia to really cook is to put another flame under the burner.

If using the burner lid to do this, don't forget to remove the O-ring first.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2012, 10:28:28 pm »
In sub-zero conditions the only way to get a meths burning trangia to really cook is to put another flame under the burner. Once the meths starts to boil you go from "about as useful as a tea-light" to "foot long flames" very quickly indeed. Great for melting snow in a bothy but very hazardous in a tent.
At that point I think I'll just bring my MSR stove, thanks.

Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2012, 06:52:26 am »
I confess that I will leave a pressurised white gas stove unattended.  Once you get used to their foibles, they're safe enough.  They only tend to run out of pressure when very full of fuel and run at high output, because the self-pressurisation from the generator can't keep up with the rapidly expanding (in percentage terms) air volume in the tank.  Likewise, overpressure is unlikely unless you have a huge saucepan and a windscreen tightly fitted around the stove.  Coleman stoves aren't hugely bothered by high pressure anyway, it's the relief valve on a SVEA 123 that causes the usual problems.
Never tell me the odds.

Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #6 on: September 17, 2012, 10:17:47 am »
I used to leave my Whisperlite unattended until a gasket in the pump failed, and it started leaking/spraying fuel in the direction of the flame...

And yes, I remember the pressure relief valve on the SVEA 123.

Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #7 on: September 17, 2012, 08:07:41 pm »
One thing I love about our Trangia is the quietness. Its great just sitting outside the tent in the mornings making a brew disturbing no one  :thumbsup:

mmmmartin

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Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #8 on: September 17, 2012, 08:16:43 pm »
In sub-zero conditions the only way to get a meths burning trangia to really cook
is to squirt some cigarette lighter fuel on the top of the cold meths and light that, which then burns and warms up the cold meths to a point where it lights and then warms up the container it is in, and then really starts to put out some heat. It takes a while but is safe.
Besides, it wouldn't be audacious if success were guaranteed.

Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2012, 08:21:35 pm »
One thing I love about our Trangia is the quietness. Its great just sitting outside the tent in the mornings making a brew disturbing no one  :thumbsup:
I like to know a stove is working.  Apparently a SVEA 123 is very loud,  but some MSR stoves will wake up a large campsite.
Never tell me the odds.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #10 on: September 17, 2012, 08:24:07 pm »
I like to know a stove is working.

It's a Trangia.  Of course it's working  :P
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2012, 08:02:39 pm »
I have a gas burner on my Tranger

http://compare.ebay.co.uk/like/221131446516?var=lv&ltyp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&var=sbar&cbt=y

Works really well and don't have to mess around with meths.

MercuryKev

  • Maxin' n Audaxin'
Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2012, 09:00:22 pm »
I have a gas burner on my Tranger

http://compare.ebay.co.uk/like/221131446516?var=lv&ltyp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&var=sbar&cbt=y

Works really well and don't have to mess around with meths.

I do like the Trangia with gas burner set up and if combined with the kettle you've got a fast, stable and windproof brew machine.  Great for real cooking too.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #13 on: October 08, 2012, 09:28:22 pm »
I'll give a big thumbs-up to the gas burner, too.

I have the Go Systems one, but as far as I can tell the only difference between that and the offical one is the size of the knob, and the Trangia logo.

What you get is a remote-feed gas burner that clips into the Trangia windscreen where the spirit burner would normally sit.  The hose exits downwards, through a hole in the base unit that's standard on modern Trangia sets.  It then attaches to a standard screw-on self-sealing butane/propane cartridge in the usual way.  It comes with a draw-string bag, which allows you to pack the burner up neatly inside the Trangia set without anything rattling around.  There isn't room (at least in a 27) to pack both gas and spirit burners at the same time, though.

In operation, you have all the normal advantages of a gas stove: it's at full power instantly, easily controllable and makes a satisfying roaring noise at high levels.  Boil times are, as you'd expect, substantially faster than with the spirit burner.  The usual advantages of the Trangia still apply: it's extremely stable and wind-resistant, and all the heat goes where you want it.  My so far brief experimentation with proper cooking suggests that it's a massive win when using the Trangia in frying mode, where the spirit burner's lack of fine control can be problematic.

Unlike many gas stoves, the Trangia burner includes a pre-heat loop.  This means that, once the burner has been lit in the normal manner, you can invert the gas cartridge to allow liquid (rather than vapour) to flow to the burner.  As the liquid is heated in the pre-heat loop, it boils and produces gas for the burner.  The advantage here is that you're not relying on ambient heat to boil the liquid in the gas cartridge, so it will operate correctly at low temperatures, and preserve the butane:propane ratio of the gas.  I've had success running mine off pure butane (which is a available in the much cheaper aerosol can style cartridges used for catering stoves) via an adaptor[1], though have yet to try it in cold conditions.

The disadvantage of running on liquid is that the control valve - primarily designed for vapour - becomes much more fiddly, with all the adjustment over a much smaller range of rotation.  It also introduces several seconds of lag, as it takes time for the liquid already in the pre-heat tube to be boiled off after the valve is closed.  Not a problem when boiling water, but you may prefer to run on vapour when simmering or frying.

While this solves most of the low temperature issues, the other disadvantages of LPG do of course apply: you're still reliant on bulky, often expensive or hard to find, cartridges and really need to carry two of them on any non-trivial trip, as it's hard to tell how full they are without weighing them.  It adds weight over an equivalent meths setup, though if you're using a Trangia in the first place, this probably isn't a huge problem.


There's also a multifuel burner available for the Trangia.  I have no experience of it myself, but it's quite expensive and reviews seem to be mixed.  A stand-alone MSR stove would seem like better value for that sort of application.  Anyone tried one?



[1] This is a tool for people who know what they're doing!  It's entirely possible to spew liquid butane everywhere if you're careless, and you have to be aware of the structure of the feed tube inside the cartridge and how it relates to the notch orientation[2], else your stove may flare unexpectedly.  They're available cheaply from the usual eBay dealers of quality (though I make no comment on what quality) Chinese tat.

[2] The tube is L-shaped, pointing towards the side of the cartridge in line with the notch on the coupling.  This enables the cartridge to be positioned sideways in a specific orientation and vapour drawn off, as in catering stoves.  With a remote-feed stove and an adaptor, you have to prevent the cartridge from rolling accidentally and keep the notch up for vapor, or down for liquid.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #14 on: October 08, 2012, 09:33:43 pm »
Oh, random Trangia question, is the kettle supposed to sit *inside* the windshield in the same way as the pans?

I ask because mine is patently too big for this, but too small to sit on top with the support arms folded out, as you would use the frying pan.  I suspect I've actually got a 25 size kettle (the stove is the 1-litre '27' kit).  I was given my Trangia set by a friend who'd got too old for camping (in her opinion), so don't know its history...
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #15 on: October 08, 2012, 10:04:56 pm »
The 27 kettle sits nicely inside the pans. As you say you've probably got the larger one.

The multifuel burner is supposed to be an Optimus Nova with the legs removed and a bracket to make it fit the Trangia.

I've just been down to the Las Vegas Home Depot to get some denatured alcohol for mine:-). Approx $8 per litre.
Not fast & rarely furious

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MercuryKev

  • Maxin' n Audaxin'
Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #16 on: October 08, 2012, 10:39:11 pm »
Oh, random Trangia question, is the kettle supposed to sit *inside* the windshield in the same way as the pans?

Short answer is yes.  It should fit in with the legs folder into the windshield and sit quite low.

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #17 on: October 08, 2012, 10:46:28 pm »
Okay, that sounds pretty conclusive then, and probably explains why there was a larger kettle (of the sort you might use on a full-size gas stove) in the box of stuff I was given - it fits on top of the Trangia with the arms folded out, but isn't exactly lightweight camping kit.

Don't suppose anyone's got a 25-series kettle and wants to swap?  ;D
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #18 on: October 09, 2012, 12:37:33 am »
I rarely use my 27 kettle these days. The pot from the mini Trangia goes with me instead, it's usually reserved for doing drinks, but when I do Proper Cooking then a 3rd pot is useful.

A friend of mine did the SCIENCE thing, and reckons that small pot +frying pan lid is more fuel efficient than the kettle for heating the same volume of water.
Not fast & rarely furious

tweeting occasional in(s)anities as andrewxclark

Kim

  • Timelord
Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #19 on: October 09, 2012, 12:49:08 am »
Not being a habitual drinker of hot drinks, I don't normally bother with the kettle anyway.  I think Mildenhall was the first time I actually attempted to use it, as barakta was with me and needed regular caffeination.  I find the Trangia pans are pretty good for controlled pouring, so there's not much advantage in the kettle.
Careful, Kim. Your sarcasm's showing...

Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #20 on: October 09, 2012, 03:46:38 am »
There's also a multifuel burner available for the Trangia.  I have no experience of it myself, but it's quite expensive and reviews seem to be mixed.  A stand-alone MSR stove would seem like better value for that sort of application.  Anyone tried one?

The Trangia multi-fuel burner retails for US$200 where I live, if you can find one, and weighs 520 grams. The MSR EX-GK and the MSR Dragonfly both retail for US$140 (again, where I live), and both weigh <400 grams. As I've said before, the MSR wind protection system is a touch better than Trangia's, IMO.

I love the silence and simplicity of the Trangia for fair weather camping, but if the situation calls for a multi-fuel stove (cold weather, long back country trips, availability of different fuels) I will live with the noise and complexity of my MSR Dragonfly.


jane

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Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #21 on: October 09, 2012, 05:46:22 am »
  I find the Trangia pans are pretty good for controlled pouring, so there's not much advantage in the kettle.
But it's sooooooo cute!

Oscar's dad

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Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #22 on: October 09, 2012, 06:46:27 am »
  I find the Trangia pans are pretty good for controlled pouring, so there's not much advantage in the kettle.
But it's sooooooo cute!

I agree.  I don't care how much weight it adds or how efficient it may not be, my Trangia kettle is the best bit of camping kit I own.

Re: Trangia 27-7 UL/HA
« Reply #23 on: October 09, 2012, 08:40:52 am »
  I find the Trangia pans are pretty good for controlled pouring, so there's not much advantage in the kettle.
But it's sooooooo cute!

I agree.  I don't care how much weight it adds or how efficient it may not be, my Trangia kettle is the best bit of camping kit I own.

+1^
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