Author Topic: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30  (Read 17865 times)

marcusjb

  • Full of bon courage.
    • Occasional wittering
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-23143314

Very sad news indeed.

My thoughts are with their friends and families.
Right! What's next?

Ooooh. That sounds like a daft idea.  I am in!

Si_Co

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2013, 12:14:10 pm »
RIP

It's a cr@p road for cycling on. The lorry would have been really shifting after the descent from Carland Cross.

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2013, 12:43:05 pm »
 :( :( 

http://www.cornishguardian.co.uk/dead-following-crash-A30-near-Newquay/story-19453604-detail/story.html

Looks like the section of road was straight and fairly level/slight incline up.   http://goo.gl/maps/3sGyz
Destroying rainforest for economic gain is like burning a Renaissance painting to cook a meal.  EOW.

LEE

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2013, 02:55:20 pm »
Tragic news and unsurprising.

I used the A30 for my LEJoG.

In my journal I wrote that "I feel fairly lucky to be alive, it's like playing Russian Roulette cycling along the A30".

The problem is that it is, to all intents and purposes, a motorway BUT without a hard shoulder.  What "hard shouder" there is (by which I mean the tiny gap to the left of the white line) is generally full of lorry parts, chunks of tyre, mudflaps and general debris.
This forces you out even further.

Never again, it's a bloody nightmare.

My advice is never to cycle on it.  It's no excuse for careless driving BUT, there are careless drivers out there, doing >70mph, and the A30 will place you dangerously close to them.

Same experience on the A74 into Gretna.

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2013, 03:28:29 pm »
RIP condolences to family and friends

jogler

  • mojo operandi
Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #5 on: July 02, 2013, 06:43:20 pm »
RIP condolences to family and friends

+1

I would not cycle on the A30 in Cornwall for
all the tea in China
a pension
all the money in the world
etc etc

there are far less risky alternatives which add no time to the duration of an E2E

I'd not be suprised if cycling is,in the future,banned on this road as has happened on the Edinburgh ring road.

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2013, 07:37:11 pm »
May they rest in peace. So sad for their families and friends. What a waste :(

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2013, 08:50:24 pm »
The A30 in Cornwall is unpleasant to drive on, let alone cycle along.  Most (but not quite all) of the dualled sections have an alternative virtually alongside (the old road, in fact).  Where the accident happened (just beyond Fraddon) is one of the places where the alternative is less clear, and close to a place where there is no near alternative despite being dual carriageway.

I drive that road quite frequently, and there are usually cyclists plodding along.  I wince every time I see them, but of course they do have an absolute right to be there.  We must be careful not to victim blame.

LEE

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #8 on: July 02, 2013, 09:16:21 pm »
  We must be careful not to victim blame.

Absolutely.  I hope I didn't give this impression.  However cycling always involves a degree of risk-assessment.

Although there may be alternative routes that don't add time I couldn't find any, and I was on a very tight schedule.  That explains why my risk-assessment put me on the A30.
If I'd had even one more day to complete LEJoG then I would have gone for a different route. (I was totally inexperienced at that sort of cycling back in 2002 actually, very naive).

I don't blame the cyclists at all but it's not clear it's actually anyone's fault.  As I went past Bodmin on the A30 I saw several Articulated Lorries getting caught in side-winds which caused their trailers to swerve into the "hard shoulder" and back out.  That's the risk of roads like that, an ill-timed gust of wind and you are history.

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #9 on: July 02, 2013, 10:24:54 pm »
Too depressing for words RIP.
Get a bicycle. You will never regret it, if you live- Mark Twain

IanN

  • Voon
Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #10 on: July 02, 2013, 10:42:50 pm »
Agreed it's a horrid bit of road. I know of two fatalities further up the hill towards the windmills - and I left the area donkeys ago.

One in a car many years ago (I knew him slightly). One of the saddest things I've seen was three bikers walking along the narrow grass strip down the left of the carriageway from the roundabout (heading East) carrying flowers to the spot where someone was killed. Off topic possibly

Hummers

  • It is all about the taste.
Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #11 on: July 02, 2013, 11:10:40 pm »
There but for the grace .....

I think we were just off the A30 (briefly) around Summercourt just under 2 weeks ago for the Lands End to London trip.

It makes you realise just how lucky (and vulnerable) you are.

My thoughts go to the families of the two cyclists killed.

H

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #12 on: July 03, 2013, 11:16:01 am »
I'm about as militant a lane controlling vehicular cyclist as they come and I'd think twice about the A30. It is effectively a motorway. I think they were just to cheap to declare it an M-way as they would have to provide an alternative.

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #13 on: July 03, 2013, 11:56:52 am »
Quote
The cyclists, named as as Toby Wallace and Andrew McMenigall, were aiming to raise £10,000 for the Kirsten Scott Memorial Trust. They were declared dead at the scene.

thisisthewestcountry.co.uk/news/cornwall_news


Their page. 960 miles in 7 days!

There are some very poignant messages on this charity page - "My son was killed doing a charity cycle on the A30 in 2009. My heart goes out to all concerned at this tragic time"
Destroying rainforest for economic gain is like burning a Renaissance painting to cook a meal.  EOW.

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #14 on: July 03, 2013, 12:17:28 pm »
I'm about as militant a lane controlling vehicular cyclist as they come and I'd think twice about the A30. It is effectively a motorway. I think they were just to cheap to declare it an M-way as they would have to provide an alternative.
I regularly ride on a similar road (70mph being a typical vehicle speed). I ride to the left of the white line, wouldn't dream of being in the lane.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Redlight

  • Enjoying life in the slow lane
Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #15 on: July 03, 2013, 01:04:02 pm »
Problem is that often the area to the left of the white line is littered with debris, potholes etc. so one assumes the two cyclists were in the lane. 

I don't know this road, but from the photo in the press it looks as though the collision happened just after a bend at the top of a hill, so one can imagine what might have happened if the lorry had come around the bend in the left hand lane and the driver had been looking at the wrong part of the road or in a wing mirror, for just a couple of seconds. That's not to absolve the driver of responsibility to concentrate on the road ahead, etc, but knowing the reality of the way people do drive, it's hard to know what the poor cyclists could have done to protect themselves.

Perhaps one positive outcome could be promotion by Cornwall and Devon tourist boards of a 'recommended' route for the many LE-Jog riders who go through the counties each year (if that isn't done already). Note, I'm not taking a "stay off the A roads" position, but simply some guidance for people who don't know the area and could use some help with route planning to avoid bastard hills, etc.
Between the Disney abattoir and the chemical refinery

Datameister

  • EU Cake Mountain
Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #16 on: July 03, 2013, 01:05:36 pm »
Dreadful news, but depressingly regular amongst those who ride LEJOG.

I will admit that our first consideration was something like "how do you get from LE to JOG without A30, A74 and A9". None of them are places I would choose to be (or more precisely none of them are places I would like to share with the vehicular traffic).

LEE

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #17 on: July 03, 2013, 02:18:21 pm »
I regularly ride on a similar road (70mph being a typical vehicle speed). I ride to the left of the white line, wouldn't dream of being in the lane.

As mentioned above, you simply can't do this on large stretches of the A30 and, even if you did, that buys you only about 12" of "protection".

Here's a typical A30 section.  I imagine the "risk assessment alarms" are ringing in the heads of many cyclists seeing this.


Regulator

  • That's Councillor Regulator to you...
Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #18 on: July 03, 2013, 02:36:05 pm »
And now we're getting the "it's a dangerous road" from the police and the Usual Suspects in the media...  ::-)

There is no such thing as a dangerous road - only dangerous road users.
Quote from: clarion
I completely agree with Reg.

Green Party Councillor

LEE

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #19 on: July 03, 2013, 02:40:48 pm »
And now we're getting the "it's a dangerous road" from the police and the Usual Suspects in the media...  ::-)

There is no such thing as a dangerous road - only dangerous road users.

Semantics.

The A30 is a dangerous road.

AikenDrum

  • Lurker at the gate
    • Audax Kernow
Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #20 on: July 03, 2013, 02:41:29 pm »
From the news report last night, it happened on a straight, fast and flat section just after the Newquay turn off at the bottom of the descent from Carland Cross. God knows what the lorry driver was doing not to have seen them - browsing his twitter feed, chatting on his mobile, asleep at the wheel... it'll come out eventually.

Every morning during the Summer, I see End to Enders dicing with death on the eastbound A30 during rush hour, and there's really no need. A recommended route would be a good idea. Here's mine, for the first 120 miles or so:

A30 to and through Penzance sp Redruth. After Canonstown, take the estuary road through Hayle (B3301), then at the Loggans Moor Rdb follow the road through Connor Downs - Camborne (A3047) - Redruth - Chacewater - Truro (A390) - Tresillian - Ladock Valley (B3275) - Fraddon - Indian Queens. Next, take the parallel "old road" over Goss Moor through Victoria to Bodmin. From Bodmin tough the dual carriageway out as far as Launceston (some moorland sections can be used between Temple and Bolventor, but these take you further onto Bodmin Moor), and then take the old A30 through Lewdown, Okehampton, Sticklepath, Whiddon Down, Crockernwell, Tedburn St Mary to Exeter.

Or, skip the A30 altogether and from Fraddon head up the Atlantic Highway (A39) through Wadebridge, Stratton, Holsworthy, Okehampton to Exeter.
London's burning with boredom now

LEE

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #21 on: July 03, 2013, 02:45:19 pm »
From the news report last night, it happened on a straight, fast and flat section just after the Newquay turn off at the bottom of the descent from Carland Cross. God knows what the lorry driver was doing not to have seen them - browsing his twitter feed, chatting on his mobile, asleep at the wheel... it'll come out eventually.

The A30 is subject to high side-winds.  With the best will in the world the driver of an articulated lorry can't always prevent the trailer getting blown off course. 
I see it constantly on my local A303 (which is why I refuse to join the Andover Wheelers on their TT course).  My car will get pushed slightly by a side wind and then I'll see the Lorry in front start to snake in the same side wind.

He may well have been texting..etc but not necessarily.

Here's my journal entry from June 2002......(it's all flooding back now)

Quote
Thu June 13 Day 1 - Lands End to Oakhampton

Cycled from B&B to Lands End, saw 2 guys coming out from Lands End on serious looking Carbon Fibre. Found out later this was Harry and Aubrey (also doing the ride in 9 days). Lands End at 8:15am then spent the whole day on the A30 until I reached Oakhampton at 7:30pm. I was making great progress on the dreadful A30 (It really is like cycling on a motorway but without the safety of a wide hard shoulder, Russian Roulette really, very dangerous but fast, your decision.) until I got near Oakhampton.

Rained all day. Bodmin Moor in Fog. Very glad I took 2 flashing red LED lights for the back.

Important point number 8. I can't stress enough how dangerous the A30 is, especially in fog. however I should also stress that it allows you to make much better progress than typical Cornish back roads.

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #22 on: July 03, 2013, 02:59:38 pm »
I regularly ride on a similar road (70mph being a typical vehicle speed). I ride to the left of the white line, wouldn't dream of being in the lane.

As mentioned above, you simply can't do this on large stretches of the A30 and, even if you did, that buys you only about 12" of "protection".

Here's a typical A30 section.  I imagine the "risk assessment alarms" are ringing in the heads of many cyclists seeing this.


That's similar to the road I ride on. Slightly less width to the hard surface, maybe 4" less than I have to 'play' with.

It makes a huge difference, that white line is usually a rumble strip so drivers straying over it get a warning and move back into lane.  The disadvantage is that you simply can't swerve around debris.
<i>Marmite slave</i>

Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #23 on: July 03, 2013, 03:43:54 pm »
I reckon I'd rather cycle up the hard shoulder of the M1 (if it were legal), than long sections of the A30 - with vehicles passing each other in both lanes doing 70mph+, and no real hard shoulder.
Destroying rainforest for economic gain is like burning a Renaissance painting to cook a meal.  EOW.

Regulator

  • That's Councillor Regulator to you...
Re: Very sad news coming out of Cornwall - two cyclists killed on A30
« Reply #24 on: July 03, 2013, 03:52:09 pm »
And now we're getting the "it's a dangerous road" from the police and the Usual Suspects in the media...  ::-)

There is no such thing as a dangerous road - only dangerous road users.

Semantics.

The A30 is a dangerous road.

It's not semantics.

I intensely dislike the bullshit that is peddled about roads being dangerous and that cyclists shouldn't use certain roads. Let's be honest - these deaths, as with many others, are to do with the inconsiderate behaviour of one road user towards another. This is about motorists behaving irresponsibly around more vulnerable road users.

I want to be able to use any road I need or want to use. I don't want to be restricted to minor roads (which in themselves have issues with motorists driving like twunts). I want motorists to respect my right to use the road and, yes, I am going to demand that they drive safely around me and other more vulnerable road users. I don't want cycling apartheid and I reserve the right to challenge anyone, cyclist or otherwise, whose actions or words are leading down that road.

Quote from: clarion
I completely agree with Reg.

Green Party Councillor