Author Topic: passport photos if you wear glasses (Read 22342 times)

Wombat · « **on:** 24 December, 2012, 12:34:19 pm »

I've never had trouble before with my passport photos, as long as there are no glaring reflections in my glasses. However, this time they have rejected my passport renewal stating they cannot see my eyes because of reflections. This is a complete lie, my eyes are clearly visible and there are no reflections. I know they claim to have tightened up the rules, but it seems what they are now doing is refusing a passport to anyone who wears glasses! They say I should remove my glasses for the photo, but they also say the photo should be my normal appearance. I am never, ever, seen without glasses, a photo of me without glasses is effectively not a photo of me.

If I agree to submit a photo of me without glasses, I can see what is going to happen, every time I go through passport control I will be asked to remove my glasses, which I will refuse to do, and promptly be arrested. I am absolutely steaming at this, what the fuck are these idiots playing at? It is sheer crass incompetence, they are faced with a clearly identifiable photo of me, which complied with the rules, yet they refuse to accept it.

Any suggestions as to who to complain to? I refuse to be singled out and asked to remove my glasses, as if I am some sort of terrorist who is hiding something.

SteveC · « **Reply #1 on:** 24 December, 2012, 12:39:31 pm »

I think it's a general thing with ID photos now. The last set I had done (not for a passport but also for 'official' purposes) stated 'no glasses' in the instructions. It's probably easier to insist for everyone rather than make a judgement on each case.

hellymedic · « **Reply #2 on:** 24 December, 2012, 12:39:33 pm »

Despite anti-reflective coated lenses, the guy who took David's passport photos advised him to remove his specs, which he did.
Nobody queried his wearing specs when he travelled.
Get photos done sans specs.
I know it's a farce but the Passport Office is like that.

a lower gear · « **Reply #3 on:** 24 December, 2012, 12:50:48 pm »

Seeing as one has to remove shoes, coats, etc, empty pockets, etc, I find that momentarily removing my glasses is the least of the multifarious hassles.

Ah! The pleasures of international travel...

Kim · « **Reply #4 on:** 24 December, 2012, 12:55:14 pm »

I took mine off as per the instructions.

Not particularly bothered, as I only wear them about half the time anyway (though generally would when travelling).

I suggest watercolours. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-20739778

hellymedic · « **Reply #5 on:** 24 December, 2012, 01:05:16 pm »

People don't really look much different with or without specs (unless they're HYOOGE and tinted).
Those who wear them think they do because they see so differently...

barakta · « **Reply #6 on:** 24 December, 2012, 01:07:35 pm »

S'ok they're known to demand people remove hearing aids, then 'not' take care of the hearing aid while going through conveyors as well.

There's a reason I haven't bothered flying since 2000. CBA with the ablist crap for a start cos I can't remove shoes etc without a chair and I'm advised that's often not available. I'm not removing HA/glasses both at same time cos I need them to communicate damnit.

Think I did my passport without spex too, I'm never seen without them.

Kim · « **Reply #7 on:** 24 December, 2012, 01:14:23 pm »

Quote from: hellymedic on 24 December, 2012, 01:05:16 pm

People don't really look much different with or without specs (unless they're HYOOGE and tinted).

I think they can on an aesthetic level, but for identifying people the difference is minor (unless you're sufficiently prosopagnosic to be using them as a cue, in which case you probably shouldn't be inspecting passports).

Surely the sensible answer is that you don't want a photograph that's going to last for ten years to contain glasses that are going to last maybe two, and be replaced by something different because the ones you like have gone out of fashion and become unobtanium.

giropaul · « **Reply #8 on:** 24 December, 2012, 02:06:00 pm »

My understanding is that it is about the newer biometric passports, and iris recognition in particular.

Kim · « **Reply #9 on:** 24 December, 2012, 02:13:26 pm »

Quote from: Giropaul on 24 December, 2012, 02:06:00 pm

My understanding is that it is about the newer biometric passports, and iris recognition in particular.

I don't think a passport photo has anywhere near that sort of resolution. AIUI the biometric passports simply encode the ratios of relative positions of facial features from the photograph (with the option for more detailed biometric data in future).

rafletcher · « **Reply #10 on:** 24 December, 2012, 02:57:32 pm »

Quote from: Wombat on 24 December, 2012, 12:34:19 pm

I refuse to be singled out and asked to remove my glasses, as if I am some sort of terrorist who is hiding something.

Your not, get over it. I've been pulled aside at Kennedy by the border patrol filks because "your names on the list, I can see it's not you, but you have to come this way". Go with the flow, it's a lot less stress.

reddo · « **Reply #11 on:** 24 December, 2012, 03:06:07 pm »

Kim's correct. Iris recognition is a different thing all together and judging by the red Xs at Heathrow the other day, they're shutting that one down.
When being scanned at those auto booth readers, I find it's works quicker sans specs (rimless and clear) but maybe that's just wishful thinking...

Wombat · « **Reply #12 on:** 24 December, 2012, 03:11:58 pm »

Oh well, so big brother ordering us about again, it is... Its the sheer lying that annoys me. They do not say "we will reject all photos with glasses" but they do it anyway. I am convinced it is utter incompetence by people who do not understand their own rules. My photo meets their rules, but they still reject it, and insist I submit a photo that is NOT a true likeness.

As for biometric passports, I thought they had abandoned that idea. We specifically asked for them, to speed up our rare airport experiences, but were told they are not being done any more.

As for rafletcher, if you must go to the USA, where they suspect anything that is not suspicious, and ignore anything that is... Friends have had model steam engines worth thousands "seized" (i.e. stolen) by the TSA goons at US airports. What a bunch of muppets, its that sort of idiocy that ensures I will never visit the US.

Kim · « **Reply #13 on:** 24 December, 2012, 03:18:17 pm »

Quote from: Wombat on 24 December, 2012, 03:11:58 pm

As for biometric passports, I thought they had abandoned that idea. We specifically asked for them, to speed up our rare airport experiences, but were told they are not being done any more.

I renewed my passport a few months ago. The new one is biometric (containing, presumably, facial recognition data from the photo). Iris and fingerprints were never a requirement for the UK, though the passport chips conform to an international standard which supports them.

Veloman · « **Reply #14 on:** 24 December, 2012, 03:30:36 pm »

Quote from: Wombat on 24 December, 2012, 12:34:19 pm

f I agree to submit a photo of me without glasses, I can see what is going to happen, every time I go through passport control I will be asked to remove my glasses, which I will refuse to do, and promptly be arrested. I am absolutely steaming at this, what the fuck are these idiots playing at? It is sheer crass incompetence, they are faced with a clearly identifiable photo of me, which complied with the rules, yet they refuse to accept it.

I wear glasses and also use contact lenses. I often grow a beard (winter) and sometimes a moustache (for a laugh). My passport photo is no glasses and no facial hair. Never had a problem going through passport control anywhere in the world. If I have beard, or am wearing glasses I just explain that I changed for whatever reason (weather, fashion, fun).

So I think that although you are clearly annoyed by some bureaucracy, you are not going to be stopped all the time as you suggest. Perhaps on reflection, and after considering what else is going on in the world, this is not as major a problem as it first appears (ie having a photograph without glasses on). I wonder how you would react to be being stopped for a full search on a random person basis (as opposed to an intelligent led or profiling basis?)

Time for a grumpy audaxer thread?

perpetual dan · « **Reply #15 on:** 24 December, 2012, 04:05:20 pm »

Have you tried the passport checking at the post office? I've always avoided it, but they might be coaxed into reason.

Mine has glasses, but is several years old. The Indian visa specifies no glasses, which is at least a clear instruction.

Of course all this is amateur level willful obstructiveness compared to getting a visa out of UKBA.

Wombat · « **Reply #16 on:** 24 December, 2012, 05:51:34 pm »

I'll grant you all I'm being grumpy about it, but the reason I'm grumpy is because it is totally unnecessary, and they are incompetently acting outside their own rules. My passport has always had a photo of me wearing glasses, and my eyes have always been clearly visible as required, so why reject it now?

I'm relieved to note that my fears of being stopped at every passport checking point are unfounded. I acknowledge that many people face far worse at border checkpoints, but wilfully introducing a potential for nastiness at such places seems stupidity beyond belief. Why deliberately do it wrong, when its just as easy to do it right?

It is the indentity and passport service themselves who say my photo is unacceptable, so its no good trying the post orifice, even if my work lunchbreak was long enough to make it through the queue (our post office in Gosport in well known as a disaster area, and the one near home doesn't do passports).

hellymedic · « **Reply #17 on:** 24 December, 2012, 06:40:00 pm »

I have never used the Post Office's checking service. The only hiccup we've had was when David's payment card didn't go through properly, something which was quickly sorted by a phone call. There'd been a transcription error somewhere.
I did read all the blurb and stuck to all their rules.
We used the online service, which sent us a form that just needed checking, signing and paying.

hubner · « **Reply #18 on:** 24 December, 2012, 07:01:01 pm »

The gov's not completely clear about it.

https://www.gov.uk/photos-for-passports

Quote

Your photo may be rejected unless it shows you:

facing forward and looking straight at the camera
with a neutral expression and your mouth closed
without anything covering the face
in clear contrast to the background
without a head covering (unless it’s worn for religious or medical reasons)
with eyes open, visible and free from reflection or glare from glasses
with your eyes not covered by sunglasses, tinted glasses, glasses frames or hair
without any shadows in the picture

So, nothing covering the face but then they say your eyes can't be covered by glasses frames, and no glare from glasses. Why don't they just say "no glasses"?

Polar Bear · « **Reply #19 on:** 24 December, 2012, 07:55:46 pm »

My passport photo was rejected due to a clash between my hair and the background. I had my local photographer do nice ones instead which I much prefer and were accepted.

These people are simply a bunch of power-crazed arseholes but unfortunateky to fight the system is to go without a passport.

I am always wearing shades at passport control but have only ever been asked to remove them once.

barakta · « **Reply #20 on:** 24 December, 2012, 08:08:24 pm »

I read a very interesting paper some years back about biometrics and how disabled and non-white people would be most fucked by the systems in use then due to "the standard" being a non-disabled white person so people with different ethnic features or any unusualnesses caused by disability or similar would be more likely not to fit within parameters..

Easy to say "fine" and small inconvenience, but if it's always the same people being extra checked that starts to add up. Like a half Egyptian acquaintance of mine who is always 'conveniently' "randomly" searched when hardly any white people or his usually white companions who travel like him are

hubner · « **Reply #21 on:** 24 December, 2012, 08:14:56 pm »

Do they say they can't accept the photo and just ask you to send another one? Or do you have to make another application and thus have to pay twice?

Uberuce · « **Reply #22 on:** 24 December, 2012, 08:48:39 pm »

I wear glasses and have had a full beard for years. I took my glasses off for my passport renewal because I reckon it's easier to impersonate me if the photo The Officials need is of a glasses wearing person. My prescription is heavy enough that it scrunches my natural eye shape a fair bit, especially given the low resolution of a one inch picture, whereas my beautiful, beautiful hazel eyes are unmistakeable when undistorted.

It takes me about three seconds to remove my glasses, but it would take a team of artisan plastic surgeons and a subject with exquisite orbital bone structure to forge my eyes, so I can kinda see their point.

The beard, however, they will take from my cold dead chin.

Basil · « **Reply #23 on:** 24 December, 2012, 08:52:45 pm »

I had to renew my passport last year. The photo has glasses. Not had any problems with that.

a lower gear · « **Reply #24 on:** 25 December, 2012, 12:14:57 am »

I've had a beard for over thirty years, it varies from 5mm fuzz to miniature gorse bush; never had any problems in immigration. My present passport is ten years old and I have much less hair now than when the photo was taken; again never any problems. Lack of problems quite likely connected with my always travelling either in a nuclear family group or solo to academic conferences, and with being white, 'respectable' and in my fifth decade. On the few occasions I've worn jacket and tie to fly, I've fancied I've noticed a smoother passage through officialdom. Profiling, eh?

Just about to renew my passport: have had a very short haircut so that my ongoing loss of hair won't look too badly adrift from the photo in a further decade.